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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/governance master: Add resolutions to mpve IRC network from Freendoe to OFTC https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/793260 | 02:02 |
|---|---|---|
| gmann | tc-members ^^ recording today decision to resolution as official motion in TC | 02:03 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/governance master: Add resolution to move the IRC network from Freendoe to OFTC https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/793260 | 02:24 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/governance master: Add resolution to move the IRC network from Freendoe to OFTC https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/793260 | 14:36 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/governance master: Add resolution to move the IRC network from Freenode to OFTC https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/793260 | 14:55 |
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| gmann | tc-members: meeting time | 15:00 |
| gmann | #startmeeting tc | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 27 15:00:17 2021 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is gmann. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tc' | 15:00 |
| gmann | #topic Roll call | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll call (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:00 | |
| gmann | o/ | 15:00 |
| ricolin | o/ | 15:00 |
| dansmith | o/ | 15:00 |
| yoctozepto | o/ | 15:01 |
| gmann | let's start | 15:02 |
| gmann | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Agenda_Suggestions | 15:02 |
| gmann | Today agenda ^^ | 15:02 |
| gmann | #topic Follow up on past action items | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Follow up on past action items (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:02 | |
| gmann | one AI | 15:03 |
| gmann | gmann to push the resolution for ATC/AC terms | 15:03 |
| gmann | I did not do that, will continue on this | 15:03 |
| gmann | #action gmann to push the resolution for ATC/AC terms | 15:04 |
| gmann | #topic Gate health check (dansmith/yoctozepto) | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Gate health check (dansmith/yoctozepto) (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:04 | |
| diablo_rojo | o/ | 15:04 |
| dansmith | tbh, I haven't pushed many patches in the last week (which is -> :( ) | 15:04 |
| dansmith | so I don't have any gut feelings on things | 15:04 |
| dansmith | I know nova has a live migration spurious fail, but I don't think that is affecting anyone else | 15:05 |
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| dansmith | obviously there have been other "health" items to be dealing with :) | 15:05 |
| gmann | ok | 15:06 |
| spotz | o/ | 15:06 |
| gmann | I have not seen frequent failure this week. | 15:06 |
| dansmith | great | 15:07 |
| gmann | anyone has anything to share on gate health ? | 15:07 |
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| yoctozepto | nothing from me | 15:08 |
| gmann | Update about ELK help, | 15:08 |
| gmann | Board will be discussing it in their meeting and we are also adding it as upstream investment opportunity | 15:08 |
| dansmith | cool | 15:09 |
| yoctozepto | ++ | 15:09 |
| gmann | about openstack-health dashboard which need subunit2sql. if we get ELK help then mtreinish can help on maintaining subunit2sql | 15:09 |
| gmann | so if we are able to save ELK then we can save subunit2sql and o-h dashboard too | 15:10 |
| spotz | We definitely need to let folks know of that aterfall | 15:10 |
| spotz | waterfall even | 15:11 |
| gmann | yeah | 15:11 |
| gmann | let's move next | 15:11 |
| gmann | #topic Planning for TC + PTL interaction (gmann) | 15:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Planning for TC + PTL interaction (gmann) (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:11 | |
| gmann | #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-ptl-interaction | 15:11 |
| gmann | not much feedback on etherpad about choosing option | 15:12 |
| gmann | if all agree, I would like to discuss here about it. | 15:12 |
| gmann | I feel we can go with option2 which is 'meet once in a release cycle' | 15:12 |
| * mnaser late walk-in | 15:13 | |
| gmann | we can decide pre-PTG time or very first day of PTG | 15:13 |
| gmann | what other think about it? | 15:13 |
| dansmith | sounds good to me.. once per cycle, somewhere near PTG | 15:13 |
| yoctozepto | pre/post PTG definetely and once per cycle is enough | 15:13 |
| yoctozepto | so 3 folks for that option so far | 15:13 |
| yoctozepto | and other tc-members? ;-) | 15:14 |
| spotz | I'm leaning pre-PTG so if therre's anything we can help with during the PTG we know\ | 15:14 |
| yoctozepto | yeah, pre-PTG might be better than post | 15:14 |
| diablo_rojo | if its just one week out before the ptg I can do that | 15:14 |
| diablo_rojo | more than that and I am busier with preparing | 15:14 |
| gmann | exact time we need to decide based on PTL availability. I would not say we fix the time instead we can check the availability at time to ~PTG | 15:15 |
| yoctozepto | makes sense, we could also have adjusted sessions | 15:16 |
| gmann | yeah | 15:16 |
| gmann | I see no objection on option2 and no one in favor of option1 so let's final option2 | 15:16 |
| yoctozepto | ++ | 15:16 |
| spotz | ++ | 15:16 |
| ricolin | +1 | 15:16 |
| gmann | I will work on the draft proposal but after fixing the channel things | 15:17 |
| diablo_rojo | sounds good | 15:17 |
| gmann | #topic Xena cycle tracker status check | 15:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Xena cycle tracker status check (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:17 | |
| gmann | this week is our Xena cycle tracker status check | 15:17 |
| gmann | #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-xena-tracker | 15:17 |
| gmann | if anyone start working on any item please add your progress/link etc in etherpad | 15:18 |
| gmann | one update from me is I am keeping contributor guide patches as -W as we have to update the IRC things there https://review.opendev.org/q/topic:%2522project-ptl-and-contrib-docs%2522+status:open | 15:18 |
| gmann | any other update form anyone on their item | 15:19 |
| gmann | I see no goal idea in Y cycle etehrpad #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/y-series-goals | 15:19 |
| gmann | one is one me for RBAC which i did not get time in this week too :( | 15:20 |
| yoctozepto | don't feel bad, I'm time-starved as well | 15:20 |
| gmann | ricolin: diablo_rojo_phon any other update or lead in this? | 15:20 |
| dansmith | finishing RBAC is going to be a multi-cycle process for glance, fwiw | 15:20 |
| diablo_rojo | Sadly none from me | 15:20 |
| spotz | This is the most I've been online this week | 15:20 |
| dansmith | we have a bunch of refactoring we have to do before we can proceed past where we are | 15:20 |
| gmann | dansmith: with Xena + Y or more further ? | 15:21 |
| diablo_rojo | I havent had much time in the last couple weeks. | 15:21 |
| dansmith | gmann: potential finish in Y, but the rate things are going with reviews on my PoC, I'm skeptical | 15:21 |
| gmann | dansmith: I see. | 15:21 |
| dansmith | gmann: point being, I think RBAC is good, but it might need to be one of those recurring ones :) | 15:21 |
| ricolin | I do looking around in community goal etherpad to find potential goals, and do found something might be great | 15:22 |
| ricolin | #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/community-goals | 15:22 |
| ricolin | like 11. Test with TLS (formerly SSL) by Default | 15:22 |
| ricolin | or 23. Finish moving legacy python-*client CLIs to python-openstackclient | 15:22 |
| ricolin | or 27. add container-images | 15:22 |
| gmann | dansmith: yeah, shipping consistent RBAC even across all project is always issue from us | 15:22 |
| dansmith | ricolin: we do 11 in a lot of places, no? | 15:22 |
| yoctozepto | dansmith: and not in a lot of places as well | 15:23 |
| ricolin | dansmith, yes, but no fully | 15:23 |
| gmann | I think devstack is default to TLS right | 15:23 |
| yoctozepto | we checked that recently in qa | 15:23 |
| yoctozepto | and the default is being overridden | 15:23 |
| yoctozepto | all over the place | 15:23 |
| gmann | ah | 15:23 |
| gmann | i remember now | 15:23 |
| ricolin | exactly | 15:23 |
| dansmith | not fully, granted | 15:23 |
| yoctozepto | we added an experimental+periodic job to test notls | 15:23 |
| yoctozepto | because it's that popular | 15:24 |
| yoctozepto | vide https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/devstack/+/741807 | 15:24 |
| yoctozepto | https://codesearch.opendev.org/?q=tls-proxy%3A%20false&i=nope&files=&excludeFiles=&repos= | 15:24 |
| yoctozepto | this is a good goal | 15:24 |
| dansmith | so what | 15:24 |
| dansmith | is the goal, remove the ability to turn it off? | 15:25 |
| yoctozepto | that's the final outcome | 15:25 |
| yoctozepto | and it's sane | 15:25 |
| gmann | on OSC, yes we need that but ricolin did you check with Artem, there is email in openstack-discuss about work plan | 15:25 |
| ricolin | it actually broken if consider to run most services with tls | 15:25 |
| gmann | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2021-May/022535.html | 15:26 |
| dansmith | ricolin: is that service broken-ness or devstack lib/foo brokenness? | 15:26 |
| yoctozepto | yeah, some probably don't configure things around CA right | 15:26 |
| yoctozepto | dansmith: I believe mostly devstack lib/foo | 15:26 |
| ricolin | heat try to enable it for testing and appears need to fix in some services before heat can support it | 15:26 |
| dansmith | right, okay | 15:26 |
| ricolin | service broken-ness I think | 15:26 |
| dansmith | lib/foo brokenness is unforunate but fixing it is work without a lot of gain to the actual projects | 15:26 |
| dansmith | if it's service brokenness then I totally agree | 15:27 |
| ricolin | gmann, not yet | 15:27 |
| yoctozepto | dansmith: yeah, but we can't say which is which | 15:27 |
| dansmith | obviously we may not be able to determine one without the other | 15:27 |
| ricolin | but I will | 15:27 |
| dansmith | yep | 15:27 |
| gmann | until we have job running with TLS on project side | 15:27 |
| gmann | may we can just identified first how many fail with devstack remove the ability of disabling it as WIP patch. | 15:28 |
| ricolin | agree | 15:28 |
| gmann | and then we can see how much work needed and this needs to be a goal or not | 15:28 |
| dansmith | so I think that devstack's notls arrangement is also how we test standalone services right? | 15:28 |
| dansmith | I think that there's some linkage there, IIRC | 15:29 |
| dansmith | if so, that's going to be a problem for people (like glance) that insist on bucking the wsgi thing :) | 15:29 |
| gmann | humm | 15:29 |
| yoctozepto | I don't really remember tbh | 15:29 |
| dansmith | glance also has resolutely decided to reject OSC entirely, which is relevant for the other suggestion here | 15:30 |
| ricolin | I will set up patches to check if there is value for diving that one | 15:30 |
| yoctozepto | ricolin ++ | 15:30 |
| gmann | ricolin: yeah and on ML to ask project to test | 15:30 |
| dansmith | I'm happy for the TC to choose both of these goals and hope we can change some hearts and minds with it, I'm just pointing it out :) | 15:30 |
| gmann | #action ricolin to start testing patch for TLS and send on ML. | 15:31 |
| gmann | dansmith: yeah OSC work seems disappear after we did resolution :) | 15:31 |
| gmann | instead of triggering it more | 15:31 |
| dansmith | heh | 15:31 |
| diablo_rojo | Not necessarily | 15:31 |
| dansmith | we've lost a lot of OSC people since as well | 15:32 |
| gmann | yeah | 15:32 |
| diablo_rojo | I had 8 students working on it over the last several months | 15:32 |
| diablo_rojo | Manila and Cinder have made huge progress. | 15:32 |
| gmann | diablo_rojo_phon: great, I remember manila intern. | 15:32 |
| diablo_rojo | All the nova microversion work is almost done | 15:32 |
| ricolin | on OSC? | 15:33 |
| dansmith | orly, news to me, but cool | 15:33 |
| diablo_rojo | ricolin, yep | 15:33 |
| gmann | I did not know about those. is there any etherpad, ML thread to track/know this. | 15:33 |
| fungi | it's easy to assume nothing is happening in a project you don't pay attention to ;) | 15:33 |
| gmann | i remember we agreed to make this as PoPup team and track things but it did not happen | 15:33 |
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| diablo_rojo | I mean, I kept etherpads with the students but thats not really what you're looking for. | 15:33 |
| gouthamr | +1 more manila Outreachy intern working on OpenStackSDK for the next three months :) | 15:33 |
| gmann | great | 15:33 |
| diablo_rojo | gmann, the popup team didnt really actually get created | 15:33 |
| gmann | yeah | 15:34 |
| ricolin | gmann, do you remember who was the one driving this potential goal? | 15:34 |
| ricolin | I mean OSC one | 15:34 |
| gmann | if we have that much progress in this cycle the i think it make sense to make this as goal in Y | 15:34 |
| diablo_rojo | gouthamr, and I still have the OSU intern helping with nova and placement stuff in the SDK | 15:34 |
| dansmith | diablo_rojo: when is it glance's turn? | 15:34 |
| diablo_rojo | gmann, I think I might hold off for one more release | 15:34 |
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| diablo_rojo | dansmith, glance is actually in a pretty good spot already | 15:35 |
| gmann | ricolin: i remember belmoreira | 15:35 |
| gmann | ricolin: and Artem proposed it many time in past | 15:35 |
| dansmith | diablo_rojo: mordred added some basic import support for something I needed before he left, | 15:35 |
| dansmith | but I think there are some pretty big gaps, IIRC | 15:35 |
| gmann | diablo_rojo: dansmith I think we can focus glance via intern then it will be big pre-work and go ahead for goal | 15:36 |
| ricolin | gmann, that will be great indeed | 15:36 |
| diablo_rojo | dansmith, I had talked to artem about things that needed to get done and I think he said there was some OSC work left for glance but the SDK is at parity? | 15:36 |
| diablo_rojo | I might be misremembering though | 15:36 |
| dansmith | I'm hiiiiighly skeptical :) | 15:37 |
| dansmith | also, last I heard from glance people, there was some fundamental brokenness about image membership assignment things | 15:37 |
| diablo_rojo | Well come join the next sdk/osc meeting and ask ;) | 15:37 |
| dansmith | I'll have to dig that back up | 15:37 |
| gmann | ok, let's get someone to propose it as goal and which cycle we can select it based on progress | 15:37 |
| diablo_rojo | I would save it for Z | 15:37 |
| diablo_rojo | not Y | 15:37 |
| diablo_rojo | just so we can use this next release to get more organized and do prep work | 15:38 |
| gmann | yeah, but we can propose it in Xena itself and select in Y or Z | 15:38 |
| dansmith | diablo_rojo: yeah the version I have on my devstack machine has no import ability, just a --with-import on the image create, which isn't really much | 15:38 |
| diablo_rojo | Fair | 15:38 |
| diablo_rojo | dansmith, hmmm alright, will have to chat with artem then | 15:38 |
| dansmith | oh, | 15:39 |
| dansmith | and totally no multistore support | 15:39 |
| dansmith | glance is planning to remove non-multistore at some point, which will be a big problem if osc doesn't have that at all | 15:39 |
| diablo_rojo | okay | 15:39 |
| gmann | dansmith: but is glance ok to move on osc now? or its just resource issue? | 15:40 |
| dansmith | gmann: they have been -2 on it since forever, AFAIK | 15:40 |
| dansmith | part of it is because it's not complete and that membership thing is wrong or something, | 15:40 |
| dansmith | and they have no interest in working on it | 15:40 |
| fungi | the glance team wants a dedicated cli/sdk they control directly | 15:40 |
| gmann | yeah, as diablo_rojo mentioned we have 8 inter working on osc we can get some bandwidth from them to work on glance too ? | 15:41 |
| dansmith | but, if some intern hours are able to resolve that and TC sets a goal, maybe we can sway some minds | 15:41 |
| gmann | yeah, | 15:41 |
| diablo_rojo | gmann, had not have. Currently I think between gouthamr and I we have 3 | 15:41 |
| dansmith | yep, I'd be glad to help direct some of that effort, but I can't promise the team will embrace osc afterwards | 15:41 |
| gmann | diablo_rojo: ack, | 15:41 |
| ricolin | dansmith, sounds like some update from glance team is required as action | 15:42 |
| gmann | let's go with that plan only. keep intern in osc work and also in glance may be future inter and also compose goal in parallel | 15:42 |
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| gmann | intern | 15:42 |
| diablo_rojo | okay | 15:42 |
| gmann | ricolin: diablo_rojo thanks for updates and work on collecting Y goal. | 15:42 |
| gmann | #topic Migration plan for 'Freenode' to 'OFTC' (gmann) | 15:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Migration plan for 'Freenode' to 'OFTC' (gmann) (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:43 | |
| gmann | this is just to tell TC who did not join yesterday emergency meeting. | 15:43 |
| gmann | please read ML about plan | 15:43 |
| * jungleboyj sneaks in late. | 15:43 | |
| gmann | and i added resolution also to record it as official TC motion | 15:43 |
| diablo_rojo | I would have joined had I not been asleep when the announcement about the emergency meeting went out lol. | 15:44 |
| fungi | i also went back and tried to address remaining/post-meeting questions on the etherpad as well | 15:44 |
| gmann | great | 15:44 |
| fungi | there was apparently some confusion over which channels existed, but hopefully my answers cleared that up | 15:44 |
| gmann | as this resolution we need to merge soon (before migration planned date), is there any way to get formal-vote topic before 7 days timeline ? | 15:45 |
| gmann | mnaser: ^^ if you know or we did something in past | 15:45 |
| dansmith | gmann: I'm ready to vote when you fix the latest set of comments | 15:45 |
| gmann | fungi: +1 | 15:45 |
| fungi | the tc could also just retroactively merge that resolution | 15:45 |
| dansmith | I say this is an emergency resolution :) | 15:45 |
| gmann | dansmith: yoctozepto sure, I will fix | 15:45 |
| yoctozepto | ok | 15:46 |
| gmann | I do not find anything to merge resolution in emergency in charter or house rule. | 15:47 |
| fungi | something to add to the charter to do list: define provisions for emergency resolutions | 15:47 |
| gmann | yeah, that we need to add seems | 15:47 |
| dansmith | it doesn't really matter, does it? I mean if we have to wait a week to merge a thing that is effectively already done, meh? | 15:47 |
| jungleboyj | :-) | 15:48 |
| fungi | i think it would need to be in the charter since that defines how motions are handled | 15:48 |
| fungi | house rules are more about non-motion changes | 15:48 |
| fungi | dansmith: yeah, that's what i meant by retroactive | 15:48 |
| dansmith | ack | 15:48 |
| gmann | dansmith: if TC agree on this I think we can merge after a week or so, but if TC chaneg their mind then it is difficult situation :) | 15:49 |
| fungi | officially the charter says a resolution can't merge this quickly, but that doesn't mean that the activity it describes has to wait | 15:49 |
| dansmith | fungi: right, that's what I'm thinking | 15:49 |
| dansmith | gmann: just amend to say "and no take-backs" | 15:49 |
| dansmith | gmann: "finder's keeper's" | 15:49 |
| yoctozepto | lol | 15:49 |
| gmann | because of L132 in 3link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/openstack-irc | 15:50 |
| fungi | but for future-proofing, ways to identify an "emergency resolution" or "urgent motion" or whatever could be helpful | 15:50 |
| dansmith | agree | 15:50 |
| gmann | let's wait for defined deadline only which is 7 days from yesterday and then update charter for future situation handling | 15:51 |
| gmann | everyone, please review that and I will fix comment together by end of today. | 15:52 |
| gmann | #topic Open Reviews | 15:52 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Reviews (Meeting topic: tc)" | 15:52 | |
| gmann | #link https://review.opendev.org/q/project:openstack/governance+is:open | 15:52 |
| gmann | most of them have min favorable vote I will merge the eligible one. seems script has some issue on counting the number of days | 15:55 |
| gmann | anything else for today ? | 15:55 |
| gmann | let's close then thanks everyone for joining | 15:56 |
| gmann | #endmeeting | 15:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Technical Committee office hours: Tuesdays at 09:00 UTC, Wednesdays at 01:00 UTC, and Thursdays at 15:00 UTC | https://governance.openstack.org/tc/ | channel logs http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-tc/" | 15:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 27 15:56:31 2021 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2021/tc.2021-05-27-15.00.html | 15:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2021/tc.2021-05-27-15.00.txt | 15:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2021/tc.2021-05-27-15.00.log.html | 15:56 |
| jungleboyj | Thank you! | 15:56 |
| spotz | Thanks gmann, everyone | 15:56 |
| yoctozepto | thanks gmann | 15:56 |
| dansmith | diablo_rojo: I didn't mean to jump all over you on the glance thing, I just have a natural reaction to "glance is in good shape" regardless of the context :P | 15:57 |
| diablo_rojo | dansmith, I totally understand | 16:03 |
| diablo_rojo | no worries at all | 16:03 |
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| mnaser | gmann: we can merge it before, its fine | 17:29 |
| mnaser | gmann: we can fast track and https://governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/house-rules.html#rolling-back-fast-tracked-changes remains | 17:30 |
| gmann | mnaser: but that is for house rule things not for resolution right? | 17:30 |
| mnaser | gmann: applies for formal-vote too | 17:31 |
| fungi | says "fast-tracked under one of those house rules" | 17:31 |
| gmann | yeah that is what i am reading | 17:32 |
| gmann | it does not talk about formal-vote motion | 17:32 |
| gmann | mnaser: we discussed to merge it after week or so and then add this fast track for formal-vote too in charter for future situation | 17:32 |
| fungi | but regardless, i don't think it needs to be approved for us to take action on the things it describes | 17:33 |
| mnaser | there is text somewhere | 17:33 |
| mnaser | that talks about the chair being allowed to merge before the normal time | 17:33 |
| mnaser | i cant find it | 17:33 |
| gmann | ah i remember that from on of your review, let me search | 17:34 |
| fungi | if you find it, then getting it mentioned somewhere more discoverable would also be great | 17:34 |
| fungi | i suppose you could also argue that since https://governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/charter.html#motions says "should" rather than "must" there's some leeway on the requirements there | 17:38 |
| gmann | cannot find. I think that was for project-updates ? | 17:41 |
| gmann | I find this one which remove the extra 3 days after sufficient vote https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/735361 | 17:45 |
| gmann | but not fast track for formal-vote | 17:47 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/governance master: Add resolution to move the IRC network from Freenode to OFTC https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/793260 | 18:51 |
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| gmann | tc-members: updated ^^ | 23:31 |
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