Friday, 2015-03-06

jlkyeah, you can just tar up a venv and distribute it via tar. Unpack, run python from inside the venv, done. Don't even need pip or virtualenv on the box.00:00
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mgagnejlk: not sure how it's dealing with native extension.00:07
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dvorakjlk: personally I hate reprepro.  it's poorly documented and the config is kind of obscure imo01:38
dvorakbut I also think most of the debian build tools are crappy01:39
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muxthey're not crappy, they're advanced!01:54
mux...so advanced they're almost unusable for anyone maintaining less than 10,000 packages01:55
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jlkdvorak: oh yeah, I'm not a fan of anything Debian based. We're not using reprepro AFAIK, we're using Aptly.03:58
jlkif I had my way, we wouldn't be using packages, but if we were, we'd be doing things on a CentOS7 based system. Yum has its warts, but the repo stuff is pretty solid.03:58
jlkor at least I understand it a lot better03:58
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dvorakI don't really care about apt vs yum, but the tooling for building RPMs is a lot less cobbled together than dpkg in my experience12:32
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purpDvorak: +12. All packagers have their quirks and foibles, and RPM succeeds by having fewer and having been groomed by long experience and deep passion.16:39
purpjlk: what if not packages? Curious and want to learn.16:40
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mgagnedvorak: I didn't have any "real" problems with reprepro, I found it very easy to use in fact. But I could be the victim of the stockholm syndrome too =)17:00
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klindgren_purp_away,  I would imagine that anything other than packages would be either venv's or containers17:21
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jlkpurp_away: oh hai. Packages adds a layer of complexity without really providing any benefits.17:27
jlkpurp_away: you have to add structure around creating packages, patching packages, pushing packages into a repository, tracking built package versions, etc...17:27
jlkwhich is a lot more work than just grabbing a hash from a git repo and building a venv out of it17:28
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jlknone of the traditional packaging benefits apply. We can't let the package manage the running service. We don't want the package once installed to overwrite the existing files, we don't want the package to manage its dependencies (as we're highly opinionated about what deps should be there anyway).17:30
jlkpurp_away: so I just don't really see a lot of benefit out of it for the amount of extra work that goes into managing the services in package format.17:30
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purp_awayjlk: Thanks, good perspective and food for thought.17:53
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jlkpurp: happy to chat more about it in person when we meet up. I know it's strange, me coming from the world of Packaging at Red Hat, but I have opinions :)17:55
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purpNot at all. Assuming you'll be in Philly next week?18:17
purpjlk: If not, I'll be in Seattle late March.18:18
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jlkpurp_away: I'll be in Philly.18:27
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klindgren_neutron cli is a horrible horrible pile of crap and should die in a fire.19:38
klindgren_The documentation for arguments that commands accept is completely wrong19:39
klindgren_IE: neutron security-group-list accepts --all-tenents - but thats not documetned anywhere it also accets --tenant-id also not documented19:39
klindgren_and you can ask for it to give you -Field tenant_id and the json response will have it - but the client refuses to print it out - even though you can see it returned in the response when you enable debug19:40
jlkopenstackclient isn't much better19:44
klindgren_*sigh* to get tenant_id to show up you need to specify it as an output column19:51
klindgren_via -c tenant_id19:52
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PietIf you have an hour to spare next week, the UX team is running a moderated card sort study using google hangouts to validate the Horizon information architecture - sign up here http://doodle.com/xs6ixvh9es7dkgc422:40
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