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| matt-borland | o/ | 15:01 |
|---|---|---|
| robcresswell | \o | 15:01 |
| piet | Morning | 15:01 |
| hurgleburgler | ( ಠ‿ಠ)┘ | 15:01 |
| piet | #startmeeting openstack_ux | 15:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Fri Jan 29 15:02:09 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is piet. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: openstack_ux)" | 15:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_ux' | 15:02 |
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| piet | Let's wait five minutes | 15:02 |
| piet | robcresswell quick question about cisco | 15:02 |
| robcresswell | Yeah? | 15:03 |
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| piet | Is cisco developing an internal cloud for it's developers, public cloud or services around the cloud? | 15:04 |
| piet | Just cruious | 15:05 |
| robcresswell | We have people on 1 and 3 iirc. | 15:05 |
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| piet | Kk | 15:05 |
| robcresswell | But, the upstream guys are pretty far separated from the product efforts. | 15:06 |
| piet | Kk | 15:06 |
| piet | Persona Validation Survey | 15:06 |
| piet | Role call | 15:06 |
| piet | o? | 15:06 |
| piet | Damg! | 15:06 |
| piet | o/ | 15:06 |
| matt-borland | o/ | 15:07 |
| hurgleburgler | ٩(ˊ〇ˋ*)و | 15:07 |
| piet | Just a warning, a bit tired... | 15:07 |
| piet | #topic Persona Validation Survey | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Persona Validation Survey (Meeting topic: openstack_ux)" | 15:07 | |
| piet | https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/2C27W3C | 15:07 |
| piet | I'm not sure there's a ton to talking about...we're lacking for respondents, so need help forward to as many people as possible | 15:08 |
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| piet | Any questions for me? | 15:09 |
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| piet | #topic User Dashboard Study | 15:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "User Dashboard Study (Meeting topic: openstack_ux)" | 15:09 | |
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| piet | We are hurting for people willing to participate in this study. I'm very worried because the general consensus seems to be that the Overview panel needs to be better for end users | 15:11 |
| piet | I really ned you folks helping to find devs deploying to the cloud | 15:11 |
| piet | https://doodle.com/poll/5sqy2gr8c34fzqy8 | 15:12 |
| matt-borland | I get the sense that this is a frequently changed/customized page | 15:12 |
| matt-borland | because it's not useful :) | 15:12 |
| piet | That wouldn't surprise me | 15:12 |
| piet | I also feel as though we don't know enough about our end users | 15:12 |
| piet | The intent of the study is to really understand workflows for end users who are ultimately our customers | 15:13 |
| matt-borland | Yeah, and there are also the people that *don't use* Horizon because of it being unscalable, or cumbersome. | 15:14 |
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| matt-borland | so it's "potential" users that are important to me. | 15:14 |
| piet | Yep | 15:14 |
| matt-borland | I'd like to find those people. | 15:14 |
| piet | I think there is the general question around workflows | 15:15 |
| piet | Questions about scaling are really intended for operators, IMHO | 15:15 |
| piet | Please, please, please forward that link | 15:16 |
| piet | Are we ready to move on? | 15:16 |
| matt-borland | y | 15:16 |
| hurgleburgler | yup | 15:17 |
| piet | #topic Mobile App Use Cases for Operators | 15:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Mobile App Use Cases for Operators (Meeting topic: openstack_ux)" | 15:17 | |
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| piet | Was kind of pulled into this study because there is a project around creating a mobile expereince | 15:17 |
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| hurgleburgler | Do they mean a mobile app or just somethign they can use on their phone? | 15:18 |
| hurgleburgler | app vs. responsive design | 15:18 |
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| piet | We're not that far yet. Really what to understand how users think about mobile | 15:19 |
| hurgleburgler | There is a project around creating an IPHONE app, if I recall correctly | 15:19 |
| piet | Same one | 15:19 |
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| hurgleburgler | what do we hope to prove with the study, I guess is my question? | 15:19 |
| hurgleburgler | We are already pushing horizon toward a mobile friendly responsive design | 15:19 |
| hurgleburgler | so, it will encompass both web and mobile | 15:20 |
| piet | The project is vahana | 15:20 |
| robcresswell | pushing, although a long way from it. I'm surprised there is any genuine need for it? I'd imagine most people just see email alerts etc and respond to that. | 15:20 |
| hurgleburgler | what i'm saying is | 15:20 |
| hurgleburgler | that is duplicating work | 15:20 |
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| piet | The goal is trying to understand the use cases. We have no idea how operators think about mobile. | 15:20 |
| hurgleburgler | Right now, 'default' just doesn't work on mobile, so no one is really using it | 15:21 |
| piet | Before we talk abut the specific technology | 15:21 |
| robcresswell | fair enough | 15:21 |
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| piet | I don't know if its an alerting system, just a small version of horizon or what... | 15:22 |
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| piet | Interestingly, one of the responses I'm getting during recruiting is that operators aren't really wanting for mobile | 15:23 |
| matt-borland | interesting | 15:24 |
| robcresswell | It gets mentioned at summits, but nothing really beyond "hey this is cool" | 15:24 |
| piet | One response is "I wouldn't be a good recruit because I don't really care..." | 15:24 |
| piet | robcresswell that was my impression too | 15:25 |
| piet | However, they seem to be going down that path, so need to get ahead of it | 15:25 |
| hurgleburgler | we are already going down that path as well | 15:25 |
| piet | Maybe it's not the UI | 15:25 |
| piet | Maybe they just enable operators to easily create their own UIs. I just have no idea | 15:27 |
| piet | Are we good to change topic? | 15:27 |
| hurgleburgler | oh yeah | 15:27 |
| piet | The take-away form the mobile study is that I don't have a clue what operators want | 15:28 |
| piet | #topic Move to a UX repository (Gerrit) | 15:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Move to a UX repository (Gerrit) (Meeting topic: openstack_ux)" | 15:28 | |
| hurgleburgler | its a tricky subject | 15:28 |
| piet | hurgleburgler anything to add? | 15:29 |
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| hurgleburgler | because if we can make horizon more of an actual dashboard, with real time status, then I can see people needed to check on it often | 15:29 |
| hurgleburgler | that's it :) | 15:29 |
| hurgleburgler | i'm done | 15:29 |
| piet | Heh | 15:29 |
| piet | hurgleburgler anything to add on gerritt? | 15:30 |
| hurgleburgler | I'm working on it | 15:30 |
| hurgleburgler | if anyone has experience in using SourceTree with Gerritt | 15:30 |
| hurgleburgler | Any help would be appreciated | 15:30 |
| hurgleburgler | I spun my wheels on it for a while, before i found this | 15:31 |
| hurgleburgler | https://jira.atlassian.com/browse/SRCTREE-2940 | 15:31 |
| hurgleburgler | So, I downleveled my SourceTree and I need to try everything again | 15:31 |
| piet | Ha! ;^) My impression is that its ready, but we need to more on to a visual ui for the designers | 15:31 |
| hurgleburgler | If we want to get stuff working right away, we might just have the non-command liney people do everything in the UI and then type 'git review' from the command line | 15:31 |
| hurgleburgler | its a work around and it won't help them with conflicts, but they can start pushing stuff right away | 15:32 |
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| piet | Well, it seems like the devs can use it for now | 15:32 |
| hurgleburgler | the repo is 100% ready for anything | 15:32 |
| hurgleburgler | But | 15:32 |
| piet | We should find something in Invision to push through | 15:33 |
| hurgleburgler | git isn't necessarily good at handling binary files | 15:33 |
| hurgleburgler | so, we will ONLY put up designs for final review that have gone through the Invision ringer | 15:33 |
| hurgleburgler | AND | 15:33 |
| piet | Why is that? | 15:33 |
| hurgleburgler | I really really want us to get to a point where all of the mockups are just SVG wireframes | 15:33 |
| hurgleburgler | SVGs are just text files | 15:33 |
| hurgleburgler | so, uploading them to the repo takes up less space | 15:33 |
| piet | You know, I haven't really played with the SVG format | 15:34 |
| hurgleburgler | We can discuss the options | 15:34 |
| hurgleburgler | But … this also brings up another point | 15:34 |
| piet | Is the resolution OK? | 15:34 |
| hurgleburgler | we are continuing to get designs from UX that are full mock ups | 15:34 |
| hurgleburgler | How can we solve this? | 15:34 |
| piet | Agreed | 15:34 |
| piet | We need to document the requirements for Invision | 15:34 |
| hurgleburgler | We can ask that before the final design is uploaded to the repo for developers to begin work on, that the design transfer it to an svg wireframe | 15:35 |
| hurgleburgler | or, we can just start -2'ing anything that gives full visual designs | 15:35 |
| robcresswell | Invision is so damn slow. | 15:35 |
| robcresswell | *sigh* | 15:35 |
| hurgleburgler | It crashes my firefox constantly | 15:35 |
| piet | Yep | 15:35 |
| piet | I was goig to mention this during another topic, but we may need to go through and archive stuff that's done | 15:36 |
| hurgleburgler | what is done? | 15:36 |
| hurgleburgler | can we convert what designs are complete and start checking those into the repo? | 15:36 |
| piet | It will be anything accepted in the repo | 15:36 |
| piet | Sure - I would look at the ironic panel to start | 15:37 |
| piet | hurgleburgler let's circle back on your comment about wireframes | 15:38 |
| hurgleburgler | Can we get a list of all of the designs that have gone through Invision? | 15:38 |
| piet | Currently displayed? | 15:38 |
| piet | I think the group can do that - don't wait for me. | 15:38 |
| hurgleburgler | ?? | 15:39 |
| piet | matt-borland can you go through and archive the stuff that is complete by TWs? | 15:39 |
| robcresswell | hurgleburgler: Just the ones that are listed as All Done right? | 15:39 |
| robcresswell | on invision. | 15:39 |
| matt-borland | piet, sure, I can dig through all that. | 15:39 |
| piet | robcresswell yeah | 15:40 |
| hurgleburgler | who can we tap to convert them to wireframes? | 15:40 |
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| hurgleburgler | I can help, but I can't do them all | 15:40 |
| hurgleburgler | it will take ages | 15:40 |
| hurgleburgler | We can write up guidelines for designs as well | 15:41 |
| hurgleburgler | we can add them to the specs on our repo | 15:41 |
| piet | Currently, it seems to be London that's adding the designs w visual designs. I'm trying to take care of that internally. To be fair, this is nothing that is explicit about what we will accpet | 15:41 |
| hurgleburgler | Exactly | 15:42 |
| hurgleburgler | but, switching is going to be a bit of overhead | 15:42 |
| hurgleburgler | including converting the images AND writing up the guidelines | 15:42 |
| piet | I think archiving the TW stuff will make a difference | 15:42 |
| hurgleburgler | Just seeing who can help out with the initial load | 15:42 |
| piet | And I can get rid of the old concept stuff | 15:42 |
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| hurgleburgler | Also, how are we handling intake requests? | 15:43 |
| piet | hurgleburgler What do you mean? | 15:43 |
| hurgleburgler | We should start asking people to create blueprints and bugs | 15:43 |
| hurgleburgler | now that we have the capability | 15:43 |
| piet | Associated with the designs they post to Invision? | 15:43 |
| hurgleburgler | If there is a new design thta is needed | 15:44 |
| hurgleburgler | or another project needs help with a design | 15:44 |
| piet | It makes sense because it formalizes the review process | 15:44 |
| hurgleburgler | Then, we can prioritize things a bit more too | 15:44 |
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| piet | I would add that they should add a link to the blueprint in Invision | 15:45 |
| hurgleburgler | Yeah | 15:45 |
| hurgleburgler | Blueprints get accepted | 15:45 |
| piet | k | 15:45 |
| hurgleburgler | so, we can focus on the work that has been accepted, instead of the chaos | 15:45 |
| piet | The chaos is bringing me down | 15:46 |
| hurgleburgler | lol | 15:46 |
| piet | Ready to move on? | 15:46 |
| hurgleburgler | yup | 15:46 |
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| piet | #topic Documentation needs | 15:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Documentation needs (Meeting topic: openstack_ux)" | 15:47 | |
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| piet | This kind of fits into the previous conversation | 15:47 |
| piet | We need to start documenting the different process along w guides | 15:48 |
| hurgleburgler | We have a wiki and we have developer docs now … | 15:48 |
| robcresswell | There's a doc folder in the repo right? | 15:48 |
| hurgleburgler | How do we decide what goes where? | 15:48 |
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| robcresswell | We should flesh out the Contributing doc in the repo so its up on docs.openstack.org | 15:49 |
| piet | I need to chat with the docs people on a project-by-project basis because there are different kinds | 15:49 |
| hurgleburgler | robcresswell +1 | 15:49 |
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| piet | Nice....in the contributor area? | 15:49 |
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| hurgleburgler | Contributing doc needs to include sections on 'Design guidelines', 'Reviewing guidelines', 'Invision', 'Intake Process' ? | 15:50 |
| piet | Yeah | 15:50 |
| hurgleburgler | Can we get some volunteers to start writing up the sections? | 15:50 |
| hurgleburgler | I'll take Design Guidelines | 15:50 |
| robcresswell | I'm away for the next week | 15:50 |
| piet | I think we can merge Design, review and invision into one. | 15:50 |
| robcresswell | But can do some after that | 15:51 |
| hurgleburgler | Since I'm apparently the most opinionated about that one | 15:51 |
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| hurgleburgler | Thanks robcresswell! | 15:51 |
| hurgleburgler | I think waiting a week is alright | 15:51 |
| piet | How does content get submitted? | 15:51 |
| hurgleburgler | via the repo | 15:51 |
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| piet | Thanks robcresswell ! | 15:51 |
| hurgleburgler | until we get the sourcetree stuff sorted out, if you write up content Piet, I can show you how to push it | 15:51 |
| piet | k | 15:51 |
| hurgleburgler | robcresswell which section would you like ot take? | 15:51 |
| piet | I may ask the docs people to help with this | 15:52 |
| piet | They were the ones that are doing the UI Content Guidelines | 15:52 |
| hurgleburgler | matt-borland are you able to take a section to help out? | 15:52 |
| piet | But need to ask (nicely) | 15:52 |
| robcresswell | hurgleburgler: I dont mind. I was probably going to sit down one afternoon and just churn out a step by step of getting new content into UX | 15:53 |
| robcresswell | similar to what Horizon has | 15:53 |
| hurgleburgler | great! | 15:53 |
| robcresswell | What we're looking for, tools to use, workflow etc. | 15:53 |
| matt-borland | hurgleburgler, sure | 15:53 |
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| piet | Yep | 15:53 |
| hurgleburgler | What would you title that robcresswell? | 15:53 |
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| robcresswell | hurgleburgler: I was just gonna update the base Contributing doc in the repo. Its empty atm | 15:54 |
| hurgleburgler | Perfect :) | 15:54 |
| robcresswell | Something like this http://docs.openstack.org/developer/horizon/contributing.html But UX-ified | 15:54 |
| hurgleburgler | Piet can you write up something on the Invision process? | 15:54 |
| hurgleburgler | UX-ified means we need fancy animations and icons | 15:55 |
| hurgleburgler | \o/ | 15:55 |
| piet | Where is the Contributing doc located? | 15:55 |
| hurgleburgler | In the repo | 15:55 |
| hurgleburgler | when we make it | 15:55 |
| hurgleburgler | erm, when robcresswell makes it | 15:55 |
| hurgleburgler | and pushes it | 15:55 |
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| hurgleburgler | baby steps | 15:55 |
| piet | Where do users find it | 15:56 |
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| hurgleburgler | we can start working on it now, and then have the docs people review and help when they can | 15:56 |
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| piet | Would it be located at http://docs.openstack.org/developer/horizon/contributing.html ? | 15:56 |
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| hurgleburgler | Yeah, when we get it on docs.openstack.org | 15:57 |
| hurgleburgler | Not sure if we need to anything special to get it included, but we'll see | 15:57 |
| piet | yeah, it would be good to chat w docs to see if they have any ideas | 15:57 |
| robcresswell | They dont get involved in dev docs | 15:57 |
| robcresswell | I've asked before | 15:57 |
| piet | k | 15:58 |
| hurgleburgler | Should we also detail the responsibilities that we expect from cores? | 15:58 |
| piet | One last thing | 15:58 |
| piet | Since we're out of time | 15:58 |
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| hurgleburgler | k | 15:58 |
| piet | Pls review https://invis.io/JD56836CQ | 15:58 |
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| piet | Ironic standalone | 15:59 |
| piet | Review summit proposals https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/mitaka-openstackux-summitpresentations | 15:59 |
| piet | robcresswell pls review "Ten steps to accomodate your users" | 16:00 |
| robcresswell | Will do | 16:00 |
| piet | Submitting this weekend | 16:00 |
| piet | ok - out of time, thanks for attending | 16:00 |
| piet | Any last words? | 16:01 |
| piet | 5 | 16:01 |
| piet | 4 | 16:01 |
| piet | 3 | 16:01 |
| piet | 2 | 16:01 |
| jacalcat | I will get mine done today. Probably late this afternoon. | 16:01 |
| hurgleburgler | have a green weekend! | 16:01 |
| hurgleburgler | great too, erg | 16:01 |
| piet | Yep - you can also decide who to inlcude as co-presenters | 16:01 |
| piet | Bye! | 16:02 |
| piet | #endmeeting openstack_ux | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:02 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Fri Jan 29 16:02:17 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:02 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_ux/2016/openstack_ux.2016-01-29-15.02.html | 16:02 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_ux/2016/openstack_ux.2016-01-29-15.02.txt | 16:02 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_ux/2016/openstack_ux.2016-01-29-15.02.log.html | 16:02 |
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