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| zaneb | #startmeeting heat | 12:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 11 12:00:36 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is zaneb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 12:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 12:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:00 | |
| *** mspreitz has joined #openstack-meeting | 12:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'heat' | 12:00 |
| mspreitz | o/ | 12:01 |
| zaneb | who is here? | 12:01 |
| sorantis | hi | 12:01 |
| skraynev | good day all | 12:01 |
| shardy | o/ | 12:01 |
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| BillArnold_ | hi | 12:01 |
| therve | /o/ | 12:01 |
| tspatzier | hi all | 12:01 |
| kirankv | hi | 12:01 |
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| pas-ha | hi all | 12:04 |
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| zb | sorry guys, unplanned reboot | 12:05 |
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| zb | I guess gnome shell doesn't like mornings either | 12:05 |
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| shardy | xfce ftw ;) | 12:05 |
| zb | lol | 12:06 |
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| zb | just have to wait for zaneb to timeout so I can reclaim that username and use meetingbot | 12:06 |
| zb | sigh | 12:06 |
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| tspatzier | go | 12:06 |
| zb | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/HeatAgenda | 12:07 |
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| zaneb | #topic Review last meeting's actions | 12:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review last meeting's actions (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:07 | |
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| zaneb | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2014/heat.2014-06-04-20.00.html | 12:08 |
| zaneb | andrew_plunk is presumably not here | 12:08 |
| zaneb | #action zaneb sync with andrew_plunk on rackspace CI job | 12:08 |
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| skraynev | same for stevebaker, I suppose | 12:09 |
| zaneb | yep | 12:09 |
| zaneb | #action zaneb sync with stevebaker on heat-slow job & making it voting | 12:09 |
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| shardy | That's been looking pretty good lately | 12:09 |
| zaneb | #action zaneb sync with stevebaker on metadata api compat patch | 12:10 |
| zaneb | yeah, the gate is looking remarkably stable atm | 12:10 |
| zaneb | #topic Adding items to the agenda | 12:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adding items to the agenda (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:10 | |
| zaneb | anybody? | 12:10 |
| zaneb | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/HeatAgenda | 12:10 |
| pas-ha | not really stable, getting this quite often http://logs.openstack.org/13/99113/1/check/check-tempest-dsvm-full/e6eeb2c/logs/screen-h-eng.txt.gz?level=TRACE | 12:11 |
| mspreitz | ResourceDefinition and plugin API stability | 12:11 |
| mspreitz | and identifying the plugin API | 12:11 |
| zaneb | mspreitz: ok | 12:11 |
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| zaneb | pas-ha: that looks worrying | 12:12 |
| zaneb | #topic Mid-cycle meetup | 12:12 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Mid-cycle meetup (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:12 | |
| pas-ha | at least two time in a row in a recheck | 12:12 |
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| BillArnold_ | zaneb i saw that sql problem yesterday, once. | 12:13 |
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| zaneb | it sounds like there is not a lot of point in holding a mid-cycle meetup in conjunction with TripleO | 12:13 |
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| zaneb | since key people like SpamapS and shadower can't be there | 12:13 |
| shardy | zaneb: Really? I thought that was the plan? | 12:13 |
| zaneb | and tbh I would rather not cancel my holiday if it's not going to be for something useful | 12:14 |
| zaneb | SpamapS suggested we split out the Heat one and hold it in August | 12:14 |
| zaneb | is there any support for that? | 12:14 |
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| skraynev | also about gate was such bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/heat/+bug/1328669 , but I have not met it . | 12:14 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1328669 in heat "Failure in neutron SetUp class during check-tempest-dsvm-neutron-heat-slow" [Undecided,New] | 12:14 |
| tspatzier | zaneb: August would be fine for me, but only the first half - and ok with splitting it out if there are enough topics | 12:15 |
| shardy | zaneb: If we're not going to be doing a combined meetup, I think we need to work out some other way to improve TripleO-Heat communication | 12:15 |
| jcoufal | as the organizer of TripleO meeting, it was very hard to find dates | 12:15 |
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| shardy | as there still seems to be a lack of regular information flow between the teams re issues and requirements | 12:15 |
| jcoufal | SpamapS cand do only second half of August | 12:16 |
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| jcoufal | and there are other people who can't do it that time | 12:16 |
| mspreitz | Does that even qualify as mid-cycle? | 12:16 |
| zaneb | shardy: agreed. the idea would be to do it at a time where we could get the key TripleO people like SpamapS and shadower (who understand Heat already) there | 12:16 |
| jcoufal | and furthermore late August it is very close to feature freeze which from my point of view doesn't make big sense | 12:16 |
| zaneb | mspreitz: it's not at the summit, so yes :) | 12:17 |
| shadower_ | zaneb: time-wise I'm fine any time in August | 12:18 |
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| jcoufal | but if you decide to split, it would be great to have people from Heat at TripleO meetup and vice-versa | 12:18 |
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| zaneb | shardy: would you prefer to go ahead with the combined one? | 12:18 |
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| shardy | zaneb: I think as jcoufal says, it would be very helpful to have at least a few folks representing heat/tripleo respectively if we do split | 12:20 |
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| shardy | zaneb: I was just under the impression combined was the way we were headed based on the ML discussion, but provided we can get at least a couple of TripleO representatives along when we meet, I'm flexible | 12:21 |
| shardy | zaneb: what I *really* want to avoid is getting to Paris then hearing we're not meeting TripleO requirements because we didn't know about them.. | 12:21 |
| zaneb | ok, let's discuss with SpamapS when he wakes up | 12:22 |
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| zaneb | yeah, that would be good to avoid :) | 12:22 |
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| zaneb | unfortunately there are no really good answers here except to plan the _next_ midcycle meetup _before_ the summit so that everyone can arrange their calendars around it | 12:23 |
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| jcoufal | also if you think about the split, think about dates, because there wasn't very big agreement on August dates as well | 12:23 |
| shardy | Yeah, and trying to orgainize such an event around summer holiday time is always going to be difficult | 12:23 |
| zaneb | yeah, the summer one is always going to be harder | 12:24 |
| zaneb | and in this case even the idea of having a meetup wasn't on the radar before summit | 12:24 |
| zaneb | #topic Plugin API stability | 12:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Plugin API stability (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:24 | |
| zaneb | we discussed this a little last week | 12:25 |
| zaneb | mspreitz: but I gather you want to continue that | 12:25 |
| mspreitz | Perusing the code, it is not obvious to me that there is a well-defined plugin API | 12:25 |
| mspreitz | the plugin gets its hands on the Resource, and can poke around any way it wants | 12:25 |
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| mspreitz | This was inspired by wondering whether ResourceDefinition changes the plugin API | 12:26 |
| zaneb | agreed, the boundaries of what is public are not well-defined | 12:26 |
| zaneb | mspreitz: it does not | 12:26 |
| zaneb | at least, not yet | 12:26 |
| mspreitz | The handle_update method gets new snippet, right? | 12:26 |
| zaneb | but there is stuff we will want to deprecate and eventually remove | 12:26 |
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| zaneb | mspreitz: yes, but it's backwards-compatible for now though | 12:27 |
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| shardy | mspreitz: well, I'd say what we document should stay as stable as possible, e.g http://docs.openstack.org/developer/heat/pluginguide.html | 12:28 |
| mspreitz | But the point of ResourceDefinition is to move away from snippets | 12:28 |
| zaneb | http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/heat/tree/heat/engine/rsrc_defn.py#n259 | 12:28 |
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| zaneb | it's all explained in that docstring ^ | 12:28 |
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| mspreitz | I'm having trouble understanding it... | 12:30 |
| mspreitz | "This class ... will eventually be deprecated and replaced by ResourceDefinition" | 12:30 |
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| zaneb | ResourceDefinitionCore | 12:30 |
| mspreitz | oh, right | 12:31 |
| mspreitz | So ResourceDefinition is intended to look like a JSON snippet? | 12:31 |
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| zaneb | exactly | 12:31 |
| zaneb | so at some point we delete it and write ResourceDefinition = ResourceDefinitionCore | 12:32 |
| shardy | zaneb: And after we work out plugin interface versioning, we might be able to lose the compatibility shim, right? | 12:32 |
| zaneb | but that will only be after a deprecation period | 12:32 |
| zaneb | shardy: hopefully | 12:32 |
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| zaneb | it seems like with this whole convergence business we _may_ end up needing an entirely new plugin api | 12:33 |
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| mspreitz | OK, so the current plan is there is an API change in the works, and it is to be done with compatability for a while | 12:33 |
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| zaneb | mspreitz: yeah, I think that's a fair summary | 12:34 |
| zaneb | the policy we came up with last week is to deprecate for at least an entire release cycle before removing | 12:34 |
| mspreitz | I think ResourceDefinitionCore is at least a move in the right direction for Convergence | 12:34 |
| mspreitz | It might be most of what is needed | 12:34 |
| zaneb | that's good, because I came up with it before the convergence idea was on the table :) | 12:35 |
| mspreitz | Is there any thought about how plugin API versioning might be done? | 12:35 |
| zaneb | candidly, no | 12:35 |
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| zaneb | ideas welcome on that | 12:36 |
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| mspreitz | The first thought that comes to my mind is this: plugin sports something that identifies API version it likes, engine examines that and calls plugin appropriately | 12:36 |
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| shardy | yay, problem solved ;) | 12:37 |
| skraynev | shardy: lol | 12:37 |
| zaneb | the first thought that comes to mind for me is that we have Resource, ResourceV2, &c. classes that plugins can inherit from | 12:38 |
| zaneb | seems like it could get messy though | 12:38 |
| mspreitz | Different base classes sounds like a particular edition of what I said | 12:39 |
| mspreitz | and yes, it can get messy | 12:39 |
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| mspreitz | But what worries me most is the surface area of the API | 12:39 |
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| mspreitz | The Guide today says what the plugin must implement, but puts no limit on how much the plugin gets into the Resource guts | 12:40 |
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| zaneb | yeah, and in retrospect we could have been a bit more explicit with e.g. naming things with a leading underscore to indicate what parts of the api should and should not be considered stable | 12:41 |
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| shardy | zaneb: I wonder if we can look at existing stuff like stevedore and see if defining the abstract interfaces via that might help | 12:41 |
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| mspreitz | Could we move towards a naming convention that identifies public part? | 12:42 |
| mspreitz | I am not familiar with Stevedore; is there a short sharp summary? | 12:42 |
| shardy | http://stevedore.readthedocs.org/ | 12:42 |
| shardy | ceilometer uses it | 12:43 |
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| zaneb | shardy: maybe. I like to think that e.g. the parser plugins are a bit more explicit | 12:43 |
| zaneb | I don't think it's a matter of using a particular tool so much as designing the API with plugins in mind | 12:44 |
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| zaneb | our Resource implementation existed before the idea of plugins was even considered | 12:44 |
| zaneb | and it's just been hacks on top of hacks ever since ;) | 12:44 |
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| shardy | zaneb: Yeah, I've not got personal experience with it, just wondering if we can leverage existing stuff instead of too much wheel reinvention | 12:45 |
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| shardy | probably worth a bit of investigation and/or chatting to the ceilometer folks | 12:46 |
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| zaneb | shardy: if you look at http://stevedore.readthedocs.org/en/latest/tutorial/creating_plugins.html#a-plugin-base-class | 12:46 |
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| zaneb | there's nothing stopping us from doing that right now | 12:47 |
| zaneb | and in fact the parser plugins look a lot like that | 12:47 |
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| zaneb | it's nothing to do with stevedore per se | 12:47 |
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| zaneb | #topic Critical issues sync | 12:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Critical issues sync (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:48 | |
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| zaneb | shardy: do we have any critical issues? | 12:48 |
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| tspatzier | BillArnold_: do you want to talk about the performance issue? | 12:48 |
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| shardy | BillArnold_: was good to hear my auth_token patch helped | 12:49 |
| skraynev | tspatzier: you mean performance between havana and icehouse ? or something else? | 12:49 |
| tspatzier | yeah, I saw the update to the bug. so is there something else, or is it good now? | 12:50 |
| BillArnold_ | mspreitz yes, i tried shardys token patch yesterday and it improved performance of stack create rest calls to close to havana levels. | 12:50 |
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| tspatzier | https://bugs.launchpad.net/heat/+bug/1324102 | 12:50 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1324102 in heat "Slowdown in create stack request between Havana and Icehouse" [Medium,New] | 12:50 |
| BillArnold_ | shardy i'm wondering if there are simply more calls to keystone | 12:50 |
| shardy | tspatzier: well the profiling indicates the auth overhead didn't cause the slowdown, because we were doing it the slow way in Havana as well as Icehouse | 12:50 |
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| shardy | BillArnold_: actually, there were more calls in Havana, because we created clients for both v2 and v3 | 12:51 |
| pas-ha | BillArnold_, could that be due to token/request size increase? | 12:51 |
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| shardy | It *could* be that v3 calls are just more expensive though | 12:51 |
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| BillArnold_ | shardy perhaps. more profiling is in order. | 12:51 |
| shardy | BillArnold_: +1 | 12:52 |
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| zaneb | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/heat/+bug/1324102 | 12:52 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1324102 in heat "Slowdown in create stack request between Havana and Icehouse" [Medium,New] | 12:52 |
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| BillArnold_ | shardy ok. would uuid vs pki make a difference? | 12:52 |
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| shardy | BillArnold_: quite possibly | 12:52 |
| BillArnold_ | shardy will do more profiling today then. | 12:53 |
| mspreitz | How are UUID and Public Key Infrastructure alternatives? | 12:53 |
| BillArnold_ | shardy are there any recommended tools for profiling? I was just adding a decorator for entry/exit. | 12:53 |
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| zaneb | mspreitz: it's more keystone tokens vs. signatures | 12:55 |
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| shardy | BillArnold_: I don't have any specific reccomendations for python, sorry, I've used oprofile in the past but mostly for profiling C apps. | 12:56 |
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| BillArnold_ | shardy entry/exit logging is sufficient | 12:57 |
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| shardy | mspreitz: I think the question was, if you were using uuid on Havana, then move to Icehouse while at the same time switching to PKI tokens, does everything keystone related get much more expensive | 12:57 |
| shardy | answer is probably yes. | 12:58 |
| mspreitz | shardy: thanks | 12:58 |
| zaneb | ok, time is about up | 12:59 |
| mspreitz | Does anybody here understand Boris' rally? | 12:59 |
| mspreitz | it is about performance profiling | 12:59 |
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| mspreitz | That is about the sum total of my knowledge | 13:00 |
| zaneb | #endmeeting | 13:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 13:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 11 13:00:08 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 13:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2014/heat.2014-06-11-12.00.html | 13:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2014/heat.2014-06-11-12.00.txt | 13:00 |
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| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2014/heat.2014-06-11-12.00.log.html | 13:00 |
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| * annegentle waves | 14:00 | |
| annegentle | who's here for the doc team meeting? | 14:00 |
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| annegentle | heya | 14:01 |
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| Sam-I-Am | hi | 14:01 |
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| annegentle | guess it's just us for now | 14:01 |
| Sam-I-Am | i think we used to be in -alt for this one... | 14:01 |
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| annegentle | yeah | 14:01 |
| gpocentek | o/ | 14:01 |
| phil_h | I am | 14:01 |
| annegentle | ok great! | 14:01 |
| annegentle | Go ahead | 14:01 |
| Sam-I-Am | phil_h: can you pick up any lost souls? | 14:01 |
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| Sam-I-Am | #startmeeting docteam | 14:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 11 14:01:45 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Sam-I-Am. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:01 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'docteam' | 14:01 |
| annegentle | thanks | 14:01 |
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| annegentle | Sam-I-Am started so I can leave early, my apologies but an appt. I can't miss. | 14:02 |
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| annegentle | Here's the agenda | 14:02 |
| annegentle | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/DocTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 14:02 |
| Sam-I-Am | i have it up... | 14:02 |
| Sam-I-Am | #topic action items from last meeting | 14:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "action items from last meeting (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:02 | |
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| annegentle | Let's review the action items | 14:02 |
| dianefleming | good morning | 14:02 |
| annegentle | both were Andreas's and he's out this week and next | 14:02 |
| annegentle | morning dianefleming! | 14:02 |
| annegentle | Andreas will streamline the Documentation/HowTo page | 14:03 |
| Sam-I-Am | the last apac meeting mostly didnt happen, so this goes back to 5/21 | 14:03 |
| annegentle | and we're abandoning the separate writers guide | 14:03 |
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| annegentle | that's it for actions | 14:03 |
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| Sam-I-Am | #topic training team migration | 14:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "training team migration (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:03 | |
| annegentle | Let's discus the Training team move to separate repo; looking for core reviewers | 14:03 |
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| annegentle | The repo is now set up since https://review.openstack.org/#/c/96334/8 merged | 14:04 |
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| annegentle | Next I'll propose the change to the governance repo to point to it under the Documentation Program | 14:04 |
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| berendt | i can support with reviewing the training guide | 14:04 |
| annegentle | berendt: great! | 14:04 |
| Sam-I-Am | sarob approched me about reviewing the training guide since it does/will reference parts of the installation guide | 14:04 |
| annegentle | the repo is openstack/training-guides | 14:05 |
| annegentle | Sam-I-Am: I'm encouraging them to use as much of it as possible | 14:05 |
| Sam-I-Am | it makes sense | 14:05 |
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| annegentle | Phil and I are looking at scripted labs -- I like the idea very much | 14:05 |
| annegentle | Sean (sarob) and I talked yesterday and I want to give the team time to get ramped up, but also ensure quality, by the Juno-2 milestone release | 14:06 |
| annegentle | That's July 24th | 14:06 |
| annegentle | (juno-1 is tomorrow) | 14:06 |
| phil_h | I believe they are the way to go | 14:06 |
| Sam-I-Am | wow, sosoon | 14:06 |
| Sam-I-Am | feels like we just released! | 14:06 |
| annegentle | the TC gives teams 2 milestone releases, so the July 24th date is simply a check in | 14:06 |
| annegentle | I'd prefer that the training group focus on training deliverables -- the lab is a great example | 14:06 |
| annegentle | my general sense is that the guides have quality issues but they are working towards our conventions and so on | 14:07 |
| annegentle | I think they will also track their bugs separately | 14:07 |
| annegentle | any questions? | 14:07 |
| annegentle | The mailing list thread has the most indepth info | 14:08 |
| annegentle | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-docs/2014-June/004572.html | 14:08 |
| annegentle | Ok, next topic, Style questions: IBM Style Guide for core reviewers | 14:08 |
| Sam-I-Am | #topic ibm style guide for core reviewers | 14:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ibm style guide for core reviewers (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:08 | |
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| annegentle | I've sent emails to our current core except for Lorin who's not working on OpenStack anymore, boo hoo | 14:08 |
| annegentle | You can either get a Kindle version or a paperbook | 14:09 |
| annegentle | thing is, there are only 6 copies paperback available right now, so I'm working through the preferences and shipping | 14:09 |
| annegentle | Will probably take me the rest of this week | 14:09 |
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| dianefleming | cool | 14:09 |
| annegentle | The idea is, while reviewing, use the IBM Style Guide for anything that isn't covered in our Conventions page | 14:09 |
| berendt | is it possible to get the kindle version for non-core reviewers? | 14:09 |
| annegentle | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/Conventions | 14:09 |
| annegentle | berendt: I couldn't find a way to "lend" but I can probably just get Rackspace to buy you one if you want | 14:10 |
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| annegentle | Seems useful for people who review often | 14:10 |
| berendt | at least I try this so I think it would be useful to increase the quality of my reviews | 14:11 |
| annegentle | Sam-I-Am: one thing I wondered is if the IBM style guide answered your last two questions to the mailing list? | 14:11 |
| phil_h | Wish there was and easy way to get more copies | 14:11 |
| annegentle | phil_h: it's not hard - if you want one I'll find you one | 14:11 |
| Sam-I-Am | annegentle: i hadn't looked... i can do that. | 14:12 |
| Sam-I-Am | the key is finding stuff | 14:12 |
| phil_h | thanks | 14:12 |
| annegentle | I've let the Rackspace editor know we won't need the Rackspace one | 14:12 |
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| annegentle | #action Anne to send IBM Style Guide Kindle to berendt | 14:12 |
| annegentle | phil_h: do you want paperback or kindle version? | 14:12 |
| dianefleming | @annegentle can you add a link on the conventions page to the kindle version? | 14:12 |
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| dianefleming | so anyone can get it? | 14:13 |
| phil_h | kindle would be fine if I can use my android | 14:13 |
| Sam-I-Am | i think there's a kindle reader app for most platforms | 14:13 |
| phil_h | yes | 14:13 |
| annegentle | #action Anne to send IBM Style Guide Kindle to phil_h | 14:13 |
| annegentle | Yep | 14:13 |
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| annegentle | Ok, I'll keep working that list | 14:13 |
| berendt | phil_h: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?hl=en&id=com.amazon.kindle | 14:13 |
| annegentle | Irony moment: buying from amazon. :) | 14:13 |
| Sam-I-Am | lol | 14:13 |
| annegentle | Ok, wanted to make sure everyone knows about the decisions on Debian install guide reviews | 14:14 |
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| Sam-I-Am | #topic debian install guide reviews | 14:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "debian install guide reviews (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:14 | |
| Sam-I-Am | that was a fun thread | 14:14 |
| annegentle | Oh and one other thing about IBM Style Guides, many RedHat writers already have it | 14:14 |
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| annegentle | Sounds like it's all resolved, I appreciate everyone's discussion on the list (and that I didn't have to break out of vacay mode) :) | 14:15 |
| Sam-I-Am | i was thankfully away looking for housing for most of it... but i tried to sum it up with a happy conclusion | 14:15 |
| annegentle | It seems like the reviews are going oka | 14:15 |
| annegentle | okay | 14:15 |
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| Sam-I-Am | tom agreed with the two resolutions | 14:15 |
| annegentle | and I guess he keeps the screenshots? | 14:15 |
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| annegentle | I was just trying to make sure I know how to review, also | 14:15 |
| annegentle | seems like we add zaro (Thomas Goirand) to those patches as reviewer | 14:15 |
| dianefleming | screenshots = no good! | 14:15 |
| Sam-I-Am | for now, yes... but there will be more 'translatable' information surrounding the screen shots | 14:16 |
| Sam-I-Am | annegentle: yes, he gets tagged in debian-affecting patches (like most of the install guide improvements) | 14:16 |
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| Sam-I-Am | whether or not he wants to do his stuff as separate patches is his choice | 14:16 |
| Sam-I-Am | right now i'm trying to leave the debian stuff as-is as much as possible | 14:16 |
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| annegentle | Okay | 14:17 |
| annegentle | The Mailing List thread crossed the May/June boundary, but I think it's all wrapped up here | 14:18 |
| annegentle | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-docs/2014-June/004563.html | 14:18 |
| annegentle | Any questions? | 14:18 |
| gpocentek | just a correction, Thomas' nick is zigo ;) | 14:18 |
| annegentle | gpocentek: ha! Thanks! | 14:18 |
| Sam-I-Am | somewhere in that is the conclusion of the thread | 14:18 |
| zigo | gpocentek: And I'm around! :) | 14:19 |
| annegentle | That's right, zaro is... now I forget! | 14:19 |
| annegentle | zigo: hiya! | 14:19 |
| zigo | annegentle: Hello! :) | 14:19 |
| Sam-I-Am | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-docs/2014-June/004579.html | 14:19 |
| annegentle | zigo: Any remaining concerns about Debian and install? | 14:19 |
| Sam-I-Am | thats the summary | 14:19 |
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| zigo | annegentle: Well, I still got some remaining patch review not done. | 14:19 |
| annegentle | thanks Sam-I-Am | 14:19 |
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| annegentle | zigo: ok yep | 14:20 |
| annegentle | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98329/ | 14:20 |
| annegentle | That one needs review | 14:20 |
| zigo | https://review.openstack.org/97158, https://review.openstack.org/96687, https://review.openstack.org/98329 | 14:20 |
| annegentle | Ah, and a rebase | 14:20 |
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| Sam-I-Am | yeah, a rebase... | 14:20 |
| Sam-I-Am | the qm/mq thing | 14:20 |
| zigo | Yeah, will work on that. | 14:20 |
| annegentle | Ok, I'll also add those links to this week's What's Up Doc so people can take a look | 14:20 |
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| zigo | Plus I need to explicitely write what some debconf screen do in the directives, but that's going to be later on. | 14:21 |
| annegentle | zigo: anything else you can think of? Thanks for the discussion | 14:21 |
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| zigo | That's going to be within each service chapters... | 14:21 |
| zigo | Like for example, the core_plugin directive in Neutron, etc. | 14:21 |
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| Sam-I-Am | zigo: to avoid patch collisions, for the larger 'install guide updates' patches... do you want to edit the big patch, or upload another patch after approval to handle the debian stuff? | 14:21 |
| zigo | I'm trying to get my patches as small and incremental as possible, yeah. | 14:22 |
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| Sam-I-Am | ok, so sounds like a separate patch later then | 14:22 |
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| Sam-I-Am | can you tag me in your patches | 14:22 |
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| zigo | You mean add you for the review? I will, thanks. | 14:22 |
| Sam-I-Am | yeah | 14:22 |
| annegentle | sounds good | 14:22 |
| zigo | https://review.openstack.org/97158 <--- For that one, I'm not sure how to handle it. | 14:22 |
| zigo | No, not that one, hang on. | 14:23 |
| Sam-I-Am | and we'll tag you in the 'big' install guide update patches, but mainly just to make sure we didn't completely break the debian stuff. you'll do your improvements in a later patch. | 14:23 |
| annegentle | zigo: ah we might need to ask sgordon to look again? | 14:23 |
| zigo | That one: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/96687/ | 14:24 |
| zigo | Andreas wrote (rightfully) that there was some redundancy. | 14:24 |
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| zigo | And that I wrote 3 times the same thing. | 14:24 |
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| annegentle | zigo: he's good at spotting inefficiency :) | 14:24 |
| Sam-I-Am | i think 97158 is pre-conclusion of that e-mail thread | 14:24 |
| zigo | I agree, though it was like that previously, it just shows more now ... | 14:24 |
| zigo | So I wonder how to fix. | 14:24 |
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| zigo | Probably first remove the redundancy everywhere first? | 14:25 |
| annegentle | Sam-I-Am: agreed on 97158 | 14:25 |
| Sam-I-Am | i'd need to look closer at the patch | 14:25 |
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| annegentle | zigo: for the redundant, is it really just the screenshot that's unique to debian? | 14:25 |
| Sam-I-Am | zigo: my suggestion is, for the most common debian stuff, provide a 'flagship' patch that sets the tone for all other patches | 14:25 |
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| Sam-I-Am | then you can use it as a template for the other patches | 14:26 |
| zigo | annegentle: That's my point, I replaced something redundant by something else (redundant screenshots). | 14:26 |
| annegentle | zigo: ah :) | 14:26 |
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| zigo | And I'm really not sure how to remove the redundancy then ... | 14:27 |
| zigo | Create another section, and refer to it at the 3 places? | 14:27 |
| zigo | (with a link) | 14:27 |
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| berendt | why not working with includes for the moment? | 14:27 |
| annegentle | zigo: I'll comment in the patch itself | 14:28 |
| zigo | Thanks! :) | 14:28 |
| zigo | I don't need an answer right now... | 14:28 |
| annegentle | berendt: zigo: includes might work, but basically you do the same thing on all three nodes? | 14:28 |
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| annegentle | (thing=same configuration of networking) | 14:29 |
| annegentle | ah precision with language | 14:29 |
| Sam-I-Am | the nodes are mostly the same | 14:29 |
| annegentle | Ok maybe we can get to one more topic before I have to leave? Do comment in reviews. | 14:29 |
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| Sam-I-Am | at least for neutron.conf | 14:29 |
| Sam-I-Am | sure | 14:29 |
| annegentle | I think it was berendt who asked about how to make the Glossary alphabet headers list in a TOC? | 14:29 |
| Sam-I-Am | oh, there was one thing before that | 14:29 |
| Sam-I-Am | but we can hit that topic | 14:29 |
| annegentle | oh yes | 14:29 |
| Sam-I-Am | #topic how to make glossary alphabet headers list in a toc | 14:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "how to make glossary alphabet headers list in a toc (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:30 | |
| annegentle | Just going to say, I talked to David Cramer and yes it can be changed in the XSLT | 14:30 |
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| annegentle | berendt: I asked him to write back on the list, it's either webhelp.xsl or docbook.xsl that has the logic | 14:30 |
| annegentle | and... I'd better go so I'm not late to the eye doc... thanks Sam-I-Am! | 14:31 |
| annegentle | and thanks all for joining! | 14:31 |
| Sam-I-Am | have fun! | 14:31 |
| berendt | I had a short look but not yet the time to work on the glossary | 14:31 |
| Sam-I-Am | we'll hit the last topic here... | 14:31 |
| Sam-I-Am | #topic review change options automation | 14:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "review change options automation (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:31 | |
| Sam-I-Am | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/97621/ | 14:31 |
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| gpocentek | more eyes of this patch would be nice | 14:32 |
| Sam-I-Am | i suspect we should take a look at that patch | 14:32 |
| gpocentek | Andreas suggested another way to deal with changed options but it will be more tricky to handle | 14:33 |
| berendt | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/97620/ is not yet merged | 14:33 |
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| gpocentek | berendt: reviews on the output will help fix/modify the code | 14:34 |
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| Sam-I-Am | anything else here? | 14:35 |
| Sam-I-Am | #topic open discussion | 14:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 14:36 | |
| Sam-I-Am | a few things going on here. i completed a havana-to-icehouse upgrade on rhel yesterday, so will be working on a patch to the ops guide | 14:36 |
| Sam-I-Am | also, i'm moving and starting a new job so i might go dark for a bit starting in a couple of days | 14:37 |
| phil_h | I have both linuxbrige working with OVS on different nodes and I see a couple of doc bugs that I need to file | 14:37 |
| gpocentek | congrats on the new job :) | 14:37 |
| phil_h | We are happy to get him | 14:37 |
| gpocentek | oh, new job at rackspace? | 14:38 |
| Sam-I-Am | yup | 14:38 |
| gpocentek | awesome! | 14:38 |
| Sam-I-Am | gonna try to get these few install guide patches through before i disappear for a bit | 14:38 |
| dianefleming | @Sam-I-Am CONGRATS!! | 14:38 |
| Sam-I-Am | the ops guide patch... maybe. | 14:38 |
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| Sam-I-Am | aight, anything else? | 14:39 |
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| Sam-I-Am | guess we're done here | 14:41 |
| Sam-I-Am | thanks everyone | 14:41 |
| Sam-I-Am | #endmeeting | 14:41 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:41 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 11 14:41:11 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:41 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteam/2014/docteam.2014-06-11-14.01.html | 14:41 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteam/2014/docteam.2014-06-11-14.01.txt | 14:41 |
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| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteam/2014/docteam.2014-06-11-14.01.log.html | 14:41 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #startmeeting XenAPI | 15:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 11 15:01:18 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is johnthetubaguy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'xenapi' | 15:01 |
| johnthetubaguy | hello all | 15:01 |
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| johnthetubaguy | hello all | 15:01 |
| johnthetubaguy | hows things going? | 15:02 |
| BobBall | Fine fine | 15:02 |
| BobBall | you? | 15:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | what topics do we have for today? | 15:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | BobBall: good thanks | 15:02 |
| BobBall | our CI is the best again | 15:02 |
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| BobBall | http://www.rcbops.com/gerrit/reports/nova-cireport.html | 15:03 |
| BobBall | the stats have been updated | 15:03 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #topic CI | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CI (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:03 | |
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| * johnthetubaguy is looking at stats | 15:03 | |
| johnthetubaguy | hehe, so we are better than jenkins, except for the yellow bit | 15:04 |
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| johnthetubaguy | how do we get the yellow bit down? | 15:04 |
| BobBall | we can't | 15:04 |
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| johnthetubaguy | why not? is that a time it takes to run thing? | 15:04 |
| BobBall | unless we get more people in different timezones working on the CI in the same way as infra does | 15:04 |
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| BobBall | once a patch is missed, it's yellow forever - so we'd need <2 hour responses on _everything_ | 15:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | right, but how often does it screw up? | 15:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | in the last 30 days | 15:05 |
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| BobBall | very very rarely | 15:05 |
| BobBall | but if it happens and we miss even 1 then our yellow bar is bigger | 15:06 |
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| johnthetubaguy | right, thats fine, just curious how we improve that, people watching it doesn't feel like the correct answer | 15:06 |
| BobBall | that's how infra fixes it :) | 15:07 |
| BobBall | people go to #openstack-infra and shout until it's fixed | 15:07 |
| BobBall | no one does that for xs CI | 15:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | … we could monitor things, and make it fix its-self a little bit | 15:07 |
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| johnthetubaguy | but anyway, maybe what we need is a better measure | 15:07 |
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| BobBall | maybe | 15:08 |
| BobBall | more automated emails would be nice | 15:08 |
| BobBall | but quite honestly I'm not fussed about the yellow | 15:08 |
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| johnthetubaguy | thats a monitoring issue on our side right? | 15:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | where our = xenserver ci | 15:08 |
| BobBall | Sure - or even better on the nova-cireport.html's side | 15:08 |
| BobBall | "Hey - I think your CI is down because it hasn't voted on XYZ" | 15:09 |
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| johnthetubaguy | the reason I say this, is at the summit there was agreement to reduce the yellow bar, and no one compained | 15:09 |
| BobBall | I think that ci report is going into infra at some point which makes it easier to add such an email | 15:09 |
| BobBall | I complained | 15:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | if we are not happy we need to complain and come up with a better idea | 15:09 |
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| johnthetubaguy | OK, so I was half asleep, what was the response? | 15:10 |
| BobBall | I pointed out in the etherpad why it is not appropriate | 15:10 |
| BobBall | I haven't followed it up yet | 15:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, so no one was reading that | 15:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | oops | 15:10 |
| BobBall | but neither has anyone else AFAIK | 15:10 |
| BobBall | i.e. no formal proposal has been made | 15:10 |
| BobBall | that I've seen anyone | 15:10 |
| BobBall | anyway* | 15:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | agreed, mostly as the gate is screwed right now | 15:10 |
| BobBall | Fine - so if/when it's proposed I will definitely argue against it | 15:10 |
| BobBall | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/juno-nova-third-party-ci I think? | 15:11 |
| BobBall | it's not loading for me | 15:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | I was just trying to get a better idea as a rebuttle | 15:11 |
| BobBall | Line 32 | 15:11 |
| BobBall | Everyone jumps when jenkins is down, but few people (other than those running the CI system) monitor 3rd party CIs with the same enthusiasm. If a 3rd party misses a patch (e.g. gerrit stream monitoring fails), then a new patch is submitted, the old missed patch is forever held as a miss by the stats. IOW I imagine Jenkis miss rate will always be lower than 3rd party miss rate. | 15:11 |
| BobBall | My suggestion.... | 15:11 |
| BobBall | Missed split: No vote vs late vote | 15:11 |
| BobBall | disagreements stats (how often does it disagree with jenkins) - perhaps say 'jenkins fail' is only if all tempest failed in Jenkins to avoid known gate instabilities? - why compare to Jenkins rather than some other known, desired state? | 15:11 |
| BobBall | correllation % / overlay with infra-jenkins | 15:11 |
| BobBall | Low disagreement stats would be the key metric IMO | 15:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | maybe | 15:12 |
| BobBall | No late votes would also be a key metric | 15:12 |
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| BobBall | No votes should be 'acceptable' in the case of CI downtime as long as the 'no votes' are not too high | 15:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | I like the idea of % late and % missed being different | 15:12 |
| BobBall | i.e. maybe 10% 'no votes' is acceptable for a 3rd party CI | 15:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, that seems reasonable | 15:12 |
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| johnthetubaguy | disagreement is harder, we want them to find other bugs, which would be disagreement | 15:13 |
| BobBall | but we did make it clear that reporting must be <2h so no 'late votes' are acceptable (although I also think that's too strict) | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | let me find the link | 15:13 |
| BobBall | Sure - it would all need to be on a scale | 15:13 |
| BobBall | i.e. if you have 10% disagreements then we're happy | 15:13 |
| BobBall | but we'll assume that 90% of all jobs should agree | 15:13 |
| BobBall | if there are _ANY_ jenkins fails that you pass, then that's a massive red flag | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/HypervisorSupportMatrix/DeprecationPlan | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | hmm, it says four hours | 15:14 |
| BobBall | but I don't like forcing a CI to match specific arbitrary numbers... the numbers should just give the PTL a feel on what is acceptable or not | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | I think an average below two is probably kinder | 15:14 |
| BobBall | unacceptable --> warning; no fix/plan --> booting | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | right, the idea here was, how do we give a clear bar, rather than a gut feeling | 15:14 |
| BobBall | let's all be reasonable here - we're all human after all :D | 15:15 |
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| BobBall | Sure - but the bar can't be set so low that none of the non-infra tests can match it | 15:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | agreed | 15:15 |
| BobBall | perhaps another metric that'd be useful is "CHANGES missed" rather than patchsets | 15:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | just don't want people feeling like, hey we don't like you, so we don't approve your CI | 15:15 |
| BobBall | if you miss patch 4 and patch 5 comes along, then you test 5, 4 shouldn't be a "miss" | 15:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | ah, that in interesting idea | 15:15 |
| BobBall | because there is no point going back and testing 4, and the CI is back up and running testing 5... | 15:16 |
| BobBall | missed vs late etc | 15:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | I think looking at the average reporting time is fine here, thinking about this more | 15:16 |
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| johnthetubaguy | anyways... | 15:17 |
| BobBall | yes | 15:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | digging out of that rat hole | 15:17 |
| BobBall | rabbit hole. Definitely bigger than a rat hole. | 15:17 |
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| johnthetubaguy | but I think we understand what we want | 15:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | lol | 15:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | what else did you want to cover | 15:17 |
| BobBall | uhhh... not sure | 15:17 |
| BobBall | oh yeah | 15:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | I am getting back to setting up a parallel setup to get out some funky stuff | 15:17 |
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| BobBall | there's a rubbish bug | 15:18 |
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| BobBall | if you give devstack/d-g a repo (i.e. review.openstack.org repo) then it'll checkout from there | 15:18 |
| BobBall | which is correct - right? | 15:18 |
| BobBall | BUT in some cases you want to merge, a-la-Zuul | 15:18 |
| BobBall | (all cases are safer with merging of course) | 15:18 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, this rings a bell | 15:18 |
| BobBall | So there was a change this last week that failed until it was rebased | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | I remember turbo hipster guys talking about this one | 15:19 |
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| BobBall | now it passes | 15:19 |
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| BobBall | I'm still pushing to try and move more of the CI to an -infra base | 15:19 |
| BobBall | which will let it use zuul | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | right | 15:19 |
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| johnthetubaguy | about ciros, did you move to the new image/ | 15:20 |
| BobBall | but I guess a short term fix might be to add some more hacky flags in D-G to merge rather than checkout | 15:20 |
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| BobBall | not this week, no | 15:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK, so no more tests enabled at this point? | 15:20 |
| BobBall | correct | 15:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | no worries, just checking | 15:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | having another meeting this week about getting us more help for this CI | 15:21 |
| BobBall | well I'm not sure what the focus would be ATM | 15:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | so there is a little bit of progress | 15:21 |
| BobBall | apart from adding the quark stuff I guess | 15:21 |
| BobBall | (or replacing nova-net with neutron+quark) | 15:21 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yeah, adding quark, adding more tests | 15:21 |
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| johnthetubaguy | maybe adding cloudcafe | 15:22 |
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| johnthetubaguy | but anyways, thats part of the discussion | 15:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | I guess | 15:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | also, just help with the 24-7 maintainance thing | 15:22 |
| BobBall | yeah | 15:23 |
| johnthetubaguy | some US people would spread the curve a little further | 15:23 |
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| johnthetubaguy | and into peak patch creation times | 15:23 |
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| johnthetubaguy | cool, so we are done for CI I guess? | 15:23 |
| BobBall | indeed... but there is a learning curve which might be too long given that we're not having many issues at all ATM | 15:23 |
| BobBall | Done indeed | 15:24 |
| BobBall | I need to update the nodepool patches with more docs | 15:24 |
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| BobBall | hoping to do that tomorrow I think | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | agreed, but its probably needed, the other thing, is moving to zuul via turbohipster people | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool | 15:24 |
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| BobBall | That's a long way off | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic Open Discussion | 15:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:24 | |
| johnthetubaguy | any thing more? | 15:24 |
| BobBall | we need all of the upstreaming done first - which is the start of those nodepool changes ;) | 15:24 |
| BobBall | Yeah... I keep meaning to test... | 15:25 |
| BobBall | is HVM working? | 15:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | BobBall: well, they can run modfied branches of some stuff | 15:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | HVM working? | 15:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | what do you mean? | 15:25 |
| BobBall | There was a suggestion on some list somewhere where tempest only worked with PV guests and not HVM | 15:25 |
| BobBall | oh, no, think it was on IRC | 15:25 |
| BobBall | probably worth switching to just run a full tempest on HVM at some point to prove it does | 15:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, no idea, I suspect they just set the image up wrongly | 15:25 |
| BobBall | and/or run some specific tests | 15:25 |
| BobBall | well does Cirros support running HVM? | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, so volume attach will need PV tools right? | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | or something like that | 15:26 |
| BobBall | right - does cirros include PV tools for that? or would it run fully HVM? | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, I doubt cirros is the correct choice for HVM tests | 15:27 |
| * BobBall doesn't know... | 15:27 | |
| BobBall | ah ok | 15:27 |
| BobBall | mabe that's the answer then | 15:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | some of our PVHM images are fairly small | 15:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | they would probably do the trick | 15:27 |
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| johnthetubaguy | (if we turn caching on) | 15:28 |
| BobBall | ok great | 15:28 |
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| johnthetubaguy | it certainly works in production, but its a good point, better image coverage would help | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | like testing windows and linx | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh wait, that will fail, but whatever | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | nested HVM, not so good | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | anyways, we are all done I guess? | 15:29 |
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| BobBall | yeah, think so | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool, thanks BobBall | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | catch you next week I guess | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | probably earlier on IRC with this nodepool stuff :) | 15:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | #endmeeting | 15:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:30 | |
| BobBall | yay! Till then. | 15:30 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 11 15:30:20 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:30 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2014/xenapi.2014-06-11-15.01.html | 15:30 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2014/xenapi.2014-06-11-15.01.txt | 15:30 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2014/xenapi.2014-06-11-15.01.log.html | 15:30 |
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| deepakcs | do we have cinder mtg today ? | 16:02 |
| jungleboyj | deepakcs: As far as I know. | 16:03 |
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| deepakcs | ok :) | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | hello hello | 16:03 |
| kmartin | hi | 16:03 |
| glenng | Ola | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | #start meeting cinder | 16:03 |
| jjacob512 | hello | 16:03 |
| xyang1 | hi | 16:03 |
| winston-d | o/ | 16:03 |
| jungleboyj | hola | 16:03 |
| bruff | o/ | 16:03 |
| scottda | hi | 16:03 |
| bswartz | jgriffith: back to your old tricks? | 16:03 |
| jungleboyj | Como estas? | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: LOL | 16:03 |
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| tbarron | hi | 16:03 |
| avishay | haha | 16:03 |
| glenng | Bien :-) | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | #startmeeting cinder | 16:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 11 16:03:56 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is jgriffith. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'cinder' | 16:04 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: some things never change | 16:04 |
| avishay | hello, officially | 16:04 |
| jgriffith | too bad kmartin missed it :) | 16:04 |
| jgriffith | yes.. hello "for the record" | 16:04 |
| * bswartz waves to the camera | 16:04 | |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: hemna_ kmartin bswartz avishay winston-d | 16:04 |
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| jungleboyj | Hello all. Happy Wednesday. | 16:04 |
| xyang1 | hi | 16:04 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: hola | 16:04 |
| eharney | hi | 16:04 |
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| hemna | morning | 16:04 |
| vbala | hi | 16:04 |
| tbarron | hi | 16:05 |
| kmartin | jgriffith: :) DuncanT- screwed it up last week :) | 16:05 |
| rushi | heyloo! | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | alrighty... got a pretty good turn out | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | kmartin: sweet!!! | 16:05 |
| avishay | wow full agenda... | 16:05 |
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| avishay | 7 topics | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/CinderMeetings | 16:05 |
| winston-d | o/ again | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | I think we better get started | 16:05 |
| jungleboyj | Yikes. Agreed. | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | #topic volume-replicaton | 16:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "volume-replicaton (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:05 | |
| jgriffith | ronenkat: you around? | 16:06 |
| ronenkat | Hi | 16:06 |
| jungleboyj | Hey roaet_ | 16:06 |
| asselin | hi | 16:06 |
| jungleboyj | Hey ronenkat ! | 16:06 |
| jungleboyj | Darn autocomplete. | 16:06 |
| DuncanT- | Hi, sorry | 16:06 |
| ronenkat | I posted https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98308/ with updates | 16:06 |
| jungleboyj | DuncanT-: Is here. Now we can start. | 16:06 |
| ronenkat | to see if tere are more comments and suggestions about it | 16:06 |
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| jungleboyj | ronenkat: Hoping to look again today. | 16:07 |
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| kmartin | ok, we have about 7 mintues per topic | 16:07 |
| avishay | it looks good to me (obviously) | 16:07 |
| hemna | I havent' had time to look at it yet | 16:07 |
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| hemna | I'll try and take a look today | 16:07 |
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| jgriffith | ronenkat: seems like I'm the only one that had anything to say so far | 16:08 |
| ronenkat | jgriffith: you made a comment on type-groups, I would prefer to do the initial drop based on volume-types, and then see what will happen with type-groups | 16:08 |
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| winston-d | will take a look tomorrow | 16:08 |
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| jgriffith | ronenkat: yeah, but the problem with that is then you have "two" models | 16:08 |
| jgriffith | ronenkat: which is what I would like to avoid | 16:08 |
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| ronenkat | if we get type-groups into Juno, I will then port it from volume-type to group-type, should be that hard | 16:09 |
| jgriffith | ronenkat: I think starting work and having a WIP is fine | 16:09 |
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| jgriffith | ronenkat: but I don't want to merge it and then change the semantics | 16:09 |
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| jgriffith | ronenkat: understood | 16:09 |
| DuncanT- | Surely replication of more than one volume would be a cg, not a type group? | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | ronenkat: so the type-groups will be needed for g as well | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | cg | 16:10 |
| ronenkat | jgriffith: seems ok, I guess that by the time we get reviews for the code, we will know about group-types | 16:10 |
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| jgriffith | ronenkat: indeed | 16:10 |
| DuncanT- | Why are type-groups relevant for replication? I'm confused | 16:10 |
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| ronenkat | DuncanT-: group-type are for enabling replication, not consistency | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: I had discussions with xyang1 as well as ronenkat | 16:10 |
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| xyang1 | jgriffith: have you seen the updated spec on CG? | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: CG and replication enabled by inclusiveness in the same type-group | 16:11 |
| bswartz | I don't think consistency groups will be useful for replication | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | xyang1: sorry, I didn't but I know you were working on it while we talked :) | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: agreed | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: that wasn't the idea | 16:11 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: they're seperate concerns IMO | 16:11 |
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| xyang1 | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/96665/ | 16:12 |
| xyang1 | type-group is described in there | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: but the idea was to use a abstract container like type-groups to pull these things together more cleanly | 16:12 |
| bswartz | for the purpose of replication, the backend may need to group things but the decision of how the grouping should happen has to be up to the backend or else it doesn't solve any problems | 16:12 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: Is that discussion written down anywhere? I'm genuinely confused | 16:12 |
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| ronenkat | DuncanT-: replication should be enabled by an extra-spec replication:enabled, that can be on the volume-type or type-group | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: it was via IRC and xyang1 captured a good dealof it in her BP | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | err... spec | 16:12 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: why does grouping need to be up to the backend? | 16:13 |
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| jgriffith | and why doesn't it solve anything if it's not? | 16:13 |
| DuncanT- | I'll read to spec and ask in the channel afterwards | 16:13 |
| jgriffith | So real quick..... | 16:13 |
| jgriffith | maybe this isn't what people want | 16:14 |
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| DuncanT- | It certainly isn't what I expected | 16:14 |
| bswartz | if the backend is replicating multiple volumes together, and it has to break those relationships either all or none, then it's the backend's grouping that matters, not anything defined by the user | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | but my opinion was that rather than proliferate new objects in the data model | 16:14 |
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| jgriffith | create an abstract one that leverages things we already have in place | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | allow admins to customize that to "mean" whatever he/she wants | 16:14 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: ? | 16:15 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: how does the backend know what volumes should be in a group without any one create the group? | 16:15 |
| bswartz | in the case of netapp, a "replication group" will correspond exactly to a "pool" (assuming we manage to sort out pools) | 16:15 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: the concept is just to provide the end user and the scheduler information about what volumes can actually be replicated | 16:15 |
| hemna | why should a replication group be confined to a pool? | 16:15 |
| hemna | that doesn't really make sense to me. | 16:16 |
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| ronenkat | bswartz: the admin creates the groups, which are then provide a "hint" to the scheduler on which backend to use | 16:16 |
| bswartz | hemna: it's just how netapp hardware works -- we replicate whole pools | 16:16 |
| hemna | ok that seems like netapp's problem :P | 16:16 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: all volumes in a pool have to be in the same replication group? | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: and that should still be doable | 16:16 |
| bswartz | yes it is a problem :-p | 16:16 |
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| bswartz | xyang1: yes | 16:16 |
| navneet_ | hemna: I guess confusion is on the word pool or pools | 16:16 |
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| jgriffith | we talked about this at the summit briefly | 16:17 |
| jgriffith | it is a bit "different" in some ways | 16:17 |
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| hemna | bswartz, as long as an admin has the flexibility to setup the groups so that it works with the pools on netapp, I think we're good. | 16:17 |
| jgriffith | but I believe it still works | 16:17 |
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| jgriffith | hemna: that's part of why I think we need this sort of "customizable" parent container | 16:17 |
| hemna | then it's a best practice guide for netapp backends | 16:17 |
| avishay | it may not be optimal for netapp, but it should work | 16:17 |
| hemna | jgriffith, +1 | 16:18 |
| bswartz | hemna: I agree, but whether we have that flexibility or not is a very subtle issue I'm trying to make sure people understand | 16:18 |
| zhithuang | xyang1: I think I need your education on what type groups is need for replications, will bug you later | 16:18 |
| hemna | bswartz, kewl. gotcha | 16:18 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: keep an eye on gerrit so we don't sneak something passed you :) | 16:18 |
| xyang1 | zhithuang: sure | 16:18 |
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| bswartz | jgriffith: yep | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: you up to speed? | 16:18 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: sounds like your type-group will just contain one type then | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: or do you want to grind us to a halt | 16:18 |
| avishay | i think we need to keep moving, 6 more topics | 16:18 |
| ronenkat | jgriffith: talking about type-groups, I think it should be split out of the CG spec, and stand on its own spec | 16:18 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: I'll read and ask in the channel later | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | ronenkat: agreed | 16:19 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: Currently I'm confused | 16:19 |
| bswartz | avishay: didn't you know the meeting is 3 hours long today? | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | ronenkat: it was just mentioned there as a dependency that doesn't exist today | 16:19 |
| bswartz | lol | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | ok | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: et'al let's chat in #openstack-cinder after meeting | 16:19 |
| avishay | bswartz: :( | 16:19 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: Yup | 16:19 |
| ronenkat | jgriffith: its on the REST API section as work to do.... | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | most seem to be "ok" with this | 16:19 |
| xyang1 | jgriffith: I removed the dependency after I added the description in cg spec. I can create a separate one, if that helps | 16:19 |
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| jgriffith | xyang1: sure, we can talk about that | 16:20 |
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| jgriffith | #topic oslo.db | 16:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "oslo.db (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:20 | |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: go | 16:20 |
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| jungleboyj | So, we are WAY behind for DB fixes. | 16:20 |
| jungleboyj | There is a review out there that has it synced up with at least where things are at in incubator. | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: one persons "fix" is another persons "bug" | 16:21 |
| jungleboyj | Do we want to bring that in so we don't continue to be behind or try and wait for the library to be officially done. | 16:21 |
| hemna | :) | 16:21 |
| jungleboyj | At which point I see it possibly missing Juno. | 16:21 |
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| jgriffith | jungleboyj: IMHO I don't think this is going to miss Juno | 16:21 |
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| jgriffith | it's being actively reviewed | 16:21 |
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| hemna | this large of a change, I think needs to land early in Juno, so we have to deal with any issues that arise. | 16:22 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: The library might miss juno if it isn't along soon | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: I don't care about that | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: I'm not inclined to wait for the lib | 16:22 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: ok | 16:22 |
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| jgriffith | DuncanT-: I'd prefer to move with the oslo incubator version | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | deal with the lib if/when it lands | 16:22 |
| DuncanT- | jgriffith: Fair enough | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | we all know how that goes | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | we could end up waiting a long time | 16:22 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Ok, that was the discussion I wanted to have. | 16:23 |
| jgriffith | making integration even more difficult | 16:23 |
| DuncanT- | I took a look at the bd sync review.... About half way through so far and one minor style comment is all | 16:23 |
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| jgriffith | jungleboyj: DuncanT- do either of you see downsides to that? | 16:23 |
| jungleboyj | So, we should review and try to get https://review.openstack.org/#/c/77125/ in soon and not wait on the lib. | 16:23 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: DuncanT- IMO it's better to do it now | 16:23 |
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| jungleboyj | jgriffith: +2 | 16:23 |
| hemna | jgriffith, +1 | 16:23 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: DuncanT- the pain of importing the lib should be minimized | 16:23 |
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| DuncanT- | jgriffith: Absolutely | 16:23 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Agreed. | 16:23 |
| jgriffith | Ok | 16:24 |
| jgriffith | coolio | 16:24 |
| jungleboyj | Ok. Good. | 16:24 |
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| jgriffith | We all need to try and focus on reviewing that monster over the next week | 16:24 |
| jungleboyj | I will review it and try it out with DB2 and make sure all is well. | 16:24 |
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| jgriffith | DB2... pissshhhhh | 16:24 |
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| jgriffith | :) | 16:24 |
| hemna | people use DB2? | 16:24 |
| hemna | :P | 16:24 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: :-p | 16:24 |
| jungleboyj | hemna: You are just jealous. | 16:24 |
| jgriffith | hemna: I thought that was dead a long time ago :) | 16:24 |
| jungleboyj | ;-) | 16:24 |
| hemna | lol | 16:24 |
| jgriffith | ok... enough making fun of jungleboyj :) | 16:24 |
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| jgriffith | #topic oslo.logging | 16:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "oslo.logging (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:25 | |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: you're the oslo talker today | 16:25 |
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| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Here I am making myself popular again. | 16:25 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: I know. | 16:25 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: hehe | 16:25 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: tic-toc | 16:25 |
| jungleboyj | So, we need to have a plan for removing the debug messages and for dealing with the addition of _LE, LI and LW. | 16:26 |
| jungleboyj | I think DuncanT- and I had something of a plan for removing the translation of debug messages. | 16:26 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: to be clear, removing 'translation' form debug messages | 16:26 |
| jgriffith | not "removing debug messages" please :) | 16:26 |
| jungleboyj | Thoughts on how and when to handle this whole moster. | 16:26 |
| hemna | :) | 16:26 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Yes, realized that after I typed it. Translation removal. | 16:26 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: the translation fix shouldn't be a terrible deal | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: could probably even be scripted | 16:27 |
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| jgriffith | jungleboyj: but I'd recommend if we want to divide and conquer we set cut-points | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | ie: | 16:27 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Was thinking of doing the commit on a per TLD directory so that it wasn't one monster patch. | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | cinder/volume/drivers/* | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | cinder/volume/*/ | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | cinder/* | 16:27 |
| DuncanT- | I'd like to see some tooling to stop the obvious old-style translations from creeping into an already updated file.... very easy to do during a rebase for example | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | work our way up | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: +1 | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: I actually -1'd a patch for that reason | 16:28 |
| hemna | I can take cinder/volume/drivers/san/* | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | hemna: cool | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | hemna: jungleboyj DuncanT- | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | two things | 16:28 |
| hemna | and some other dirs in volume/drivers | 16:28 |
| deepakcs | Whats _LE LI and LW - can someone provide brief info on this.. I am a bit out of sync.. hope thats not a crime :) | 16:28 |
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| jgriffith | 1. Let's get a bp with the strategy/details in it | 16:28 |
| kmartin | DuncanT-: if it was automate in hacking would be the best | 16:28 |
| DuncanT- | deepakcs: There's a doc link in the commit message | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | 2. Let's look at a hacking add to weed these out | 16:28 |
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| deepakcs | DuncanT-, commit msg of which commit ? | 16:29 |
| jgriffith | deepakcs: not a crime at all | 16:29 |
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| jgriffith | deepakcs: happens to me all the time | 16:29 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Ok. Sounds good. I can obviously make the changes to drivers/volume/ibm | 16:29 |
| jgriffith | deepakcs: those are "languages" to be added to the translation *machine* | 16:29 |
| DuncanT- | deepakcs: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98981/ | 16:29 |
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| xyang1 | everything under volume/drivers/emc will be updated with newer version of the drivers, so you can hold off on that | 16:29 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: correct? | 16:29 |
| hemna | I can do cinder/zonemanager as well | 16:30 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Get through that first and then worry about the _LE stuff. | 16:30 |
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| deepakcs | jgriffith, :) it would be good if folks can provide more info for others to get the context, as not everyone can be at sync with all of cinder :) | 16:30 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: agreeed, but deepakcs would like to know what that is :) | 16:30 |
| deepakcs | DuncanT-, thanks, will look | 16:30 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: deepakcs They are hits to Oslo as to what type of message it being sent. | 16:30 |
| kmartin | jungleboyj: while you at it you can hit the hp's one too? | 16:30 |
| jungleboyj | So that decisions on translation can be made later on. | 16:30 |
| jungleboyj | kmartin: For a price. | 16:31 |
| jgriffith | deepakcs: that's very true... myself included :) | 16:31 |
| kmartin | jungleboyj: I think you still owe me...lol | 16:31 |
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| avishay | this seems redundant ... LOG.warning(_LW( ...)) ...need to specify that it's a warning twice? | 16:31 |
| jungleboyj | deepakcs: I need to understand that part better myself. | 16:31 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: frankly we can just go back to doing our own messaging and logging | 16:31 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: :) | 16:31 |
| jungleboyj | avishay: Agreed. Jim Carey has been working with Doug on that. | 16:32 |
| DuncanT- | avishay: The second bit tells the translation machinery what sort of message it is | 16:32 |
| hemna | avishay, ugh, I hope we don't have to do that. | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | s/(_(/(_LE(/g | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | no? | 16:32 |
| jungleboyj | kmartin: You didn't let me buy you one. | 16:32 |
| jungleboyj | Ok, so, there is a lot more to talk about. | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | just make everything an error :) | 16:32 |
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| jgriffith | avishay: +1, seems silly | 16:32 |
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| jungleboyj | How about I write a BP for the debug translation removal and we split up the work from there. | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | jungleboyj: +1 | 16:33 |
| hemna | I would hope that _LW() is a replacement for LOG.warning() | 16:33 |
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| jgriffith | #action jungleboyj write a bp for removing translations from debug messages | 16:33 |
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| DuncanT- | Otherwise cases like msg=_LW("foo"); LOG.warning(foo); break | 16:33 |
| jungleboyj | Get new commits to piece in the _LW and _LE support and then tackle later getting it everywhere? | 16:33 |
| jgriffith | hemna: that's what seems weird to me, it doesn't appear so | 16:33 |
| hemna | jungleboyj, +1 | 16:33 |
| hemna | jgriffith, yuk | 16:33 |
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| jgriffith | hemna: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98981/5/cinder/volume/drivers/lvm.py #L155 | 16:34 |
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| jgriffith | hemna: double yuk :) | 16:34 |
| avishay | all of the information is there - it seems wrong to add it to the entire codebase a second time... just add it to LOG.foo | 16:34 |
| Arkady_Kanevsky | any extensions for tempest to handle _LW, _LE and firends? | 16:34 |
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| jgriffith | Arkady_Kanevsky: I dunno | 16:34 |
| avishay | jgriffith: next topic? | 16:34 |
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| jgriffith | #topic 3'rd party cinder | 16:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "3'rd party cinder (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:35 | |
| jgriffith | CI tests that is | 16:35 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: avishay I will work to better understand the messaging hints before we go further there. Plenty of work just being debug translation up to date. | 16:35 |
| jgriffith | asselin: | 16:35 |
| DuncanT- | avishay: You'd need to re-write all of the message translation extraction stuff to be context aware, and in some cases that is unsolvable in python via static analysis | 16:35 |
| asselin | Hi, so I've pushed up my changes for nodepool | 16:35 |
| jgriffith | asselin: yes! | 16:35 |
| asselin | I'd like to get someone else to test it out in a different env | 16:35 |
| jgriffith | asselin: thanks... I'll be trying it out | 16:35 |
| jgriffith | asselin: expect to hear from me tomorrow :) | 16:35 |
| avishay | DuncanT-: OK, just seems strange, but I'll take your word for it :) | 16:36 |
| asselin | I'll be on vacation next week, so this week... | 16:36 |
| xyang1 | asselin: those changes will be need if you have all Jenkins slave nodes running on VMs? | 16:36 |
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| jgriffith | I have the first version running (but have to reboot my node inbetween tests for it to be reliable) | 16:36 |
| asselin | yes, this will create one-time use jenkins slaves | 16:36 |
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| asselin | I haven't tested the whole process b/c I cannot stream the gerrit events due to corp firewall rule | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | xyang1: I don't think you "have" to do it this way | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | xyang1: but it solves some problems | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | xyang1: and makes things a bit more effecient | 16:37 |
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| jgriffith | xyang1: for example I have a master and 3 slaves always up and running | 16:37 |
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| jgriffith | xyang1: and after every run i have to reboot the slave | 16:37 |
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| jgriffith | xyang1: this will allow you to be more "on-demand" so to speak | 16:38 |
| bswartz | ugh | 16:38 |
| jgriffith | in terms of slaves | 16:38 |
| xyang1 | jgriffith: so this will dynamically create a slave VM? | 16:38 |
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| jgriffith | xyang1: ask asselin :) | 16:38 |
| asselin | xyang1, yes | 16:38 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:38 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: This will keep a pool of slave VMs pre-created | 16:38 |
| asselin | that's the purpose of nodepool | 16:38 |
| jungleboyj | asselin: Where is you code at again? | 16:38 |
| xyang1 | I see, thanks | 16:38 |
| jungleboyj | Starting to look at this a bit. | 16:38 |
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| asselin | keep a pool of slaves ready to test | 16:38 |
| bswartz | do you mean literally reboot a machine or just roll back a VM? | 16:39 |
| xyang1 | DuncanT-: pre-created? | 16:39 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: I literally have to reboot the slave Instance | 16:39 |
| asselin | also, everyone should look at http://www.mail-archive.com/openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org/msg26258.htm in case you also have firewall rules | 16:39 |
| xyang1 | DuncanT-: asselin just said it will be created dynamically | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: I tried clean.sh and some other hacks that folks have out there | 16:39 |
| kmartin | jungleboyj: see the agenda, https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/CinderMeetings | 16:39 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: Yes, it will keep e.g. 3 vms up and waiting for the next test run request to come in, so that tests can be started without having to wait for vm creation | 16:39 |
| asselin | https://github.com/rasselin/os-ext-testing | 16:39 |
| asselin | https://github.com/rasselin/os-ext-testing-data | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: but it always fails consecutive runs if I don't reboot :( | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | didn't spend enough time to figure out "why" | 16:40 |
| xyang1 | DuncanT-: ok | 16:40 |
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| DuncanT- | xyang1: Dynamically creates new replacements as soon as you take one out of the pool | 16:40 |
| bswartz | jgriffith: but the slave is a VM right? | 16:40 |
| asselin | these are forks of jaypipes solution he mentioned at the summit. Once it's tested, we can merge back to his repo | 16:40 |
| hemna | bswartz, yes | 16:40 |
| bswartz | whew | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: yes, all my stuff is in an OpenStack Cloud | 16:40 |
| jungleboyj | asselin: kmartin Thanks | 16:40 |
| bswartz | okay that makes sense | 16:40 |
| xyang1 | Where are you guys going to publish the logs? | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | phewww... ok | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | anything else? | 16:40 |
| xyang1 | amazon, dropbox? | 16:40 |
| DuncanT- | Looks like you can use nodepool to manage throw-away bare metal nodes too with ironic | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | xyang1: yeah, that's a bit of a problem :( | 16:41 |
| asselin | xyang1, I haven't gotten to that yet.... | 16:41 |
| hemna | heh Ironic. | 16:41 |
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| hemna | DuncanT-, I don't think it's there yet. | 16:41 |
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| jungleboyj | xyang1: We are sending ours to softlayer for accessibility. | 16:41 |
| xyang1 | It's going to take a while for us to sort out the firewall issue too. I can't even submit code from my office:( | 16:41 |
| jgriffith | I'm looking at my AWS account but I don't think I'm willing to continue paying with my personal money for that | 16:41 |
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| asselin | jgriffith, that's bascially it, we can chat more in the cinder channel. | 16:42 |
| DuncanT- | hemna: On a good day, with a following wind.... people behind me are actively swearing at^w^wworking on it right now | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | asselin: cool... thanks! | 16:42 |
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| jgriffith | #topic HDS NAS cinder drivers | 16:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "HDS NAS cinder drivers (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:42 | |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: FYI, we have a place for the backends now and some front end hardware. Drivers developers are getting tempest running. | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: ready? | 16:42 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: Making decent progress. | 16:42 |
| sombrafam | yep | 16:42 |
| sombrafam | hi guys, so, following the recommendation of Stefano, we would like to hear if there's something else, in a sort term that is needed to finish the HNAS aproval. | 16:42 |
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| jgriffith | sombrafam: ok, so where should we start? | 16:43 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/84244/ | 16:44 |
| sombrafam | well, I have fixed the review you posted | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | I think the main problem here is this just got lost in the shuffle at the end of Icehouse | 16:44 |
| sombrafam | DuncanT-: also posted some comments that I havent finished yet | 16:44 |
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| jgriffith | sat for close to 6 weeks with no activity | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | bad reviewers | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:44 |
| sombrafam | lol | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | for that I apoligize | 16:44 |
| sombrafam | they are evil | 16:44 |
| avishay | jgriffith: needs a spec? | 16:45 |
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| jgriffith | since May however folks started engaging so that's good | 16:45 |
| * jungleboyj puts he tail between his legs. | 16:45 | |
| jgriffith | avishay: it was started "pre-spec" days | 16:45 |
| sombrafam | avishay: actually the blueprint is aproved already | 16:45 |
| jgriffith | avishay: so I didn't want to add that burden | 16:45 |
| avishay | jgriffith: sombrafam: i have no problem with no spec for this, just asking :) | 16:45 |
| DuncanT- | I've two comments on there, the config file one being more pertinent | 16:46 |
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| jgriffith | sombrafam: so as you've noticed reviews are hard | 16:46 |
| sombrafam | DuncanT-: we have pretty good reasons to use the XML. | 16:46 |
| * jungleboyj will try to take a look. | 16:46 | |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: not only getting them done | 16:46 |
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| jgriffith | sombrafam: but we're an opinionated group | 16:46 |
| avishay | DuncanT-: there are a whole bunch of drivers that do that config file stuff - i don't like it either but there is precedent | 16:46 |
| xyang1 | DuncanT-: regarding the config file. the benefit of using the xml config file is that you don't have to restart cinder-volume service if you change anything in the config file | 16:46 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: don't be discouraged, just try and turn around the suggestions | 16:46 |
| xyang1 | DuncanT-: we use it too | 16:46 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: and hang out in irc | 16:46 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: the more people "see" you around the more they'll think of you and your code | 16:47 |
| sombrafam | also we use that in the other driver | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: the queue for reviews is extremely large and things get lost easily | 16:47 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: Ok, that's a good reason. If there are any other deficiencies in the config stuff, I'd like to hear them, if only so we can think about fixing them in future | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: especially if people use things like the fancy new priority filters | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: about the *other* driver..... | 16:48 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: I'm not saying don't merge because of it, just that I wanted an explanation :-) | 16:48 |
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| DuncanT- | Any CI plans for this driver? | 16:48 |
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| xyang1 | DuncanT-: sure. thanks | 16:48 |
| sombrafam | DuncanT-: you mean the new CI framework? | 16:49 |
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| DuncanT- | sombrafam: Yeah | 16:49 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: setting up a 3'rd party CI | 16:49 |
| jgriffith | to run against it | 16:49 |
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| sombrafam | DuncanT-: John said it is ok if we send using the old testing scheme since we started to send this prior to the CI | 16:50 |
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| sombrafam | so, we let plans for future drivers | 16:50 |
| jungleboyj | sombrafam: But you will need to have plans for implementing the CI going forward. | 16:50 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: and that's fine for your initial submission IMO, but the question is "do you plan to implement 3'rd party CI" | 16:50 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: +2 | 16:50 |
| DuncanT- | sombrafam: Oh, it isn't a blocker to getting merged, given how long you've been waiting, but it is a requirement of all drivers, old and new, before the end of J | 16:50 |
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| xyang1 | jgriffith: does that apply to the ViPR driver?:) we can submit cert test results like in Icehouse, not thru CI? | 16:51 |
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| sombrafam | DuncanT-: so, all drivers, even the one merged will need to pass trough CI? | 16:51 |
| jgriffith | tic-toc... two items on agenda still | 16:51 |
| thingee | jgriffith: -1 | 16:51 |
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| thingee | we're not making exceptions | 16:51 |
| xyang1 | jgriffith: by the way, we are building CI system, but lots of driver to cover | 16:51 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: why don't you grab me in #openstack-cinder | 16:51 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: Nope, you volenteered to look at the CI stuff :-) | 16:51 |
| jgriffith | sombrafam: I'll fill you in on what's going on there | 16:52 |
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| jgriffith | thingee: HEY! | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | thingee: when did you sneak in | 16:52 |
| sombrafam | jgriffith: ok | 16:52 |
| jungleboyj | thingee: Lives. | 16:52 |
| avishay | thingee: was wondering when you were going to step out of the shadows :) | 16:52 |
| xyang1 | DuncanT-: we are building it. problem is we have 4 drivers:(. so we need to setup 4 CI | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | lurker | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | xyang1: which was my point all along :) | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | just saying | 16:52 |
| jungleboyj | xyang1: Same here. | 16:52 |
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| xyang1 | DuncanT: in one lab we've already set it up and tested with default LVM | 16:53 |
| sombrafam | jgriffith: so, the only blocker to get merged so far is the unit conversion issue right? | 16:53 |
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| jgriffith | BTW, in theory you need a CI for every driver that VIPR supports to :) | 16:53 |
| asselin | xyang1, with the automated setup, it should be easy. But I'm still not 100% convinced you can't do it with one...... | 16:53 |
| kmartin | time checks 7 minutes left | 16:53 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: HP currently have 3, plus a specific config of LVM that isn't tested by the gate | 16:53 |
| thingee | sombrafam: jgriffith is fine without CI, but I'm going to require it | 16:53 |
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| thingee | this patch was submitted march 13 | 16:53 |
| thingee | way before I | 16:53 |
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| thingee | we require *all* new drivers to have CI. | 16:54 |
| xyang1 | I hope we can have one for every product, I mean ViPR counts as one product | 16:54 |
| jgriffith | thingee: that seems a bit "harsh" but okie dokie | 16:54 |
| avishay | thingee: s/new// ? | 16:54 |
| jgriffith | let's move along | 16:54 |
| thingee | otherwise we have to make exception for other drivers, and I'm not doing that | 16:54 |
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| jgriffith | #topic mid-cycle sprint | 16:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "mid-cycle sprint (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:54 | |
| scottda | I saw the discussion around a mid-cycle sprint, possibly in Colorado. | 16:55 |
| scottda | I asked around the HP Fort Collins site and there is room(s) available. | 16:55 |
| scottda | Also, help from our Admin and Mangers. | 16:55 |
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| jgriffith | scottda: sweet | 16:55 |
| jgriffith | scottda: what dates? | 16:55 |
| hemna | So what is the purpose of the mid cycle meetup ? | 16:55 |
| sombrafam | thingee: if you male an exception for other driver that submitted before the CI proposal you will have no drivers :) | 16:55 |
| scottda | Good dates for the 'Big Room' are July 14,15,17,18, 21-25, 27-Aug 1 ... Other options exist if those dates don't work. | 16:55 |
| scottda | If there is interest and dates could be decided upon, I'll work on arrangements. | 16:55 |
| jgriffith | hemna: to make funny faces at hemna in person | 16:55 |
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| hemna | ooh cool. I'll write that up to my mgr to justify travel :P | 16:56 |
| bswartz | is this like a hackathon on steroids? | 16:56 |
| jungleboyj | jgriffith: +2 | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | scottda: bad selection for me | 16:56 |
| hemna | I think we need to have it prior to J2. | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | OSCSON, cousins wedding, wifes B-Day | 16:56 |
| scottda | Date? Those are just ideas for one room. We could find space somewhere | 16:56 |
| DuncanT- | bswartz: Yes | 16:56 |
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| jgriffith | so let's throw up a google survey or something | 16:56 |
| avishay | jgriffith: mazal tov! ;) | 16:56 |
| xyang1 | jgriffith: people can still join virtually? | 16:56 |
| scottda | It also depends on how many people might be there. | 16:57 |
| jgriffith | get some input from everybody | 16:57 |
| avishay | xyang1: +1 | 16:57 |
| navneet_ | Is it at US timezone? | 16:57 |
| avishay | we should have google hangout too | 16:57 |
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| jgriffith | including how many folks are actually able to travel | 16:57 |
| jgriffith | avishay: for sure | 16:57 |
| DuncanT- | navneet_: Yes | 16:57 |
| DuncanT- | xyang1: Yes | 16:57 |
| jgriffith | Ok, let's start trying to organize this | 16:57 |
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| jgriffith | decide if we're doing virtual or in person etc | 16:58 |
| xyang1 | avishay: we'll miss DuncanT- and jungleboy's dance though:) | 16:58 |
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| jgriffith | HP Fort Collins would be great for me :) | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | Just 1/2 hour away | 16:58 |
| avishay | xyang1: i guess i missed something in atlanta, not sure i want to know :) | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | scottda: you want to send an email out on the dev ML? | 16:58 |
| DuncanT- | In person @ Fort Collins would suite me I think | 16:58 |
| scottda | sure | 16:58 |
| navneet_ | time.... | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT-: nice | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | Ok... two imintes | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | minutes even | 16:59 |
| jgriffith | #topic backend pools | 16:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "backend pools (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:59 | |
| bswartz | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98715/ | 16:59 |
| thingee | one minute warning | 16:59 |
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| jgriffith | Let's do an etherpad for comparison/opinions | 16:59 |
| navneet_ | before people say anything I want to suggest we have detalied discussions abt wips | 16:59 |
| navneet_ | jgriffith:+1 | 16:59 |
| avishay | why not spec? | 17:00 |
| bswartz | thanks winston-d for making a counter proposal | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | navneet_: why don't you create an etherpad and send some info out on ML | 17:00 |
| bswartz | I commented on it | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | yeah, winston-d nice work | 17:00 |
| navneet_ | jgriffith: sure | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | and we're out of time :( | 17:00 |
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| navneet_ | etherpad for our proposal is already out thr.. | 17:00 |
| DuncanT- | bswartz: I agree with you about dynamic pools | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | but we actually go through everything for the most part | 17:00 |
| navneet_ | if u want to use | 17:00 |
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| tjones | hi folks - you about done? i need to start the next meeting | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | navneet_: no, I mean an etherpad for the discussion/comarison | 17:00 |
| winston-d | bswartz: i am fine not having that option | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | navneet_: can link to other docs if you like | 17:01 |
| navneet_ | DuncanT-: have some concerns with performance | 17:01 |
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| jgriffith | tjones: yup | 17:01 |
| jgriffith | tjones: we're out of here | 17:01 |
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| jgriffith | #endmeeting cinder | 17:01 |
| avishay | ok, bye all! | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:01 | |
| tjones | jgriffith: thanks | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 11 17:01:14 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:01 |
| navneet_ | with winstons proposal | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2014/cinder.2014-06-11-16.03.html | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2014/cinder.2014-06-11-16.03.txt | 17:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2014/cinder.2014-06-11-16.03.log.html | 17:01 |
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| DuncanT- | navneet_: cinder channel? | 17:01 |
| navneet_ | sur | 17:01 |
| jgriffith | navneet_: sorry... cinder-channel | 17:01 |
| jgriffith | haha | 17:01 |
| tjones | #startmeeting vmwareapi | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 11 17:01:33 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is tjones. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| Arkady_Kanevsky | can we provide pointer to both WIPs on meeting schedule? | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:01 | |
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| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'vmwareapi' | 17:01 |
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| navneet_ | ejgriffith:np | 17:01 |
| tjones | hi who is here today? | 17:01 |
| arnaud | o/ | 17:01 |
| * mdbooth is here | 17:01 | |
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| browne1 | hi | 17:02 |
| garyk | hello | 17:02 |
| tjones | vuil: you here? | 17:02 |
| kirankv | hi! | 17:02 |
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| tjones | hey kirankv - haven't seen you in a while. welcome back | 17:03 |
| vuil | yep | 17:03 |
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| tjones | ok great - lets get started with our fav topic | 17:03 |
| kirankv | tjones: :) thx | 17:03 |
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| tjones | #topic approved BP | 17:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "approved BP (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:03 | |
| tjones | vuil: want to let us know how phase 2 refator is going? | 17:03 |
| vuil | phase 2+3 are happening in parallel. | 17:04 |
| dims__ | o/ | 17:04 |
| vuil | I just updated the phase 2 patches, they are ready for review | 17:04 |
| tjones | do you have a link to share with all of the patches in order? | 17:04 |
| garyk | vuil: can you please post the first patch | 17:04 |
| vuil | phase 3 needs to be updated on top of them, and still needs some decomposition | 17:04 |
| tjones | even i am getting lost | 17:04 |
| garyk | tjones: you beat me :) | 17:04 |
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| vuil | a sec | 17:05 |
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| vuil | Not first, but https://review.openstack.org/#/c/87002/ | 17:05 |
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| vuil | and all its dependencies technically are phase 2 stuff | 17:05 |
| tjones | following the links - this one looks 1st https://review.openstack.org/#/c/99238/2 | 17:05 |
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| vuil | there were some reordering of the patches | 17:06 |
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| vuil | there is an 'image handling' patch that I am trying to rebase to the right parent after all these motion. if you start at 99238 you may see it hanging out in an odd place. Will fix after the meeting | 17:06 |
| dims__ | vuil, commit message is missing blueprint info - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/99238/ | 17:07 |
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| tjones | vuil: it's pretty confusing with the multiple dependencies. if you could add a section to https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/vmware-subteam-juno with all of the patches in review order i think it would help. then i can send a message to the ML with this and other info on what we are doing | 17:07 |
| vuil | well that one technically is just code cleanup, encountered while I refactor the code for sure... | 17:07 |
| dims__ | ah there is a fork as well in the dependency chain | 17:08 |
| vuil | sure. Gimme 1/2 hour after the meeting. Once the rebase is done we should have a main chain of commits which should make things clearer | 17:08 |
| tjones | as a team our absoute highest prio is the review of this patchset. | 17:08 |
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| tjones | s/this/these | 17:09 |
| dims__ | +1 tjones. sounds awesome vuil | 17:09 |
| mdbooth | Unfortunately I'm not at my desk, but when I get in to the office tomorrow I have a little tool which generates dependency trees from outstanding gerrit patches | 17:09 |
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| tjones | ohh - nice! mdbooth | 17:09 |
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| tjones | that would be very helpful (not just for this one) | 17:09 |
| mdbooth | Where should I post the output? | 17:09 |
| tjones | in that etherpad would be great | 17:10 |
| mdbooth | Or the tool, for that matter | 17:10 |
| mdbooth | Ok | 17:10 |
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| tjones | anything else about the refactor? | 17:10 |
| tjones | #action vuil to update https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/vmware-subteam-juno on the patchsets | 17:10 |
| tjones | #action tracy to send out email to the ML asking for reviews | 17:10 |
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| tjones | #action all of us review these patches | 17:11 |
| tjones | #action mdbooth post the tool and output to https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/vmware-subteam-juno | 17:11 |
| mdbooth | tjones: garyk and I also have outstanding refactor patches, although not directly related | 17:11 |
| vuil | @dims re: fork, yes and no, (98322 looks like one, but after rebase will be part of chain). That said, I set 98529 aside as a branch as I think of it as somewhat orthogonal to the refactoring work. | 17:11 |
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| dims__ | vuil, thanks for the clarification | 17:12 |
| tjones | yeah but i am worried about this. we need the big ones done so we can add features for juno. i know there allways will be refactor work - but i don't want to block new features on the piecemeal ones. how do you guys think we should handle this? | 17:12 |
| tjones | with the core team? | 17:13 |
| tjones | one could argue that power_off should have been part of phase 1 | 17:14 |
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| dims__ | tjones, from discussions with mriedem, he is expecting disk and image handling in spawn to get broken down, once that is done the refactor is done IMHO | 17:14 |
| vuil | as long as the changes are orthogonal to the main refactor work, I am somewhat okay. Then it is just a review priority thing. | 17:14 |
| tjones | dims__: good as long as once that is done we can continue feature work i am happy | 17:15 |
| tjones | ok anything else on approved BP? | 17:15 |
| vuil | things that interferes with the main commit refactor chain can cause rebase headaches, so please be cognizant of it | 17:15 |
| dims__ | lets keep the patch series in refactor to just that and not expand the scope | 17:15 |
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| dims__ | right vuil | 17:15 |
| mdbooth | vuil: garyk just had a patch +2d which will touch almost everything | 17:16 |
| tjones | garyk: mdbooth could you pause on those patches until phase 2/3 is done? | 17:16 |
| mdbooth | although trivially | 17:16 |
| dims__ | tjones, i don't think we should stop pushing | 17:16 |
| vuil | which one is it? | 17:16 |
| mdbooth | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/91352/ | 17:16 |
| tjones | oh yeah that one | 17:17 |
| mdbooth | It's been approved, in fact | 17:17 |
| tjones | it's merging. we are ok | 17:17 |
| mdbooth | :) | 17:17 |
| tjones | :-D | 17:17 |
| dims__ | tjones, mdbooth rebase is the cost we have to bear :) | 17:17 |
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| tjones | just don't want to step on eachothers toes as *much* as we were in icehouse. that was unbearable. and in fact the one of the purposes of refactor | 17:18 |
| vuil | will be fun, but this we should be okay. | 17:18 |
| tjones | ok lets move on | 17:18 |
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| tjones | garyk: hot plug?? | 17:18 |
| mdbooth | How many toes does https://review.openstack.org/#/c/97170/ step on? | 17:18 |
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| garyk | mdbooth: it does not step on any :) | 17:19 |
| tjones | even any of vuil? | 17:19 |
| garyk | i think that the only contenious code at the moment is the actual spawn and vmops related stuff | 17:19 |
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| garyk | the power off does not even clash with those | 17:20 |
| tjones | great | 17:20 |
| garyk | i think that we should be prgamatic about things (but that is me) | 17:20 |
| dims__ | good news all around | 17:20 |
| mdbooth | Ok, in that case I will continue trying to get reviews on that | 17:20 |
| dims__ | +1 garyk | 17:20 |
| tjones | then we are ok. garyk are you pausing on hotplug until refactor is done? | 17:20 |
| garyk | tjones: at the moment it is in review. has been for over 2 months now :( | 17:20 |
| tjones | i know…. | 17:21 |
| garyk | i guess it will be a matter of rebasing after the spawn code is in | 17:21 |
| tjones | yeah ok lets leave that then for now | 17:21 |
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| garyk | even though it is authogonal (most prba spelt wrong) | 17:21 |
| vuil | +1 gary,mdbooth on the general approach to this | 17:21 |
| garyk | there are 2 new vmops methods :) | 17:21 |
| garyk | it sucks to not work on features but i think satellite things to vmops can and should be done | 17:22 |
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| dims__ | did anyone pick up the work to "ensure one nova compute process == one cluster" | 17:22 |
| dims__ | do we need a blueprint for it? | 17:23 |
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| tjones | listens…. | 17:23 |
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| vuil | not that I am aware of | 17:23 |
| vuil | on both qns | 17:23 |
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| tjones | me either. just a note in my head that it needs doing | 17:23 |
| vuil | on first qn :-) | 17:23 |
| dims__ | ok, let me poke on it and let u all know | 17:23 |
| garyk | dims__: tjones: vuil: i was planning on doing that | 17:23 |
| tjones | dims__: thanks | 17:23 |
| tjones | ok lets talk about unapproved BP now | 17:24 |
| garyk | my major concern with it is backward and forwards compatibility. | 17:24 |
| tjones | #topic BP under review | 17:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "BP under review (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:24 | |
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| tjones | #undo | 17:24 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Topic object at 0x2452690> | 17:24 |
| dims__ | garyk, ok, i'll help, you have the pen :) | 17:24 |
| garyk | dims__: ok. | 17:24 |
| garyk | i'll sync up with you tomorrow | 17:25 |
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| tjones | ok good | 17:25 |
| tjones | #topic BP in review | 17:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "BP in review (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:25 | |
| tjones | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova-specs+message:vmware,n,z | 17:25 |
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| tjones | who wants to discuss their BP? | 17:25 |
| * mdbooth *still* hasn't written up the oslo.vmware api BP | 17:26 | |
| kirankv | VMware nova-Storage optimization for clusters with multiple datastores | 17:26 |
| garyk | garyk: ephemeral disks | 17:26 |
| tjones | #link https://review.openstack.org/98704 | 17:26 |
| kirankv | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/95907/5/specs/convergence.rst | 17:26 |
| garyk | idea is to waut till after the spawn to add the code | 17:26 |
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| tjones | yes but we do need to get the specs approved | 17:27 |
| kirankv | oops wrong link | 17:27 |
| kirankv | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98704/4 | 17:27 |
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| tjones | dims__: has a -1 | 17:28 |
| mdbooth | Looks like trivia, though | 17:28 |
| tjones | but not techical issues | 17:28 |
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| tjones | should we vote 0 on non-technical issues? | 17:28 |
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| mdbooth | kirankv: I read that earlier. I wondered what the impact was of over-using a single datastore | 17:29 |
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| mdbooth | Do we balance datastores for performance? | 17:29 |
| mdbooth | What would the impact be of a popular impact ending up on a datastore? | 17:29 |
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| mdbooth | Would it be worth dedicating a simple datastore to the image cache? | 17:29 |
| mdbooth | s/simple/single/ | 17:30 |
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| kirankv | mdbooth: As long as we stay in the max limits mentioned in the vsphere doc, we should be fine | 17:30 |
| dims__ | kirankv, waiting for a response to my questions :) | 17:30 |
| mdbooth | dims wrote: If for some reason some datastores need to be off line then it would be very difficult to figure out which vm(s) will be affected. Right? | 17:31 |
| mdbooth | So not all trivia | 17:31 |
| dims__ | right :) | 17:31 |
| tjones | didn't scroll down enough - sorry | 17:32 |
| kirankv | mbooth: how much to size the simple datastore that caches images would be a challenge | 17:32 |
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| dims__ | we don't need to do this here on IRC do we? | 17:32 |
| mdbooth | dims__: Guess not | 17:32 |
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| kirankv | it really depends on the workloads (flavors) getting deployed | 17:32 |
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| tjones | we do have time now and it's faster for you guys to discuss it when you are all here. we have 1 more to discuss after that | 17:33 |
| kirankv | dims__ : will respond and address you comments by tommorrow | 17:33 |
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| mdbooth | The performance balancing thing is a question for platform experts (i.e. not me) | 17:33 |
| mdbooth | Just strikes me as a potential issue | 17:34 |
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| mdbooth | vuil: ^^^ | 17:34 |
| vuil | :-) | 17:35 |
| vuil | I will take a look at the bp and give you my 2c | 17:35 |
| tjones | vuil: mdbooth was brining up some performance issues above | 17:35 |
| tjones | can you address those as well? | 17:36 |
| mdbooth | vuil: My question was: if we're going to create linked clones across datastores rather than making copies, how much of an issue would it be in practise for a popular image to end up on a particular datastore | 17:36 |
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| mdbooth | Especially when that datastore was picked effectively at random | 17:36 |
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| kirankv | the blueprint tries to address that by first trying to put the VM on the datastore where the cache is present, another improvement is to distribute the cache across the datastores so that cross referencing across datastores is avoided | 17:38 |
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| tjones | kirankv: do you mean https://review.openstack.org/84662 | 17:39 |
| mdbooth | Latter would emasculate the patch though, right? | 17:39 |
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| mdbooth | Although we could copy directly from another cache | 17:39 |
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| dims__ | mdbooth, right that may be easier for maintenance | 17:40 |
| kirankv | tjones: thats a different bp, thats only to optimize performance by avoiding a network transfer | 17:40 |
| mdbooth | That would be a different patch, though | 17:40 |
| mdbooth | kirankv: right | 17:40 |
| vuil | I hope folks are not waiting for me. Still reading... | 17:40 |
| tjones | ok lets take an action for kirankv to address dims concerns and vui to address the performance issues and move on? ok with that ? | 17:41 |
| mdbooth | +1 | 17:41 |
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| tjones | s/issues/concerns | 17:41 |
| kirankv | tjones: ok | 17:41 |
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| tjones | #action kirankv to address dims__ comments on https://review.openstack.org/98704 and vui to address performance concners | 17:42 |
| tjones | #link https://review.openstack.org/86074 | 17:42 |
| tjones | garyk: you are up | 17:42 |
| garyk | tjones: not much to update | 17:42 |
| garyk | ephemeral is up for review | 17:42 |
| garyk | i'll post a link in a sec | 17:43 |
| tjones | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86074/ | 17:43 |
| garyk | :) | 17:43 |
| tjones | johnthetubaguy: was interested in this before | 17:43 |
| garyk | spbm is also in review | 17:43 |
| garyk | https://review.openstack.org/84652 | 17:44 |
| tjones | funny that is not on my list | 17:44 |
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| garyk | so basically both BP's are waiting for cores | 17:44 |
| garyk | the SPBM code has been posted in review since last year december | 17:44 |
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| tjones | lets make sure that we have 2 guys from our side +1 on the specs before we start pushing cores to review it | 17:45 |
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| garyk | ok np | 17:45 |
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| tjones | rado reviewd spmb and arnaud reviewed ephemeral. can someone else please take a look at these this week? | 17:46 |
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| garyk | i'll ping them for the reviews. thanks | 17:46 |
| tjones | #action review https://review.openstack.org/84652 and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98704/4 | 17:46 |
| tjones | no i mean they all ready did - we should get 2 fresh people to look ;-) | 17:46 |
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| tjones | any other BP discussions? | 17:47 |
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| tjones | #topic bugs | 17:48 |
| tjones | https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bugs?field.tag=vmware | 17:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:48 | |
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| tjones | 2 new ones | 17:48 |
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| garyk | tjones: i have been over the bugs and have posetd fixes for 2 networking issues. don't recall the bug #'s off hand | 17:48 |
| tjones | ok thanks gary | 17:48 |
| tjones | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1325866 | 17:49 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1325866 in nova "Datastore in a Cluster-Datastore fails to enter maintenance mode if instance has a CD-Rom attached to it" [Undecided,New] | 17:49 |
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| tjones | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1328455 | 17:49 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1328455 in nova "vmware: Instance going to error state while resizing" [Undecided,New] | 17:49 |
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| tjones | these 2 look like things that customers would get really annoyed by and they have no owner. | 17:49 |
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| garyk | tjones: i'll try and look at that one tomorrow | 17:50 |
| tjones | thanks - other people can volunteer too ;-) | 17:51 |
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| tjones | #topic opendiscussion | 17:51 |
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| tjones | ok what else do you want to talk about? | 17:51 |
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| kirankv | garyk: if you need help in testing them, let me know | 17:52 |
| tjones | browne1: to reporter is asking for an update on https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1317393 | 17:52 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1317393 in nova "VMware: operating system not found after upgrade to 5.5" [Medium,New] | 17:52 |
| garyk | kirankv: thanks | 17:53 |
| browne1 | tjones: ok, yes, i saw that. i'll reply | 17:53 |
| tjones | keep going back to bugs - mdbooth hows your iscsi fun going? | 17:53 |
| tjones | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1324036 | 17:53 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1324036 in nova "Can't add authenticated iscsi volume to a vmware instance" [Undecided,Confirmed] | 17:53 |
| mdbooth | tjones: Discussing it with arnaud right now, actually :) | 17:53 |
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| tjones | should we assign that one to you since you are working on it? | 17:54 |
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| mdbooth | tjones: Sure | 17:54 |
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| mdbooth | tjones: I spent yet more time thinking about locking | 17:55 |
| mdbooth | btw | 17:55 |
| mdbooth | Way too much time, in fact | 17:55 |
| tjones | lol - we have 5 minutes if you want to discuss | 17:55 |
| mdbooth | Which then led me to wondering why I was bothering | 17:55 |
| mdbooth | Specifically: under what circumstances might 2 nova instances be accessing the same datastore | 17:56 |
| mdbooth | as I understand it, a datastore can only be a member of 1 cluster, right? | 17:56 |
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| mdbooth | So we'd need to have multiple novas managing a single cluster | 17:56 |
| vuil | that would be a clean way to go, but not necessarily | 17:56 |
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| mdbooth | vuil: So clusters can share a datastore? | 17:56 |
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| vuil | yeah. | 17:57 |
| mdbooth | vuil: Sight | 17:57 |
| mdbooth | s/t// | 17:57 |
| kirankv | but its recommended not to share datastores except for datastores that are used to host templates etc | 17:57 |
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| mdbooth | vuil: I thought I'd talked myself out of it :( | 17:58 |
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| mdbooth | vuil: I came up with a horrible solution involving abusing Events in vsphere | 17:58 |
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| mdbooth | Also zookeeper, but that requires fencing | 17:58 |
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| mdbooth | All solutions require session transactions | 17:58 |
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| vuil | yikes. | 17:59 |
| * mdbooth has a solid proposal for session transactions | 17:59 | |
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| vuil | I seem to recall there was some other use case where we need the lock, not just multi cluster -> single DS | 18:00 |
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| vuil | it's escaping me right now | 18:00 |
| mdbooth | If we can assure ourselves that there's only a single nova involved, we can use nova locks | 18:00 |
| mdbooth | Which are going to be much faster anyway | 18:00 |
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| mdbooth | vuil: There's also the vsphere 'solution' thing | 18:01 |
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| mdbooth | Although I read all the docs and I still don't really understand what it is | 18:01 |
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| vuil | Looks like we need to take it over to -vmware | 18:01 |
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| mdbooth | But it sounds like a mechanism to implement custom services | 18:01 |
| mdbooth | vuil: Indeed | 18:02 |
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| tjones | oops - sorry gotta end now | 18:02 |
| tjones | we can move over to openstack-vmware | 18:02 |
| tjones | #endmeeting | 18:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:02 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 11 18:02:47 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:02 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2014/vmwareapi.2014-06-11-17.01.html | 18:02 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2014/vmwareapi.2014-06-11-17.01.txt | 18:02 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2014/vmwareapi.2014-06-11-17.01.log.html | 18:02 |
| tjones | thanks all for attending | 18:03 |
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| notmyname | Swift team meeting time | 19:00 |
| notmyname | roll call | 19:00 |
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| notmyname | who's here? | 19:01 |
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| pandemicsyn | all the people! | 19:01 |
| briancline | o/ | 19:01 |
| peluse_ | yo | 19:01 |
| acoles | here | 19:01 |
| torgomatic | erf | 19:01 |
| tdasilva | hello | 19:01 |
| notmyname | I think clayg is still in transit. :-( | 19:01 |
| notmyname | #startmeeting swift | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 11 19:01:52 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is notmyname. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'swift' | 19:01 |
| notmyname | Thanks for coming. big stuff to talk about this week | 19:02 |
| notmyname | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Swift | 19:02 |
| notmyname | briancline updated the agenda perfectly :-) | 19:02 |
| notmyname | I guess I'm pretty predictable :-) | 19:02 |
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| notmyname | first up, for some tangentially related logistics | 19:03 |
| briancline | huzzah! | 19:03 |
| notmyname | I'm having surgery tomorrow morning, early, and I've added clayg and torgomatic to the swift-ptl group in gerrit, temporarily | 19:03 |
| notmyname | I expect to be back online this weekend. maybe friday pm | 19:04 |
| clayg | o/ | 19:04 |
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| peluse_ | good luck man! | 19:04 |
| notmyname | thanks | 19:04 |
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| notmyname | so, moving on to the current stuff in swift... | 19:04 |
| portante | a/ | 19:04 |
| portante | o/ | 19:04 |
| notmyname | #topic storage policies merge | 19:04 |
| portante | sorry I am late | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "storage policies merge (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:04 | |
| notmyname | portante: no worries. just getting started | 19:05 |
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| notmyname | just last night clayg proposed what I think is the "final" set of SP patches. ie the set with all the functionality | 19:05 |
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| notmyname | note that the new "end of chain" is https://review.openstack.org/#/c/99315/ | 19:05 |
| portante | 2 vector timestamps | 19:05 |
| peluse_ | reviewing now... | 19:05 |
| portante | I'd like some time to review that | 19:06 |
| notmyname | of course | 19:06 |
| acoles | i've started but not done on 99315 | 19:06 |
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| portante | would there be any revolt pushing this out from this week to next? | 19:06 |
| clayg | REVOLT! | 19:06 |
| notmyname | clayg: can you confirm that, other than discovered issues in the proposed patches, there is no additional functionality expected to be proposed | 19:06 |
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| clayg | notmyname: well i'm not sure the two vector timestamp stuff is really done *done* | 19:07 |
| notmyname | ok | 19:07 |
| clayg | notmyname: at a minimum it needs some extra probetests, and after two days of testing and testing i just sorta said - well i guess that's good enough | 19:07 |
| notmyname | :-) | 19:07 |
| notmyname | ok | 19:07 |
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| clayg | notmyname: I tried to audit everywhere that swift core was dealing with timestamps and I think it's all quite managable, but w/o probetests my confidence in the consistency engine in the face of the internalized form is only like... 95% | 19:08 |
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| notmyname | ack | 19:08 |
| clayg | aybe 92% | 19:08 |
| notmyname | 93.4%? | 19:08 |
| peluse_ | clayg: I'm only a few files into it but so far it seems like an improvement even aside from the new functinality (cleaner) | 19:08 |
| acoles | clayg: i have a concern that the offset needs to be absolute, like another timestamp, for it to be useful for the object metadata post use case | 19:09 |
| briancline | (no, negotiate up!) | 19:09 |
| clayg | peluse_: maybe the timestamp class is sorta nice | 19:09 |
| peluse_ | yup | 19:09 |
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| acoles | clayg: the Timestamp class IS nice | 19:09 |
| clayg | acoles: maybe we can offline that - i'm pretty sure it's useless if the offset is absolute ;) | 19:09 |
| clayg | fixed deterministic is the way to go! | 19:09 |
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| acoles | clayg: yeah, discuss offline | 19:10 |
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| notmyname | ok, so it looks like we should target Monday instead of today/tomorrow for the SP merge | 19:10 |
| notmyname | ie giving several more days for review | 19:10 |
| peluse_ | I think I'm washing my hair on Monday... | 19:10 |
| clayg | notmyname: what about getting some of the other pending stuff merged | 19:11 |
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| notmyname | clayg: well that's my next topic :-) | 19:11 |
| clayg | notmyname: did you want to cut a release 1.14 or some such before sp? | 19:11 |
| acoles | peluse_: ! | 19:11 |
| portante | peluse_: wait, you have that much hair to wash? :) | 19:11 |
| notmyname | we've had the soft freeze for a while, and there is stuff queued up | 19:11 |
| portante | hair washing? | 19:11 |
| portante | next topic? | 19:11 |
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| peluse_ | :) | 19:11 |
| notmyname | I'm not anticipating a 1.13.2 or 1.14 release before the SP release | 19:11 |
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| portante | notmyname: where are we at with the xLO fixes? | 19:12 |
| notmyname | what I am expecting is that we'll land the SP chain and also the stuff that's queued up. and all of that will be in the release | 19:12 |
| notmyname | portante: 2 +2s but not merged | 19:12 |
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| briancline | what's queued up for the SP release? or is that the bottom half of the priority reviews page | 19:12 |
| portante | but does that fix anticw's concerns? | 19:12 |
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| briancline | (other than SP of course) | 19:12 |
| notmyname | portante: yes it does | 19:12 |
| portante | great | 19:12 |
| notmyname | the bottom half of https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Swift/PriorityReviews has patches that have 1 +2 and could be in a release | 19:12 |
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| notmyname | I don't have the stuff with 2 +2s listed anywhere right now | 19:13 |
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| notmyname | portante: and, later, I've got to decide if we backport that to icehouse (likely, but not definite) | 19:13 |
| briancline | could probably beat gerrit into submission to find that | 19:13 |
| notmyname | portante: if so, I'll take care of it | 19:13 |
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| portante | notmyname: k | 19:13 |
| notmyname | so that's the current tension: a bunch of queued reviews and the SP chain that we want to avoid a bunch of rebasing on | 19:14 |
| notmyname | how about this: today I'll merge the stuff that's pending (2 +2s) and then clayg can rebase tomorrow after those land. | 19:14 |
| notmyname | ? | 19:14 |
| notmyname | clayg: thoughts? | 19:14 |
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| * portante wonders if the 2-vector timestamps should go in first against master as is | 19:14 | |
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| notmyname | the point of the soft freeze is to avoid a bunch of rebases, but if we're all in agreement, then we can to it on a limited basis | 19:15 |
| notmyname | portante: stop your speculation ;-) | 19:15 |
| portante | okay | 19:15 |
| notmyname | lol | 19:15 |
| * portante wonders why it is not raining here ... | 19:15 | |
| clayg | rebase's away! | 19:15 |
| notmyname | everyone else ok with me landing the pending stuff and then having a monday target for SP landing? | 19:16 |
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| briancline | +1 | 19:16 |
| clayg | the only reason to avoid them is cause it's ugly in gerrit for reviewers - but everyone's tolerance seems to have built up against that | 19:16 |
| clayg | notmyname: monday is a weird day to do anything | 19:16 |
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| notmyname | clayg: so are other days that end in "y" | 19:16 |
| portante | I don't mind the patch set rebase if it does not hinder clayg's efforts | 19:16 |
| notmyname | portante: that's my concern | 19:16 |
| clayg | portante: no it's no trouble for me at all really | 19:16 |
| clayg | portante: it's just annoying to reviewers | 19:17 |
| portante | okay ... pig pile! | 19:17 |
| briancline | *shrug* I've grown numb to long patch chains | 19:17 |
| acoles | i don't mind being annoyed | 19:17 |
| * portante wonders if he is comfortably numb | 19:17 | |
| notmyname | the gate seems to have moved from "horrible" to simply "terrible", so it may take all night to merge stuff | 19:17 |
| briancline | numb not because of this... that's glance's fault | 19:17 |
| notmyname | or tomorrow | 19:18 |
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| portante | notmyname: what was the special way to land this patch set? | 19:18 |
| portante | is it written up somewhere? | 19:18 |
| notmyname | #action notmyname to land pending changes | 19:18 |
| portante | the PS set | 19:18 |
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| portante | SP | 19:18 |
| notmyname | portante: good question. nice transition :-) | 19:18 |
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| * portante checks made out to ... | 19:19 | |
| notmyname | so, given the state of the gate (13.5 hours at a 50% pass rate now), we don't want to try to land 29 patches there | 19:19 |
| acoles | notmyname: aww | 19:19 |
| clayg | man... i remember when it was *only* 27 | 19:19 |
| notmyname | lol | 19:19 |
| portante | ;) | 19:19 |
| notmyname | so I've been talking with -infra to figure out a better way | 19:19 |
| notmyname | here's what we've come up with: | 19:19 |
| notmyname | review the current patches as normal | 19:20 |
| notmyname | leave +1s and +2s | 19:20 |
| notmyname | (or -1s) | 19:20 |
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| notmyname | when they all have all the necessary reviews, then we will have -infra build at new feature branch (probably "sp-review") and we'll force push all the patches there. then one merge commit will be proposed to master and reviewed in gerrit. I'll link the existing patch reviews (for historians) and we'll merge that one patch | 19:21 |
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| notmyname | the key is that all 29 patches will not have to be gated. just the final set of them all will be gated once | 19:21 |
| notmyname | I'm working with mordred on this | 19:22 |
| clayg | yay mordred! | 19:22 |
| notmyname | make sense? | 19:22 |
| portante | so will the individual commits be lost then? | 19:22 |
| notmyname | portante: no | 19:22 |
| portante | great, all for it then | 19:23 |
| notmyname | portante: the individual commits (the 29 proposed) will still exist. but they will be added to master in one atomic commit (which is also nice for future bisects and bug tracking) | 19:23 |
| notmyname | basically, this is how you are supposed to do git ;-) | 19:23 |
| portante | nice | 19:24 |
| notmyname | ok. so that takes us up to the "everything is on master" time | 19:24 |
| zaitcev | you mean in one merge | 19:24 |
| peluse_ | cool | 19:24 |
| notmyname | I'm hoping that we'll be there on tuesday (ie merge monday) | 19:24 |
| * portante wonders if a disney movie quote fits here ... fox and the hound | 19:24 | |
| notmyname | at that point, with the SP patches and the other queued up stuff, we'll cut and RC for the next release | 19:25 |
| notmyname | and master is open for new patches | 19:25 |
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| notmyname | the RC period will be extended from the normal 3-4 days to two weeks | 19:25 |
| portante | is anybody from rackspace here? | 19:25 |
| notmyname | during this time, I'm hoping that everyone will be able to do their own testing in their labs for this release | 19:26 |
| torgomatic | it amazes me that it takes a whole team effort to force Gerrit to work like Git wants it to :| | 19:26 |
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| briancline | are there any and/or do we need to define any parameters (logistically) for testing the RC? | 19:26 |
| clayg | torgomatic is filled with astonishment | 19:26 |
| notmyname | I have soft commitments from RAX, HP, softlayer, Red Hat, and maybe NeCTAR and maybe eNovance to do testing | 19:26 |
| briancline | or just throw everything imaginable at it? | 19:26 |
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| notmyname | briancline: the most important thing is that existing clusters don't break. after that, look at the new features and do "stuff" to ensure it works as expected. IOW, what would happen if you deployed it to prod and turned it on :-) | 19:27 |
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| notmyname | I'm most concerned about regressions. then functionality | 19:28 |
| zaitcev | do we have the 2-phase config in the latest SP or not? If yes, it has to be documented in some kind of readme 1) yum update or apt-get something, 2) edit swift.conf (on all nodes) and set SP_SCHEMA=true | 19:28 |
| zaitcev | or is it implicit for >1 policies | 19:28 |
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| briancline | are there any metrics or other things in specific that all who are *extremely* familiar with this full set of patches would like us to make note of? | 19:29 |
| notmyname | zaitcev: yes. updating the code is "safe". having >1 policy is what is the trigger for many of the code paths and is the "can't downgrade" point of no return | 19:29 |
| briancline | aside from what we might usually do in our individual normal course of testing | 19:29 |
| peluse_ | zaitcev: the docs have udpated info about the order to do upgrades | 19:29 |
| notmyname | peluse_: ah good | 19:29 |
| zaitcev | peluse_: thanks, I'll re-review | 19:29 |
| notmyname | assuming nothing is found during the RC period that is not also fixed during the RC period, then at the end of it we will have the final release. that will be Swift v2.0 | 19:30 |
| peluse_ | zaitcev: Cool, in the section called "Upgrading" or something like that | 19:30 |
| peluse_ | yes! | 19:30 |
| notmyname | and I'm letting some upstream community, packagers, and marketing people know | 19:30 |
| clayg | briancline: containers are going to be slower to fill up, at least in the pathological case - it may be hard to prove with the all the object server and http connection overhead | 19:30 |
| notmyname | unfortunately, as external-to-devs get involved, it puts more pressure on specific dates | 19:31 |
| clayg | briancline: but if you're benchmarking normally uses 100 containers - you might try it with only 10 - and get a before and after | 19:31 |
| notmyname | all of this put together means an end-of-June release | 19:31 |
| notmyname | any questions here? does this sound reasonable? | 19:31 |
| peluse_ | bueno | 19:31 |
| briancline | clayg: works for me - I'll make a note for myself | 19:32 |
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| notmyname | peluse_: will y'all be testing at Intel? can I add your name to the "soft QA commitment" list? | 19:32 |
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| peluse_ | we don't have production clusters but I planned on testing an upgrade on a real test cluster | 19:32 |
| notmyname | ack | 19:32 |
| notmyname | ok, so everyone review the SP patches, and when not looking at those, take a look at the ones listed at the bottom of https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Swift/PriorityReviews | 19:33 |
| portante | ack | 19:33 |
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| notmyname | and, once again, thank you to everyone here. every time I see the Swift community come together, I struck by your awesomeness :-) | 19:34 |
| peluse_ | good luck tomorrow... say yes to morphine | 19:34 |
| tdasilva | notmyname: good luck tomorrow | 19:35 |
| notmyname | thanks | 19:35 |
| portante | aw, com'on man, think wolverine! | 19:35 |
| notmyname | as a note about the non-SP release, if there are other patches that need to be in the release, please add them to the bottom of that wiki page | 19:35 |
| portante | did he have any morphine? | 19:35 |
| peluse_ | portante: youre right I think he passed | 19:35 |
| notmyname | briancline had one more topic he wanted to discuss | 19:35 |
| notmyname | #topic container sync questions | 19:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "container sync questions (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:35 | |
| notmyname | briancline: you're up | 19:35 |
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| briancline | right, so this is just a quick meta-question or two on container sync - | 19:36 |
| briancline | in reviewing some of the innards and the doc on it (http://docs.openstack.org/developer/swift/overview_container_sync.html), it isn't quite clear how it handles syncing objects whose replica 0 lives on a downed storage node | 19:37 |
| briancline | there's a brief mention of balancing distribution of work but not missing work, but the latter part isn't covered much that I saw | 19:37 |
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| briancline | I've got a WIP for the multinode instructions and figured if I can get some clarity on it then perhaps I could submit a change to clarify these | 19:38 |
| clayg | briancline: the second sync point watches will march up and sync all rows - but it expects to short circut when everyone is doing their job | 19:39 |
| notmyname | I know that the container sync processes weren't very scalable (unlike the expirer). what have you seen in your testing pandemicsyn? | 19:39 |
| clayg | notmyname: well you get replica count guys per container | 19:39 |
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| clayg | so smaller less active containers sync more quicklyish than larger more active ones - and it's really mostly dominted by the weight | 19:39 |
| notmyname | clayg: I mean the single-thread, single-process syncer that is transporting for the whole cluster. I don't recall if that was improved | 19:40 |
| clayg | but there's no idea of "container-sync is running slow, i'll run more" | 19:40 |
| briancline | clayg: ahh ok, so the secondary/teriary nodes should detect this from SP2? if so, will they have the intelligence to distinguish between the replica 0 node being down versus it taking a long time to complete a prior sync? | 19:40 |
| clayg | notmyname: well it is single process per container server... | 19:40 |
| notmyname | clayg: ah ok | 19:40 |
| clayg | briancline: what? | 19:40 |
| clayg | briancline: you're talking specifically about container sync with storage policies? | 19:41 |
| notmyname | sync point, I think :-) | 19:41 |
| clayg | or ust scaling container sync in general? | 19:41 |
| briancline | no, container sync itself | 19:41 |
| clayg | oh heheheheh | 19:41 |
| notmyname | briancline: SP now means storage polices :-) | 19:41 |
| briancline | oh, haha | 19:41 |
| briancline | sorry, sync point 2 :) | 19:41 |
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| clayg | briancline: no they don't distinguish, everyone moves everything eventually | 19:42 |
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| clayg | briancline: but at first they only try mod replica count and then wait for the second pass before doing all rows and hope they other guys make that second sweep quick | 19:42 |
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| briancline | alright, that helps a good bit | 19:43 |
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| clayg | briancline: you might be surprised | 19:43 |
| clayg | briancline: but it *sounds* good! | 19:43 |
| clayg | briancline: and it works... which is always nice | 19:43 |
| briancline | I only mean it helps my understanding ;-) | 19:43 |
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| notmyname | cool. I think other design/usage questions should come up in #openstack-swift | 19:44 |
| clayg | heheheh | 19:45 |
| notmyname | and Rackspace is looking at it too, so you might want to ping them on it as well. and I'm hoping all of it results in patches to make it better :-) | 19:45 |
| briancline | so my current understanding is the contention point is we don't want to worry about a single coordination point that would solve some of the scaling issues, and that it's totally serial per container server, correct? | 19:45 |
| briancline | if this is a bit too in the weeds I can take it offline | 19:46 |
| notmyname | briancline: ya, I think it should be discussion in -swift | 19:47 |
| notmyname | *discussed | 19:47 |
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| briancline | I mostly put it on the agenda since I've seen a lot of lonely souls ask about it without much input | 19:47 |
| briancline | alright, cool | 19:47 |
| notmyname | #topic other topics? | 19:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "other topics? (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:47 | |
| notmyname | anythign else to bring up as a group this week? | 19:47 |
| creiht | howdy | 19:48 |
| creiht | sorry | 19:48 |
| notmyname | welcome :-) | 19:48 |
| notmyname | creiht: we are just finishing up | 19:48 |
| notmyname | actually, I think we're done | 19:48 |
| creiht | perfect timing :) | 19:49 |
| notmyname | thanks everyone for attending and participating | 19:49 |
| clayg | creiht: i'll stay and talk with you if you want | 19:49 |
| notmyname | #endmeeting | 19:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:49 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 11 19:49:19 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:49 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2014/swift.2014-06-11-19.01.html | 19:49 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2014/swift.2014-06-11-19.01.txt | 19:49 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2014/swift.2014-06-11-19.01.log.html | 19:49 |
| notmyname | creiht: there are the logs. pay attention to the release plan stuff ^^ | 19:49 |
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| creiht | k | 19:49 |
| creiht | was just about to go through scrollback | 19:50 |
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| notmyname | creiht: tl;dr is try to merge SP on monday and then have a 2 week RC period | 19:51 |
| creiht | k | 19:51 |
| notmyname | creiht: I'm working with -infra to make that sane | 19:51 |
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| notmyname | creiht: and I'll click approve on a bunch of pending patches as soon as I get back from lunch | 19:51 |
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| creiht | k | 19:51 |
| notmyname | details in the logs :- | 19:51 |
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| notmyname | ) | 19:51 |
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| cutforth | * is this how i wonder? | 20:23 |
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| cutforth | test | 20:33 |
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