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| openstackgerrit | Jakub Wachowski proposed openstack/governance master: New project: monasca-events-agent https://review.openstack.org/500676 | 05:22 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Drop Technical Committee meetings https://review.openstack.org/459848 | 08:44 |
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| ttx | smcginnis: agreed, you have to dive deeper, which is why I flagged them all for extra attention | 08:52 |
| ttx | If anyone is around for the TC office hours, i'm here :) | 09:10 |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Update goals status for Monasca https://review.openstack.org/491458 | 09:22 |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Update goals status for Monasca https://review.openstack.org/491458 | 09:26 |
| * johnthetubaguy waves at ttx | 09:30 | |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: hi! | 09:32 |
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| ttx | All see http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-tc/2017-September/001465.html so that I can try to build a schedule for the TC room @ PTG | 12:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: loving the grouping, although honestly I am interested in all those topics | 12:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: +1 for monday morning being empty | 12:34 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: same for me (all topics) | 12:37 |
| ttx | Let's try to free up all Monday morning + end early on Tuesday afternoon so that we can catch up in other rooms | 12:37 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: sounds like a good plan | 12:55 |
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| smcginnis | ttx: Sounds like a good plan to me too. | 13:39 |
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| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Update team diversity tags https://review.openstack.org/500830 | 13:51 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Add policy and completion goals for nova https://review.openstack.org/500918 | 16:34 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Add policy and completion goals for nova https://review.openstack.org/500918 | 16:43 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Add policy and completion goals for nova https://review.openstack.org/500918 | 16:44 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chandan Kumar proposed openstack/governance master: Update the process of tempest plugin split goal https://review.openstack.org/500489 | 16:59 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chandan Kumar proposed openstack/governance master: Updated the progress on tempest plugin split goal https://review.openstack.org/500489 | 17:00 |
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| openstackgerrit | Sean McGinnis proposed openstack/project-team-guide master: Add driverfixes branch information https://review.openstack.org/500941 | 17:48 |
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| openstackgerrit | Sean McGinnis proposed openstack/project-team-guide master: Add driverfixes branch information https://review.openstack.org/500941 | 18:15 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for openstack-ansible https://review.openstack.org/500979 | 20:46 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for openstack chef https://review.openstack.org/500983 | 20:57 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for openstack docs team https://review.openstack.org/500984 | 21:00 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for horizon team https://review.openstack.org/500985 | 21:14 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for i18n team https://review.openstack.org/500986 | 21:17 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for kolla team https://review.openstack.org/500987 | 21:20 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for kuryr team https://review.openstack.org/500988 | 21:25 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for charms team https://review.openstack.org/500991 | 21:30 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for openstackclient https://review.openstack.org/500992 | 21:34 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for oslo team. https://review.openstack.org/500993 | 21:35 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for debian package team https://review.openstack.org/500994 | 21:37 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for rpm package team https://review.openstack.org/500996 | 21:39 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for openstack puppet team https://review.openstack.org/500997 | 21:42 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for qa team https://review.openstack.org/500998 | 21:45 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for rally team https://review.openstack.org/501000 | 21:48 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for refstack team https://review.openstack.org/501003 | 21:52 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for the release team https://review.openstack.org/501004 | 21:55 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for requirements team https://review.openstack.org/501005 | 21:57 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for security team https://review.openstack.org/501007 | 22:03 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for shade team https://review.openstack.org/501012 | 22:08 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for solum team https://review.openstack.org/501015 | 22:16 |
| dhellmann | lbragstad : I wonder if you want to just roll all of those updates into 1 patch | 22:16 |
| lbragstad | dhellmann: i was going to do that originally, but didn't know if i was going to hit snags with some projects needing respins and what-bot | 22:17 |
| dhellmann | maybe not, I don't know. seems just as easy to review though. | 22:17 |
| lbragstad | not* | 22:17 |
| dhellmann | ah | 22:17 |
| lbragstad | dhellmann: that's true - i apologize for the spam :( | 22:17 |
| dhellmann | nah, I'm not complaining | 22:17 |
| dhellmann | just trying to figure out what's less work for everyone :-) | 22:17 |
| lbragstad | dhellmann: the burndown chart tool is pretty awesome by the way | 22:18 |
| dhellmann | sdague gets credit for starting that | 22:18 |
| lbragstad | i got that working today, so thank you for that | 22:18 |
| lbragstad | ack - i'll be sure to thank him, too | 22:18 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goals for stable team https://review.openstack.org/501016 | 22:20 |
| dhellmann | it would be really nice to turn that into something easy to use with a config file instead of having to customize | 22:20 |
| lbragstad | dhellmann: yeah - that's what i was thinking | 22:20 |
| lbragstad | it's pretty close | 22:20 |
| lbragstad | the only thing i had to really replace was the branch i was tracking my work with | 22:21 |
| dhellmann | I put some stuff in the releases repo recently to run gerrit queries and show the results using a yaml file to define the queries | 22:21 |
| dhellmann | between that and the dashboard thing we should have some good examples of working with queries | 22:21 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:21 |
| lbragstad | that other thing that would be nice would be to feed in the projects you need to track somehow | 22:22 |
| lbragstad | but i'm not sure how best to do that yet | 22:22 |
| dhellmann | right, that's the sort of thing I mean | 22:22 |
| lbragstad | i'm not sure if this is the right answer, but i could parse the goal document itself and look for "Goal not applicable." and ignore the project from the expected_repos.txt | 22:23 |
| dhellmann | if we can get that done, then we can use periodic jobs to publish the results | 22:23 |
| dhellmann | or we could use a more parseable format for the goal data and render to html | 22:23 |
| dhellmann | I just did rst to start because it was easy | 22:23 |
| lbragstad | yeah - that's true | 22:24 |
| dhellmann | if we're going to publish burndown charts, we could manage those separately, too | 22:24 |
| lbragstad | i like that idea | 22:24 |
| dhellmann | we would want a different list for each chart anyway | 22:24 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:25 |
| lbragstad | then when a project updates the documents for a specific goal, they still only have to make a change to a single repository | 22:25 |
| dhellmann | true | 22:25 |
| lbragstad | and it's in sync with whoever is maintaining the burndown chart | 22:25 |
| dhellmann | good point | 22:25 |
| lbragstad | how did you generated the list for expected_repos.txt? | 22:26 |
| dhellmann | some of the stuff I did for the doc-migration burndown chart wasn't based on gerrit queries, so we want to leave room for some customization capabilities in there, too | 22:26 |
| dhellmann | and we might not want the charts to be tied only to the goals, since when they become easy to use they may be useful for other projects | 22:27 |
| dhellmann | the doc migration is another example of that | 22:27 |
| lbragstad | right | 22:27 |
| dhellmann | it wasn't an official goal | 22:27 |
| dhellmann | and individual teams might find them useful, too | 22:28 |
| lbragstad | that's a good point | 22:28 |
| dhellmann | I wonder if it makes sense to make it so the generator can be pip installed, so teams could put it in their regular doc build | 22:28 |
| dhellmann | or if it's better to just put all of the stuff in one repo and have a small team willing to review those patches to maintain it | 22:29 |
| dhellmann | and let anyone use it for whatever they want to track | 22:29 |
| lbragstad | then projects can configure it with a config file specific to a chart | 22:29 |
| dhellmann | config file, maybe some custom code, yeah | 22:29 |
| lbragstad | the later sounds like a step to the former | 22:29 |
| dhellmann | make it really easy to dump json files in the format needed to import them cleanly | 22:30 |
| dhellmann | definitely worth exploring, I think | 22:30 |
| lbragstad | i agree | 22:30 |
| dhellmann | maybe step 1 is set up a repo for tracking goals this time around, and see where that takes us | 22:30 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:30 |
| dhellmann | don't call the repo "goals" just "burndown-dashboards" or something | 22:30 |
| lbragstad | because the data files and such need to be reset with each chart | 22:31 |
| dhellmann | exactly | 22:31 |
| dhellmann | even the javascript needs to be tweaked, until we get something that renders that | 22:31 |
| lbragstad | that seems like a good idea - maybe a simple doc with what's supported and how to bootstrap a new chart | 22:31 |
| dhellmann | you know, it's probably worth looking into existing tools, too | 22:31 |
| dhellmann | something like bokeh or whatever the newest hotness is | 22:31 |
| lbragstad | you mean the d3 stuff? | 22:31 |
| dhellmann | yeah | 22:31 |
| lbragstad | i thought that was super interesting | 22:32 |
| lbragstad | i'd never really played with it | 22:32 |
| lbragstad | but yeah - exploring other things would be worth it too i think | 22:32 |
| dhellmann | https://bokeh.pydata.org/en/latest/ | 22:32 |
| lbragstad | dhellmann: that looks like it might work | 22:35 |
| dhellmann | I don't know if that's any easier to use or not. Might be overkill. But it's worth looking at. | 22:35 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 22:35 |
| dhellmann | I could see us building a library of things to populate data sets and then using that to render them instead of also building our own rendering stuff. | 22:36 |
| dhellmann | I guess another way to do this would be to use storyboard | 22:39 |
| dhellmann | automate adding stories or tasks or whatever and then add the visualization to that | 22:40 |
| lbragstad | interesting | 22:40 |
| lbragstad | yeah - that wouldn't be a bad idea for adoption | 22:40 |
| dhellmann | I don't really fully understand the data model of storyboard, so I don't know which sorts of objects would be needed or how easy it would be to do things like create a bunch of stories with tags and then show them in a dashboard | 22:41 |
| lbragstad | that's a good question | 22:41 |
| lbragstad | but worth asking the storyboard team i'msure | 22:41 |
| dhellmann | you know, that would give teams a place to report their status directly, too, since they could just change the story status | 22:41 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:42 |
| lbragstad | so you can positively assert a project has completed a goal | 22:42 |
| dhellmann | so we wouldn't need the data in the governance repo, if the goal page linked to the dashboard | 22:42 |
| dhellmann | right -- re-distribute the work of updating the status | 22:42 |
| lbragstad | yeah - that's a bit that we're missing in the current burndown because we don't really know how many patches are going to be necessary to implement a goal | 22:43 |
| dhellmann | yeah, that's why I eventually added the part to track published URLs | 22:43 |
| lbragstad | yeah - that makes sense | 22:44 |
| dhellmann | the more I think about the storyboard part, the more I like that. it abstracts the types of tasks | 22:44 |
| lbragstad | right | 22:44 |
| dhellmann | when it's possible to automate closing the story with a patch, or even some other action (like a thing that looks for published URLs) we can | 22:44 |
| lbragstad | because it doens't require each dashboard to change in order to assert completion (if that makes sense) | 22:44 |
| dhellmann | when we can't, updating the data is distributed to as many people as possible | 22:44 |
| dhellmann | and right, it standardizes the thing being tracked | 22:44 |
| dhellmann | it feels a bit of a shame that we weren't able to find any existing bug tracker that worked the way we wanted | 22:46 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:46 |
| lbragstad | i do like that flow | 22:46 |
| lbragstad | when a goal is agreed upon, a bunch of tasks get opened for affected projects | 22:46 |
| lbragstad | the burn down tracks progress/patches and knows when to take a project of the list entirely | 22:47 |
| dhellmann | yep, and that should be easy enough to automate by reading the governance project list | 22:47 |
| dhellmann | I could see teams using the feature for tracking their release cycle work visually, too | 22:48 |
| lbragstad | so - you essentially have a burn down chart with all the states we have in lp for example | 22:48 |
| lbragstad | (approve, started, implemented, etc..) | 22:49 |
| dhellmann | right | 22:49 |
| lbragstad | for both bugs and blueprint | 22:49 |
| lbragstad | s | 22:49 |
| dhellmann | I wonder how hard it would be to track status changes over time | 22:49 |
| lbragstad | it's really just a view at that point | 22:49 |
| dhellmann | vs. just a single stack bar chart | 22:49 |
| dhellmann | yeah, exactly | 22:49 |
| lbragstad | status changes over time? | 22:50 |
| dhellmann | well, yeah. the burndown chart computes the number of items in a given state at regular intervals | 22:50 |
| dhellmann | that's how you get the nice bands of color | 22:50 |
| lbragstad | yep | 22:50 |
| dhellmann | storyboard is going to give you the current states, but not their states in the past | 22:50 |
| lbragstad | oh | 22:51 |
| lbragstad | i see what you mean | 22:51 |
| dhellmann | I mean, it probably can tell you when things were edited | 22:51 |
| lbragstad | yeah - for me, i think that would be useful | 22:51 |
| dhellmann | so maybe there's a new data model to go with the chart | 22:51 |
| lbragstad | looking at the whole burn down of our bug work over a cycle for example | 22:51 |
| dhellmann | and a periodic thing to run and update that data for the chart, so that drawing the chart is pulling the sequence of numbers instead of pulling the raw data and building the sets of numbers | 22:52 |
| lbragstad | the data model you have in data.csv is what accomplishes that today, right? | 22:52 |
| dhellmann | yeah | 22:52 |
| lbragstad | yeah - the deployment would have to guarantee the periodic bits | 22:52 |
| dhellmann | assuming the number of states of stories/tasks are fixed, and not user-configurable, the table would just be a bunch of ints and a date | 22:53 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:53 |
| lbragstad | i would think it would be set | 22:53 |
| lbragstad | unless we're talking about things like tags | 22:53 |
| lbragstad | were a project can have official and unofficial tags | 22:53 |
| dhellmann | you'd want to define the query to run generically somehow | 22:54 |
| dhellmann | so a chart would have a name, a query, and a UUID | 22:54 |
| dhellmann | and then the data for all charts could live in one table | 22:54 |
| dhellmann | and maybe we'd have an active/inactive flag so we don't recompute a bunch of old charts that aren't useful | 22:54 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 22:54 |
| dhellmann | again, it seems like something that is likely to already exist in some other tools | 22:56 |
| lbragstad | right | 22:56 |
| dhellmann | of course our wheel would be much rounder than theirs ;-) | 22:57 |
| lbragstad | we do love super round wheels | 22:57 |
| lbragstad | i'd be curious to see what the storyboard folks have to say about it | 22:57 |
| lbragstad | i'm not seeing a dedicated etherpad for the storyboard team https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/PTG/Queens/Etherpads | 22:58 |
| lbragstad | maybe a ML thread is appropriate? | 22:59 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for storelets team https://review.openstack.org/501029 | 23:02 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for tripleo team https://review.openstack.org/501031 | 23:06 |
| dhellmann | lbragstad : yeah, a thread seems good. I don't know if the storyboard folks have a room for the ptg | 23:09 |
| dhellmann | I hate to reopen the "which bug tracker should we use" can of worms, but that may be worth doing, too. | 23:10 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for dragonflow team https://review.openstack.org/501034 | 23:14 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/governance master: Update policy goal for os-win team https://review.openstack.org/501035 | 23:19 |
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| lbragstad | dhellmann: yeah - fwiw ^ that should be all the reviews | 23:21 |
| lbragstad | for projects that are not affected by that goal | 23:21 |
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