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| pleia2 | lifeless: usually would have been yesterday, but we did it today (and early for you, as derekh had to head out), chat was mostly about this change you reviewed https://review.openstack.org/#/c/61052/ | 00:56 |
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| pleia2 | lifeless: oh and derekh is going to look at your networking comments from line 151 on tripleo-test-cluster | 00:58 |
| lifeless | ok | 00:58 |
| lifeless | pleia2: was my review largely in line with the discussion you had? | 00:58 |
| pleia2 | lifeless: yep, and very helpful | 01:00 |
| lifeless | ok cool | 01:01 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack-infra/tripleo-ci: Test environment worker template. https://review.openstack.org/58596 | 02:00 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Don't enable services in os-svc-install https://review.openstack.org/59300 | 02:05 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack-infra/tripleo-ci: Test environment worker template. https://review.openstack.org/58596 | 02:25 |
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| rpodolyaka1 | morning | 05:20 |
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| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: morning! | 06:14 |
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| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: hey! have you seen my update on rebuild? | 06:21 |
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| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: I have not | 06:22 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: so it's not much, but it managed to rebuild a BM node saving a string in a file on ephemeral partition | 06:22 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: I brought it up int he nova meeting | 06:22 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: \o/ | 06:22 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: thats brilliant | 06:22 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: great! I've seen a few comments | 06:22 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: ship it | 06:22 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: it's on review :) | 06:23 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: I was going to pull it down and write up proper commit messages for them all | 06:23 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: cool! | 06:24 |
| rpodolyaka1 | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60286/ | 06:24 |
| rpodolyaka1 | so the latest patch set must work | 06:24 |
| rpodolyaka1 | but I haven't tested novaclient yet | 06:24 |
| rpodolyaka1 | did a manual API query using curl | 06:24 |
| rpodolyaka1 | but client should be an easy one | 06:25 |
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| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: ok, so I'm going to pull the current set, fixup all the commit comments, then push it back up - ok ? | 06:46 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: great! | 06:49 |
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| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: ok, done, baton passed to you. I've put impl notes in the commit messages for easy reference. | 07:11 |
| lifeless | eerm, done now;) | 07:12 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: cool! | 07:13 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: I've also squashed two commits together | 07:14 |
| lifeless | adding the column and using it | 07:14 |
| lifeless | both would be PITA to test in isolation | 07:14 |
| rpodolyaka1 | makes sense | 07:14 |
| lifeless | so https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60286/ should be marked abandonded | 07:15 |
| rpodolyaka1 | done | 07:18 |
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| Ng | morning | 08:41 |
| rpodolyaka | o/ | 08:47 |
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| lsmola | hello tripleo | 08:59 |
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| lsmola | tzumainn: jtomasek rdopieralski mrunge jpich attention, a converstation about the tuskar horizon merge | 09:04 |
| jtomasek | o/ | 09:04 |
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| tzumainn | hiya! | 09:05 |
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| tzumainn | mrunge, jpich, so if we were to merge with horizon, I don't think we talked about how we'd handle reviews - would we be allowed to move our core reviewers over as well? | 09:06 |
| lsmola | so the important question is, are we fine not being push the changes in infrastructure by ourselves? | 09:06 |
| tzumainn | or is that something that horizon would prefer not to happen? | 09:06 |
| lsmola | s/being/being able | 09:06 |
| rdopieralski | I assumed that we would have to earn our -core like everybody else | 09:07 |
| mrunge | rdopieralski, that's my understanding | 09:07 |
| jcoufal | rdopieralski: david said he will prepare some plan for core merger | 09:07 |
| jpich | How we handle reviews was one of the points that remained to be discussed, after the agreement on Tuesday that yeah, the UI is a good match for Horizon | 09:07 |
| lsmola | rdopieralski: no, the core merge is also a point of conversation | 09:07 |
| rdopieralski | then again, it shouldn't be too hard if we worked in tuskar-ui full time | 09:07 |
| tzumainn | so given that our code is being completely rebuilt from the ground up, in parallel with various supporting libraries and apis in tripleo - do you have a sense of how core review latency might be in horizon while we try to earn -core? | 09:08 |
| lsmola | jpich: not sure about the rules for core, a good amount of contribution over 2 releases? | 09:08 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: yes, that is my worry | 09:08 |
| jpich | lsmola: A number of good contributions and lots and lots of useful reviews | 09:09 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: we will be building this from scratch, so is it a good idea to do it in Horizon? | 09:09 |
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| tzumainn | lsmola, I'm not sure - we talked about developing from ground up within tripleo, and lifeless mentioned that he'd be okay with fairly rapid development, even if things don't fully work yet | 09:10 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, I'm not sure we would be able to do that within horizon - mrunge, jpich, any sense of that? | 09:10 |
| jpich | tzumainn: I don't expect the latency would be different from other reviews (so, pretty high at the moment ;() especially as the core team needs to get up to speed with what's already there, and how to build the necessary env | 09:10 |
| * mrunge has to leave right now :-( | 09:11 | |
| lsmola | given the current Horizon speed, and given we will have possibly 100s of patches to infrastructure tab we need to get in in like 3 months. When a lot of those patches will work with mocked data | 09:11 |
| tzumainn | jpich, lsmola I wonder if the merge would make more sense once things start working in tuskar again, and documentation is up to date so it's easier for new people to get up to speed | 09:11 |
| mrunge | I wish we could have this discussion at a different time | 09:11 |
| jpich | It sounds to me if you need the velocity of a new/incubated project, it might not make sense to merge just yet | 09:11 |
| jpich | mrunge: IMO it would be appropriate to summarise / have it on the mailing list too | 09:11 |
| lsmola | mrunge: :-( | 09:12 |
| lifeless | I thought the horizon folk were ok with separate project, and something to facilitate fast movement on reviews in that project? | 09:12 |
| jtomasek | lifeless: I think it all depends on the review and core merge that is to be decided on tuesday | 09:13 |
| jtomasek | so we should probably start this discussion on list and make a final decision on tuesday Horizon meeting | 09:13 |
| jtomasek | ? | 09:13 |
| lsmola | lifeless: it has changed to be part of Horizon codebase on the way, it is possible to be disabled plugin | 09:13 |
| lifeless | I distinctly remember david being ok with with the current separate project structure :) | 09:14 |
| jpich | jtomasek: +1 re:on list discussion | 09:14 |
| lsmola | lifeless: so we are getting back to be a separate codebase under Horizon program? | 09:14 |
| lifeless | remember tuskar-api isn't integrated yet, so Horizon typically wouldn't accept patches to work with it *anyway* | 09:15 |
| lifeless | I don't know of anything that has changed that | 09:15 |
| lifeless | lsmola: well, I don't know the history of the discussion here right now ;) | 09:15 |
| lifeless | lsmola: so am just kibbitzing with what I am aware of | 09:15 |
| jpich | I think a summary to the list of what was decided on Tuesday may be useful, because I've heard already 2 different summaries, which differ from my own understanding (so, 3 :-)) | 09:15 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, I came into this discussion a bit late, when people were talking about merging with horizon directly - was there something that changed before that to prevent us from being a separate project under the horizon umbrella? | 09:16 |
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| lsmola | jpich: ok | 09:16 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: I guess just the conversation with mrunge | 09:16 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: plus the plugin architecture that would support that | 09:16 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: and that the merge would be quicker | 09:17 |
| jtomasek | AFAIK on thuesday meeting it was decided that it is ok to merge tuskar-ui with Horizon codebase directly as it can be included as disabled plugin. Also, there was a statement that tuskar-ui can included "non working code" in the means of using mock API calls | 09:17 |
| lsmola | lifeless: so going back to being separate codebase under Horizon program | 09:17 |
| tzumainn | here's the minutes for reference: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-12-10-22.01.log.html | 09:18 |
| jpich | jtomasek: My understanding was that, we agreed it fits under the horizon program but all the details including the timeline and core team make up remained to be discussed, and lsmola and mrunge would bring up a plan for this | 09:18 |
| jtomasek | jpich: correct | 09:18 |
| lsmola | lifeless: given the certain level of bureaucracy it will take, what it will bring us. And what will be benefit comparing to doing the merge to Horizon codebase later from triple Programm | 09:19 |
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| jpich | tzumainn: Yeah... I was there :-) and the other people who have a different understanding were there too, hence: confusion | 09:19 |
| jtomasek | jpich: only trhing decided about reviews was that we can skip the rule of +2 reviews from multiple companies for the tuskar-ui part | 09:19 |
| jtomasek | afaik | 09:19 |
| lsmola | jpich: yeah I guess that's why we need to build a clear plan too :-) | 09:19 |
| lifeless | lsmola: I'm fairly certain, that like tempest, the other cross-project codebase OpenStack has; unintegrated/incubated projects May Not include direct support in Horizon | 09:20 |
| jpich | jtomasek: Right, though the core membership question would need to be solved first for this to be useful | 09:20 |
| lifeless | lsmola: being in the same program is as close as we can get, unless that's waived | 09:20 |
| jpich | jtomasek: or meaningful :) | 09:20 |
| jtomasek | jpich: yep | 09:20 |
| lsmola | jpich: ok being separate codebase, under horizon program, it would mean we can be Cores for just a tuskar-ui codebase, not for horizon | 09:21 |
| lsmola | lifeless: ok | 09:22 |
| jpich | lsmola: I'm not sure about that, AFAIK there's only one core team for a program, but I could be mistaken | 09:22 |
| lsmola | lifeless: sounds to me like a last stop before the integration to Horizon codebase | 09:22 |
| lifeless | programs to have as many core teams as they want | 09:22 |
| lifeless | gerrit supports pretty arbitrary arrangements | 09:22 |
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| lsmola | lifeless: given it's not even possible now, which i didn't know :-) not did mrunge i guess | 09:22 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, so is that what our plan should be? separate code base, separate core team? that would seem to solve the concerns | 09:23 |
| lsmola | lifeless: btw. when the tripleo will be integrated? | 09:23 |
| lifeless | lsmola: it won't; *tuskar* will :) | 09:23 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: yes i think so | 09:23 |
| lifeless | lsmola: programs don't integrate, projects do. | 09:23 |
| lifeless | lsmola: they integrate when they are fairly mature | 09:24 |
| lifeless | there is a checklist in the governance repo now IIRC | 09:24 |
| lifeless | it's not exhaustive, still need to pass TC vote, but it sets a fairly clear lower bound | 09:24 |
| lifeless | healthy dev team, multiple organisations contributing, healthy review team, API stability, functional d-g and tempest plugins | 09:24 |
| lsmola | lifeless: ok | 09:26 |
| lifeless | anyhow - gnight! | 09:26 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, so it sounds like the thing to do is to circle back with mrunge with this understanding? | 09:26 |
| tzumainn | lifeless, night! | 09:26 |
| lsmola | lifeless: thank you, have a good night :-) | 09:26 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: well seems it's not possible to integrate to Horizon code now | 09:26 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: so let's become a separate codebase under Horizon program :-) | 09:27 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, right, but we still want to move under the program, right? | 09:27 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, exactly | 09:27 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: i guess it does make sense, as it is a last step before the integration | 09:27 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, so I guess circle back with mrunge, quickly see if there are additional details either side needs? I'm basing that on the horizon meeting minutes | 09:27 |
| tzumainn | so I could be misunderstanding everything | 09:28 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: not sure when the mrunge is getting back | 09:28 |
| jtomasek | lsmola: tzumainn: fine, still the decision is to be made on tuesday and depends on the core reviewer team distribution/merge | 09:28 |
| jpich | I humbly request a summary to be sent to the mailing list as well so people have a chance to catch up and make sure we're all on the same page | 09:28 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: yes | 09:28 |
| jtomasek | jpich: I can try to put things into email, is it ok with everyone? | 09:28 |
| lsmola | jpich: yes I will send it today | 09:28 |
| jtomasek | ok:D | 09:28 |
| jpich | 2 emails, so we can have 2 different summaries ;) | 09:29 |
| tzumainn | jpich, that makes sense, it just seems like this entire conversation got us back exactly to where we were immediately after the horizon email : ) | 09:29 |
| lsmola | jpich: we can continue conversation on mailing lists :-) | 09:29 |
| jtomasek | lols | 09:29 |
| tzumainn | er, the horizon meeting | 09:29 |
| jpich | Cool! :) | 09:29 |
| jtomasek | I'd love to see what david thinks about separate core rev team... | 09:30 |
| lsmola | jpich: 2 emails? where who? | 09:30 |
| jpich | Thanks lsmola, jtomasek, tzumainn | 09:30 |
| jpich | lsmola: It was a joke ;) | 09:30 |
| tzumainn | thank you, jpich! | 09:30 |
| lsmola | jpich: ok | 09:30 |
| lsmola | jpich: I think I am starting to hallucinating, not had much sleep today :-) | 09:31 |
| jpich | lsmola: Time for a nap? :) | 09:31 |
| lsmola | jpich: thank youu :-) | 09:31 |
| lsmola | jpich: after the work maybe :-) or after the lunch | 09:31 |
| lsmola | :-D | 09:31 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, lol, how old is your kid again? a month? | 09:31 |
| lsmola | jpich: for now, moooere coffee | 09:32 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: 10 days | 09:32 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, lol, enjoy your lack of sleep | 09:32 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: damned iit seems like a month | 09:32 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: :-) | 09:32 |
| lsmola | yeah why are you not sleeping ? :-D | 09:33 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: when will i get used to this master? | 09:33 |
| lsmola | :-D | 09:33 |
| tzumainn | lsmola, never :P you just kinda work around it | 09:33 |
| tzumainn | but you should get your daughter on a standard sleep schedule ASAP | 09:34 |
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| lsmola | tzumainn: so step one is to turn my son into daughter? :-D | 09:34 |
| tzumainn | oh, whoops | 09:34 |
| tzumainn | please don't :P | 09:34 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: i think he has a standard schedule now | 09:34 |
| tzumainn | seriously? that's a minor miracle | 09:35 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: he is awake from 11Pm to 6am | 09:35 |
| tzumainn | lol | 09:35 |
| lsmola | tzumainn: and he does not like dark :-D | 09:35 |
| mrunge | ok, reading backlog | 09:36 |
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| openstackgerrit | Derek Higgins proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Fix wait for Neutron L2 Agent https://review.openstack.org/61976 | 12:32 |
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| cd-undercloud | ************** overcloud complete status=1 ************ | 12:33 |
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| derekh | any reviewers out devtest_overcloud is broken, that patch I think fixes it ^^ | 12:33 |
| derekh | /opt/stack/tripleo-incubator/scripts/wait_for: eval: line 53: unexpected EOF while looking for matching `"' | 12:33 |
| rpodolyaka | right on time :) | 12:42 |
| slagle | derekh: i +2'd. nice catch btw. | 12:44 |
| slagle | is this one of those times we can +A with only 1 +2 since it fixes the cd cloud? | 12:44 |
| derekh | slagle: yup, I think so, so for it, cd is broken | 12:47 |
| derekh | note that cd is broke in the approve message | 12:48 |
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| slagle | derekh: k, approved | 12:50 |
| openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Fix wait for Neutron L2 Agent https://review.openstack.org/61976 | 12:52 |
| rpodolyaka | does ^ work for you guys? | 12:59 |
| rpodolyaka | it seems there is a small issue with host name | 12:59 |
| rpodolyaka | so the pattern ends like .*overcloud-novacompute-" | 13:00 |
| rpodolyaka | but hostname is overcloud-novacompute0-2c7khwvqp5ek | 13:00 |
| rpodolyaka | so trailing 0 makes grep fail | 13:01 |
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| slagle | hmm, i see that | 13:07 |
| openstackgerrit | Marios Andreou proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Adds included-template-path param for resolving template FileIncludes https://review.openstack.org/61986 | 13:09 |
| derekh | rpodolyaka: crap wanna submit a fix so we can approve | 13:15 |
| rpodolyaka | derekh: cool! | 13:15 |
| derekh | slagle: rpodolyaka Sorry, was in too much of a hurry to try and get stuff working again and change the hostname part at the last minute | 13:16 |
| rpodolyaka | derekh: np, it's all Friday the 13th :) | 13:16 |
| derekh | rpodolyaka: this is true | 13:17 |
| * rpodolyaka had better not cut releases today | 13:17 | |
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| openstackgerrit | Jan Provaznik proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Add haproxy element https://review.openstack.org/61374 | 13:40 |
| openstackgerrit | Jan Provaznik proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Add keepalived element https://review.openstack.org/61375 | 13:41 |
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| openstackgerrit | James Slagle proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Fix check for overcloud compute hostname https://review.openstack.org/61999 | 14:06 |
| slagle | should resolve cd failure ^^ | 14:06 |
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| openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Fix check for overcloud compute hostname https://review.openstack.org/61999 | 14:25 |
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| SpamapS | slagle: THANKS! | 14:41 |
| SpamapS | slagle: in my eagerness to make the neutron agent check more accurate, I broke it ;) | 14:41 |
| * SpamapS has become lazy with all this gated software | 14:42 | |
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| slagle | derek did most of the work with the first fix :) | 14:45 |
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| SpamapS | slagle: and actually the problem is worse | 14:50 |
| SpamapS | it isn't -notcompute we are waiting for | 14:50 |
| SpamapS | it is -novacompute | 14:50 |
| SpamapS | so.. double doh | 14:50 |
| slagle | that's what derek fixed | 14:51 |
| slagle | i think | 14:51 |
| slagle | let me double check | 14:51 |
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| Ng | heh | 14:52 |
| openstackgerrit | Clint "SpamapS" Byrum proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Wait for nova-compute to claim to be up https://review.openstack.org/61894 | 14:52 |
| slagle | yea, in this onehttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/61976/1 | 14:52 |
| slagle | oh, or were you talking about the other wait? | 14:53 |
| slagle | streams are crossed :) | 14:53 |
| SpamapS | slagle: no that is good | 14:53 |
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| SpamapS | ahh you've all been nice and busy this evening. :) | 14:54 |
| SpamapS | slagle: I had not rebased yet :-P | 14:54 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add POWER_MANAGER support to devtest. https://review.openstack.org/62013 | 15:13 |
| openstackgerrit | Marios Andreou proposed a change to openstack/tuskar: WIP : sketch of what using merge.py looks like for tuskar https://review.openstack.org/52045 | 15:14 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add POWER_MANAGER support to devtest. https://review.openstack.org/62013 | 15:14 |
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| openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Wait for nova-compute to claim to be up https://review.openstack.org/61894 | 15:23 |
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| cd-undercloud | ************** overcloud complete status=1 ************ | 15:32 |
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| slagle | jslagle@redhatjjslagle@redhatzie9Sho2 | 15:47 |
| slagle | hah | 15:48 |
| slagle | perhaps i should be more careful about performing autotype logins | 15:48 |
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| * beekneemech reads all of slagle's email :-) | 16:01 | |
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| Ng | slagle: normally I'd advocate always starting passwords with / to prevent the IRC mistype, but even that wouldn't have saved you there ;) | 16:04 |
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| jdob | Ng: that's a really neat idea about the passwords, i've never heard that before | 16:08 |
| Ng | jdob: the other option is to make them be english phrases, so it just looks like you typed something in the wrong channel, not the wrong window | 16:09 |
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| slagle | i'm going to change all my passwords "/kick jdob" | 16:09 |
| Ng | haha | 16:09 |
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| jdob | haha, damn slagle, that's funnier than mine. i was gonna joke about Ng's second option of english phrases and joke about making all my passwords "+1" | 16:09 |
| Ng | hehe | 16:10 |
| slagle | lol | 16:10 |
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| SpamapS | That is all interesting, but it is 2013... two factor FTW | 16:23 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add POWER_MANAGER support to devtest. https://review.openstack.org/62013 | 16:27 |
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| marios | happy friday tripleo! | 17:21 |
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| cd-undercloud | ************** overcloud complete status=0 ************ | 17:22 |
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| devananda | SpamapS: ping | 17:35 |
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| * Ng ejects for dinner and suchlike | 17:46 | |
| SpamapS | devananda: pong | 17:47 |
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| devananda | SpamapS: hi! want a brain-dump today, in advance of monday's meeetings? | 17:48 |
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| SpamapS | devananda: definitely... in 10? | 17:50 |
| SpamapS | I need to put something in my mouth hole before I can properly open my ear holes. | 17:50 |
| devananda | SpamapS: as do I. let's aim for 10 but it might be 15 ... | 17:50 |
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| SpamapS | devananda: yeah just buzz me on G+ or Skype. | 17:56 |
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| cd-undercloud | ************** overcloud complete status=0 ************ | 18:17 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Consolidate rootwrap settings for neutron element https://review.openstack.org/62059 | 18:49 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add POWER_MANAGER support to devtest. https://review.openstack.org/62013 | 18:53 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add devtest real BM MAC and PM command support https://review.openstack.org/62041 | 18:53 |
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| dprince | slagle: so... what command do I run to generate docs. | 19:09 |
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| * dprince confesses that he doesn't care as much as he should about them | 19:09 | |
| * dprince would much prefer using straight up markdown | 19:10 | |
| slagle | dprince: :) | 19:10 |
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| slagle | let me grab it | 19:10 |
| slagle | sphinx-build -b html doc/source doc/build | 19:11 |
| slagle | ^^ from the tripleo-incubator directory. you'll need to have all the needed sphinx extensions installed | 19:11 |
| slagle | i set that up in a venv. just try to run it and see if it tells you you're missing something | 19:11 |
| slagle | once it builds, you can just open up doc/build/index.html in a browser | 19:12 |
| dprince | slagle: ah yes. same thing we do for our rpm builds. I'll fix this stuff up. Thanks. | 19:13 |
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| cd-undercloud | ************** overcloud complete status=1 ************ | 19:14 |
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| SpamapS | slagle: just run tox to build the docs | 19:27 |
| SpamapS | slagle: tox -evenv python setup.py sphinx_build | 19:28 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add POWER_MANAGER support to devtest. https://review.openstack.org/62013 | 19:38 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add devtest real BM MAC and PM command support https://review.openstack.org/62041 | 19:38 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add devtest real BM MAC and PM command support https://review.openstack.org/62041 | 19:43 |
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| SpamapS | rpodolyaka: how's the preserve_ephemeral work going? I had thought about helping out with it this week, but distractions have been overpowering my ability to do that... | 19:51 |
| openstackgerrit | Clint "SpamapS" Byrum proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Make refresh-env more resilient for users https://review.openstack.org/61617 | 19:52 |
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| slagle | dprince: i see the export example for POWER_MANAGER is still ipmi | 19:59 |
| dprince | slagle: initially I had it as virt and then I switched it to IMPI. | 20:00 |
| slagle | dprince: i guess i'm ok with that. as long as people actually read the comment | 20:00 |
| dprince | slagle: I'm happy to switch it back. Whatever the majority things makes sense. | 20:00 |
| slagle | dprince: oh wait, it's problem actually isn't it? | 20:00 |
| slagle | when they copy the command to heat stack-create the undercloud, $POWER_MANAGER won't be set | 20:00 |
| slagle | so then it's called with PowerManager= | 20:01 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Update glance-api to use notification_driver https://review.openstack.org/62076 | 20:01 |
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| SpamapS | lifeless: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59298/6 ... still waiting for you to un -2 it. | 20:08 |
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| cd-undercloud | ************** overcloud complete status=1 ************ | 20:13 |
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| SpamapS | timeout waiting for the whole tamale | 20:22 |
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| SpamapS | | notcompute | 104385 | ClientException: The server has either erred or is incapable of performing the requested operation. (HTTP 500) (Request-ID: req-47a550c9-af91-4115-bf60-08fd4a7d480c) | CREATE_FAILED | 2013-12-13T19:30:59Z | | 20:23 |
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| SpamapS | transient Nova API error | 20:25 |
| SpamapS | 2013-12-13 19:30:55,613.613 16472 DEBUG nova.api.openstack.wsgi [req-47a550c9-af91-4115-bf60-08fd4a7d480c 2de96ce5da994575a08447c93bcafd53 4956c533154c476799c688eda7ed65ab] Returning 500 to user: The server has either erred or is incapable of performing the requested operation. __call__ /opt/stack/venvs/nova/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/nova/api/openstack/wsgi.py:1237 | 20:25 |
| SpamapS | 2013-12-13 19:30:55,613.613 16472 INFO nova.osapi_compute.wsgi.server [req-47a550c9-af91-4115-bf60-08fd4a7d480c 2de96ce5da994575a08447c93bcafd53 4956c533154c476799c688eda7ed65ab] 127.0.0.1 "GET //v2/4956c533154c476799c688eda7ed65ab/servers/668661bc-6370-41aa-b4e0-15668a39307c HTTP/1.1" status: 500 len: 335 time: 70.4482870 | 20:25 |
| SpamapS | /var/log/upstart/nova-api.log:2013-12-13 19:30:55,610.610 16472 ERROR nova.api.openstack [req-47a550c9-af91-4115-bf60-08fd4a7d480c 2de96ce5da994575a08447c93bcafd53 4956c533154c476799c688eda7ed65ab] Caught error: Connection to neutron failed: Maximum attempts reached | 20:26 |
| SpamapS | guessing that might be our old'nbusted neutron server responding slowly | 20:27 |
| * SpamapS EOD's early to handle some weekendy stuff | 20:27 | |
| SpamapS | later | 20:27 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: yeah, ESATURDAY though | 20:34 |
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| tzumainn | lifeless, quick question, if I may - what do you think of the name "subrole" instead of "node profile" or "role configuration"? The latter is accurate, but I think it might be initially confusing to users | 20:37 |
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| lifeless | tzumainn: Given how vague role itself is | 20:40 |
| lifeless | tzumainn: I suspect it will cause more confusion - I'm not super happy with Role even - whats the role when you run cinder-local + nova-compute on one machine? | 20:40 |
| tzumainn | lifeless, true - role sounds like it should apply more to instances, right? | 20:41 |
| tzumainn | and a node only has an implicit role based on what services are running on it? | 20:41 |
| lifeless | I'm not sure we should use 'Role' at all TBH - I mean, I used it once in describing things, but on reflection... | 20:42 |
| lifeless | our actual primitives are images + configuration | 20:42 |
| tzumainn | okay, are you arguing for use of the primitive names? in my view, the UI terminology should abstract a bit and better reflect the purpose | 20:45 |
| lifeless | mmm | 20:47 |
| lifeless | I'm saying that that terms that don't map well to the primitives are misleading | 20:48 |
| lifeless | and that the primitives are not entirely fixed. Some are, some less so. | 20:48 |
| lifeless | for instance | 20:49 |
| lifeless | if we end up with language like 'a role is a disk image built for running openstack services on a node' | 20:49 |
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| lifeless | I'm not arguing for things like 'image configuration' which would be intrinsically confusing - is it the configuration for building the image, or for deploying it ? | 20:51 |
| lifeless | tl;dr naming of things is hard | 20:51 |
| tzumainn | lol | 20:52 |
| tzumainn | yeah, I'm terrible with terminology | 20:52 |
| lifeless | So, lets talk constraints/desired properties here | 20:52 |
| lifeless | I think we want to minimise the total # of terms folk need to read up to get a definition on | 20:53 |
| lifeless | e.g. foo + configuration of foo probably needs only[4~ 'foo' defined, | 20:53 |
| lifeless | I think we want to avoid redefining anything already defined in OpenStack | 20:53 |
| lifeless | unless we have a genuinely unique slant on it, and then we want to reference the base definition | 20:54 |
| tzumainn | lifeless, in that case, when we say 'deployment', do we really mean "Heat stack"? | 20:54 |
| lifeless | yup, eactly | 20:54 |
| tzumainn | okay | 20:55 |
| tzumainn | so looking at Heat presentations | 20:55 |
| lifeless | is 'deployment' unique enough to get it's own definition? I don't know. | 20:55 |
| tzumainn | a template defines resources, and when a stack is deployed, it creates instances of those resources | 20:56 |
| lifeless | right | 20:56 |
| tzumainn | in which case, the most direct term for 'role' would be. . . 'resource'? | 20:56 |
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| lifeless | yup - you can see why resoruce class weirded me out | 20:56 |
| tzumainn | yeah, I understand now | 20:57 |
| lifeless | it gets a little more awkward though | 20:57 |
| lifeless | we currently create resoruces in heat | 20:57 |
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| lifeless | but we're likely to be manipulating resource groups to control scale | 20:58 |
| tzumainn | I thought the template defined a resource, and we create resource instances? | 20:58 |
| lifeless | so a compute resource to define image + configuration, and a resource group to define scale | 20:59 |
| lifeless | I don't know if we want to really surface /all/ of that - we're not a generic edit-your-own-heat-template tool, at least not at the moment | 20:59 |
| tzumainn | I'm not entirely up-to-date with heat, when you say "resource" group, do you refer to this line on the wiki? | 21:00 |
| tzumainn | "Heat also provides an autoscaling service that integrates with Ceilometer, so you can include a scaling group as a resource in a template. " | 21:00 |
| lifeless | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/heat/+spec/native-resource-group | 21:01 |
| tzumainn | ah, thanks | 21:02 |
| tzumainn | okay, so it seems like what we've been calling 'role' is a somewhat arbitrary categorization of resources | 21:04 |
| tzumainn | and if we were to be most direct, a 'role configuration' would be a 'resource', 'node profile' is a 'flavor' and a 'role' is something like a resource category | 21:05 |
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| lifeless | so, I think we need 'flavors' not flavor - because we don't want to be pinned down to one exact model of hardware | 21:06 |
| lifeless | this is part of accomodating the difference between virt and nonvirt | 21:06 |
| tzumainn | right, that makes sense | 21:06 |
| lifeless | family is up | 21:06 |
| tzumainn | ah, np - thanks for the conversation! | 21:06 |
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| lifeless | but broadly yeah - thats what I'm saying | 21:16 |
| lifeless | we might want to disambiguate | 21:16 |
| lifeless | because a resource can be anything | 21:16 |
| lifeless | like | 21:16 |
| lifeless | compute resource, network resource | 21:17 |
| lifeless | I don't know - it's tricky, just spitballin | 21:17 |
| lifeless | so on role - seriously, what is role as a user addressable concept? what does one mean... | 21:18 |
| lifeless | like back with resource classes, the split between compute and storage doesn't make sense for some applications | 21:18 |
| lifeless | but it does for others | 21:18 |
| lifeless | In a sense we're reducing the capabilities of heat in order to offer an understandable model for deploying openstack | 21:19 |
| lifeless | so - here's a possible guiding principle | 21:19 |
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| tzumainn | lifeless, in answer to your question, it now sounds to me like a 'role' is intended to be a convenient way to categorize resources | 21:43 |
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| lifeless | tzumainn: so in heat terms, would a resourcegroup end up in multiple roles? | 21:54 |
| lifeless | or are roles a partition over resourcegroups ? | 21:54 |
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| tzumainn | as I understand it, a resourcegroup is a type of resource - I'm just going by the first line of the blueprint which says 'Design and develop a Heat-native resource group resource' | 21:55 |
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| tzumainn | so yeah, a resourcegroup would fall under a single role | 21:55 |
| tzumainn | and. . . we would likely want to create a new role for that resourcegroup | 21:55 |
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| tzumainn | I mean - aren't role names completely arbitrary from the Heat perspective? | 21:56 |
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| lifeless | resourcegroups don't have names ;) | 21:58 |
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| lifeless | so, what if we inverted the thing | 21:58 |
| lifeless | rather than a partition | 21:58 |
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| lifeless | we said 'any resourcegroup which includes configuration for nova-compute shows up under 'Compute' | 21:58 |
| lifeless | and ... cinder-storage ... 'Block Storage' | 21:59 |
| lifeless | and ... swift ... 'Object Storage' | 21:59 |
| lifeless | and ... *-api ... 'Control Plane' | 21:59 |
| lifeless | then an all-in-one setup, would show a resourcegroup of size one under all 4 top level categories | 21:59 |
| tzumainn | ah, that makes sense to me | 22:00 |
| tzumainn | I was thinking that a resourcegroup could show up under a new role, like 'Compute & Storage' or something | 22:00 |
| lifeless | so I'm trying to pin down role | 22:01 |
| tzumainn | because the role names themselves are arbitrary, right? does 'Control Plane' have a meaning within Heat? | 22:01 |
| lifeless | No, nor -other than convention- within the TripleO plumbing | 22:01 |
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| tzumainn | exactly | 22:01 |
| tzumainn | so if we had a resourcegroup, there's no reason why we couldn't create a new Role and put it under there, right? | 22:01 |
| lifeless | (In fact 'Role' isn't even defined outside of the list discussion over the last couple days, AFAIK) | 22:01 |
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| lifeless | what would that mean ? | 22:02 |
| lifeless | So - AIUI the whole categorisation thing has several purposes | 22:03 |
| lifeless | to guide folk to ensure they run everything needed | 22:03 |
| lifeless | to make high level review of the cloud possible | 22:04 |
| tzumainn | there's no reason for the UI to limit itself to Control/Compute/etc, it can also create a new category to fit oddly-shaped resourcegroups, is what I meant | 22:04 |
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| lifeless | to provide a gentle onramp into the heinous complexity that is a deployed openstack | 22:04 |
| lifeless | tzumainn: oh right | 22:04 |
| lifeless | tzumainn: so, there's a question there; is tuskar-UI generic | 22:05 |
| lifeless | or is it specific | 22:05 |
| lifeless | if it's generic then having lots of customisation makes sense | 22:05 |
| lifeless | if it's specific then perhaps just management/control/compute/b-store/o-store/other | 22:05 |
| tzumainn | well - I don't have a lot of practical experience with actually creating Heat templates - how many resources is a template likely to define? | 22:06 |
| lifeless | and other is defined as 'didn't fit into any of the other categories' | 22:06 |
| lifeless | a large cloud with everything split out? a dozen probably | 22:06 |
| lifeless | network, control-db, control-secure, control-apis, messagequeue, backup, monitoring, ceilometer, sceheduler | 22:07 |
| tzumainn | I personally would be in favor of having the UI with default roles that are customizable - but it's possible that someone with actual practical experience deploying a large cloud would tell me different | 22:07 |
| lifeless | one or maybe more compute | 22:07 |
| lifeless | swift-proxy | 22:07 |
| lifeless | swift-object store | 22:07 |
| lifeless | so the MAAS+Juju example is super generic | 22:08 |
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| lifeless | were you at the summit? | 22:08 |
| tzumainn | I was not :( | 22:08 |
| lifeless | ok | 22:08 |
| lifeless | so it should be online, lets see | 22:08 |
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| lifeless | tzumainn: http://www.openstack.org/summit/openstack-summit-hong-kong-2013/session-videos/presentation/canonical-keynote-building-business-value-through-interoperability | 22:12 |
| lifeless | I don't know if this will really capture it | 22:12 |
| lifeless | so I'll describe it | 22:13 |
| lifeless | Juju, which has a lot of overlap with Heat, is a generic tool for configuring clusters on top of a compute cloud | 22:13 |
| lifeless | Their UI to install OpenStack with Juju+MAAS is not specialised -it's just the Juju UI | 22:13 |
| lifeless | So until recently the way your deployed OpenStack was to have a manual that says 'pick X, pick Y, pick Z', set values A,B,C etc | 22:14 |
| lifeless | where X and Y and Z are essentially resource definitions for Heat. | 22:14 |
| lifeless | What they now have is a saved-stack thing | 22:14 |
| lifeless | where you clone an exported stack | 22:15 |
| lifeless | which is like a full Heat template | 22:15 |
| lifeless | and then edit it to suit. And finally click 'go' | 22:15 |
| lifeless | Point is is that this is generic. | 22:15 |
| lifeless | It has nothing in it that says 'this will get you a working OpenStack cloud' | 22:15 |
| lifeless | I think it might have a basic linter for 'this mandatory setting is missing' | 22:15 |
| lifeless | So one of the things that disambuates a Heat template editor from Tuskar, for me, is this business logic. | 22:16 |
| lifeless | Knowing that you need Compute | 22:16 |
| lifeless | and should have Block Storage | 22:16 |
| lifeless | and should have monitoring | 22:16 |
| lifeless | ok, enough riffing, I need to go do stuff here | 22:16 |
| lifeless | hope this sparks some useful thoughts | 22:17 |
| tzumainn | it does, thanks! | 22:17 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add POWER_MANAGER support to devtest. https://review.openstack.org/62013 | 22:32 |
| openstackgerrit | Dan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add devtest real BM MAC and PM command support https://review.openstack.org/62041 | 22:32 |
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