openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/python-openstackclient: Enable release notes translation https://review.openstack.org/383382 | 00:15 |
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openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/python-openstackclient: Mask passwords in debug logs for auth_config_hook https://review.openstack.org/382699 | 01:34 |
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rcernin | Hi! OSC can I ask about the shell formatter: https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-openstackclient/+bug/1616323 I've been told its hard to maintain, so is there actually any hope for having this fixed? | 09:21 |
openstack | Launchpad bug 1616323 in python-openstackclient "make openstack cli -f shell output friendly to bash" [Undecided,New] | 09:21 |
openstackgerrit | Reedip proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: Add necessary info to Floating IP list https://review.openstack.org/381658 | 09:22 |
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openstackgerrit | Kyrylo Romanenko proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: Improve output of supported API versions https://review.openstack.org/382923 | 10:56 |
openstackgerrit | Kyrylo Romanenko proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: Improve output of supported API versions https://review.openstack.org/382923 | 11:02 |
openstackgerrit | Kyrylo Romanenko proposed openstack/osc-lib: Improve output of supported client versions https://review.openstack.org/383000 | 11:05 |
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openstackgerrit | Matt Riedemann proposed openstack/osc-lib: Add release note for security bug 1630822 https://review.openstack.org/383755 | 14:11 |
openstack | bug 1630822 in OpenStack Security Advisory "Debug and -vv outputs user password in plain text" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1630822 | 14:11 |
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timrc | stevemar: Yo yo! | 14:39 |
* stevemar waves at timrc | 14:39 | |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: we have unhappy customers! | 14:39 |
stevemar | https://twitter.com/timrchavez/status/784384300728799233 | 14:39 |
* timrc wields pitchfork | 14:39 | |
* stevemar uses his laptop as a shield | 14:40 | |
stevemar | so we could make the error message happen easily | 14:40 |
timrc | So, if can (and I think we mostly do) agree that requiring someone to explicitly install an older client to get access to the features in the new client is not an ideal experience. | 14:41 |
stevemar | we could also make the "pip install openstackclient[orchestration] | 14:41 |
stevemar | bit easily work too | 14:41 |
timrc | If the reason it's explicit is because the implementation in the new client is experimental, I think we just need to state that. | 14:41 |
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stevemar | the reason it's explicit is because the code base is in heatclient :( | 14:42 |
timrc | Or yeah maybe we do openstackclient[stable] and openstackclient[devel|experimental|all|whatever] which would enable All Teh Things, experimental or otherwise. | 14:42 |
stevemar | hmmm | 14:43 |
stevemar | you guys install with pip right? not the packaged stuff? | 14:43 |
timrc | pip yeah | 14:43 |
stevemar | i kinda like that, but decided what is experimental and not would be funny | 14:43 |
timrc | So if it's just because OS client is acting as a wrapper maybe openstackclient[core] and openstackclient[all] | 14:44 |
stevemar | when you install heatclient the entrypoint is created for OSC to pickup: https://github.com/openstack/python-heatclient/blob/master/setup.cfg#L31-L34 | 14:45 |
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stevemar | we could do openstackclient[all] easily | 14:46 |
timrc | I think Nicola has a point too... what would be the harm of just installing python-heatclient as a dep to osc? From a user perspective you just expect it to be there. | 14:46 |
timrc | Is it that you don't want bug reports for heat coming in through osc? | 14:46 |
stevemar | nah, those are easy to redirect | 14:47 |
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stevemar | part of that reasoning 1) we don't want "help" to explode and 2) we didn't want to install all the dependecies that the various clients have | 14:47 |
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stevemar | i think 2 is less of an issue now: fewer clients are doing silly things, more are using global requirements to sync up | 14:48 |
stevemar | but where is the line drawn, we can install heat cmds, but why not barbican | 14:48 |
* stevemar goes to get breakfast | 14:48 | |
stevemar | (10 feet away in the kitchen) | 14:49 |
timrc | No it's all or nothing, I think. | 14:49 |
stevemar | timrc: damn big tent | 14:51 |
timrc | From a user perspective I'd much rather install 9,000 deps than having cli fragmentation. Stil lots of value of providing a wrapper around heat in OSC as an example. If someone did not know that could install python-heatclient to enable heat in OSC, then they're liable to just use OSC. Not sure if there's a deprecation warning in python-heatclient, but it could get confusing. | 14:51 |
timrc | um | 14:52 |
timrc | liable to just use python-heatclent | 14:52 |
stevemar | timrc: that would mean installing all these: https://github.com/openstack/python-openstackclient/blob/master/test-requirements.txt#L26-L39 | 14:52 |
timrc | heatclient* I cannot type. Slack has ruined me. | 14:52 |
stevemar | :) | 14:52 |
stevemar | timrc: at the minimum, we could easily add a [all] target and allow you to install all the deps, i think that is fair | 14:53 |
timrc | stevemar: Is the intention for all those clients to go away eventually and have native implementations in OSC? | 14:53 |
stevemar | timrc: i think so. i would like that. | 14:54 |
stevemar | timrc: some obviously will be around longer than others | 14:54 |
stevemar | but they would go away like keystoneclient did | 14:54 |
stevemar | some of the smaller projects already tossed away their old CLIs | 14:54 |
timrc | So installing them all everytime should give us more impetus to get rid of them :P | 14:56 |
stevemar | timrc: let me look at the dependencies that would be brought in | 14:56 |
stevemar | if it's only a handful, i am not against it | 14:56 |
stevemar | timrc: would you like to see that by default or using someting like [all] | 14:57 |
stevemar | timrc: what slack is kennedy talking about? | 15:00 |
stevemar | the cloud-platform one? | 15:00 |
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* dtroyer_zz sigs | 15:48 | |
dtroyer_zz | ok, here's the thing | 15:48 |
* rdodev pays attention | 15:48 | |
dtroyer_zz | OSC currently uses the project client libraries as their Python->REST layer, eventually we want the SDK but we're not there yet | 15:49 |
dtroyer_zz | except for Network, that uses the SDK, except Neutron is adding more plugin stuff into neutronclient anyway, so we'll stll need it anyway for some things | 15:49 |
timrc | stevemar: Reading up... had a phone call aka I work for IBM. | 15:49 |
dtroyer_zz | The dpendencies for OSc are bad now, only get worse if we install all 25 cleint libraries | 15:49 |
dtroyer_zz | for some use cases, that might be a don't-care, for others it is a mess | 15:50 |
dtroyer_zz | This is the compromise we have. | 15:50 |
dtroyer_zz | Also, some projects didn't want to 'let go' of their CLI totally and want control over it directly, so they like the plugins | 15:51 |
dtroyer_zz | others don't want to touch it at all | 15:51 |
timrc | dtroyer_zz: You just managed to depress me with that last statement :) | 15:52 |
dtroyer_zz | if we had a reasonable install story that, say, didn't require a windows user to install a runtime, binary support packages, and 30+ python packages, I'd be much more willing to just throw everything into the box | 15:52 |
timrc | Oops scroll up... the whole "except Network, that uses the SDK, except Neutron..." | 15:52 |
dtroyer_zz | timrc: welcome to client-land | 15:52 |
rdodev | So, again, from the pure UX perspective, I'd say leave those projects out of the new CLI entirely. It's easier to say "the new CLI doesn't support that service, use their CLI instead" as opposed to "oh we do support it, but you have to install X first" | 15:53 |
dtroyer_zz | this is where my old-fart background in TurboPASCAL makes me long for mostly-pre-linked binaries | 15:53 |
timrc | My thoughts are we should install all the clients, if it sucks, it sucks. OSC should not hide anything. | 15:53 |
briancurtin | so just make openstack even worse? | 15:53 |
dtroyer_zz | so here's part of the plan: osc-lib will be growing easy support for a plugin to do exactly that, except its designed for things like a stand-alone Ironic install that doesn't want the rest of OpenStack stuff | 15:54 |
rdodev | But then we can make it great again | 15:54 |
timrc | briancurtin: What's the point of OSC then if not to unify the cli? | 15:54 |
briancurtin | it’s not to unify a bunch of shit | 15:54 |
dtroyer_zz | it _is_ unifying the CLI, and doing it in a way that anyone (really!) can be part of it | 15:54 |
briancurtin | could just make a metapackage that does that | 15:54 |
timrc | What makes OpenStack worse is a proliferation of clients and fragmentation. | 15:54 |
briancurtin | and that’s why OSC and SDK exist... | 15:55 |
briancurtin | those 30+ clients are all bad. all different. an absolute mess. OSC provides a sheen on top of some of that, will eventually just go to openstacksdk | 15:56 |
dtroyer_zz | <rant> It's easy to throw stones, its hard to go pick them up and contribute to building the pyramid. Basically 5 people are doing the bulk of the OSC and SDK work.</rant> | 15:57 |
timrc | Just take the usability case where I see an example of someone using 'openstack stack' to do stuff with heat, I go install OSC in my venv, and then get: | 15:57 |
timrc | openstack: 'stack' is not an openstack command. See 'openstack --help'. | 15:57 |
timrc | Did you mean one of these? | 15:57 |
timrc | backup create | 15:57 |
timrc | backup delete | 15:57 |
timrc | backup list | 15:57 |
timrc | backup restore | 15:57 |
timrc | backup show | 15:57 |
dtroyer_zz | yup, it sucks. only the other things we've had are worse | 15:58 |
dtroyer_zz | I am (SERIOUSLY!!) wanting to scrap our help and start over. But we thought being able to log in using KSA plugins was more important, Neutron commands were more important, etc | 15:59 |
timrc | Generating that example above was interesting, prompted me for a password. Strange :P | 15:59 |
dtroyer_zz | yup, too many things need to auth to even find out WTF is going on | 15:59 |
dtroyer_zz | some people want it to do that to even show you any comamnd list | 15:59 |
timrc | I don't even have to authenticate though, I just it enter to get passed the password prompt. | 16:00 |
timrc | :mindblown: | 16:00 |
dtroyer_zz | heh, nice | 16:00 |
dtroyer_zz | bug please? | 16:00 |
timrc | dtroyer_zz: Sure thing | 16:00 |
dtroyer_zz | thanks | 16:01 |
timrc | So since we don't even know 'stack' is an option in OSC before installing python-heatclient, I think I like stevemar's suggestion to create another package called python-openstackclient[all] which installs all the deps. What are others' thoughts? | 16:02 |
dtroyer_zz | so timrc, back to your original point, we could keep a list of known plugins in OSC, and show the user a prompt to install the appropriate package when it is not available. | 16:02 |
dtroyer_zz | How do we do that for N packaging systems? | 16:02 |
dtroyer_zz | A metapackage would work, that would at least be packaging system-specific | 16:03 |
timrc | Eh yeah... I forget about all of those :P | 16:03 |
timrc | dtroyer_zz: Keeping track of plugins can work... really if 'openstack stack foo' returned 'Please install python-heatclient to enable' I think that would be okay. | 16:03 |
dtroyer_zz | we have to a) maintain that list and b) force all of the downstreams to update that text for their environment | 16:04 |
dtroyer_zz | and then, still know the difference between a typo and a command we don't know about | 16:04 |
timrc | We should just stub subcommands in OSC and allow plugins to override them? | 16:05 |
dtroyer_zz | we do keep a top-level list of known plugins in our docs, but not a list of their commands | 16:05 |
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dtroyer_zz | we would need to have at a minimum a list of all resources that map to the right plugin | 16:05 |
timrc | And it's just best effort for our clients? I mean we have a set of popular clients, that's a good start. | 16:06 |
dtroyer_zz | oh, plugins overriding built-ins? that's on the list, there are two things reuired before we get to that | 16:06 |
dtroyer_zz | one of them is not fixing help :) | 16:07 |
timrc | lol | 16:07 |
dtroyer_zz | neither is the other | 16:07 |
dtroyer_zz | honestly, I am so glad to be having this kind of feedback conversation rather what we had three years ago | 16:08 |
dtroyer_zz | it means we're making significant progress | 16:08 |
timrc | OSC is a great joy to use. Even in the last year it's gotten much better. | 16:08 |
timrc | Getting subnet commands into OSC was huge. | 16:08 |
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dtroyer_zz | it has, thanks to a bunch of folks help. rtheis and the Neutron folks have done a TON of work | 16:09 |
timrc | Okay I have a lunch date with my 5yo daughter. I'll be back soon-ish | 16:14 |
dtroyer_zz | best kind of date! | 16:17 |
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openstackgerrit | Dean Troyer proposed openstack/osc-lib: Remove os-client-config hacks for 1.19.x and 1.20.x https://review.openstack.org/358278 | 16:26 |
stevemar | oh dang this moved on | 16:26 |
stevemar | timrc: dawwww | 16:27 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: reading up | 16:27 |
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dtroyer_zz | stevemar: I added the metapackage idea to the summit etherpad | 16:28 |
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stevemar | OK caught up | 16:33 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: timrc the bug you refer to for auth prompting if fixed and should be in 3.3.0 | 16:33 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz, timrc the whole "plugins stomping on each others commands" thing should be eliminated now | 16:33 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: it sounds crazy but a hardcoded list of what commands map to which extension doesn't seem to bonkers to me | 16:34 |
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dtroyer_zz | the plugin command bit was more about having a registry in OSC itself mapping plugin commands back to the pacakges required to be installed, similar to what dpkg/apt does | 16:35 |
stevemar | "Basically 5 people are doing the bulk of the OSC and SDK work" <<< when they have time :) | 16:35 |
dtroyer_zz | maintaining that is the primary problem | 16:35 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: so i did a quick analysis of the various clients and requirements | 16:36 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: it's actually not bad | 16:36 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: http://paste.openstack.org/show/584873/ | 16:37 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: do a find for "****" | 16:37 |
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stevemar | there are actually only 5 libraries that would need to be installed in addition to what we already lay down | 16:38 |
dtroyer_zz | k | 16:38 |
dtroyer_zz | I thought pyOpenSSL came with glanceclient | 16:38 |
stevemar | apparently not | 16:38 |
stevemar | https://github.com/openstack/python-glanceclient/blob/master/requirements.txt | 16:38 |
dtroyer_zz | when did that happen??? | 16:39 |
dtroyer_zz | I'm happy, but unaware | 16:39 |
* stevemar shrugs | 16:40 | |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: so if we take out the deps that muranoclient brings in (pyopenssl and yaql), then it's only 3 with minimal deps (dogpile.cache, swiftclient and appsdir) | 16:41 |
stevemar | i list those at the end | 16:41 |
dtroyer_zz | so, yeah, glancecleint really doesn't need openssl anymore | 16:41 |
dtroyer_zz | woot! | 16:41 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: so in theory the dependency argument is not an issue :P | 16:42 |
dtroyer_zz | ok, so the real issue is just how many plugin packages would be added | 16:42 |
dtroyer_zz | ha | 16:42 |
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stevemar | right, i think we could picky here | 16:42 |
stevemar | see which projects have been around the longest and are most mature | 16:43 |
dtroyer_zz | I think we should count vowels in the project anmes and use that as our filter | 16:43 |
stevemar | lol | 16:43 |
stevemar | fewer or more is better? | 16:43 |
dtroyer_zz | I'm still on the side of fewer, as the total number is still absurd | 16:44 |
dtroyer_zz | but the delta is less than we thought | 16:44 |
stevemar | yes, much less, i thought we'd get random junk | 16:44 |
dtroyer_zz | well, warlock is still in there :) | 16:44 |
stevemar | things are settling in openstackclient, some of the smaller projects will get kicked out eventually from big tent | 16:44 |
dtroyer_zz | you think? | 16:45 |
stevemar | i think we're past the growth stage | 16:45 |
dtroyer_zz | I said something like that the other day and got strange looks from people who I wish would understand where we are on the whole | 16:46 |
dtroyer_zz | internal $EMPLOYER folk | 16:46 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: it would also cost us nothing to setup individual targets for each service, like oslo.db does for each db: https://github.com/openstack/oslo.db/blob/master/setup.cfg#L22-L52 | 16:47 |
stevemar | we would simply lay down the extra library | 16:48 |
stevemar | i guess the argument there is, if a user can do `pip install osc[orchestration]` why can't they do `pip install heatclient` | 16:48 |
dtroyer_zz | :) knowing that either is necessary is just a doc step, I know | 16:49 |
dtroyer_zz | which is why I'd like to first consider a single meta-apckage | 16:49 |
dtroyer_zz | hey, would it make sense to put the plugin command tests jobs into that metapacakge? move all of the plugin-related bits there? | 16:50 |
dtroyer_zz | ie, the list of known plugins | 16:50 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: i needs more info on meta packages | 16:51 |
stevemar | link me? | 16:51 |
dtroyer_zz | it was just in the conversation with timrc earlier | 16:51 |
dtroyer_zz | I added it to https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/osc-ocata-summit | 16:51 |
dtroyer_zz | that would give the noob docs a single install package and get it all at once | 16:52 |
stevemar | how does a metapakage help those that install from pip? | 16:52 |
stevemar | and not use apt or yum | 16:52 |
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dtroyer_zz | 'pip install openstackcleint' has python-openstackclient and friends as a dep | 16:52 |
stevemar | ah | 16:52 |
stevemar | like what mordred did with keystoneauth and keystoneauth1 | 16:53 |
dtroyer_zz | and the distro version works the same, implemented using their native tools | 16:53 |
stevemar | right | 16:53 |
dtroyer_zz | this gets us (in DevStack terms) 'install_package openstackclient' everywhere | 16:53 |
stevemar | i'd love to hear how that suggestion would be received << timrc | 16:53 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: i do agree with the thinking that if we lay everything down from the get-go then more people will use it | 16:54 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: game starting in 15 minutes so i'll be AFK | 16:54 |
dtroyer_zz | I don't think more people will use it, fewer people will wonder why the 'stack' commands are not there | 16:54 |
dtroyer_zz | I'll put it on so I know when to hit you up for a review | 16:55 |
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stevemar | :) | 16:55 |
stevemar | who needs enemies when you have friends like that | 16:56 |
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openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/osc-lib: Add release note for security bug 1630822 https://review.openstack.org/383755 | 17:00 |
openstack | bug 1630822 in OpenStack Security Advisory "Debug and -vv outputs user password in plain text" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1630822 | 17:00 |
stevemar | timrc: thanks for jumping on irc and not asking for slack, i wanted to see dtroyer_zz looped in | 17:05 |
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mordred | stevemar: what did I do? | 17:06 |
dtroyer_zz | mordred: something ksa something package | 17:06 |
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mordred | I think that was morgan | 17:07 |
mordred | phew | 17:07 |
dtroyer_zz | heh, auto-complete fail maybe? | 17:07 |
mordred | as long as I didn't mess something _else_ :) | 17:07 |
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stevemar | mordred: never :) | 17:08 |
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dtroyer_zz | stevemar: during the national anthem(s) can you look at this? https://review.openstack.org/383000 | 17:09 |
dtroyer_zz | I think that'll be the release point for osc-lib | 17:09 |
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stevemar | dtroyer_zz: also https://review.openstack.org/#/c/382923/4 | 17:10 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: approved | 17:10 |
dtroyer_zz | sure, I hadn't gotten to that repo yet … | 17:11 |
stevemar | dtroyer_zz: oh come on, 2 outs in 2 pitches... | 17:11 |
dtroyer_zz | fast game so far | 17:11 |
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stevemar | dtroyer_zz: tuuuuulo | 17:36 |
stevemar | 2 run jack | 17:36 |
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openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/osc-lib: TrivilalFix: Using assertIsNone() instead of assertEqual(None) https://review.openstack.org/376323 | 17:39 |
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openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/osc-lib: Improve output of supported client versions https://review.openstack.org/383000 | 17:52 |
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openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/python-openstackclient: Improve output of supported API versions https://review.openstack.org/382923 | 17:54 |
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openstackgerrit | whitekid proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: Fix router unset --route option https://review.openstack.org/383854 | 18:26 |
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mriedem | rtheis: where does one report bugs against openstacksdk? | 18:39 |
mriedem | i didn't find a project in launchpad | 18:39 |
rtheis | mriedem: https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-openstacksdk/+filebug | 18:40 |
mriedem | ah python-openstacksdk | 18:41 |
mriedem | fooled me | 18:41 |
openstackgerrit | Milan Kováčik proposed openstack/api-wg: Specify time intervals based filtering queries https://review.openstack.org/383862 | 18:43 |
mriedem | rtheis: thanks https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-openstacksdk/+bug/1631480 | 18:46 |
openstack | Launchpad bug 1631480 in OpenStack SDK "session endpoint lookup doesn't handle endpoints with paths" [Undecided,New] | 18:46 |
mriedem | rtheis: btw o/ | 18:47 |
rtheis | mriedem: yw o/ | 18:47 |
briancurtin | mriedem: does https://review.openstack.org/#/c/369499/ fix it for you? | 18:47 |
mriedem | oooo i'll try | 18:48 |
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openstackgerrit | Milan Kováčik proposed openstack/api-wg: Specify time intervals based filtering queries https://review.openstack.org/383862 | 18:51 |
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openstackgerrit | Ankur proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: [SUPER WIP] l3-agent-list-hosting-router https://review.openstack.org/383886 | 19:17 |
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mriedem | briancurtin: it didn't | 19:29 |
briancurtin | mriedem: ok, well i’ll see if i can adjust it to your case | 19:30 |
mriedem | let me know if you need any debug info, it should be in the bug report though | 19:30 |
timrc | stevemar: No problem. It's completely silly to say "Hey let's have an upstream convo... in an IBM slack channel" | 19:32 |
timrc | And twitter is not at all ideal IMO. | 19:32 |
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stevemar | timrc: thanks for the understanding :) | 19:33 |
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ankur-gupta-f2 | rtheis_: ping question about how to go about implementing l3-agent-* router commands in OSC | 19:57 |
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ankur-gupta-f2 | there are 4 commands that hit either v2.0/routers/<id>/l3-agents or v2.0/agent/<id> etc... | 19:58 |
ankur-gupta-f2 | would I have to touch the sdk as well? | 19:59 |
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rtheis_ | ankur-gupta-f2: you would need to update the sdk first | 20:00 |
rtheis_ | Then these could be options on a list command | 20:00 |
rtheis_ | openstack agent list --router | 20:01 |
rtheis_ | openstack agent list --network | 20:01 |
rtheis_ | openstack router list --agent | 20:01 |
rtheis_ | openstack network list --agent | 20:01 |
rtheis_ | That's my initial thoughts but we could run this by dtroyer too | 20:02 |
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ankur-gupta-f2 | rtheis_: Okay will take a crack. but should the optional arg be more specific | 20:03 |
ankur-gupta-f2 | in this case --agent-l3 | 20:03 |
ankur-gupta-f2 | since there is also dhcp agent commands that need to be implemented | 20:03 |
rtheis | I don't think so | 20:03 |
rtheis | The end user just wants to know which agents impact the specified router | 20:04 |
rtheis | or network | 20:04 |
rtheis | implementation detail that the agent is L3, DCHP, etc | 20:04 |
ankur-gupta-f2 | rtheis: Will take a stab at it and add you and dtroyer_zz to the patchset for any further discussion | 20:06 |
rtheis | ok | 20:06 |
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ankur-gupta-f2 | rtheis: Thanks for the input. Good thing I asked first :) | 20:07 |
rtheis | yw | 20:07 |
rtheis | ankur-gupta-f2: "agent" should be "network agent" in my examples above | 20:07 |
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openstackgerrit | Dean Troyer proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: More 3.3.0 release notes https://review.openstack.org/383935 | 20:51 |
dtroyer | stevemar: ^^^ if you can interrupt your celebrating. We'll bump the 3.3.0 release to that | 20:52 |
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stevemar | dtroyer: thats another reason to celebrate :) | 21:32 |
stevemar | dtroyer: apparently we added --description to a lot of things | 21:35 |
dtroyer | I had not realized how many | 21:39 |
openstackgerrit | Steve Martinelli proposed openstack/python-openstackclient: More 3.3.0 release notes https://review.openstack.org/383935 | 21:39 |
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