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| flaper87 | #startmeeting Glance Drivers | 14:01 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 6 14:01:58 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is flaper87. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Glance Drivers)" | 14:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'glance_drivers' | 14:02 |
| flaper87 | Courtesy Glance Drivers' meeting reminder: nikhil_k, flaper87, sigmavirus24, rosmaita, mclaren, dhellmann, jokke_ | 14:02 |
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| nikhil | o/ | 14:02 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 14:02 |
| nikhil | thanks for the reminder flaper87 | 14:02 |
| rosmaita | o/ | 14:02 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: w000h00! I really love the courtesy pings | 14:02 |
| nikhil | :) | 14:02 |
| flaper87 | The only reason I have a calendar is so I can ignore it | 14:02 |
| rosmaita | flaper87: +1 | 14:02 |
| nikhil | haha, true :P | 14:02 |
| flaper87 | ok, I guess it'll be the 3 of us for now | 14:03 |
| flaper87 | #topic Agenda | 14:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Agenda (Meeting topic: Glance Drivers)" | 14:03 | |
| flaper87 | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-drivers-meeting-agenda | 14:03 |
| rosmaita | i need an app that will give me an electric shock at meeting time | 14:03 |
| flaper87 | rosmaita: ++ | 14:03 |
| flaper87 | that'd be awesome | 14:03 |
| rosmaita | ESaaS | 14:03 |
| flaper87 | and it feel just into the agenda topic, we should discuss that instead | 14:03 |
| flaper87 | :P | 14:03 |
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| flaper87 | #topic spec-lite (or no spec) (flaper87) | 14:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "spec-lite (or no spec) (flaper87) (Meeting topic: Glance Drivers)" | 14:03 | |
| *** jwagner_away is now known as jwagner | 14:04 | |
| flaper87 | I think it's time to start discussing spec-lite | 14:04 |
| nikhil | ++ | 14:04 |
| flaper87 | I was reviewing our processes and other project's | 14:04 |
| flaper87 | I talked to johnthetubaguy and got feedback from him. He mentioned that Nova doesn't use specs at all for small specs but just blueprints | 14:05 |
| flaper87 | and it seems like a good idea to me but I obviously want to know your thoughts | 14:05 |
| flaper87 | The blueprint is *always* required and that's what we use for rel-mgmt anyway | 14:05 |
| flaper87 | The description seems to be enough for a lite spec | 14:05 |
| flaper87 | Thoughts? | 14:06 |
| rosmaita | i'm ok with that, if the description isn't enough, then we know a full spec is needed | 14:06 |
| nikhil | yes and yes though I have one feedback that seems important to me | 14:06 |
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| flaper87 | rosmaita: ++ | 14:06 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: shoot | 14:06 |
| nikhil | BLueprints are not discoverable and not a good source of reference | 14:06 |
| flaper87 | that is great feedback | 14:07 |
| nikhil | for example -- say we have 3 specs that deal with image status changes (state transition -- just an example) | 14:07 |
| * sigmavirus24_awa is here, sorry for being late | 14:07 | |
| nikhil | having to refer all 3 and say that they are compatible and | 14:07 |
| nikhil | that they allow changes that fit into the cycle goals | 14:07 |
| nikhil | and that they won't create a blackhole to further change | 14:07 |
| nikhil | changes* -- becomes rather difficult | 14:08 |
| nikhil | and to concise thoughts and provide a directional feedback becomes quite tough | 14:08 |
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| flaper87 | I wonder how important is discoverabilty and reference for these kind of specs | 14:08 |
| nikhil | one thing that we could do is appoint someone duty to import the change logs from BPs into specs | 14:08 |
| flaper87 | I mean, they are spec lite and the blueprint is kind of a formality | 14:08 |
| flaper87 | please, correct me if I'm wrong | 14:08 |
| nikhil | sure, one more example | 14:09 |
| nikhil | quite recent | 14:09 |
| nikhil | the image member notification change | 14:09 |
| flaper87 | but, I'd expect the commit messages for these spec-lite to be lenghty and almost have the whole spec in it | 14:09 |
| flaper87 | :D | 14:09 |
| nikhil | that allowed changes to the domain proxies in a way that someone could mis interpret | 14:09 |
| nikhil | I wonder if that sort of thing would re trigger another change that reverses it | 14:09 |
| nikhil | and we do find that in many a cases people propose a change after something that is opposite has been merged | 14:10 |
| nikhil | historical references become a tribal knowledge | 14:10 |
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| *** sigmavirus24_awa is now known as sigmavirus24 | 14:10 | |
| * jokke_ is lurking | 14:10 | |
| nikhil | but I am okay if we want to redact the process and try a no-spec thing to see how things work | 14:11 |
| flaper87 | I think that feedback is awesome | 14:11 |
| nikhil | my feedback was observational and not necessarily future proofing | 14:11 |
| nikhil | Thanks! | 14:11 |
| flaper87 | Would it be fair to say: "lets give this a try BUT for spec lite, we ought to be nitpicky on commit messages" ? | 14:12 |
| rosmaita | i wonder whether we can require a post-spec, maybe taking the commit message from the spec-lite? | 14:12 |
| rosmaita | that way we'd get the info into the specs repository | 14:12 |
| nikhil | rosmaita: I was proposing something along those lines | 14:12 |
| nikhil | or even to glance doc/source/* | 14:12 |
| jokke_ | can we just state then that if the bp is proposed without spec it needs to be clear and short enough to have that description in the commit message? | 14:12 |
| nikhil | pick the important changes and put them in the prj repos | 14:13 |
| flaper87 | jokke_: yeah, that's kinda what we are headed towards here | 14:13 |
| rosmaita | yeah, key thing is to have everything in one place for new devs to look at when they want to get up to speed on the glance project | 14:13 |
| jokke_ | like not assume and not leaving the room for guessing, just plain and simple ;) | 14:13 |
| flaper87 | The good thing about this is that, if a driver thinks a tiny spec might be useful, the commit message can be copied over by the driver himself/herself | 14:14 |
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| nikhil | flaper87: also, for worthy spec lite changes, I presume we will have some sort of major impact to one of the dimensions of the prj -- say developer, deployer, security, notification, api etc ?' | 14:14 |
| *** Bjoern_ is now known as BjoernT | 14:14 | |
| jokke_ | one question 'though ... how that will affect the review workflow | 14:14 |
| flaper87 | mmh, I'd say that major impacts should require a full spec | 14:14 |
| nikhil | jokke_: +1 to using wisdom where appropriate. I think we are sorta agreeing this for a generic case | 14:15 |
| jokke_ | with the specs (regardless how long and detailed it is) it's quite clear when it's ok to start merging code | 14:15 |
| flaper87 | jokke_: mmh, not sure I follow | 14:15 |
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| jokke_ | I'm one of us that didn't get that much exposed to the workflow when bps were purely used | 14:15 |
| flaper87 | I mean, if the blueprint is approved, the patches can be merged | 14:15 |
| nikhil | flaper87: so let's take the example of the notification change. That affects notifications in a drastic way -- there were no member notification and now they exist. Should that be a full spec? | 14:15 |
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| jokke_ | so how I verify that there is agreement to get that feature in, when it has not gone through the spec process and reviews | 14:16 |
| nikhil | jokke_: I think we will have to be prompt on setting the status of "direction approved" on the BP when it's okay to start merging code | 14:16 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: mmh, I'd say no. I mean, it's an addition but it's not changing existing ones. | 14:16 |
| jokke_ | the reason why everyone moved to specs was because the workflow was difficult to follow | 14:17 |
| flaper87 | I guess we could restrict the impact group list | 14:17 |
| flaper87 | as in: if it affects dev, deployer, security, api then write a spec | 14:17 |
| nikhil | flaper87: so, for such cases I think we should enforce adding a section to the BP that describes the impact to notification so that the driver copy pasting the code doesn't have to second guess what's going on... just saying.. | 14:17 |
| jokke_ | another pointer I'd like to raise is that relying on bps would work for while but I'd like to remind that there is continuous work ongoing to move OpenStack away from Launchpad | 14:17 |
| flaper87 | but the same reasoning should happen even if we have an actual spec considered light | 14:18 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: oh yes, the section should be there | 14:18 |
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| jokke_ | the specs repos are easy to maintain and keep regadless what release and bug tracking system is being used | 14:18 |
| flaper87 | ok, lets give this one more week. We gotta discuss other topics | 14:18 |
| flaper87 | sorry for timeboxing the topic | 14:18 |
| jokke_ | nikhil: ok, thnx | 14:18 |
| nikhil | flaper87: one more thing happens with BPs is that they are spammed a lot. So we have to continuously triage. As LP API is exposed. | 14:18 |
| sigmavirus24 | alternate idea: what if we use a different directory in the specs repo with a different template? | 14:18 |
| flaper87 | Lets put some thoughts on it and discuss it again next week | 14:18 |
| sigmavirus24 | mitaka/lite/ | 14:19 |
| sigmavirus24 | (for example) | 14:19 |
| rosmaita | sigmavirus24: ++ | 14:19 |
| rosmaita | i think that's what jokke_ was getting at | 14:19 |
| flaper87 | sigmavirus24: I'd like to avoid proposing more patches to that repo and increasing the review queue | 14:19 |
| nikhil | sigmavirus24: +1 ( I was saying either that or put it in glance prj repo) | 14:19 |
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| nikhil | the adv to putting in glance repo is | 14:19 |
| flaper87 | I mean, not *I* but that's the idea behind not having a spec at all | 14:19 |
| jokke_ | I think that's what I proposed few weeks ago when this discussion was agreed to be postponed until Mitaka ;) | 14:19 |
| nikhil | the code and the spec can go in together in one review | 14:19 |
| sigmavirus24 | flaper87: but we're still calling them specs which will cause lots of confusion | 14:19 |
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| sigmavirus24 | if we don't want to use that repo we need to really be discussing this on the ML | 14:20 |
| jokke_ | sigmavirus24: ++ | 14:20 |
| sigmavirus24 | nikhil: that may work too, I'm not sure I like that | 14:20 |
| flaper87 | sigmavirus24: wait, it's just for spec lites, not for all the specs | 14:20 |
| sigmavirus24 | flaper87: I get that | 14:20 |
| flaper87 | sigmavirus24: and yes, that's the second part of the discussion | 14:20 |
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| sigmavirus24 | I just don't think any of us are on the same page and the wider community may have better ideas | 14:20 |
| * nikhil shuts up and waits for next week discussion on this | 14:20 | |
| flaper87 | One reason I brought this up is because it seems to be working for nova | 14:20 |
| * sigmavirus24 will shut up too | 14:20 | |
| sigmavirus24 | flaper87: ah, I think I missed the description of how nova does this | 14:21 |
| flaper87 | now, we really need to change topic! Lets discuss this again next week | 14:21 |
| rosmaita | maybe we should all take action items to look at how nova does this | 14:21 |
| * sigmavirus24 also doesn't work on nova so he may just have been expected to know it from experience and doesn't | 14:21 | |
| flaper87 | #topic https://review.openstack.org/#/c/229891/ (flaper87) (Nova v1 -> v2) | 14:21 |
| * sigmavirus24 nodes | 14:21 | |
| *** openstack changes topic to "https://review.openstack.org/#/c/229891/ (flaper87) (Nova v1 -> v2) (Meeting topic: Glance Drivers)" | 14:21 | |
| nikhil | woohoo! | 14:21 |
| flaper87 | ok, that's the spec to make nova use v2, it was merged | 14:21 |
| flaper87 | It's a mix between the old spec and the one for Liberty | 14:21 |
| flaper87 | There are some patches up already | 14:22 |
| nikhil | \\o \o/ o// | 14:22 |
| flaper87 | w000h00 | 14:22 |
| flaper87 | moving on unless there are questions | 14:22 |
| flaper87 | :D | 14:22 |
| nikhil | flaper87: were there amendments going on that? | 14:22 |
| nikhil | I may have read the commentary wrong | 14:22 |
| jokke_ | flaper87: was that done via backmail, bribery, combination of those or via some other back magic? :P | 14:22 |
| flaper87 | jokke_: ssssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhh | 14:23 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: nope, just nits here and there because I can't english | 14:23 |
| nikhil | LOL | 14:23 |
| nikhil | ok | 14:23 |
| flaper87 | if there are scary things in there, please, do tell so they can be fixed before the code is out | 14:23 |
| flaper87 | ok, moving on | 14:23 |
| flaper87 | #topic https://review.openstack.org/#/c/230970/ (Use approved specs dir) (flaper87) | 14:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "https://review.openstack.org/#/c/230970/ (Use approved specs dir) (flaper87) (Meeting topic: Glance Drivers)" | 14:23 | |
| nikhil | ++ | 14:23 |
| nikhil | (to scary things) | 14:23 |
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| flaper87 | It's pretty straightforward. I think we should put approved patches under approved and then move them under `implemented` | 14:24 |
| flaper87 | That way we know what was actually implemented | 14:24 |
| nikhil | works for me | 14:24 |
| jokke_ | flaper87: so new specs should be proposed against approved, right? | 14:24 |
| flaper87 | in the process of checking Liberty patches, I found some that weren't implemented and they were still in the Liberty folder. This should help for future releases | 14:24 |
| flaper87 | jokke_: correct | 14:24 |
| flaper87 | s/releases/cycles/ | 14:25 |
| sigmavirus24 | +1 flaper87 | 14:25 |
| rosmaita | +1 | 14:25 |
| flaper87 | sweet | 14:25 |
| flaper87 | #topic https://review.openstack.org/#/c/206431/ <- (rosmaita) this is a Nova spec, not a Glance spec, but I'd like to talk about it briefly if there's time | 14:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "https://review.openstack.org/#/c/206431/ <- (rosmaita) this is a Nova spec, not a Glance spec, but I'd like to talk about it briefly if there's time (Meeting topic: Glance Drivers)" | 14:25 | |
| flaper87 | rosmaita: floor is yours | 14:25 |
| nikhil | nova does this too | 14:25 |
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| flaper87 | nikhil: yeah, I've been researching a bit lately by looking into other projects | 14:26 |
| rosmaita | just want to point out a nova spec | 14:26 |
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| rosmaita | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/206431/ | 14:26 |
| nikhil | gotcha | 14:26 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: that's the inherited properties spec? | 14:26 |
| rosmaita | it concerns property protectrions | 14:26 |
| rosmaita | jokke_: yes | 14:26 |
| * jokke_ likes that spec | 14:26 | |
| rosmaita | so the proposal is that a config option be added to nova so it uses admin creds for adnim-protected properties | 14:27 |
| nikhil | rosmaita: so, is a service token the key objection at this point? | 14:27 |
| rosmaita | nikhil: not really | 14:27 |
| rosmaita | but, it's a problem for cinder, too | 14:27 |
| flaper87 | I like it too but I won't deny that using admin to write the properties worries me | 14:27 |
| nikhil | eh | 14:27 |
| rosmaita | and someone brought up that it's a pain to keep the config potion and the prop protections config coordinated | 14:27 |
| flaper87 | The fact that you need to make that in 2 steps w/ 2 different users probably means that there's something missing somewhere | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | so i just want to mention that maybe we oculd think of a better / more general solution | 14:28 |
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| flaper87 | rosmaita: ++ | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | but, we also already have a lot for mitaka | 14:28 |
| flaper87 | rosmaita: that's true | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | so the current spec could be short term | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | would work for nova | 14:28 |
| flaper87 | I think we could let this go as a short term solution | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | but worth brainstorming "the future" | 14:28 |
| flaper87 | and then I'll shut the #@$#@$ up because I'm basically saying the same thing you're saying | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | or maybe discuss with cinder and others at the summit | 14:28 |
| rosmaita | (sorry, mytyping is slow) | 14:29 |
| jokke_ | flaper87: yeah ... there is the fact that we still have no idea if it was random guy wiht our client or another service doing the call ;) | 14:29 |
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| nikhil | hmm, I think a service token would help in so many ways | 14:29 |
| rosmaita | i may propose something for design summit if we are light on topics | 14:29 |
| nikhil | w/ re-uploads too | 14:29 |
| flaper87 | rosmaita: as of now, we are light on topics | 14:30 |
| rosmaita | but, yeah some kind of service token, or combo token, or something | 14:30 |
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| nikhil | flaper87: should we discuss mid-cycle sometime soon? | 14:30 |
| rosmaita | ok, i will slap in a paragraph and people can + or - it | 14:30 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: ++ | 14:30 |
| nikhil | I think planning it early would help, last time was a BIG PAIN | 14:30 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: yup, I was planning to do that as soon as we get the summit schedule done | 14:30 |
| nikhil | gotcha | 14:30 |
| flaper87 | nikhil: agreed | 14:30 |
| flaper87 | hopefully this next week/the one before the summit | 14:31 |
| nikhil | the reason to bring this up was if not design summit the above topic can go to mid-cycle as fall back | 14:31 |
| nikhil | cool, thanks! | 14:31 |
| rosmaita | i'm behind on finishing the new-import spec, will have it up before Thurs meeting | 14:31 |
| flaper87 | ok, we're out of time! | 14:31 |
| nikhil | rosmaita: +1 | 14:31 |
| flaper87 | rosmaita: please, I'll give you candies | 14:31 |
| flaper87 | and whisky | 14:31 |
| rosmaita | i like whisky | 14:31 |
| flaper87 | well, not if I drink it first | 14:31 |
| flaper87 | ok | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | ok | 14:32 |
| rosmaita | save me a sip | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | I'll give you whisky | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | #endmeeting | 14:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:32 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 6 14:32:10 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | thanks everyone | 14:32 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance_drivers/2015/glance_drivers.2015-10-06-14.01.html | 14:32 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance_drivers/2015/glance_drivers.2015-10-06-14.01.txt | 14:32 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance_drivers/2015/glance_drivers.2015-10-06-14.01.log.html | 14:32 |
| nikhil | I've heard about run-candies flaper87 rosmaita | 14:32 |
| rosmaita | bye! | 14:32 |
| nikhil | rum-candies | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | seriously, everything is a thing here | 14:32 |
| rosmaita | there are also whisky candies | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | EVERYTHING IS! | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | rosmaita: there are whisky pop-corns | 14:32 |
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| flaper87 | :) | 14:32 |
| flaper87 | not joking | 14:32 |
| rosmaita | whisky pop-corn will work | 14:33 |
| rosmaita | that's amazing | 14:33 |
| rosmaita | i am now super-motivated to finish that spec | 14:33 |
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| flaper87 | w000h000 | 14:33 |
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| crinkle | EmilienM: you're traveling, yes? | 14:59 |
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| EmilienM | crinkle: I'm boarding in ~30 min max | 15:00 |
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| mattymo1 | hi | 15:00 |
| crinkle | EmilienM: mmk | 15:00 |
| xarses | hi | 15:00 |
| yottatsa | hi | 15:00 |
| crinkle | #startmeeting puppet-openstack | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 6 15:00:20 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is crinkle. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| degorenko | o/ | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| sbadia | EmilienM: haha :) | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'puppet_openstack' | 15:00 |
| sbadia | hello | 15:00 |
| xarses | o/ | 15:00 |
| iberezovskiy | hi | 15:00 |
| iurygregory | hello o/ | 15:00 |
| skolekonov | hi | 15:00 |
| EmilienM | hello :) | 15:00 |
| mwhahaha | hi | 15:00 |
| angdraug | o/ | 15:00 |
| jasondotstar | o/ | 15:01 |
| crinkle | #topic Review past action items | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review past action items (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:01 | |
| jasondotstar | decided to join. | 15:01 |
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| crinkle | puppet team to review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/226830/ | 15:01 |
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| EmilienM | crinkle: thx for your reviews ^ we made good progress | 15:01 |
| dilyin | hi | 15:01 |
| crinkle | this went through a few more iterations since last week, I think it's close to done | 15:01 |
| crinkle | EmilienM: yep thanks for bearing with me :) | 15:01 |
| sbadia | wow a lot of reviews | 15:01 |
| EmilienM | ahah, that's cool :) | 15:01 |
| crinkle | all other action items look completed | 15:01 |
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| crinkle | #topic CI status | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CI status (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:02 | |
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| crinkle | EmilienM: want to give a quick update since you're here? | 15:02 |
| EmilienM | yeah so: | 15:02 |
| EmilienM | just fyi, we have now integration jobs in a better shape, since we have less services running on both jobs | 15:02 |
| EmilienM | the split was useful, and we should now carefuly interpret the job color | 15:02 |
| iurygregory | nice =) | 15:03 |
| EmilienM | crinkle: I'm pushing more documentation at the moment, so people can easily get onboarded | 15:03 |
| crinkle | cool | 15:03 |
| clayton | o/ | 15:03 |
| EmilienM | crinkle: I'm done for functional CI | 15:03 |
| sbadia | nice, thx EmilienM | 15:03 |
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| crinkle | #topic Kilo release (should happen next week): please backport bugs or small features | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Kilo release (should happen next week): please backport bugs or small features (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:04 | |
| crinkle | contributors please make sure your patches are backported, reviewers please be reviewing patches for the stable/kilo branch | 15:04 |
| crinkle | anything else we need to discuss on this? | 15:05 |
| EmilienM | also, call for volunteers | 15:05 |
| EmilienM | to help in release process (launchpad, release notes, etc) | 15:05 |
| sbadia | I can help on this | 15:05 |
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| EmilienM | please ping me and I'll schedule it with interested folks | 15:05 |
| jasondotstar | I'd like to help as well. | 15:05 |
| crinkle | #info ping Emilien to get involved with the kilo release | 15:06 |
| EmilienM | sbadia, jasondotstar: thanks, I'll come back to you | 15:06 |
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| crinkle | #action sbadia and jasondotstar signed up to help with kilo release | 15:06 |
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| sbadia | ack | 15:06 |
| jasondotstar | ack | 15:06 |
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| crinkle | #topic ability to override variables of 'params' class (e.g. service/package names) | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ability to override variables of 'params' class (e.g. service/package names) (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:07 | |
| crinkle | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/229918/ | 15:07 |
| crinkle | iberezovskiy: ? | 15:07 |
| iberezovskiy | crinkle, thanks | 15:07 |
| iberezovskiy | I want to discuss a problem with overriding default parameters which are hardcoded in 'params' classes. | 15:07 |
| iberezovskiy | Sometimes it's useful to override these params if their calculation (which depends on OS) is not appropriate | 15:07 |
| iberezovskiy | for users. They may want use antoher options for deployments (e.g. install packages from their custom mirrors | 15:07 |
| iberezovskiy | or install debian package on Ubuntu and so on). Current implementation of 'params' class | 15:07 |
| iberezovskiy | doesn't allow this functionality. I've prepared a patch with one of possible solution for this case | 15:07 |
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| iberezovskiy | I've added new 'globals' class with defaults from 'params', but with one important difference - we can change each varibale from that class. | 15:08 |
| iberezovskiy | btw, Email thread was started by Thomas Goirand (zigo) | 15:08 |
| iberezovskiy | #link https://www.mail-archive.com/openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org/msg64891.html | 15:08 |
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| mwhahaha | So is there a reason we can't use the other method of overriding these values with the <| |> syntax like we already do? | 15:08 |
| mwhahaha | is there something that is missing that requires the global.pp method? | 15:08 |
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| clayton | iberezovskiy: how does overriding via globals actually work in practice? | 15:09 |
| mwhahaha | https://github.com/stackforge/fuel-library/blob/deb63f09df23170207310f06ca4e12785d018dc2/deployment/puppet/openstack/manifests/nova/controller.pp#L399 | 15:09 |
| xarses | it seems over kill instead of adding the debian defaults | 15:10 |
| iberezovskiy | clayton, e.g. it work with mongodb module https://github.com/puppetlabs/puppetlabs-mongodb | 15:10 |
| crinkle | instead of using a globals class we could just have class parameters default to using params.pp, that way they can be overridden with whatever the user wants | 15:10 |
| crinkle | lots of classes have things like package_name => that can be overridden in that class for instance | 15:10 |
| iberezovskiy | crinkle, my globals class actually use 'params' by default | 15:10 |
| mwhahaha | xarses: the issue isn't debian defaults, it's trying to run debian packages on ubuntu | 15:11 |
| clayton | iberezovskiy: couldn't you do the same thing by instantiating the params class? | 15:11 |
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| xarses | mwhahaha: k | 15:11 |
| clayton | I'm in favor of the functionality, I'm just trying to understand this approach to the problem | 15:11 |
| mwhahaha | iberezovskiy: i think the question is instead of yet another class called globals, it's turning params into a parameterized class like globals | 15:11 |
| xarses | mwhahaha: ++ | 15:12 |
| crinkle | you can't have params be a parameterized class, because sometimes you have to inherit that class | 15:12 |
| clayton | ah, nod, I see | 15:12 |
| aglarendil | can we think of using hiera for this? | 15:12 |
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| clayton | aglarendil: I think you could just include the globals class and then set the parameters for it via hiera | 15:13 |
| iberezovskiy | mwhahaha, in case of <| |> you need to override every resource where parameter that you need to override can be used | 15:13 |
| mwhahaha | iberezovskiy: how many is that? | 15:13 |
| dilyin | service default provider issues -> I guess we need to add confine to the pacemaker provider | 15:13 |
| mwhahaha | iberezovskiy: just trying to understand the scope of the required changes, if it's one package that's not the end of the world | 15:13 |
| mwhahaha | if it's 100s then globals might be better | 15:13 |
| iberezovskiy | mwhahaha, a lot of thing are tied of service name for example | 15:14 |
| crinkle | I think adding parameters to existing classes is a lot easier than adding a globals class | 15:14 |
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| clayton | crinkle: well, and we already have those parameters in many cases. | 15:14 |
| mwhahaha | but with <||> we can just include a mos specific class that does <| |> for all of the mos packages/service names | 15:14 |
| Hunner | The parse order for globals is usually globals -> params -> init/server/client/etc to allow "global" parameter changes (hense the name) | 15:14 |
| clayton | mwhahaha: one downside to <||> in this case is that the collector silently fails if the package name ever changes. | 15:15 |
| Hunner | <||> is good for overriding resource parameters, but not logic that uses variables | 15:15 |
| crinkle | clayton: so what's the issue then? if users can already specify the debian package name if they want then aren't we done? | 15:15 |
| * EmilienM | 15:15 | |
| Hunner | And yeah, silent failures as clayton says | 15:15 |
| clayton | crinkle: I think I was agreeing with you :) | 15:15 |
| crinkle | clayton: aha :) | 15:15 |
| EmilienM | damn | 15:15 |
| EmilienM | I think crinkle is right, I like the idea | 15:15 |
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| iberezovskiy | crinkle, so if we need to override all 'params', we need to split them by classes, isn't? | 15:17 |
| Hunner | Is crinkles idea basically "add more base class parameters to override params values?" | 15:17 |
| clayton | I believe so. we already have it in place for a number of them | 15:17 |
| angdraug | so back to mwhahaha's question, how much work would that be? | 15:17 |
| iberezovskiy | crinkle, what about interclass dependencies? | 15:17 |
| clayton | I think the thought at one point was to move away from interclass dependencies where services are referenced by name | 15:18 |
| iberezovskiy | two classes requires one param, for one class it was overridden, for another wasn't | 15:18 |
| mattymo1 | like mysql service name? | 15:18 |
| Hunner | interclass dependencies should be on the class, not resources inside the class. It makes for a cleaner graph and easier groking | 15:19 |
| aglarendil | well, we could work with hiera hierarchy and put default parameters into default class and then fetch all hiera parameters at once | 15:19 |
| aglarendil | like %{operatingsystem}.yaml | 15:20 |
| crinkle | iberezovskiy: if two classes need the same value set then it should be up to the user to set it in both places | 15:20 |
| aglarendil | and add one additional override.yaml | 15:20 |
| clayton | Hunner: I think we need to move to handling them via named anchors personally, like this - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/216926/ | 15:20 |
| crinkle | the same as when we have to set a password in two different classes | 15:20 |
| Hunner | clayton: That looks nice, and of course is needed for class containment | 15:21 |
| clayton | it makes the dependencies a lot easier to deal with and requires less explicit ones | 15:21 |
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| angdraug | folks, time... | 15:23 |
| crinkle | does anyone else have thoughts about adding a globals class? | 15:24 |
| crinkle | or perhaps we should continue this on the mailing list? | 15:24 |
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| EmilienM | +1 for mailing list | 15:24 |
| iurygregory | ML is fine i think , get feedback ;) | 15:24 |
| iberezovskiy | let's continue in ML | 15:24 |
| aglarendil | +1 for ML | 15:24 |
| Hunner | If multiple independent classes need their params changed, globals is +1. If all classes can just inherit the base class, we could use that and not globals | 15:24 |
| EmilienM | since it does not sound we have a decision | 15:24 |
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| crinkle | #action continue globals topic on mailing list | 15:25 |
| crinkle | #topic Use OpenstackClient for nova providers auth | 15:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Use OpenstackClient for nova providers auth (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:25 | |
| crinkle | #link https://review.openstack.org/226862 | 15:25 |
| crinkle | #link https://review.openstack.org/229548 | 15:25 |
| degorenko | crinkle, hey o/ | 15:25 |
| crinkle | degorenko: ? | 15:25 |
| crinkle | hiya | 15:25 |
| degorenko | so, my patch with a new auth based on openstack client for puppet nova is ready now, i need review | 15:25 |
| degorenko | but there is one issue - nova_network provider will use old way auth based on nova client | 15:25 |
| degorenko | because openstack client doesn't provide such possibility - to manage nova networks | 15:26 |
| degorenko | so my question is: is it ok to mix two ways? | 15:26 |
| degorenko | nova-network is deprecated so, it can be removed later, i think | 15:26 |
| crinkle | i'm fine with it | 15:26 |
| clayton | +1 | 15:26 |
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| degorenko | then, guys, please review this: https://review.openstack.org/226862 and this one: https://review.openstack.org/229548 | 15:26 |
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| crinkle | #action reviewers review 226862 and 229548 | 15:27 |
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| crinkle | #topic blueprints: use-openstackclient-in-module-resources vs use-aviator-in-module-resources | 15:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints: use-openstackclient-in-module-resources vs use-aviator-in-module-resources (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:27 | |
| aglarendil | so I actually raised this topic | 15:28 |
| crinkle | aglarendil: these were approved a while ago, did you have questions on them? | 15:28 |
| EmilienM | w00t? | 15:28 |
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| aglarendil | well, actually, they contradict each other | 15:28 |
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| crinkle | yes, if you read the openstackclient one it overrides the aviator one | 15:28 |
| aglarendil | then the other one should be obsoleted | 15:29 |
| mattymo1 | except the openstackclient isn't so amazing( | 15:29 |
| aglarendil | but I think it should be vice versa | 15:29 |
| EmilienM | #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/puppet-openstack-specs/specs/juno/use-openstackclient-in-aviator-resources.html | 15:29 |
| aglarendil | we discussed ruby client for openstack providers in Atlanta | 15:29 |
| aglarendil | and I though it was a really nice idea | 15:29 |
| EmilienM | we have spent so much time about that, I don't think we will revert our current design. | 15:30 |
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| aglarendil | well, I think that ruby client is better | 15:30 |
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| aglarendil | but I failed to find an ML discussion on that | 15:30 |
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| EmilienM | aglarendil: crinkle did an awesome presentation in Vancouver about that | 15:30 |
| crinkle | aglarendil: let me find the discussion | 15:30 |
| EmilienM | aglarendil: a lot of things happened since Atlanta :-) | 15:30 |
| * EmilienM looking for crinkle's slides | 15:31 | |
| aglarendil | crinkle: EmilienM: okay, I will look into it and write an email to ML if I have any objections | 15:31 |
| crinkle | #link https://groups.google.com/a/puppetlabs.com/forum/#!searchin/puppet-openstack/aviator$20openstackclient/puppet-openstack/GJwDHNAFVYw/ayN4cdg3EW0J | 15:31 |
| EmilienM | #link http://www.slideshare.net/Colleen_Murphy/vancouver-presentation-48498077 | 15:31 |
| aglarendil | I personally think that ruby client will be much more effective, not to say that there is no ruby client for OpenStack which is kind of embarassing | 15:32 |
| EmilienM | that's a tl;dr about why we did that | 15:32 |
| aglarendil | at least for me :-) | 15:32 |
| EmilienM | aglarendil: go ahead and write it ! | 15:32 |
| aglarendil | EmilienM: thanks, I will read it and write my comments | 15:32 |
| crinkle | aglarendil: I think the deciding factor at the time was that we wanted keystone v3 support, which aviator didn't have and we didn't think would be added soon | 15:32 |
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| aglarendil | crinkle: the module has been abandoned for a while, but we could revive it actually | 15:32 |
| EmilienM | and using openstackclient actually help OpenStackClient team to improve it and get short feedback loop | 15:32 |
| crinkle | aglarendil: not the module, the library | 15:33 |
| aglarendil | we have volunteers here - e.g. dilyin | 15:33 |
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| clayton | EmilienM: yeah, but distros don't update openstackclient very often | 15:33 |
| dilyin | yes, I can take maintainership on the ruby-openstack library | 15:33 |
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| aglarendil | dilyin: or Aviator library which seems better | 15:33 |
| EmilienM | clayton: all our code is tested against UCA & RDO | 15:33 |
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| clayton | EmilienM: I know, I'm just saying that getting changes upstream in openstack client has a long feedback loop before we can use the results. | 15:34 |
| EmilienM | clayton: so we adjust the code to work with these distros | 15:34 |
| EmilienM | clayton: sometimes we don't use the client because a feature is not supported. | 15:34 |
| EmilienM | clayton: it's not that bad, we made lot of improvements | 15:34 |
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| EmilienM | clayton: do you have any blocker at this time? | 15:35 |
| clayton | nope | 15:35 |
| crinkle | aglarendil: will you bring this topic up on the mailing list? | 15:35 |
| aglarendil | crinkle: yep, sure | 15:35 |
| EmilienM | aglarendil: sorry to be that guy, but you're really late in the party to come and say "let's re-write everything in ruby" | 15:35 |
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| crinkle | #action aglarendil to bring up openstackclient vs aviator on mailing list | 15:36 |
| EmilienM | we already tried all (or almost) solutions and we decided to use the osclient for some reasons. | 15:36 |
| aglarendil | EmilienM: we can always discuss it and change it if we find more benfits for it than drawbacks | 15:36 |
| crinkle | #topic service default provider issues | 15:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "service default provider issues (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:37 | |
| crinkle | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/229095/ | 15:37 |
| crinkle | mwhahaha: ? | 15:37 |
| mwhahaha | The issue I'm running into is that the "<SERVICE DEFAULT>" value is being put into configs and used for some reason as part of our acceptance/unit tests. I thought this was supposed to be handled correctly but I don't think it is. | 15:37 |
| mwhahaha | It seems we only remove <SERVICE DEFAULT> in the exists? function within the openstack_config provider but we aren't checking if this is the value to prevent it from put into the configs. | 15:37 |
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| mwhahaha | see failures on that review | 15:38 |
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| clayton | I've got another review for service defaults that's also having acceptance failures that I can't seem to figure out, not sure if it's the same - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/230536/ | 15:38 |
| EmilienM | I wonder is spredzy is around | 15:39 |
| sbadia | EmilienM: no he is in the train | 15:40 |
| clayton | mwhahaha: My patch actually passed CI until I switched from a hard coded <SERVICE DEFAULT> to $::os_service_default. no idea why that would matter. | 15:40 |
| mwhahaha | me neither | 15:40 |
| mwhahaha | does puppet interpret string vs a global variable differently? | 15:41 |
| EmilienM | I've seen that failure too, in puppet-neutron | 15:41 |
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| mwhahaha | anyway just thought i'd mention it if anyone has any ideas | 15:43 |
| mwhahaha | guess we can move on | 15:43 |
| EmilienM | yeah, not sure the meeting is good place for debug | 15:43 |
| EmilienM | but we need to pay attention about that | 15:43 |
| crinkle | who was responsible for adding the fact? can we assign them responsibility for looking into this? | 15:43 |
| mwhahaha | i added it | 15:43 |
| crinkle | aha :) | 15:43 |
| mwhahaha | but i don't know how the provider is properly handling the '<SERVICE DEFAULT>' stuff | 15:43 |
| EmilienM | mwhahaha: you have to fix the world now ! | 15:43 |
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| crinkle | i don't have any ideas | 15:43 |
| mwhahaha | bunch of magic :/ | 15:44 |
| EmilienM | me neither but I'll take time to look later | 15:44 |
| iurygregory | big problem =X | 15:44 |
| clayton | crinkle: I don't think it's the fact, I've tested my patch locally and the fact seems to work fine | 15:44 |
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| clayton | I think it's an interaction issue | 15:44 |
| crinkle | clayton: hmmm | 15:44 |
| crinkle | mwhahaha: thanks for bringing it up, we'll help look into it | 15:45 |
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| crinkle | #topic openstack client timeouts and handling | 15:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "openstack client timeouts and handling (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:45 | |
| crinkle | mattymo, aglarendil, dilyin ? | 15:45 |
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| EmilienM | mwhahaha: we keep sync on ML about that ok? | 15:45 |
| mwhahaha | k | 15:45 |
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| aglarendil | I think we should discuss all the excetoption handling stuff there. not only timeouts | 15:47 |
| EmilienM | aglarendil: could you extend what you want to discuss exactly? | 15:47 |
| aglarendil | EmilienM: there are many operational intermittent issues which lead to providers failures | 15:47 |
| EmilienM | "exception handling stuff" is a bit general | 15:47 |
| EmilienM | aglarendil: exemples? | 15:48 |
| aglarendil | e.g. 503/401 errors which we could retry after a while | 15:48 |
| aglarendil | other example is 404 on deletion of the resource | 15:48 |
| aglarendil | and so on | 15:48 |
| EmilienM | afik our providers already have timeouts handling | 15:48 |
| EmilienM | glance_image for sure | 15:48 |
| crinkle | it's built into the base provider | 15:48 |
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| EmilienM | in openstacklib, right | 15:49 |
| aglarendil | EmilienM: I think I overlooked it somehow | 15:49 |
| aglarendil | okay, which ML thread are we talking about? could you post a link? | 15:49 |
| EmilienM | look https://github.com/openstack/puppet-openstacklib/blob/master/lib/puppet/provider/openstack.rb | 15:49 |
| mattymo1 | sorry I stepped away for a second | 15:50 |
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| EmilienM | aglarendil: I'm not sure we're talking about a ML thread now | 15:50 |
| EmilienM | topics are appreciated when they are prepared, we have a short timing guys | 15:50 |
| mattymo1 | 1 is retry on certain codes.. the second is how we should treat the openstack client process if it hangs beyond timeout | 15:50 |
| aglarendil | EmilienM: so you wrote a message to mwhahaha about the previous topic | 15:50 |
| mattymo1 | if the API doesn't ever respond, that process runs infinitely and eats all CPU and takes down the host | 15:51 |
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| EmilienM | aglarendil: I asked him to use ML to keep synchronised about our investigations | 15:51 |
| mattymo1 | should puppet be responsible for this or openstackclient code itself? | 15:51 |
| EmilienM | yes | 15:51 |
| aglarendil | mattymo1: I think we should not trust openstackclient code as we are operators | 15:51 |
| EmilienM | openstackclient is not supposed to retry by itself | 15:51 |
| aglarendil | and should wrap it with exceptions on our own | 15:52 |
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| EmilienM | aglarendil: trust? osclient is part of openstack, you need to trust it. | 15:52 |
| crinkle | I think right now we only handle 401 or getting the message "Unable to establish connection", I think the providers would benefit from better error handling ane retries in http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/puppet-openstacklib/tree/lib/puppet/provider/openstack.rb#n55 | 15:52 |
| aglarendil | EmilienM: should I cite House M. D. that everyone lies ?-) | 15:52 |
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| EmilienM | aglarendil: I would apprecaite more productive topics and discussion | 15:53 |
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| aglarendil | EmilienM: okay - I will rephrase it | 15:53 |
| aglarendil | we do not control openstackclient completely and we should be able to | 15:54 |
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| EmilienM | we have 7 min left, not sure there is any decision we can take. If you have concerns about openstackclient usage, start an open discussion on the ML | 15:54 |
| aglarendil | react properly on its misbehaviour or other intermittent issues | 15:54 |
| aglarendil | okay, will do | 15:54 |
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| EmilienM | aglarendil: like crinkle said, you can look at http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/puppet-openstacklib/tree/lib/puppet/provider/openstack.rb#n55 and see what is missing | 15:54 |
| crinkle | aglarendil: I do see advantage in adding better error handling and retries, please feel free to make patches there | 15:54 |
| clayton | aglarendil: we've put puppet-healthcheck between a lot of the web services and providers, to avoid issues with services not being up | 15:55 |
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| EmilienM | the feedback from operators would be useful to improve this provider | 15:55 |
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| aglarendil | EmilienM: I put it onto my drafts list - will follow up in ML | 15:55 |
| crinkle | excellent | 15:55 |
| EmilienM | aglarendil: cool thx | 15:56 |
| crinkle | #topic Open Discussion, Bug and Review triage | 15:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion, Bug and Review triage (Meeting topic: puppet-openstack)" | 15:56 | |
| EmilienM | crinkle: I'm boarding now - thx again for leading the meeting | 15:56 |
| crinkle | EmilienM: have a good flight! | 15:56 |
| EmilienM | thx, see you in pdx | 15:56 |
| crinkle | there are a few patches listed on https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/puppet-openstack-weekly-meeting-20151006 to look at | 15:56 |
| crinkle | any other patches or bugs folks want to bring up in the next couple minutes? | 15:57 |
| degorenko | yep: https://review.openstack.org/219275 :) | 15:57 |
| iurygregory | anyone good with acceptance can take a look at - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/208054/ | 15:57 |
| iurygregory | =) | 15:57 |
| * crinkle will look at those after the meeting | 15:58 | |
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| aderyugin | one more: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/218234/ | 15:58 |
| crinkle | alright, thanks everyone | 15:59 |
| crinkle | #endmeeting | 15:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 6 15:59:54 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/puppet_openstack/2015/puppet_openstack.2015-10-06-15.00.html | 15:59 |
| sbadia | thanks! | 15:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/puppet_openstack/2015/puppet_openstack.2015-10-06-15.00.txt | 16:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/puppet_openstack/2015/puppet_openstack.2015-10-06-15.00.log.html | 16:00 |
| iberezovskiy | thanks | 16:00 |
| mugsie | #startmeeting Kosmos | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 6 16:00:18 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is mugsie. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Kosmos)" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'kosmos' | 16:00 |
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| dougwig | O/ | 16:00 |
| mugsie | o/ | 16:00 |
| mugsie | give people a few minutes to file in ... | 16:00 |
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| dougwig | Walking into office myself. Post flu shot. | 16:00 |
| johnsom | o/ | 16:01 |
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| mugsie | dougwig: ouch. I had to stop getting them | 16:01 |
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| elarson | o/ | 16:01 |
| KunalGandhi | o/ | 16:01 |
| mugsie | i think thats quorum | 16:01 |
| mugsie | #topic Action Items from last week | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Action Items from last week (Meeting topic: Kosmos)" | 16:01 | |
| mugsie | ALL Review arch spec | 16:02 |
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| mugsie | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223663/ | 16:02 |
| mugsie | there was a flurry of reviews yesterday :) | 16:02 |
| johnsom | I started a trend | 16:02 |
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| mugsie | so we can call this done I think ... | 16:02 |
| mugsie | yeah, of -1s | 16:02 |
| mugsie | :D | 16:02 |
| mugsie | #topic Architecture | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Architecture (Meeting topic: Kosmos)" | 16:03 | |
| johnsom | Well, we should talk about the pools | 16:03 |
| mugsie | #link http://docs-draft.openstack.org/63/223663/3/check/gate-kosmos-specs-docs/2e30f04//doc/build/html/specs/liberty/sysarch.html | 16:03 |
| mugsie | yeah, that was in the sub items for the arch | 16:03 |
| mugsie | for those who didnt see my last comment on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223663/ | 16:03 |
| mugsie | One question that has occurred to me ... | 16:04 |
| mugsie | Do we need pools? | 16:04 |
| mugsie | My understanding is that pools are to allow multiple (IP L3 port numbers, not neutron) ports on a single LB. | 16:04 |
| mugsie | For 99% of GLB solutions we just route traffic to an IP for *all* port numbers (by the very nature of GLB - it is usually DNS, or in some cases anycasting) | 16:04 |
| mugsie | So, can we simplify this, by adding members directly to a lb? Or am I sleep deprived and missing something? | 16:04 |
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| dougwig | mugsie: the pool is a good spot to collect the lb algorithm, hang monitors, etc. | 16:04 |
| johnsom | I was wondering about the relationship between pool and monitor | 16:05 |
| dougwig | you can do that directly in the front-end object, yes, but then you can't reuse pools | 16:05 |
| mugsie | sure, but my question is, how would multiple pools work? or do we make it a single pool per lb? | 16:05 |
| mugsie | dougwig: re use is a good point | 16:05 |
| johnsom | It seems like monitors should be a child of the pool | 16:06 |
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| johnsom | In the reuse case you would have multiple monitors hitting the endpoints | 16:06 |
| mugsie | so, adding a pool_id to the loadbalancer,. and removing the join table, and move monitors to the pools? | 16:06 |
| dougwig | that'd be my vote, yes. | 16:07 |
| johnsom | My vote would be move monitor to pools | 16:07 |
| mugsie | johnsom: and keep multiple pools per LB? | 16:08 |
| johnsom | At the moment I can't think of a good use case for multiple pools per lb | 16:08 |
| dougwig | i would go M:1 for lb:pool, which implies pool_id in lb. i don't see much use yet for M:N there. | 16:08 |
| mugsie | cool. | 16:09 |
| johnsom | I guess only if you want to monitor some endpoints differently than others, but that is strange | 16:09 |
| mugsie | any other thoughts from everyone? | 16:09 |
| dougwig | johnsom: that'd be a second pool, i'd think. | 16:09 |
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| mugsie | if I get these up by end of day today, can we try and merge this week? | 16:09 |
| johnsom | Yes | 16:09 |
| mugsie | (unless there is more issues of course) | 16:10 |
| KunalGandhi | the GSLB that we use in the real use case has mostly 1-1 bwtween loadbalancer and pool | 16:10 |
| johnsom | If you don't see my vote, nag | 16:10 |
| dougwig | ditto | 16:10 |
| mugsie | will do | 16:10 |
| mugsie | KunalGandhi: great. looks like we are converging | 16:10 |
| mugsie | #topic Billing Model | 16:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Billing Model (Meeting topic: Kosmos)" | 16:10 | |
| mugsie | so, last week people brought up the idea of "billing per DNS request" | 16:11 |
| johnsom | Yes | 16:11 |
| mugsie | I dont think we will have a complete idea this week, but can people think about if this is the only model? | 16:11 |
| mugsie | as if we want to do that, we will need to go annoy the designate ptl | 16:12 |
| mugsie | and he is a real pain to deal with :) | 16:12 |
| KunalGandhi | billing per load balancer, billing per regional vip ? | 16:12 |
| dougwig | we really need our operators to speak up on this one. i don't think enterprises or vendors care much. | 16:12 |
| mugsie | (designate made a policy decission last year *not* to support DNS query stat collection) | 16:13 |
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| dougwig | mugsie: can you share background on why not? | 16:13 |
| mugsie | cost of doing the actual collection, cost of transforming the data, and the complexity of matching DNS Request logs to projects | 16:14 |
| mugsie | by running something in front of bind to collect the data, it can halve the through put of thaty DNS server | 16:14 |
| johnsom | I guess there are two billing options that come to mind for GSLB: 1. flat rate (you have one) 2. per query processed. Are there others? | 16:14 |
| dougwig | i can see that logging could be more expensive than a udp query. | 16:14 |
| mugsie | and for designate there was a massive complexity in how we would do it for multiple DNS servers | 16:15 |
| dougwig | how does route 53 bill? i can look it up if no one knows off the top of their head. | 16:15 |
| mugsie | flat + queries | 16:15 |
| mugsie | afaik | 16:15 |
| elarson | wouldn't monitoring queries be dependent on the dns server backend? | 16:15 |
| mugsie | elarson: yup | 16:15 |
| dougwig | zones + health checks + queries + geo queries | 16:16 |
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| dougwig | had to google it | 16:16 |
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| elarson | sounds like it would be up to an operator then to find a way to do that then | 16:16 |
| elarson | for example proxy in front with logs that get pushed and analyzed | 16:17 |
| mugsie | yeah, but designate would have to have a consistant API for us to collect that data into Kosmos, or they would have to add it to the kosmos bill later | 16:17 |
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| mugsie | but, I think this does need further thought | 16:17 |
| dougwig | indeed | 16:17 |
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| mugsie | come back to this in a week or so? | 16:18 |
| elarson | right, I'm saying it doesn't seem to be something supportable by the API. but +1 on more thinking about it | 16:18 |
| dougwig | mugsie: maybe this is a good f2f topic for the summit. | 16:18 |
| mugsie | yeah | 16:19 |
| dougwig | pull in some designate folks. | 16:19 |
| mugsie | yeah, i think we can get them in a room / hallway | 16:19 |
| mugsie | #topic Open Discussion | 16:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Kosmos)" | 16:19 | |
| johnsom | pub... | 16:19 |
| mugsie | on that note - who is going to be in Tokyo? | 16:19 |
| elarson | o/ | 16:20 |
| johnsom | I will be attending | 16:20 |
| dougwig | me | 16:20 |
| mugsie | We do not have offical summit time, but we can rob tables in the hallway etc | 16:20 |
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| mugsie | cool. we should arange to sync during the week then | 16:20 |
| mugsie | and I need to go hunt down the neutron PTL, and figure out midcycle dates - watch this space for that | 16:21 |
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| dougwig | agreed. or arrange an evening social thing. or both. | 16:21 |
| mugsie | yeah, definitly | 16:22 |
| mugsie | any other off agenda topics? | 16:22 |
| johnsom | Sounds good. I also plan to have a small section in the LBaaS and beyond talk to introduce Kosmos | 16:22 |
| dougwig | good. | 16:22 |
| dougwig | we did a short intro of it at the silicon valley "summit" as well. | 16:22 |
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| * elarson plans on eating lots of sushi... if anyone was curious ;) | 16:22 | |
| mugsie | great :) | 16:22 |
| johnsom | Cool, slides to donate? | 16:22 |
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| dougwig | we did it etherpad style. | 16:23 |
| johnsom | Ok | 16:23 |
| dougwig | let me dig it out, for content at least. | 16:23 |
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| mugsie | OK, any other topics? | 16:25 |
| mugsie | I have a few crazy ideas floating around, but I need to clarify them in my own head | 16:25 |
| dougwig | scotch can help order thoughts. | 16:25 |
| johnsom | +1 | 16:26 |
| mugsie | scotch?? Your telling an irish man to drink scotch? :P | 16:26 |
| xgerman | dougwig is cruel | 16:26 |
| mugsie | we make pretty good whiskey ourselves :D | 16:26 |
| dougwig | if your country made better whisky, i'd say otherwise. | 16:26 |
| elarson | mugsie: fine, I'll drink it. | 16:26 |
| xgerman | also for mid cycle can we combine that withe the L4-L7 midscycle? | 16:26 |
| dougwig | :) | 16:26 |
| mugsie | dougwig: harsh :) | 16:27 |
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| mugsie | xgerman: where is that? | 16:27 |
| xgerman | TBD | 16:27 |
| mugsie | OK. will sync with people on the mid cycle front | 16:28 |
| mugsie | #action mugsie start mid cycle planning | 16:28 |
| mugsie | ok, people want 30 mins back? | 16:28 |
| mugsie | silence is agreement | 16:29 |
| johnsom | Sounds good to me | 16:29 |
| mugsie | #endmeeting | 16:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:29 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 6 16:29:28 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:29 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/kosmos/2015/kosmos.2015-10-06-16.00.html | 16:29 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/kosmos/2015/kosmos.2015-10-06-16.00.txt | 16:29 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/kosmos/2015/kosmos.2015-10-06-16.00.log.html | 16:29 |
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