Thursday, 2015-01-08

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sigmavirus24nikhil_k: o/15:00
curtis_pennero/15:01
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flaper87o/15:01
sigmavirus24Hi curtis_penner15:01
nikhil_k\o15:02
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curtis_pennerHi15:02
lakshmiSo/15:02
nikhil_k#startmeeting Glance15:02
openstackMeeting started Thu Jan  8 15:02:14 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is nikhil_k. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.15:02
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'glance'15:02
nikhil_k#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-team-meeting-agenda15:02
kragnizo/15:02
nikhil_k#topic Updates15:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Updates (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:02
zhiyanHappy new years guys15:02
kragnizzhiyan: happy new year!15:02
flaper87happy new year everyone15:02
zhiyan(even i do lunar one)15:03
nikhil_k#info Mini summit head count - expected ~15 or less15:03
nikhil_kOh yes , happy new year :)15:03
zhiyan:)15:03
nikhil_kPlease enter details soon for the same15:03
nikhil_k#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-team-meeting-agenda15:03
nikhil_koops15:04
nikhil_k#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kilo-glance-mid-cycle-meetup15:04
nikhil_k#link http://osdir.com/ml/openstack-dev/2015-01/msg00098.html15:04
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nikhil_kWhatever I had to say about it is in Participation and Sessions section of the meeting agenda etherpad15:05
* sigmavirus24 is disappointed that he won't be making the mid-cycle15:05
flaper87sigmavirus24: that makes it 2 of us15:05
nikhil_kPlease let me know if anyone has any concerns15:06
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nikhil_kGiven the limited amount of expected participation, it feels okay for us to keep a couple of hours of open discussion on both days15:06
nikhil_kMost likely the schedule can be set mid-late next week.15:07
zhiyannikhil_k: do we need to try remote way? i probably can help test it15:07
nikhil_kRemote participation is still being figured out15:07
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flaper87nikhil_k: +2 for having the schedule ready next week15:07
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nikhil_kzhiyan: yeah, the event manager is trying to figure it out15:08
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zhiyannikhil_k: happy to know it15:08
nikhil_kflaper87: about your topic, it might take a just bit more time to co-ordinate with Nova15:08
nikhil_kHope to keep it on Tuesdays tentatively15:08
nikhil_ks/Tuesdays/Tuesday/15:08
flaper87nikhil_k: +215:09
nikhil_kDoes anyone have anything more to add?15:09
flaper87I won't be able to attend so anything I can do from here, I'll do.15:09
nikhil_kflaper87: ok, sounds good. Thanks!15:09
nikhil_knext up15:10
nikhil_k#topic Stuff to be corrected.15:10
*** openstack changes topic to "Stuff to be corrected. (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:10
nikhil_kI've mentioned to a few folks on our project channel to be more vigilant about the reviews15:11
nikhil_kseems like we've a lot more code being proposed from new contributors to Glance15:11
nikhil_kto add to that we have made some mistakes ourselves15:11
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nikhil_kCommit messages, improper splitting of the Merge Props, security bugs - these are some of the categories which have been very error prone lately15:12
nikhil_kI believe this needs to be corrected and15:13
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nikhil_kthe first responsibility is mine, so here are some of the action items from my end15:13
nikhil_k1. scrutinize the reviews, provide feedback to the reviewers15:13
nikhil_k2. get a Glance specific review guideline list15:14
nikhil_kbesides15:14
nikhil_k#link http://docs.openstack.org/infra/manual/developers.html#peer-review15:14
TravT_what is improper splitting of the merge props?15:14
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nikhil_k3. scrutinize bug descriptions and tally them with the reviews and sync with core and non-cores about the same (enhanced best practices)15:15
flaper87FWIW, I think the best way to help people improve their reviews is by commenting on the same patch and pointing out things that are missing in the patch15:15
flaper87for example, if I see a commit message that is not proper, I'd ask the author to provide a better error message15:15
nikhil_kflaper87: That is an ideal case, it has not been happening lately.15:15
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nikhil_kMoreover, cores are proposing and +2/Aing such changes15:16
nikhil_kwhich is what calls for added measure15:16
flaper87right, I'm pretty sure I've done it too.15:16
sigmavirus24On other projects there has typically been resistance to asking people to improve commit messages beyond adding DocImpact (or some other flag), I wasn't sure if it was acceptable here too15:16
nikhil_kI am compiling a list of such errors and common gotchas15:16
sigmavirus24nikhil_k: perhaps examples would be helpful to some people as well, if you're okay with that15:17
nikhil_kWill be sharing it with a few active devs first and then have it circulated widely15:17
sigmavirus24+115:17
kragnizIt's also very easy to amend the commit message via gerrit for trivial changes15:17
nikhil_ksigmavirus24: TravT_ ^15:17
sigmavirus24kragniz: agreed15:17
flaper87I think asking for better commit message is fine and must be done15:17
nikhil_kkragniz: glad that you brought it up15:17
nikhil_kIf it's easy, why are reviewers not using it15:18
flaper87it's not a matter of fixing typos but providing a message good enough to help people understand what's happening in the patch15:18
nikhil_kThe problem does not seem to be with ease, rather with missed review guidelines15:18
flaper87nikhil_k: if you amend the commit message you'll be set as committer15:18
flaper87nikhil_k: agreed15:18
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nikhil_kflaper87: that too, however in a must do situation reviewers can do it15:19
flaper87yup15:19
nikhil_kAlso, this devaluates the importance of +1s15:19
nikhil_kRight now, I'm not so confident to even +2/A a patch which has as many as 2-3 +1s15:20
nikhil_kIdeally, the to-be cores should study the patch and bring out fallacies in fewer PS15:21
nikhil_kthat way it gives core reviewers to move the queue quicker15:21
flaper87As bad as it sounds, I don't normally trust +1's as I trust -1's15:21
nikhil_kflaper87: agreed, however15:21
flaper87"don't normally" to be read as "almost never"15:21
nikhil_kmany times there are arguments that a patch has 5 +1s and does not have a +215:22
nikhil_kthink, the reasons are stated above15:22
nikhil_kThe review guidelines doc was being prepared however, it got delayed with k1 in the middle15:23
flaper87yup, if the patch is trivial, I'd probably feel confident to +2/A, otherwise I'd just +215:23
nikhil_kBest to catch up with it son15:23
nikhil_ksoon*15:23
flaper87nikhil_k: agreed15:23
flaper87ping ?15:26
kragnizmove on?15:26
nikhil_kAre there any questions on this topic and on the specs details mentioned in the etherpad?15:26
nikhil_kok, next topic15:27
kragniznikhil_k: all sounds good to be worked on in the future15:27
nikhil_k#topic Shout outs15:27
*** openstack changes topic to "Shout outs (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:27
nikhil_k#info jokke_ did some excellent work on stability, especially when the gate was broken15:28
nikhil_k#info kragniz has been extremely vigilant on various aspects and had pointed out that we missed an important commit in k115:28
* flaper87 now knows why kragniz wanted to move on15:28
kragniz\o/ thanks!15:29
flaper87jokes apart:15:29
kragnizflaper87: haha15:29
flaper87kragniz: jokke_ great work15:29
flaper87thanks for all the efforst there15:29
kragniz:)15:29
flaper87efforts*15:29
nikhil_kjokke_ kragniz and sigmavirus24 : Have been excellent with bug triage, releases, etc.15:29
zhiyanthank you joke kragniz15:29
nikhil_kKudos to these folks for taking up the often neglected yet important part of the project!15:30
sigmavirus24but it's fun stuff ;)15:30
TravT_great work!15:30
nikhil_kAnyone else that you all noticed?15:30
zhiyannikhil_k: and flaper87 ? :)15:31
sigmavirus24cpallares has been catching some excellent things on review too15:31
flaper87zhiyan: :)15:31
flaper87sigmavirus24: right, cpallares has been doing an awesome work15:32
sigmavirus24(Shame she isn't here at the moment)15:32
sigmavirus24#info cpallares has been catching some excellent things on review too (and flaper87 agrees ;))15:32
nikhil_kwoot!15:32
kragnizivasilevskaya, too15:33
nikhil_kAwesome15:33
flaper87ok, ok, ok ok, Iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii geeeet it, glance's community is super amazing!15:33
nikhil_k#info cpallares and  ivasilevskaya - thanks for your efforts and good work!15:33
flaper87congrats everyone for your hard work15:33
zhiyan:))15:33
nikhil_klol, flaper8715:33
flaper87:P15:34
nikhil_kbut yeah, something like that15:34
nikhil_k#topic Reviews/Bugs/Releases15:34
*** openstack changes topic to "Reviews/Bugs/Releases (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:34
sigmavirus24flaper87: better than rust? =P15:34
nikhil_kFollow up from previous discussion, please make a note to tag, link and mark the bug/review appropriately for expecting it to be in a release15:35
flaper87sigmavirus24: no15:35
flaper87erm, I mean, yes15:35
flaper87:P15:35
sigmavirus24lol15:35
nikhil_kI believe, our current way of handling releases has been working well15:35
kragniznikhil_k: this is marking it in launchpad, right?15:36
nikhil_kTo avoid missing important commits in major releases like k2 - please be extra careful.15:36
sigmavirus24nikhil_k: one clarification: should we mark a bug as k-2 if we think it *should* be in there or if we think it will be able to make it in there? (or both?)15:36
nikhil_kkragniz: yes15:36
kragnizcool15:36
nikhil_ksigmavirus24: the bug supervisor can mark it k2 as long as we are confident15:36
nikhil_kwould like to avoid clutter in the release page15:37
sigmavirus24Understood. :)15:37
nikhil_krelease management wont be much happy15:37
sigmavirus24Thanks for clarifying15:37
nikhil_k#topic Stable branch for glance_store15:37
*** openstack changes topic to "Stable branch for glance_store (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:37
nikhil_kAny takers?15:38
flaper87o/15:38
flaper87it's funny... the most mentally unstable dude in this group takes care of stable branches15:38
flaper87that'd be me :P15:38
nikhil_klol15:38
flaper87I'm already in the global stable team15:39
rprakash_#info talking about telcowg in next summit, that will be too late for getting featutres into l1 as now its k2/k3 at most for now15:39
flaper87if some glance-core wants to take care of our glance/glance_Store stable branches15:39
flaper87it'd be great15:39
kragnizflaper87: maybe you need to be a little unhinged to take them on :P15:39
zhiyanflaper87: o/15:39
nikhil_kflaper87: we are supposed to have a stable team for Glance15:40
rprakash_Rather join weekly telcowg at Openstack and get our OPNFV requirements early in k2..cycles15:40
nikhil_krprakash_: wrong channel?15:40
flaper87lemme rephrase that, it'd be good to have one more guy besides me looking after stable branches15:40
rprakash_sorry folks15:40
flaper87nikhil_k: right, I knew I had to rephrase that phrase :P15:40
nikhil_kflaper87: The overall Glance stable team would be a good choice, imho15:41
* flaper87 agrees15:41
flaper87I'm happy to be part of it15:41
nikhil_kThat can include repr from each of the store drivers15:41
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* nikhil_k suggests that approach to be able to tackle security/stability isssues faster15:42
* nikhil_k hands are so cold to type correctly :P15:42
sigmavirus24nikhil_k: you're in VA. It's -25F with the windchill where I am15:43
sigmavirus24(Approx -32C)15:43
nikhil_kdearness15:43
kragnizsigmavirus24: yum15:44
* flaper87 is living the weirdest winter ever... it's like 5C outside15:44
zhiyanmy place approx -20c15:44
sigmavirus24zhiyan: ^515:44
flaper87o.015:44
zhiyanoutside i mean15:44
zhiyanok, next one?15:45
kragniz9C here!15:45
flaper87zhiyan: LOL, yeah, I figured :P15:45
nikhil_klol zhiyan15:45
curtis_penner7C here15:45
zhiyanit's mine15:45
nikhil_kok, next15:45
lakshmiSTake 77 here15:45
flaper87who else? who else?15:45
kragniz(outside)15:45
zhiyan:)15:45
nikhil_k#topic Cancellable store.add operation15:45
*** openstack changes topic to "Cancellable store.add operation (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:45
flaper87aaaaaaaah :(15:45
kragniznot #topic weather? :P15:45
nikhil_kzhiyan: ?15:45
zhiyanyes. cool. when i fix the bug, i think we'd better do a enhancment for glance.15:46
zhiyancurrently, glance allow use deletes image which under uploading stage - 'saving' status.15:47
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nikhil_kHmm, that would be tricky to do15:47
zhiyanso use could use image-delete to cancel the uploading, or just remove a 'bad' image (think about nova capturing image get wrong/failure)15:48
zhiyancurrently we already support it15:48
zhiyanbut a issue exist in glance, if you interest pls check/review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/144464/15:48
zhiyanthe point it that, even we support that, it has some delay15:49
nikhil_kzhiyan: the tricky part is for the uploader thread to check the status in intervals during the upload15:50
nikhil_kit can be bad on the DB15:50
zhiyaneven image-delete image metatdata get delete from db and the request return to end user immediately, but actually the previrus uploading is still executing.15:51
nikhil_kzhiyan: The situation does not look good however, the alternatives are not great either. Do you have a proposal in mind?15:52
zhiyandue to currently glance can only get stored image location when store.add() return, so concurrent glance-delete couldn't remove any on-going chunks15:52
zhiyanyes15:52
zhiyanso i think we need to way to break store.add()15:53
sigmavirus24Is there a spec for this?15:53
zhiyanthat means when an image get delete, we need ask store to cancel on-going uploading operation. then the uploading 'thread' will notice it (by an exception glance_store raised out)15:53
* nikhil_k likes where sigmavirus24 is going15:53
zhiyansigmavirus24: not yet, in my mind now.15:54
zhiyannikhil_k: that's not a big deal, will/i'd like prepare15:54
nikhil_ksg15:54
zhiyannikhil_k: actually i think this could be a part of store-capabilities (as a follow-up new cap)15:55
zhiyanif store support this cap, then we can cancel the on-going upload safely, then finally, that means15:55
zhiyanend user could 'cancel' a uploading image quickly.15:55
zhiyanand the quota will never exceeded15:55
nikhil_kmight be worth an investigation15:56
* nikhil_k likes the spec idea15:56
zhiyani mentioned some details of my thoughts in the last sentence of my comment at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/144464/ as well.15:56
nikhil_kzhiyan: can we give some time for open discussion?15:56
zhiyansure15:56
nikhil_kzhiyan: Thanks for the detailed analysis. Much appreciated!15:57
nikhil_k#topic Open Discussion15:57
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Glance)"15:57
zhiyanhmm ok.15:57
flaper87just a heads up: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/144875/15:57
flaper87that baby is out there15:58
zhiyannikhil_k: so i'd like to add that stuff as a topic for mid-cycle meeting, sounds good?15:58
nikhil_kflaper87: woah! nice ;)15:58
flaper87Figting with gate failures right now but I think I'll get it done soon15:58
nikhil_kzhiyan: yeah, def15:58
nikhil_kzhiyan: will you be attending?15:58
zhiyannikhil_k: remote15:59
kragnizflaper87: it's looking nice!15:59
zhiyan(always remote, Hmm)15:59
TravT_how many people will actually be in person?15:59
nikhil_k10-15 prolly16:00
nikhil_kThanks everyone!16:00
nikhil_k#endmeeting16:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"16:00
kragnizthanks nikhil_k!16:00
openstackMeeting ended Thu Jan  8 16:00:53 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)16:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2015/glance.2015-01-08-15.02.html16:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2015/glance.2015-01-08-15.02.txt16:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2015/glance.2015-01-08-15.02.log.html16:00
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