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| openstackgerrit | Thomas Morin proposed openstack/governance master: Add openstack/neutron-inter to neutron https://review.openstack.org/599428 | 08:31 |
|---|---|---|
| openstackgerrit | Thomas Morin proposed openstack/governance master: Add openstack/neutron-interconnection to neutron https://review.openstack.org/599428 | 08:32 |
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| cmurphy | o/ tc-members | 09:00 |
| cdent | good morning | 09:01 |
| cmurphy | morning cdent | 09:01 |
| ttx | o/ | 09:02 |
| ttx | did we have any nomination for the TC yet ? ends Thursday EOD | 09:03 |
| ttx | looks like no | 09:04 |
| * cmurphy unsees any | 09:04 | |
| ttx | We know EmilienM is not running again, what about the others | 09:04 |
| cmurphy | I don't intend to run again | 09:05 |
| cdent | this coming thursday? I think I've only seen one anouncement so might make sense to announce again | 09:05 |
| ttx | That leaves dhellmann fungi TheJulia pabelanger | 09:05 |
| ttx | cdent: yes I agree the announcement was a bit underwhelming. I hoped a couple of announcements would raise the profile | 09:05 |
| ttx | cmurphy, EmilienM: maybe announcing you re not running will trigger vocations | 09:06 |
| cdent | Perish the thought, but do we have a policy for actions when "not enough nominations"? | 09:12 |
| ttx | cdent: no... I'd say by default that would mean less seats while keeping the majority rules | 09:13 |
| ttx | BUT i suspect if we have nobody at the last minute a bunch of people might seize the opportunity | 09:13 |
| cmurphy | I'm sure there will be a lot of last-minute nominations | 09:13 |
| ttx | yes, I have a number of people who told me they would apply, just later | 09:14 |
| cdent | there usually is. I'm not trying to cause a moral panic or something, just curious if there was a policy | 09:14 |
| ttx | cdent: There is not, although we probably can read the current text in various ways | 09:15 |
| ttx | brb | 09:31 |
| cdent | I'll put something in today's tc report about elections, as a reminder | 09:39 |
| * ttx looks up the TC etherpad for PTG | 09:45 | |
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| evrardjp | cmurphy: :) | 09:50 |
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| dims | o/ | 12:13 |
| mnaser | morning everyone | 12:21 |
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| dhellmann | tc-members: who else will be around in Denver on Saturday evening? | 13:02 |
| smcginnis | I will. | 13:03 |
| EmilienM | o/ | 13:03 |
| mugsie | I will, need to see what time I land | 13:04 |
| * cmurphy no | 13:04 | |
| dhellmann | it looks like I land at 5:30 local time | 13:04 |
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| smcginnis | I arrive 3:37pm. | 13:05 |
| dhellmann | save me a seat at the beer truck | 13:05 |
| mugsie | I don't land in denver until 20:30 (after ~ 16hrs of travelling, so will probably not be in any condition to do anything) | 13:06 |
| dhellmann | or food truck? I'm already confused. | 13:06 |
| cmurphy | there's a food truck at the beer building | 13:07 |
| dhellmann | mugsie : yeah, wow. I'll plan to see you sunday. :-) | 13:07 |
| dhellmann | cmurphy : yes! that's what I meant. | 13:07 |
| * zaneb not arriving until Sunday afternoon | 13:07 | |
| dhellmann | zaneb : ack, we'll look forward to you joining us for discussions if you'll make it in time | 13:08 |
| zaneb | I suspect I won't be there until towards the end, but I imagine we'll continue over dinner anyway | 13:09 |
| dhellmann | yes, I expect so | 13:10 |
| EmilienM | there is a beer building? | 13:10 |
| EmilienM | what did I miss again | 13:10 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I land at 11pm, so no | 13:10 |
| ttx | EmilienM: the brewery on the next block | 13:11 |
| mugsie | is this the beer place in the old firehouse? | 13:11 |
| smcginnis | Yep | 13:15 |
| dhellmann | yeah | 13:15 |
| dhellmann | the beer wasn't bad and the food trucks were good and IIRC they changed during the week | 13:15 |
| mugsie | yeah, the beer was pretty good, I dont think i ate there though last time | 13:16 |
| ttx | dhellmann: the food truck situation changed according to their website | 13:16 |
| ttx | I think it's now the same truck all week, run by the brewery | 13:17 |
| ttx | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/PTG/Stein/CityGuide | 13:17 |
| fungi | yeah, it's on my to do list to send a self-nomination out, though i liked ttx's idea from last time about using it more as a platform to encourage others to run as well | 13:18 |
| ttx | fungi: sounds like a good way to start the show | 13:18 |
| fungi | dhellmann: i get into denver saturday afternoon. would totally be up for a walk over to the firehouse | 13:18 |
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| dhellmann | cool, it sounds like we can probably plan to meet there, then | 13:19 |
| dhellmann | ah, well, if it's the same all week maybe that will encourage us to get off-site some | 13:19 |
| fungi | i don't recall whether i ever actually ate from the food trucks there anyway... my thoughts were mostly elsewhere | 13:19 |
| fungi | so, i suppose like mugsie | 13:20 |
| * mnaser is landing sunday AM | 13:28 | |
| evrardjp | EmilienM: apparently all the really important things | 13:33 |
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| jroll | denver has so many good breweries | 14:09 |
| dims | sunday afternoon | 14:12 |
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| persia | https://las.gnome.org/conferences/LAS is also in town the weekend before PTG, for those interested in cross-community socialisation | 14:19 |
| smcginnis | Sheesh, why don't we get a mansion? :) | 14:21 |
| persia | Mansions aren't actually that large :) | 14:24 |
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| TheJulia | The ones that might begin to be large enough.... are likely ones we don't want to spend much time in... or that we would need search parties for. | 15:00 |
| TheJulia | dhellmann: Sadly no on Saturday. I fly in early Sunday morning. | 15:01 |
| TheJulia | I guess I should try to find some words to whip into a candidacy statement. | 15:03 |
| zaneb | it's going to be interesting to watch this play out: https://jenkins.io/blog/2018/08/31/shifting-gears/ | 15:06 |
| cdent | zaneb: yeah, I thought so too | 15:07 |
| smcginnis | Hmm, that could be interesting. | 15:09 |
| cdent | zaneb: speaking of interesting to watch: shall we do any prep before denver for our 5 minutes of fame, or shall we wait until there and figure it out? | 15:10 |
| zaneb | cdent: lol. I had the thought that I should put together a handful of slides this week | 15:10 |
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| evrardjp | interesting indeed | 15:33 |
| fungi | zaneb: yeah, i'm particularly interested in their idea to use serverless/faas for execution... wondering how that will actually work out for them | 15:34 |
| * TheJulia gets out the kitchenaid and bags of words | 15:36 | |
| zaneb | I interpreted that as a shorthand for 'we'll spin up a container on k8s to run the job and then destroy it afterwards', rather than actually using a FaaS platform, but I'm not familiar enough with the Jenkins ecosystem to know if that's an accurate interpretation or not | 15:38 |
| TheJulia | I kind of interpreted it at a higher level, that they know they are loosing market share and interest due to the model in which jenkins is typically leveraged, and that they are starting to explore but are not completely committing to one true way of moving forward | 15:39 |
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| zaneb | the interesting thing to me was that he acknowledged they were stuck in a local maximum. they have a community that relies on this ecosystem of plugins and backward compatibility, but they acknowledge that at another level it's actually terrible. and he wants to drop backwards compat in order to rearchitech | 15:43 |
| zaneb | rearchitect | 15:43 |
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| TheJulia | yeah, thta was my other huge takeaway | 15:43 |
| zaneb | so it will be fascinating to see how people react | 15:44 |
| cdent | we can watch and learn | 15:50 |
| smcginnis | Maybe they should rewrite in go. | 15:51 |
| evrardjp | cdent: we should/must learn :P | 15:52 |
| evrardjp | smcginnis: I laughed and thought "rust" at the same time. | 15:52 |
| evrardjp | but go is a cooler kid | 15:52 |
| evrardjp | so let's say go! | 15:52 |
| evrardjp | haha | 15:53 |
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| dhellmann | tonyb , diablo_roja, persia : my self-nomination has failed with a validation error that I don't understand. Did I do something wrong? http://logs.openstack.org/82/599582/1/check/election-tox-ci-checks/0e1c223/ara-report/result/a45db82a-4500-4378-bbbf-c617bd62ab55/ | 16:03 |
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| persia | dhellmann: I believe we did something wrong. From what I can tell, we failed to tell the autovalidation code that "TC" was a valid election, even though it isn't a project. | 16:04 |
| dhellmann | ok | 16:04 |
| evrardjp | yeah it looks like there should be a condition out there :) | 16:05 |
| dims | who needs them anyway! :) | 16:05 |
| dims | damn, not even a chuckle :) | 16:06 |
| dhellmann | persia : I think I see how to fix it, let's see if I'm right | 16:06 |
| evrardjp | dims: :) | 16:06 |
| persia | dhellmann: If you happen to feel like s/candiate/candidate/ whilst you are there, that might also improve readability of that section :) | 16:07 |
| dhellmann | hmm | 16:09 |
| dhellmann | now I'm not sure I know how to fix it properly | 16:09 |
| dhellmann | is it just a missing "not" ? | 16:09 |
| persia | I believe so, yes. | 16:09 |
| persia | Or at least, my first attempt to fix it would be to insert "not" on line 111. | 16:10 |
| persia | Err, 110. | 16:10 |
| * persia needs to configure vim more | 16:11 | |
| dhellmann | https://review.openstack.org/599668 and https://review.openstack.org/599669 | 16:11 |
| persia | Just waiting for 599582 to report zuul results to approve 599668 | 16:13 |
| persia | And thanks for the quick patch :) | 16:13 |
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| openstackgerrit | Andreas Jaeger proposed openstack/governance master: Retire openstack-infra/odsreg https://review.openstack.org/599712 | 17:37 |
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| openstackgerrit | Andreas Jaeger proposed openstack/governance master: Retire openstack-infra/odsreg https://review.openstack.org/599712 | 18:04 |
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| openstackgerrit | Matt Riedemann proposed openstack/governance master: Update upgrade-checkers goal with storyboard info https://review.openstack.org/599759 | 19:28 |
| mriedem | tox -e docs on the governance repo is broken by https://review.openstack.org/#/c/590179/ | 19:29 |
| dhellmann | whee | 19:33 |
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| mriedem | oh apparently it's stale crap under docs | 19:42 |
| mriedem | which is why ci doesn't hit it | 19:42 |
| dhellmann | we should add -E to that command line | 19:43 |
| mriedem | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/597047/ | 19:44 |
| smcginnis | TheJulia: Can you point to an instance where -W causes problems in Ironic? The behavior you describe does not sound right. | 19:45 |
| TheJulia | smcginnis: http://logs.openstack.org/91/599191/3/check/openstack-tox-docs/cb19776/job-output.txt.gz#_2018-09-04_03_36_25_635326 is one, the exception below is the first time I've seen that. The original patch is compltely a POC, but I happened to wonder why only the docs failed earlier today and noticed it | 19:48 |
| smcginnis | TheJulia: Hmm, that has to be a setting somewhere. I know we have multiple methods of the same name in cinder and are able to use module documentation without errors. | 19:50 |
| TheJulia | that or there is some sort of funky race | 19:51 |
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| TheJulia | It looks like we have some patches pass, but now most fail | 19:55 |
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| smcginnis | I can't see much of a difference from how we have docs in cinder, unfortunately. | 19:57 |
| smcginnis | I was hoping I'd spot an obvious flag or something. | 19:57 |
| TheJulia | Yeah, looks like it is the next thing on my plate after I get this current thing out of my head | 19:57 |
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| openstackgerrit | Matt Riedemann proposed openstack/governance master: Add a note about deployment projects for upgrade-checkers goal https://review.openstack.org/599835 | 20:30 |
| mriedem | dhellmann: ^ related to what we talked about this morning | 20:30 |
| mriedem | not sure if that's too wordy | 20:30 |
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| dhellmann | mriedem : looking | 20:37 |
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| mriedem | dhellmann: tbc, you agree with making devstack/grenade integration part of the completion criteria for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/599835/ ? | 21:02 |
| mriedem | not all projects use grenade | 21:03 |
| mriedem | or even have the supports-upgrade tag i guess... | 21:03 |
| dhellmann | mriedem : maybe just devstack then? I don't want to pull in too much. Maybe "if they support X, integration needs to be done"? | 21:03 |
| mriedem | hell i'm just adding nova-status upgrade check to devstack now https://review.openstack.org/599847 :) | 21:03 |
| mriedem | yeah any project with the supports-upgrade tag should be running the checker in their upgrade job | 21:05 |
| dhellmann | that's a good way to phrase it | 21:05 |
| mriedem | i'll spin | 21:05 |
| mriedem | as for devstack, idk - there isn't really a tag for that | 21:05 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add openstack/cookbook-openstack-bare-metal project https://review.openstack.org/596746 | 21:07 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add Jay Faulkner as an extra-atc for ironic https://review.openstack.org/597212 | 21:07 |
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| openstackgerrit | Matt Riedemann proposed openstack/governance master: Add upgrade testing completion criteria for upgrade-checkers goal https://review.openstack.org/599849 | 21:15 |
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| tonyb | dhellmann: sorry abouyt the failure, and thanks for the fix. It should merge RSN | 22:43 |
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| johnsom | Looking at the TC notes, I want to point out another talk that has troubled me over the last few summits. It's given by a vendor, pitching a product, which is all ok and fine, but the abstract is pitching it as a project team update/information when the presenters and company have not participated on the project beyond two patches years ago. The problem here is they present information about the upstream/opensource | 23:00 |
| johnsom | project that is not accurate and outdated. | 23:00 |
| johnsom | https://www.openstack.org/summit/berlin-2018/summit-schedule/events/22701/advanced-network-services-load-balancing-as-a-service-lbaas | 23:00 |
| johnsom | It has led to confusion where folks attend this session then get confused with the actual project update session content or in hallway discussion tell us that it was just presented that the upstream project doesn't support features that it has for a while. | 23:03 |
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| dhellmann | johnsom: thanks for that | 23:42 |
| dhellmann | jbryce : ^^ | 23:42 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ^ | 23:42 |
| dhellmann | I wonder how we can improve this without requiring every project team to review the conference talk proposals. :-/ | 23:43 |
| dhellmann | s/requiring/asking/ | 23:43 |
| johnsom | Yeah, that is hard. | 23:44 |
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| johnsom | Maybe politely ask them after a presentation was given that was more marketing vs. a project update that for future presentations they provide a more accurate abstract? | 23:45 |
| dhellmann | maybe if we had a list of folks who could and would answer queries from the program committees for each track, they would at least know who to ask | 23:45 |
| dhellmann | yeah, that assumes there's someone monitoring every talk as it's given, too | 23:45 |
| johnsom | Right, though we have folks that like to watch the talks about their topic. | 23:45 |
| johnsom | This one also might be easy to look at the presenters and check their community participation level. | 23:46 |
| dhellmann | yeah, we can ask track committees to do that much, if we can expose the data for them easily | 23:46 |
| dhellmann | although just because someone hasn't written code doesn't mean they're out of touch or not involved | 23:47 |
| johnsom | I.e. is the abstract about the project as a whole, but the presenters aren't in stackalytics or attend the IRC meetings.... | 23:47 |
| dhellmann | that's why I was proposing asking other community folks | 23:47 |
| johnsom | Right, agreed | 23:47 |
| smcginnis | Hard to limit it on upstream participation. There are some very knowledgable downstream folks. | 23:47 |
| pabelanger | ttx: just a follow up to your question this morning, I am not planning on running again for the TC. I've just sent that via email to the openstack-dev ML. | 23:47 |
| smcginnis | It's difficult to tell if that means a sales pitch or just they really had something they wanted to talk about. | 23:47 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis : yeah, I think the point is downstream folks shouldn't give talks that look like upstream updates | 23:48 |
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| smcginnis | Hopefully it's that obvious. I've seen several that were not. | 23:48 |
| jbryce | Thanks for the pointer. I'll check it out | 23:48 |
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| johnsom | I am ok with downstream folks giving update talks. I don't really want to limit that. | 23:48 |
| dhellmann | at least let's get the abstracts accurate :-) | 23:48 |
| dhellmann | johnsom : I think it'd be ok to at least check in with the project, but yeah, not limit | 23:49 |
| johnsom | I am perfectly fine with related pitches too, this one is just a bit painful, at least for me. | 23:50 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: I'd like to chat about the UX for self-nominating in the election. As this is the first time we've had a CI job that votes. I want to find a way that's both easy for candidates and good for the officials | 23:51 |
| dhellmann | tonyb : it wasn't so bad. I'm not sure about email addresses as filenames, but I think I get the point (you don't want to care about the contents of the file) | 23:52 |
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| tonyb | dhellmann: Yup and the email address is the only thing we have that links gerrit and the OSF | 23:53 |
| dhellmann | yeah | 23:53 |
| dhellmann | maybe that info can be taken from the patch author data | 23:53 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: I was thinking specifically of when the zuul votes -1 on ci-check. how do you as a candidate work out what went wrong | 23:53 |
| dhellmann | well, I opened the ara report and looked at the failure | 23:54 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: that's was we used to do and it was error prone, and adds a technical limitation for allowing $person acting as a proxy for $candidate | 23:54 |
| dhellmann | I threw together a patch to make that output shorter to make it easier to figure out what was going on | 23:54 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: Would it be better we separated ci-checks into 2 jobs one for the chnage and one for the repo? | 23:55 |
| dhellmann | I don't know if there's a way to make a job leave a more comprehensive comment. Maybe a bot could. | 23:55 |
| dhellmann | I was mostly just not interested in all of the redundant checks from other candidates in other elections. | 23:55 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: Yeah we can't deafult to only the change but we can add a more candidate friendly job | 23:55 |
| dhellmann | sorry, I have to go offline | 23:56 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: np this isn't urgent | 23:56 |
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