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| hongbin | #startmeeting zun | 03:00 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 03:00:05 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 03:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 03:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'zun' | 03:00 |
| hongbin | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2017-06-20_0300_UTC Today's agenda | 03:00 |
| hongbin | #topic Roll Call | 03:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:00 | |
| kevinz | kevinz | 03:00 |
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| mkrai | o/ | 03:00 |
| lakerzhou | lakerzhou | 03:00 |
| Namrata | NAmrata | 03:01 |
| hongbin | thanks for joining kevinz mkrai lakerzhou Namrata | 03:01 |
| hongbin | ok, let's get started | 03:02 |
| hongbin | #topic Announcements | 03:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:02 | |
| hongbin | i have an announcement | 03:02 |
| hongbin | i and kevinz will present at openstack day china next month | 03:02 |
| hongbin | both of us has an accepted presentation about zun | 03:03 |
| mkrai | Great :) | 03:03 |
| Namrata | great | 03:03 |
| hongbin | that is all from my side | 03:03 |
| hongbin | any announcement from you? | 03:03 |
| mkrai | No | 03:03 |
| lakerzhou | will you please share the slides? | 03:03 |
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| hongbin | lakerzhou: sure, i will share mine after the presentation | 03:04 |
| kevinz | lakerzhou: me too | 03:04 |
| lakerzhou | hongbin and kevin, thanks | 03:04 |
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| hongbin | ok | 03:04 |
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| hongbin | #topic Cinder integration | 03:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Cinder integration (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:04 | |
| hongbin | i am working on a WIP patch to introduce cinder integration | 03:05 |
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| hongbin | i don't think it is ready to be reviewed yet, but the idea is there | 03:06 |
| hongbin | basically, the idea is to connect to the cinder volume and bind-mount it to the container | 03:07 |
| hongbin | the high level idea has been outlined in a spec | 03:07 |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/468658/ | 03:07 |
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| hongbin | a WIP patch will be ready to be reviewed soon | 03:07 |
| hongbin | that is all from me for this topic | 03:07 |
| hongbin | any question? | 03:08 |
| mkrai | Thanks Hongbin. I will be happy to review | 03:08 |
| hongbin | mkrai: thanks madhuri | 03:08 |
| mkrai | I think I have one but that might be a vague question | 03:08 |
| hongbin | mkrai: go ahead | 03:08 |
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| mkrai | After reeading the spec, why do we have to use os-brick? Cinder doesn't provide the same device info? | 03:09 |
| hongbin | os-brick is the library to connect to different cinder backend | 03:09 |
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| hongbin | the connection code will be very different for each backend, and os-brick provides a abstracted layer for that | 03:10 |
| mkrai | I see | 03:10 |
| mkrai | os-brick is just a library? | 03:11 |
| hongbin | yes, it is a library (not a service) | 03:11 |
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| mkrai | Ok thanks for the information | 03:11 |
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| hongbin | and it is maintained by the cinder team | 03:11 |
| hongbin | ok, move on to the next topic | 03:11 |
| hongbin | #topic Introduce container composition (kevinz) | 03:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Introduce container composition (kevinz) (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:12 | |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/437759/ The design spec | 03:12 |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-container-composition The etherpad | 03:12 |
| hongbin | kevinz: ^^ | 03:12 |
| kevinz | I have several questions to discuss | 03:12 |
| kevinz | First is about the Object and db models of Capsule | 03:13 |
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| hongbin | go ahead | 03:13 |
| kevinz | Does caspule need to include the container uuid? Or container object store a capsule uuid | 03:14 |
| mkrai | Capsule should store the container uuid | 03:15 |
| hongbin | kevinz: from my perspective, it is better to make container's data model independent, so agree with mkrai | 03:15 |
| kevinz | OK, now I plan to use this: 'containers': fields.ListOfObjectsField('Container'), | 03:16 |
| hongbin | sounds like a good option to try | 03:16 |
| kevinz | Capsule store the container Object entry | 03:16 |
| kevinz | Or just a List of container uuid | 03:16 |
| mkrai | what is container object entry? | 03:17 |
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| kevinz | capsule.containers will point to the container | 03:18 |
| mkrai | i mean is it a dictionary or something else? | 03:18 |
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| kevinz | mkrai: I think it is a Object List | 03:19 |
| mkrai | If we have decided to keep the container and capsule object independent. It will be good to store the container object itself | 03:20 |
| hongbin | mkrai: i think in db level, the capsule object will have a fields called "containers", which is a list of container objects | 03:21 |
| hongbin | sorry, in object level | 03:21 |
| kevinz | hongbin: that's what I mean. Thanks hongbin | 03:22 |
| hongbin | i guess that is what kevinz mean as well :) | 03:22 |
| hongbin | ListOfObjectsField is actually a list of "container" object per my understanding | 03:22 |
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| kevinz | yes it is | 03:24 |
| hongbin | mkrai: still have doubt? | 03:24 |
| mkrai | No | 03:24 |
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| mkrai | Got it. Thanks | 03:24 |
| mkrai | So I suggest to store container object in capsule db | 03:24 |
| hongbin | oh, in db level | 03:25 |
| mkrai | yes | 03:25 |
| hongbin | mkrai: just want to clarify, what is the goal for this proposal? | 03:26 |
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| mkrai | keep container and capsule db independent | 03:26 |
| hongbin | i see | 03:27 |
| mkrai | The same as you suggested :) | 03:27 |
| hongbin | i think we can take this proposal as a homework, and eveyone give it more thoughts | 03:27 |
| kevinz | OK | 03:28 |
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| hongbin | kevinz: mkrai i did have some thoughts about the capsule feature, i think it is better to make it as an add-on | 03:28 |
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| hongbin | kevinz: mkrai like a api extension | 03:29 |
| mkrai | hongbin: Would you like to tell it now? | 03:29 |
| hongbin | kevinz: mkrai i think this will make the end-users to tell the difference between "container" and "capsule", contianer-api is the core api, capsule is an add-on | 03:30 |
| hongbin | kevinz: mkrai i guess that is how it works in neutron (core api, extension) | 03:31 |
| mkrai | I am in favor of this idea | 03:31 |
| mkrai | Otherwise mixing container and capsule might get complicated in future as well | 03:32 |
| mkrai | So its better to keep them independent | 03:32 |
| kevinz | I'm OK also, so that all tha API will be separated? | 03:33 |
| mkrai | Yes I think so | 03:33 |
| hongbin | kevinz: just an initial idea, there will be a zun-api and zun-capsule-api | 03:33 |
| hongbin | kevinz: like a docker core api, and the swarm api | 03:34 |
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| hongbin | (swarm api is an add-on) | 03:34 |
| mkrai | +1 | 03:35 |
| hongbin | (if swarm mode is disabled, there is just docker core api) | 03:35 |
| kevinz | hongbin: I see. It's a good point. We can decide to separate it, I think much work need to do | 03:35 |
| hongbin | kevinz: :) yes | 03:36 |
| kevinz | hongbin: So that the in the db level, container and capsule will separated? | 03:36 |
| kevinz | and capsule will maintain its own containers? | 03:36 |
| hongbin | kevinz: from my point of view, separation in api level is important, the data model is optional | 03:37 |
| kevinz | hongbin: got it. I think so. That will reduce the API cost as well | 03:38 |
| hongbin | kevinz: ack | 03:38 |
| hongbin | kevinz: btw, let's keep the disucssion open for this idea | 03:39 |
| kevinz | hongbin: ack:-) | 03:39 |
| hongbin | ok, anything else on this topic? | 03:39 |
| kevinz | a small one | 03:40 |
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| hongbin | go ahead | 03:40 |
| kevinz | I plan to place the yaml abstract functions in API server side. | 03:40 |
| kevinz | Just mkrai referred in last meeting | 03:40 |
| hongbin | ok | 03:40 |
| kevinz | That's all from my side | 03:40 |
| mkrai | Thanks kevinz for the consideration :) | 03:41 |
| hongbin | thanks kevinz | 03:41 |
| hongbin | Namrata: ready to talk about your htea integration work? | 03:41 |
| kevinz | mkrai:hongbin: Thanks for your help | 03:41 |
| Namrata | yeah sure hongbin | 03:42 |
| hongbin | Namrata: go ahead | 03:42 |
| hongbin | #topic Add Zun Resources to Heat | 03:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Add Zun Resources to Heat (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:42 | |
| Namrata | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/437810/ | 03:42 |
| Namrata | Add Container to Zun resources | 03:42 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: will talk about nfv as the next topic if you are still there :) | 03:42 |
| Namrata | Hongbin update the patch | 03:42 |
| Namrata | *updated | 03:43 |
| Namrata | Thanks for that | 03:43 |
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| lakerzhou | I am still online | 03:43 |
| Namrata | I think only comments need to be incorporated | 03:43 |
| Namrata | So hope to get this merged this week | 03:43 |
| diga | sorry I got very late in joining the meeting | 03:43 |
| hongbin | Namrata: thanks Namrata | 03:44 |
| hongbin | diga: hey, thanks for joinning | 03:44 |
| hongbin | ok, next topic | 03:44 |
| diga | hongbin: Hi | 03:44 |
| hongbin | #topic NFV use cases | 03:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "NFV use cases (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:44 | |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-nfv-use-cases | 03:44 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: want to drive this topic? | 03:44 |
| lakerzhou | I am try to tackle SR-IOV use case for container first because it is relatively simpler than DPDK. However it is still too complicated. I am breaking it down to three BPs. | 03:45 |
| lakerzhou | 1. build PCI resource data model. I am almost done with the design spec. Should have it ready for review tomorrow. | 03:45 |
| lakerzhou | 2. Support PciPassthroughFilter in zun scheduler | 03:46 |
| lakerzhou | 3. Support SR-IOV usage. It has dependency on Kuryr. | 03:47 |
| hongbin | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-pcipassthroughfilter | 03:47 |
| diga | lakerzhou: Hi, what dependency we have on kuryr for SR-IOV | 03:47 |
| lakerzhou | Once I have #1 reviewed. I will finalize #3. | 03:47 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: ack | 03:48 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: i couldn't find hte bp for #3, do you have the link? | 03:48 |
| diga | lakerzhou: I can help you if you need help on NFV side as I am working closely with OpenStack NFV orchestration team | 03:48 |
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| lakerzhou | two major changes in Kuryr. 1. matching a SR-IOV port to endpoint; 2. Binding endpoint to container | 03:49 |
| diga | okay | 03:49 |
| lakerzhou | Hongbin, I don't have a BP for #3 yet | 03:50 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: ack, mind i assigning you an action item to create a bp for #3? | 03:50 |
| lakerzhou | Hongbin: sure, please. | 03:51 |
| hongbin | #action lakerzhou create a bp for supporting SR-IOV usage | 03:51 |
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| hongbin | lakerzhou: i will review the action item in the next team meeting | 03:51 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: just fyi | 03:52 |
| lakerzhou | Also, with #1 and #2 completed, we should in better position to support GPU in ZUN. | 03:52 |
| hongbin | sound good | 03:52 |
| lakerzhou | I am working with a large cloud operator with some requirements for GPU work load. | 03:53 |
| hongbin | i see, it looks containerized gpu is a trend | 03:53 |
| lakerzhou | I will share the thoughts later. But some example in spec already use GPU as a example. | 03:54 |
| diga | Yeah, so many consumers are asking about containerized GPUs | 03:54 |
| hongbin | i see | 03:54 |
| diga | mostly telcos | 03:54 |
| lakerzhou | that is all from me. Will send the spec of #1 for review tomorrow. | 03:55 |
| hongbin | lakerzhou: thanks lakerzhou | 03:55 |
| diga | Good work lakerzhou | 03:55 |
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| hongbin | #topic Open Discussion | 03:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:56 | |
| hongbin | anyone has a topic to bring up? | 03:56 |
| diga | hongbin: about cinder integration, yesterday I made the setup ready, will test the patch & push it today | 03:56 |
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| hongbin | diga: ack | 03:57 |
| diga | hongbin: will talk to you later as I have some questions on it | 03:57 |
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| hongbin | diga: ok | 03:57 |
| hongbin | anything else to discuss? | 03:58 |
| hongbin | seems no | 03:58 |
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| hongbin | all, thanks for joining the meeting | 03:58 |
| hongbin | #endmeeting | 03:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 03:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 03:58:51 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 03:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2017/zun.2017-06-20-03.00.html | 03:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2017/zun.2017-06-20-03.00.txt | 03:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2017/zun.2017-06-20-03.00.log.html | 03:58 |
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| rkmrHonjo | hi | 04:01 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | hi all | 04:01 |
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| sagara | Hi | 04:01 |
| tpatil | Hi | 04:01 |
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| sagara | I heard Sampath won't come today's meeting | 04:02 |
| tpatil | Ok | 04:02 |
| rkmrHonjo | oh | 04:02 |
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| rkmrHonjo | OK, I start this meeting. | 04:04 |
| rkmrHonjo | #startmeeting masakari | 04:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 04:04:16 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is rkmrHonjo. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 04:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 04:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'masakari' | 04:04 |
| sagara | thanks | 04:04 |
| rkmrHonjo | #topic Bugs (stuck/critical) | 04:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (stuck/critical) (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:05 | |
| rkmrHonjo | Do you have any items to discuss? | 04:05 |
| tpatil | I have reviewed two high priority bugs patches | 04:06 |
| tpatil | Can someone please review these patches? | 04:06 |
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| rkmrHonjo | tpatil: Can you paste these URLs on here? | 04:06 |
| tpatil | Dinesh: please give the reference of these patches | 04:06 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | #link: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/474184/ | 04:07 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | #link: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/468771/ | 04:07 |
| tpatil | Dinesh_Bhor: thanks | 04:07 |
| rkmrHonjo | tpatil, Dinesh_Bhor: thanks, I'll review these patches. | 04:08 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | rkmrHonjo: thanks | 04:09 |
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| rkmrHonjo | #action: rkmrHonjo reviews https://review.openstack.org/#/c/474184/ , https://review.openstack.org/#/c/468771/ | 04:09 |
| rkmrHonjo | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/440999/ got two +2 at once, but it failed to pass workflow. So Takahara push new patch. Please review patch set 4. | 04:11 |
| tpatil | Sure | 04:12 |
| rkmrHonjo | tpatil: thank you. I already put +2 for patch set 4. | 04:12 |
| tpatil | Ok | 04:13 |
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| rkmrHonjo | Optimize the link address https://review.openstack.org/#/c/472008/ is very simple patch. I think that we can review and merge this quickly. | 04:15 |
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| rkmrHonjo | I put +2 for that patch. I can merge this if someone put one more +2. | 04:16 |
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| tpatil | I will review the above patch today | 04:18 |
| rkmrHonjo | tpatil: thanks! It won't take long. | 04:19 |
| tpatil | Right , it's indeed very simple patch | 04:20 |
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| rkmrHonjo | Do you have any other items? Let's go to next topic if you don't have it. | 04:23 |
| tpatil | Next topic please | 04:23 |
| rkmrHonjo | ok. | 04:23 |
| rkmrHonjo | #topic Discussion points | 04:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discussion points (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:24 | |
| rkmrHonjo | Do you have any items to discuss? | 04:24 |
| tpatil | Abhishek : please discuss about mistral workflow execution | 04:24 |
| abhishekk | ok | 04:25 |
| rkmrHonjo | please | 04:25 |
| abhishekk | rkmrHonjo: the measure issue in adding mistral driver is business rules we have in masakari | 04:26 |
| tpatil | Mistral allows to execute workflow synchronously | 04:26 |
| tpatil | Now we are checking if it's possible to add logic to suffice business rules in masakari engine and execute the evacuate workflow in mistral | 04:27 |
| tpatil | Once that is analyzed, we will update specs | 04:28 |
| rkmrHonjo | tpatil: How long does the researching take? (This question is just a my interest.) | 04:30 |
| abhishekk | rkmrHonjo: we might need to add certain actions in mistral | 04:30 |
| tpatil | Plan to finish it in this week | 04:30 |
| rkmrHonjo | abhishekk: oh, sorry, I didn't know it. What's kind of action will you add? | 04:32 |
| rkmrHonjo | tpatil: thank you for telling me. | 04:33 |
| abhishekk | rkmrHonjo: that we are checking now but for example filtering the list to get HA Enabled instances (this action is not there in mistral or else need to analyze existing actions) | 04:33 |
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| tpatil_ | We will check the existing evacuate workflow in mistral and see what new things we might need to add there | 04:35 |
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| rkmrHonjo | abhishekk, tpatil: I see. thanks. | 04:35 |
| rkmrHonjo | Are the any other items? | 04:37 |
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| rkmrHonjo | s/the/there/g | 04:38 |
| rkmrHonjo | sorry | 04:38 |
| rkmrHonjo | Can I go to next topic? | 04:39 |
| abhishekk | yes | 04:39 |
| rkmrHonjo | ok. Do you want to talk about rpm? I'll skip it if you don't want. | 04:39 |
| rkmrHonjo | "rpm" means "rpm packaging". https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Masakari | 04:41 |
| tpatil_ | Sampath has all the updates about rpm, rpm packing stuff is all done but some issue with the versioning and tags which he will resolve | 04:41 |
| rkmrHonjo | tpatil_: Ah...that's right. | 04:43 |
| rkmrHonjo | ok, let's go to AOB topic. | 04:43 |
| rkmrHonjo | #topic AOB | 04:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:44 | |
| rkmrHonjo | I pushed a new spec. | 04:44 |
| rkmrHonjo | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/473057/ Add event notification feature to masakari | 04:44 |
| rkmrHonjo | I'm appreciate it if you review this spec. | 04:45 |
| rkmrHonjo | (I'm not hurry.) | 04:46 |
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| tpatil_ | I have started reviewing this spec. will update my comments in this week | 04:48 |
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| rkmrHonjo | tpatil_: thanks a lot!!! | 04:49 |
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| rkmrHonjo | ok, do you have any other items? | 04:49 |
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| tpatil_ | No | 04:51 |
| sagara | no | 04:51 |
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| rkmrHonjo | ok... Time is not over. But we can close this meeting. Can I close now? | 04:52 |
| abhishekk | rkmrHonjo: yes | 04:52 |
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| abhishekk | thank you all, good day | 04:53 |
| rkmrHonjo | thank you all. | 04:53 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | thanks all | 04:53 |
| sagara | thank you | 04:54 |
| rkmrHonjo | bye | 04:54 |
| rkmrHonjo | #endmeeting | 04:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 04:54 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 04:54:20 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 04:54 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2017/masakari.2017-06-20-04.04.html | 04:54 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2017/masakari.2017-06-20-04.04.txt | 04:54 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2017/masakari.2017-06-20-04.04.log.html | 04:54 |
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| yuval | #startmeeting karbor | 09:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 09:01:56 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is yuval. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 09:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 09:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'karbor' | 09:02 |
| yuval | Hello and welcome to Karbor's weekly meeting | 09:02 |
| yuval | waiting a couple of minutes for people | 09:03 |
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| chenying | hi | 09:03 |
| yuval | hey chenying | 09:03 |
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| edisonxiang | Hi team | 09:04 |
| zhonghua | hi | 09:04 |
| yuval | hey edisonxiang, zhonghua | 09:04 |
| zhonghua | :) | 09:04 |
| yuval | #info chenying edisonxiang zhonghua in meeting | 09:04 |
| edisonxiang | good morning | 09:04 |
| yuval | anyone else coming? | 09:05 |
| yuval | lets begin | 09:06 |
| yuval | #topic Karbor releases | 09:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Karbor releases (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:06 | |
| yuval | Just releases 0.3.0 for karbor and karbor-dashboard | 09:06 |
| yuval | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/466628/ | 09:06 |
| yuval | *released | 09:06 |
| yuval | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/466629/ | 09:07 |
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| yuval | we are getting close to Pike release | 09:07 |
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| yuval | in July 24th we have a feature freeze and final release deadline for python-karborclient | 09:08 |
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| yuval | therefor, anything that should be added to python-karborclient (and changes to the dashboard which require an update to python-karborclient) must be released until then | 09:08 |
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| chenying | I know. I need submit the patches about OSC plugin before that time. | 09:09 |
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| yuval | chenying: great job on osc, the patch passed | 09:09 |
| yuval | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/473675/ | 09:09 |
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| chenying | yuval: There are some patches about every resource API, need be submitted. | 09:10 |
| yuval | chenying: I know, I'll review them quickly once they are up | 09:10 |
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| chenying | yuval: OK Thanks. | 09:10 |
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| chenying | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/428556/ | 09:11 |
| yuval | edisonxiang: are you back on karbor? | 09:11 |
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| chenying | About this patch, network protectable plugin, If the fullstack is OK, I hope it can be merged. chenhuayi is working on the protection pluin about network now. | 09:12 |
| yuval | chenying: the fullstack fails | 09:12 |
| edisonxiang | yuval: not yet, but if I can do something for karbor, please feel free to ping me | 09:12 |
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| chenying | yuval: The reason is not in karbor. The cinder-backup service fails because of the rbmit_mq error. I have mention it for several times. | 09:13 |
| yuval | chenying: ok, I'll review today | 09:14 |
| chenying | Some guy in cinder may need solve this problom. | 09:14 |
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| yuval | #topic Open Discussion | 09:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:15 | |
| chenying | Last Irc meeting, I suggest that how about holding karbor irc meeting every two weeks? What's your oppions about it? | 09:16 |
| chenying | all | 09:16 |
| zengchen | +1 | 09:16 |
| yuval | Yes, we'll hold the meeting once every two weeks, in the time of this meeting | 09:17 |
| zhonghua | LGTM | 09:17 |
| chenying | yuval: Good idea. | 09:17 |
| chenying | Tc now don't ask for periodic irc meeting any more. | 09:18 |
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| yuval | I'll submit the patch to irc-meetings | 09:18 |
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| yuval | https://review.openstack.org/475709 | 09:20 |
| yuval | anything else? | 09:20 |
| chenying | Good job. | 09:22 |
| yuval | Right. The next PTG is in Denver, September 11-15 | 09:22 |
| yuval | I'm suggesting to do a VTG - virtual team gathering | 09:22 |
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| chenying | Sound good. | 09:23 |
| yuval | zhonghua: edisonxiang: ? | 09:23 |
| edisonxiang | yuval: are you going to Denver? | 09:24 |
| chenying | yuval You means that you will not go to ptg? | 09:24 |
| zhonghua | yuval: what is "VTG"? vedio meeting? | 09:25 |
| yuval | edisonxiang: chenying: zhonghua: not sure yet. VTG - video | 09:25 |
| edisonxiang | It's a good idea | 09:25 |
| yuval | great | 09:26 |
| yuval | anything else you would like to discuss? | 09:26 |
| zhonghua | good | 09:26 |
| yuval | thanks for attending! | 09:28 |
| yuval | #endmeeting | 09:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 09:29 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 09:28:59 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 09:29 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2017/karbor.2017-06-20-09.01.html | 09:29 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2017/karbor.2017-06-20-09.01.txt | 09:29 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2017/karbor.2017-06-20-09.01.log.html | 09:29 |
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| anabells | hi | 13:42 |
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| jlibosva | #startmeeting networking | 14:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 14:00:24 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is jlibosva. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking' | 14:00 |
| jlibosva | hi everyone | 14:00 |
| mlavalle | o/ | 14:00 |
| haleyb | hi | 14:00 |
| hichihara | hi | 14:00 |
| hoangcx_ | o/ | 14:00 |
| amotoki | hi | 14:00 |
| bcafarel | hello | 14:00 |
| jlibosva | #topic Announcements | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:00 | |
| jlibosva | I don't have any announcements to make :) | 14:01 |
| jlibosva | does anybody have anything to announce? | 14:01 |
| mlavalle | Just remind people that Pike-3 is around the corner | 14:01 |
| jlibosva | it's 27 July, right? | 14:01 |
| mlavalle | #link https://releases.openstack.org/pike/schedule.html | 14:01 |
| mlavalle | yeap, Jul 24 - 28 | 14:02 |
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| amotoki | note that library freeze is one week earlier | 14:02 |
| mlavalle | good point | 14:03 |
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| jlibosva | ok, thanks guys for bringing this up | 14:03 |
| amotoki | one more thing, (partially related) neutron-fwaas/vpnaas-dashboard repo have been created today. | 14:03 |
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| amotoki | i am preparing various things around this. fwaas-dashboard will be part of neutron. | 14:03 |
| annp | hi, sorry for late | 14:03 |
| amotoki | that's all | 14:04 |
| hichihara | amotoki: Core member is you only? | 14:04 |
| hoangcx_ | amotoki: +1 | 14:04 |
| amotoki | hichihara: the initial core will be neutron-fwaas-core + horizon-core. it will change gradually | 14:04 |
| hoangcx_ | amotoki: will you announce a link to the thread you raised? | 14:04 |
| hichihara | amotoki: I got it | 14:05 |
| amotoki | hoangcx_: no announce thread. i will announce it once the setup is done | 14:05 |
| hoangcx_ | amotoki: Yep. | 14:05 |
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| amotoki | let's move on | 14:06 |
| jlibosva | we can move one | 14:06 |
| jlibosva | oh, one thing | 14:06 |
| jlibosva | there won't be a neutron ci meeting today | 14:06 |
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| jlibosva | it was announced on ML | 14:06 |
| jlibosva | #topic Blueprints | 14:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Blueprints (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:06 | |
| jlibosva | as mentioned before | 14:07 |
| jlibosva | we're in pike-3 now | 14:07 |
| jlibosva | https://launchpad.net/neutron/+milestone/pike-3 | 14:07 |
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| jlibosva | it seems some blueprints haven't been flipped yet | 14:07 |
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| amotoki | perhaps we need to re-target uncompleted blueprint from pike-2 to pike-3 | 14:08 |
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| amotoki | https://launchpad.net/neutron/+milestone/pike-2 | 14:08 |
| jlibosva | yep | 14:08 |
| jlibosva | there are a few | 14:08 |
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| jlibosva | is anybody blocked on his work and need to raise a flag here? | 14:08 |
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| tmorin | o/ | 14:09 |
| mlavalle | jlibosva: a couple of the ones that show up in the pike-3 panel are docs | 14:09 |
| jlibosva | I think we need to go through bugs and blueprints and flip them to p3 | 14:10 |
| jlibosva | so nobody is blocked? | 14:11 |
| mlavalle | nobody present in this meeting, it seems | 14:11 |
| jlibosva | ok, let's move on then :) | 14:12 |
| jlibosva | #topic Bugs and gate failures | 14:12 |
| mlavalle | tmorin: did you mean your are blocked with a blueprint? | 14:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs and gate failures (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:12 | |
| tmorin | mlavalle: no, I was just arriving late and saying "hi" | 14:12 |
| jlibosva | :) | 14:12 |
| jlibosva | who was bug deputy for last week? | 14:12 |
| hichihara | maybe kevin | 14:13 |
| mlavalle | Kevinbenton took the role last week | 14:13 |
| jlibosva | I guess kevinbenton is sleeping at this hour | 14:13 |
| hichihara | I think so | 14:13 |
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| jlibosva | is anybody else aware of anything critical in the gate? | 14:14 |
| amotoki | one thing related to gate failure. last week we broke heat dsvm py35 job (though it was already solved) | 14:15 |
| mlavalle | well we have a couple of critical bugs with no owners | 14:15 |
| jlibosva | https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1697533 ? | 14:15 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1697533 in neutron "test_install_flood_to_tun failed with: 'tun_id=0x378' not in u' unchanged'" [Critical,Confirmed] | 14:15 |
| amotoki | I wonder we need to enable some py35 dsvm job from the experience | 14:15 |
| amotoki | mlavalle: jlibosva: cover critical bugs first | 14:16 |
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| jlibosva | amotoki: we're working on functional job with python35 flavor, we had quite a progress there | 14:16 |
| hichihara | I thought Ihar works it for py35 | 14:16 |
| jlibosva | so the bug I posted looks familiar | 14:16 |
| jlibosva | we used to have a workaround for it, I remember that required some new openvswitch package | 14:16 |
| amotoki | my point is that some other projects already enable py35 tempest job and we potentially breaks their gate. | 14:17 |
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| amotoki | so I wonder we need to enable minimum set which cover py35 dsvm in addition to the func job. thought? | 14:18 |
| jlibosva | ok, let's talk about py35 first :) | 14:18 |
| jlibosva | amotoki: we track the py35 goal in Neutron CI meetings | 14:18 |
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| jlibosva | amotoki: currently we aim to make functional jobs voting so we have some coverage of python3 functionality. Then we want to add tempest | 14:19 |
| jlibosva | amotoki: do you have a link to that failure handy? | 14:19 |
| jlibosva | I wonder whether functional job would cover that issue | 14:19 |
| amotoki | bug 1698355 | 14:19 |
| openstack | bug 1698355 in oslo.serialization "py35 dsvm job failing with RemoteDisconnected error" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1698355 - Assigned to Ihar Hrachyshka (ihar-hrachyshka) | 14:19 |
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| amotoki | it turned out an serialization issue and we hit MemoryError in py35. Good finding by Ihar | 14:20 |
| amotoki | It happend inside db plugin module of SG. | 14:21 |
| amotoki | so I am not sure we can cover it by func job | 14:21 |
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| jlibosva | that return value should be list sounds to me like UT should be able to catch that | 14:23 |
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| amotoki | yeah, it might be possible. it is a corner case around db_obj vs ovo with netaddr.IPNetwork handing in oslo.serialization. | 14:24 |
| jlibosva | but yeah, definitely we should move towards having tempest python3 voting | 14:24 |
| jlibosva | though we still have issues in functional tests that fail on real scenarios - like ip_lib commands | 14:25 |
| jlibosva | which would make agents failing | 14:25 |
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| jlibosva | amotoki: so do you agree that functional tests should be first step? | 14:26 |
| amotoki | jlibosva: agree. | 14:26 |
| jlibosva | and also everyone else :) | 14:26 |
| amotoki | otherwise, we will have more issues in tempest jobs | 14:26 |
| jlibosva | yep | 14:26 |
| jlibosva | ok, let's move on | 14:26 |
| jlibosva | I'll assing https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1697533 to myself as I made that workaround there | 14:26 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1697533 in neutron "test_install_flood_to_tun failed with: 'tun_id=0x378' not in u' unchanged'" [Critical,Confirmed] | 14:26 |
| jlibosva | it could be that ovs was updated or something | 14:26 |
| jlibosva | but I don't see functional job busted, so it probably doesn't happen always | 14:27 |
| jlibosva | another critical bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1696376 | 14:27 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1696376 in neutron "logging resource UT failures on networking-midonet gate jobs" [Critical,In progress] - Assigned to YAMAMOTO Takashi (yamamoto) | 14:27 |
| jlibosva | which has a fix proposed https://review.openstack.org/#/c/471699/ | 14:27 |
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| jlibosva | it seems it requires some eyes from fwaas cores | 14:28 |
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| mlavalle | jlibosva: I will take a look | 14:28 |
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| jlibosva | mlavalle: thanks! | 14:29 |
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| reedip_ | mlavalle : it would be great if you can | 14:29 |
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| jlibosva | I don't see any other critical bugs | 14:29 |
| reedip_ | we are discussing the same on the fwaas meeting | 14:29 |
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| jlibosva | reedip_: is it running right now? | 14:30 |
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| amotoki | fwaas uses the same slot at #-meetng-4 | 14:30 |
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| reedip_ | jlibosva : yes | 14:30 |
| reedip_ | :) | 14:30 |
| jlibosva | :-/ | 14:30 |
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| jlibosva | so unless there is any other critical bug, I'd move to my favourite part of meeting | 14:31 |
| jlibosva | and that's getting a volunteer for bug deputy role, yay! | 14:31 |
| jlibosva | for this week | 14:31 |
| jlibosva | if there is no volunteer then I'll take it | 14:32 |
| jlibosva | ok, sold to me, I'll update wiki after the meeting | 14:32 |
| amotoki | I will be a volunteer for the NEXT week | 14:32 |
| jlibosva | amotoki: ok, thanks. I'll write you to the wiki page too | 14:32 |
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| jlibosva | let's move on then | 14:33 |
| jlibosva | #topic Docs | 14:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Docs (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:33 | |
| jlibosva | mlavalle: hi :) | 14:33 |
| mlavalle | hi | 14:33 |
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| mlavalle | I want to highlight that there is a review spelling out the plan to move all the docs to the project trees | 14:33 |
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| mlavalle | If you don't have much time but still are interested on what is going on, there is a section here that summarizes what is going on: | 14:34 |
| mlavalle | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/472275/8/specs/pike/os-manuals-migration.rst@230 | 14:34 |
| amotoki | the docs-spec is here https://review.openstack.org/#/c/472275/ if you are interrested in what is happening | 14:34 |
| mlavalle | amotoki has already pushed patchsets covering some of thos action items, both for Neutron and the neutron client | 14:35 |
| mlavalle | and I will start moving soon the networking guide to the Neutron tree | 14:35 |
| mlavalle | If anyone is interested in helping with this process, pelase ping amotoki or me, so we can coordinate | 14:36 |
| mlavalle | that's all from me | 14:36 |
| jlibosva | mlavalle: thanks for updates | 14:36 |
| mlavalle | amotoki: do you have anything else you would like to highlight? | 14:37 |
| amotoki | nothing from me | 14:37 |
| mlavalle | I do | 14:37 |
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| mlavalle | I want to highlight the great job amotoki is doing in this area :-) | 14:37 |
| mlavalle | that's all | 14:37 |
| jlibosva | and all other areas :) | 14:37 |
| hichihara | ++ | 14:37 |
| reedip_ | ++ amotoki :) | 14:37 |
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| jlibosva | we can move on then | 14:38 |
| jlibosva | #topic Transition to OSC | 14:38 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Transition to OSC (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:38 | |
| amotoki | on OSC side, the remaining few commands are in slow progress | 14:39 |
| jlibosva | amotoki: hi :) another yours area you are great at | 14:39 |
| amotoki | the remaining things are l3-agent and tags. I am the owner of these patches now. | 14:39 |
| amotoki | good news is that SDK patch on network tag support has been merged and released. | 14:40 |
| amotoki | so we can focus on OSC patches now. | 14:40 |
| hichihara | cool | 14:40 |
| amotoki | that's all from me | 14:40 |
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| jlibosva | amotoki: you mentioned earlier today that libraries have freeze week before p3, is neutronclient considered a library? or it doesn't have a freeze? | 14:41 |
| amotoki | jlibosva: this is non-client library freeze | 14:41 |
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| amotoki | neutronclent has the same feature freeze as neutron | 14:42 |
| jlibosva | amotoki: ok, thanks for clarification | 14:42 |
| jlibosva | and updates :) | 14:42 |
| jlibosva | I think we can move on | 14:42 |
| jlibosva | #topic Neutron-lib and planned neutron refactoring | 14:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Neutron-lib and planned neutron refactoring (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:42 | |
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| jlibosva | boden couldn't make it to the meeting but he updated me beforehand | 14:43 |
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| jlibosva | he wanted to highlight this spec https://review.openstack.org/#/c/473531/ | 14:43 |
| jlibosva | and also this new extension attribute - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/475577 | 14:44 |
| mlavalle | he needs reviewing eyes, I guess | 14:44 |
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| jlibosva | yep :) | 14:45 |
| jlibosva | and raise awareness | 14:45 |
| jlibosva | and that's all from boden via me | 14:45 |
| mlavalle | added to my pile | 14:45 |
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| jlibosva | does anybody have anything related to neutron-lib | 14:46 |
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| jlibosva | I take it as no | 14:46 |
| jlibosva | #topic open discussion | 14:46 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:46 | |
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| jlibosva | has anybody a topic to discuss here? | 14:47 |
| ralonsoh | May I? | 14:47 |
| jlibosva | ralonsoh: sure, go ahead! :) | 14:47 |
| ralonsoh | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/474248/ | 14:47 |
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| ralonsoh | There is an small bug in os-vif bug/1632372 | 14:47 |
| ralonsoh | related to Neutron, Nova and Neutron-lib | 14:48 |
| ralonsoh | Because the possible change in the API, I need your reviews | 14:48 |
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| ralonsoh | All the information is in PS1 comment | 14:49 |
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| tmorin | sorry, doing two things at a time | 14:49 |
| ralonsoh | And that's all, thank you in advance | 14:49 |
| tmorin | there one thing I have about neutron-lib | 14:49 |
| tmorin | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/467277/ has now had a few reviews, and would benefit from reviews from cores | 14:50 |
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| ralonsoh | hichihara: I will appreciate some reviews on this set of bugs | 14:51 |
| jlibosva | ralonsoh: hichihara so what would be the next steps? maybe raising this in a ML? | 14:51 |
| jlibosva | I think that would be the best way to get feedback from both nova and neutron folks | 14:52 |
| ralonsoh | jlibosva: thanks! | 14:52 |
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| hichihara | ralonsoh: You're welcome. I agree witch jlibosva because the issue is cross project | 14:53 |
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| amotoki | regarding os-vif one, I am not sure it is an API change or not. we need to check where this new variable is consumed carefully. let's cross check | 14:53 |
| ralonsoh | hichihara: I'll do this. Thanks | 14:53 |
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| jlibosva | tmorin: thanks for raising the review here | 14:54 |
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| jlibosva | hichihara: maybe you want to have a look at tmorin 's review :) https://review.openstack.org/#/c/467277/ | 14:55 |
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| jlibosva | we have 5 mins left, any other thing to raise here? | 14:55 |
| ebbex | https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1687896 , suppose I'll just file a new one for the errors we're seeing (that we didn't with another patch) now a "fix" has been released for neutron-rpc-server? | 14:55 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1687896 in neutron "neutron-rpc-server fails to start on configuration that works under neutron-server" [Undecided,Fix released] - Assigned to Sean McCully (sean-mccully) | 14:55 |
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| hichihara | tmorin jlibosva: I'll review again. But we'd like to see bgpvpn members +1 before merging. | 14:56 |
| ebbex | Since technically neutron-rpc-server is actually running, but not very useful :) | 14:56 |
| jlibosva | hichihara: thanks | 14:56 |
| tmorin | hichihara: doude provided a +1, and pcarver as well on a later PS | 14:57 |
| amotoki | ebbex: thanks for raising this. neutron-rpc-server needs more users to make it mature. | 14:57 |
| tmorin | hichihara: I'm not sure matrohon will have time to review, and not sure who else is active enough | 14:57 |
| jlibosva | ebbex: maybe it's worth ivestigating why we don't see the failure on the gate | 14:58 |
| jlibosva | and possibly create a fullstack test for it | 14:58 |
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| amotoki | jlibosva: I think we have not enabled it in the gate | 14:58 |
| hichihara | tmorin: I'm OK. | 14:58 |
| ebbex | jlibosva: Yeah, cause I don't think anyone has been running it as two separace uwsgi+rpc before. | 14:58 |
| jlibosva | ebbex: but yeah, if there are other new errors, please file a bug | 14:58 |
| ebbex | jlibosva: thanks :) | 14:59 |
| tmorin | hichihara: I'll see if matrohon can have a look, but please don't wait too long for him | 14:59 |
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| jlibosva | amotoki: I guess little fullstack test would be a good candidate :) but that might be just me :) | 14:59 |
| jlibosva | ok, we're at the top of the hour | 14:59 |
| hichihara | tmorin: OK. Thanks. | 14:59 |
| jlibosva | thanks all for coming and all the discussions :) | 15:00 |
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| mlavalle | o/ | 15:00 |
| jlibosva | #endmeeting | 15:00 |
| tmorin | hichihara: many thanks to you for your reviews | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 15:00:10 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2017/networking.2017-06-20-14.00.html | 15:00 |
| tmorin | o/ | 15:00 |
| amotoki | thanks | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2017/networking.2017-06-20-14.00.txt | 15:00 |
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| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2017/networking.2017-06-20-14.00.log.html | 15:00 |
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| ralonsoh | #startmeeting neutron_qos | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 15:00:42 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ralonsoh. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron_qos)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'neutron_qos' | 15:00 |
| ralonsoh | Hello | 15:00 |
| mlavalle | o/ | 15:00 |
| ralonsoh | hi mlavalle | 15:00 |
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| davidsha | Hi | 15:00 |
| alisanhaji | Hello | 15:00 |
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| ralonsoh | hi davidsha, alisanhaji | 15:01 |
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| ralonsoh | slawek is not going to attend today, but I have his updates | 15:01 |
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| davidsha | kk | 15:01 |
| reedip_ | o/ | 15:01 |
| ralonsoh | hi reedip_ | 15:01 |
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| ralonsoh | let's start | 15:01 |
| ralonsoh | #topic RFEs | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "RFEs (Meeting topic: neutron_qos)" | 15:01 | |
| ralonsoh | QoS, in general, has been a bit slow during last weeks | 15:02 |
| ralonsoh | slaweq is the most active contributor right now | 15:02 |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1692951 | 15:02 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1692951 in neutron "[RFE] DSCP mark on the outer header" [Wishlist,Confirmed] | 15:02 |
| ralonsoh | This is a new possible RFE | 15:02 |
| ralonsoh | it makes sense: currently there is no marking in tunneling headers | 15:03 |
| alisanhaji | Yes, I filled it | 15:03 |
| ralonsoh | alisanhaji: perfect. Do you have plans to implement it? | 15:03 |
| davidsha | We could just extend the existing dscp rule with a new field. | 15:03 |
| ralonsoh | alisanhaji: OVS or LB drivers | 15:03 |
| alisanhaji | Well I can but we can discuss the possible implementation | 15:04 |
| ralonsoh | davidsha: hmmmm also you should be able to copy the inner one | 15:04 |
| alisanhaji | Both I think | 15:04 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: you have more experience in this. Do you think that should need an spec?? | 15:04 |
| mlavalle | ralonsoh: I think it will | 15:05 |
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| mlavalle | but before that, has the rfe been discussed int the drivers meeting? | 15:05 |
| davidsha | alisanhaji: Do you intend to have a separate dscp mark for each? | 15:05 |
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| alisanhaji | the solution is to use the MARK field to track the inner header and mark the outer header | 15:05 |
| davidsha | mlavalle: Not ye I believe | 15:05 |
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| mlavalle | so the steps should be to have the rfe approved in the drivers meeting and then we can discuss the spec | 15:06 |
| alisanhaji | we could just copy the inner DSCP but to have extended possibilities, I think we should separate both | 15:06 |
| ralonsoh | alisanhaji: please, join http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/#Neutron_drivers_Meeting to discuss it | 15:07 |
| mlavalle | if this team has a strong feeling that this should be implemented, I will take a look at the filed bug and mark it as triaged, so it gets discussed by the drivers | 15:07 |
| davidsha | alisanhaji: kk, It probably won't need a seperate QoS rule, just add a new optional field for encap_mark or such. | 15:07 |
| ralonsoh | alisanhaji: IMO, it makes sense | 15:07 |
| mlavalle | ralonsoh: ^^^^ | 15:07 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: I agree | 15:08 |
| mlavalle | ok | 15:08 |
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| ralonsoh | perfect, next one | 15:08 |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1578989 | 15:08 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1578989 in neutron "[RFE] Strict minimum bandwidth support (egress)" [Wishlist,In progress] - Assigned to Rodolfo Alonso (rodolfo-alonso-hernandez) | 15:08 |
| mlavalle | the question the drivers have been asking about QoS RFE's is whether you are interested in the feature and whether you have resources to implement | 15:08 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: this about this spec? | 15:09 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: the strict min? | 15:09 |
| davidsha | ralonsoh: in general. | 15:09 |
| mlavalle | the comment was for the previous one | 15:09 |
| mlavalle | and in general | 15:09 |
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| ralonsoh | in general: we are just two or three people implementing the features | 15:10 |
| mlavalle | if we can answer yes to both questions, drivers will support | 15:10 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: I can help/implement the DSCP mark RFE | 15:10 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: so yes | 15:10 |
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| mlavalle | great | 15:11 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: thanks | 15:11 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: what about the strict min one? | 15:11 |
| davidsha | I can review also. | 15:11 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: because the spec is merged | 15:12 |
| mlavalle | ralonsoh: with that one, I think we can move ahead | 15:12 |
| ralonsoh | but the main contributor and parent of the idea, ajo, is not working in the team anymore | 15:12 |
| mlavalle | I understand slaweq__ wanted to do some pieces, right? | 15:13 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: I mean, I really don't know exactly which was the whole idea, who to implement it | 15:13 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: I think ajo and me had different ideas about it... | 15:13 |
| mlavalle | ahhhh | 15:13 |
| mlavalle | I didn't realize that | 15:14 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: that's the point | 15:14 |
| mlavalle | we could amend the spec | 15:14 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: ok, I'll try to ping ajo. Do you think this is a good idea? | 15:14 |
| mlavalle | you are here and if you have a clear concept of wht should be implemented, we can pursue that | 15:14 |
| mlavalle | I do | 15:15 |
| ralonsoh | mlavalle: perfect | 15:15 |
| ralonsoh | ok, let's move to the next one | 15:15 |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1596611 | 15:15 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1596611 in neutron "[RFE] Create L3 IPs with qos (rate limit)" [Wishlist,Triaged] - Assigned to LIU Yulong (dragon889) | 15:15 |
| ralonsoh | The spec is merged | 15:15 |
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| ralonsoh | but there is no activity on the API and the LB implementation | 15:16 |
| ralonsoh | I tried to ping the author with no luck | 15:16 |
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| ralonsoh | I'll comment again the patches, just to know if he is going to continue the development | 15:17 |
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| mlavalle | yeah, let's do that | 15:17 |
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| ralonsoh | perfect, next one | 15:17 |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1560961: | 15:17 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1560961 in neutron "[RFE] Allow instance-ingress bandwidth limiting" [Wishlist,Fix released] - Assigned to Slawek Kaplonski (slaweq) | 15:17 |
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| ralonsoh | good progress: spec and OVS implementation merged | 15:17 |
| mlavalle | yeap | 15:17 |
| ralonsoh | LB implementation: #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/475584/ | 15:18 |
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| mlavalle | after some API turbulence LOL | 15:18 |
| ralonsoh | waiting for reviews! | 15:18 |
| mlavalle | I'll add that to my pile | 15:18 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: hehehe but everything could be solved!! | 15:18 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: thanks!! | 15:18 |
| ralonsoh | slaweq is doing a very good job | 15:18 |
| mlavalle | yeah, he is great | 15:19 |
| mlavalle | keep him happy | 15:19 |
| ralonsoh | sure!!! | 15:19 |
| ralonsoh | ok, next topic (I think I'm not missing anything) | 15:19 |
| ralonsoh | #topic Bugs | 15:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (Meeting topic: neutron_qos)" | 15:19 | |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1698046 | 15:19 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1698046 in neutron " Add support for ingress bandwidth limit rules in ovs agent" [High,Confirmed] | 15:19 |
| ralonsoh | I'll take this one | 15:19 |
| ralonsoh | Is just the documentation | 15:20 |
| ralonsoh | for ingress rules | 15:20 |
| ralonsoh | next one | 15:20 |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1697937 | 15:20 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1697937 in neutron "TC shouldn't raise an exception when deleting qdisc if device doesn't exist" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Rodolfo Alonso (rodolfo-alonso-hernandez) | 15:20 |
| mlavalle | correct | 15:20 |
| mlavalle | only doc | 15:20 |
| ralonsoh | that was a bug requested by kevin | 15:20 |
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| ralonsoh | the patch: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/474244/ | 15:21 |
| ralonsoh | is waiting for last reviews | 15:21 |
| mlavalle | I'll look at this one today | 15:21 |
| ralonsoh | next one | 15:22 |
| ralonsoh | https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1676877 | 15:22 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1676877 in neutron "Increase "TestQosPlugin.test_update_policy_rule" coverage" [Medium,In progress] - Assigned to Reedip (reedip-banerjee) | 15:22 |
| ralonsoh | reedip_: how is going the patch? | 15:22 |
| ralonsoh | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/456773/ | 15:22 |
| reedip_ | havent had the time to relook at it . Will do it after the meeting. | 15:22 |
| ralonsoh | reedip_: thanks! I'll keep an eye on this one | 15:22 |
| ralonsoh | next one | 15:23 |
| ralonsoh | https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1649517 | 15:23 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1649517 in neutron "qos policy attached to network, qos_policy_id is reflecting on neutron net-show , but not on the port with neutron port-show" [Wishlist,In progress] - Assigned to Reedip (reedip-banerjee) | 15:23 |
| reedip_ | ralonsoh : just saw I already had an edit ready . Just pushed it | 15:23 |
| ralonsoh | this one is yours too | 15:23 |
| ralonsoh | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/419642/ | 15:23 |
| reedip_ | ralonsoh : Just pushed a patch a minute ago | 15:23 |
| reedip_ | :) | 15:23 |
| ralonsoh | now I see that! so I'll review it after the meeting, perfect! | 15:24 |
| ralonsoh | and the last one | 15:24 |
| ralonsoh | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1694396 | 15:24 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1694396 in neutron " qos scenario tests should be skipped if rule type is not supported" [High,In progress] - Assigned to YAMAMOTO Takashi (yamamoto) | 15:24 |
| ralonsoh | yamamoto in not here..... | 15:24 |
| ralonsoh | what a pity | 15:24 |
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| mlavalle | it makes sense, though | 15:25 |
| mlavalle | I mean the bug | 15:25 |
| davidsha | He went offline about 10 mins ago. | 15:25 |
| ralonsoh | I know | 15:25 |
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| ralonsoh | but only one project is using it | 15:26 |
| reedip_ | its 0030 there in Japan :| | 15:26 |
| ralonsoh | I know that backwards compatibility should prevail | 15:26 |
| ralonsoh | but IMO this change (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/461257/) should be merged and the project affected should modify the code | 15:26 |
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| ralonsoh | following the logic of not braking anything, there will be no new features | 15:27 |
| ralonsoh | s/braking/breaking | 15:27 |
| ralonsoh | but, of course, comments are accepted in the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/468982/ | 15:28 |
| ralonsoh | to discuss if it makes sense to revert the patch or to modify the tests in the external project | 15:28 |
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| ralonsoh | mlavalle: if you don't mind, please take a look at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/468982/ | 15:29 |
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| ralonsoh | ok, that's all the backlog I have | 15:29 |
| ralonsoh | #topic Open Discussion | 15:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: neutron_qos)" | 15:29 | |
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| ralonsoh | do have any open? | 15:30 |
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| reedip_ | ralonsoh : I was just thinking , and its just a simple point. do we ever consider MPTCP as a protocol for DCNs in Neutron? | 15:30 |
| reedip_ | I havent explored it in Neutron, and was thinking if it can help DCNs ? | 15:30 |
| ralonsoh | reedip_: uffff no. | 15:30 |
| reedip_ | :) | 15:31 |
| reedip_ | okk, the uffff means you have had this thought a lot | 15:31 |
| ralonsoh | reedip_: do you have any doc to illustrate us? | 15:31 |
| ralonsoh | no no the uffff means: if we put this in Neutron, it will explode | 15:32 |
| ralonsoh | hehehe | 15:32 |
| mlavalle | lol | 15:32 |
| davidsha | Explosions are nice to watch though... | 15:32 |
| ralonsoh | hahahaha | 15:32 |
| reedip_ | ralonsoh : I was looking at XMP protocol ( a white paper ) and it had a mention of MPTCP . More about it here https://www.multipath-tcp.org/ | 15:33 |
| ralonsoh | reedip_: if you have something like an spec, doc or something else, please share it | 15:33 |
| reedip_ | no I dont want the wrath of Neutron Cores on my head ! | 15:33 |
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| ralonsoh | btw, ECN? | 15:34 |
| reedip_ | It is basically multipath TCP which tries to use multiple paths to a destination to reduce the overall load and improve the throughput | 15:34 |
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| reedip_ | ralonsoh : I was working on the ECN only , it just branched from there | 15:34 |
| davidsha | reedip_: Sounds like it could be a candidate for a l3 extension all to itself. | 15:34 |
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| ralonsoh | but this will improve the speed in the host? | 15:34 |
| ralonsoh | I don't think so | 15:34 |
| reedip_ | ralonsoh : it is useful for bulk data transfer like VM Migration | 15:34 |
| ralonsoh | must MPTCP be supported by TOR? | 15:35 |
| reedip_ | or large chunks of data trasnfer | 15:35 |
| reedip_ | it is not useful for low -latency transfers which is there for Hadoop , Map-reduce or cassadra | 15:35 |
| reedip_ | anyways, just my thought. | 15:35 |
| reedip_ | davidsha: let me first get ECN out of the way :) then I will think about MPTCP :P | 15:36 |
| davidsha | reedip_: :P | 15:36 |
| ralonsoh | reedip_: agree!! | 15:36 |
| ralonsoh | hehehehe | 15:36 |
| reedip_ | anyways, I got to go | 15:36 |
| ralonsoh | no problem | 15:36 |
| ralonsoh | any other open?? | 15:36 |
| davidsha | reedip_: cya! | 15:36 |
| reedip_ | thanks , cya later guys :) | 15:36 |
| davidsha | I'm good. | 15:36 |
| mlavalle | o/ | 15:36 |
| ralonsoh | thank you guys!! | 15:36 |
| ralonsoh | bye! | 15:37 |
| ralonsoh | #endmeeting | 15:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:37 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 15:37:05 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:37 |
| davidsha | Thanks! | 15:37 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_qos/2017/neutron_qos.2017-06-20-15.00.html | 15:37 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_qos/2017/neutron_qos.2017-06-20-15.00.txt | 15:37 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_qos/2017/neutron_qos.2017-06-20-15.00.log.html | 15:37 |
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| lbragstad | ping ayoung, breton, cmurphy, dstanek, edmondsw, gagehugo, henrynash, hrybacki, knikolla, lamt, lbragstad, lwanderley, notmorgan, rderose, rodrigods, samueldmq, spilla, aselius | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | #startmeeting keystone | 18:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 18:00:13 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is lbragstad. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:00 |
| samueldmq | hey | 18:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:00 |
| henrynash | hi | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:00 | |
| rderose | o/ | 18:00 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 18:00 |
| samueldmq | henrynash: o/ | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | henrynash: rderose o/ | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | samueldmq: o/ | 18:00 |
| samueldmq | and rderose too | 18:00 |
| spilla | o/ | 18:00 |
| samueldmq | :) | 18:00 |
| knikolla | o/ | 18:00 |
| rderose | samueldmq: :) | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | gettin' the band back together ;) | 18:00 |
| rderose | ha | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | alright - i suppose we can go ahead and get started | 18:02 |
| lbragstad | #announcements | 18:02 |
| raildo | o/ | 18:02 |
| lbragstad | #topic announcements | 18:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "announcements (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:02 | |
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| lbragstad | #info review focus should be on features and efforts that have large patch sets | 18:03 |
| hrybacki | o/ | 18:03 |
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| lbragstad | e.g. policy-docs, project tags, api keys, documentation, etc... | 18:03 |
| gagehugo | o/ | 18:03 |
| lbragstad | speaking of documentation, sjain and samueldmq shared a bunch of what they've accomplished last week | 18:03 |
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| lamt | o/ | 18:04 |
| lbragstad | and that's actually one of our topics for today | 18:04 |
| lbragstad | #topic documentation follow-up | 18:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "documentation follow-up (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:04 | |
| lbragstad | samueldmq: sjain | 18:04 |
| lbragstad | o/ | 18:04 |
| sjain | so the reorganisation of docs is here, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/475119/ | 18:04 |
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| sjain | thanks for your reviews lbragstad | 18:04 |
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| sjain | I'll take those in accounts | 18:05 |
| lbragstad | sjain: anytime - i think those patches look pretty good, thanks for putting them together | 18:05 |
| sjain | the basic restructuring is done, we need to add some more descriptions in those | 18:05 |
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| sjain | meanwhile for the theme change, somehow the build failed https://review.openstack.org/#/c/466066/8 | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | for those who are unfamiliar with what's going to happen, there is a spec that details the work | 18:06 |
| sjain | I'll look into that | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/472275/ | 18:06 |
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| henrynash | yeah, like the new split | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | henrynash: ++ | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | i do too | 18:06 |
| sjain | :) | 18:06 |
| samueldmq | henrynash: ++ that's pretty awesome, the idea is to separate te docs for the different audiences | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | i think it will give us an opportunity to clean up a lot of things | 18:07 |
| samueldmq | so if you're a dev, all the docs for you will be in a single place, just for you | 18:07 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: that's my feeling too | 18:07 |
| rderose | samueldmq: ++ | 18:07 |
| lbragstad | i'm not sure if this only applies to me, but i've always struggled with some of the content in our in-tree docs and if it should be in the offical openstack-manuals project | 18:07 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: yeah there might be some overlap (very likely) | 18:08 |
| lbragstad | i'm hoping that if we pull more of that into our project, we'll have the ability to consolidate and reduce duplication if we notice any | 18:08 |
| lbragstad | which is the plan according to the openstack-manuals spec | 18:08 |
| samueldmq | yeah, lot of work going on | 18:08 |
| sjain | Yes I have noticed some overlaps, which I will try to account while migrating | 18:08 |
| samueldmq | luckily we have sjain with us :D | 18:09 |
| sjain | happy to help :) | 18:09 |
| lbragstad | yeah - we shouldn't be afraid to isolate the migration from the refactoring | 18:09 |
| samueldmq | sjain: yeah, take notes, and make fixes after migrating | 18:09 |
| samueldmq | so that we keep the migration clean | 18:09 |
| samueldmq | what lbragstad just said | 18:09 |
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| lbragstad | that should make it easier for others to hop in and help too | 18:09 |
| lbragstad | then we can start working patches in parallel | 18:10 |
| sjain | yup sure | 18:10 |
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| lbragstad | sjain: from what I can tell, i think the migration looks good | 18:10 |
| sjain | I migrated some docs and submitted the patches, but the docs team is currently working on those | 18:10 |
| lbragstad | sjain: it also looks like the comments holding up the theme switch were addressed in a follow on patch | 18:10 |
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| sjain | yes in this one, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/475119/ | 18:11 |
| lbragstad | yep - good deal | 18:12 |
| sjain | The comments mostly on toctree and sections are addressed with this reorganisation | 18:12 |
| sjain | and overall it looks better | 18:12 |
| lbragstad | just a word for everyone reviewing those patches, if they are organizing things that fall inline with what we have to do for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/472275/ then we should be sure to use the doc-migration branch | 18:12 |
| lbragstad | that will make it easier for us to track that work | 18:13 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: branch -> patch? | 18:13 |
| samueldmq | oops | 18:13 |
| samueldmq | topic? | 18:13 |
| lbragstad | er - topic, yes | 18:13 |
| lbragstad | thanks samueldmq | 18:13 |
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| samueldmq | also | 18:13 |
| samueldmq | there is a bunch of work in the docs migration (as per the cp spec lbragstad linked) | 18:14 |
| samueldmq | so anyone is welcome to help with that too | 18:14 |
| lbragstad | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/472275/ | 18:14 |
| lbragstad | ^ we'll need to accomplish the project specific items listed in that spec for Pike | 18:14 |
| lbragstad | in order to be on track with the other projects | 18:14 |
| lbragstad | luckily sjain and samueldmq have given us a good start | 18:15 |
| samueldmq | yep, and we're ahead on the migration, we should be able to be done with it soon | 18:15 |
| sjain | I'm anyways here to work on that :P | 18:15 |
| lbragstad | awesome | 18:15 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: when is P-3? | 18:15 |
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| samueldmq | or when we'll have the rc's? | 18:15 |
| lbragstad | sjain: samueldmq is there anything else you need from the rest of the team? | 18:15 |
| lbragstad | samueldmq: let me check | 18:16 |
| samueldmq | there will be more patches coming along the way | 18:16 |
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| samueldmq | they'll need love | 18:16 |
| samueldmq | :) | 18:16 |
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| sjain | :D | 18:16 |
| lbragstad | samueldmq: end of july | 18:16 |
| lbragstad | july 24 - 28 | 18:16 |
| lbragstad | #link https://releases.openstack.org/pike/schedule.html | 18:16 |
| lbragstad | also note that feature proposal freeze is next week | 18:17 |
| lbragstad | #info keystone feature proposal freeze is next week | 18:17 |
| samueldmq | that's close | 18:17 |
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| lbragstad | yes | 18:17 |
| lbragstad | we should be in full on review mode | 18:17 |
| samueldmq | ++ | 18:18 |
| lbragstad | anything else docs-wise? | 18:18 |
| samueldmq | not from me | 18:18 |
| sjain | nothing more for now | 18:18 |
| lbragstad | good deal - moving on | 18:18 |
| lbragstad | #topic Office Hours / Bug Days | 18:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Office Hours / Bug Days (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:18 | |
| lbragstad | knikolla: | 18:18 |
| lbragstad | o/ | 18:18 |
| knikolla | o/ | 18:18 |
| knikolla | We had bug day/office hours last friday. But nothing got merged because of low core attendance (only lbragstad). It would be nice to have at least 2 cores (3 would be ideal) during these activities so we can review and merge bugfixes. | 18:19 |
| knikolla | To encourage more core attendance, we can either change the day to something more appropriate, instead of friday. | 18:19 |
| knikolla | Alternatively, if we can’t find a day appropriate for everyone, I can keep track of everyone’s active hours and request reviews from them when they have shown time online. | 18:19 |
| knikolla | </end copy paste> | 18:19 |
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| lbragstad | yeah - i like the idea of changing days | 18:19 |
| gagehugo | ++ | 18:19 |
| lbragstad | with summer being here - it's hard to have good attendance on Friday's because of vacation and what-not | 18:20 |
| * hrybacki agrees | 18:20 | |
| lbragstad | which I find totally acceptable | 18:20 |
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| lbragstad | (not that anyone needs my permission) | 18:20 |
| lbragstad | so - with that | 18:20 |
| lbragstad | anyone have an alternate proposal for a bug day/office hours? | 18:21 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: do we want to dedicate an entire day? | 18:21 |
| gagehugo | thursday? | 18:21 |
| hrybacki | or would a half-day attract more folks? | 18:21 |
| lbragstad | hrybacki: that's a good question, what do you have in mind? | 18:21 |
| rderose | how about after this meeting? | 18:21 |
| hrybacki | we'd need to poll the group but -- Thursday afternoons for example might be easier to fit into a schedule | 18:22 |
| hrybacki | or following this meeting per rderose | 18:22 |
| lbragstad | rderose: i was think something similar to that | 18:22 |
| knikolla | ++ on poll. we're not having much attendance today to make a decision. | 18:22 |
| hrybacki | knikolla: would you like to make a Doodle poll? | 18:22 |
| lbragstad | rderose: other teams, like nova and openstack-ansible, dedicate 30 minutes to an hour to go through all new bugs and perform bug triage as a group | 18:22 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: I do like the idea of grooming the list and then setting goals to be accomplished by EOD | 18:23 |
| rderose | lbragstad: I see, I like that idea | 18:23 |
| lbragstad | hrybacki: rderose ++ | 18:23 |
| lbragstad | i do, too | 18:23 |
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| lbragstad | i think if we want to actually get something done, there is going to have to be some amount of goal setting | 18:23 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: knikolla do we have a 'contributor' list that accurately depicts those that are interested and able to help out? | 18:23 |
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| knikolla | hrybacki: stackalytics? | 18:24 |
| lbragstad | we originally documented that here | 18:24 |
| lbragstad | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-office-hours | 18:24 |
| hrybacki | knikolla: I'd say our targets are actually a subset of what would be on stackalytics | 18:24 |
| knikolla | hrybacki: true, but that list is from october/november i think | 18:24 |
| lbragstad | some folks are going tohave things pop up on various days that might limit their attendance | 18:25 |
| knikolla | the one on the etherpad lbragstad linked | 18:25 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: of course | 18:25 |
| hrybacki | knikolla: okay so maybe two first steps | 18:25 |
| hrybacki | 1) Review list of people to help 2) Send Doodle poll to that group asking when (in general) would work best for them | 18:25 |
| lbragstad | we could even just send it to the openstack-dev mailing list | 18:26 |
| hrybacki | then we stick to that. Regular time/placed events attract a better following | 18:26 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 18:26 |
| knikolla | ++ | 18:26 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: we could. Personal emails will probably elicit a better response rate though | 18:26 |
| lbragstad | hrybacki: true | 18:26 |
| gagehugo | ++ | 18:27 |
| hrybacki | I think having a smaller, more committed crew (initially) will have a better pay off in the long run | 18:27 |
| lbragstad | once we get consensus, we'll need a note sent to the openstack-dev mailing list advertising the changes | 18:27 |
| hrybacki | ++ | 18:27 |
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| lbragstad | another note about this effort | 18:27 |
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| lbragstad | i think it would be beneficial for all folks planning on attending to come with several bugs in mind | 18:27 |
| lbragstad | how you go about collecting those is totally up to you | 18:28 |
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| rderose | lbragstad: ++ | 18:28 |
| lbragstad | but we can use our 30 minute meeting to consolidate our lists into what we want to work on | 18:28 |
| lbragstad | and use that to set goals | 18:28 |
| hrybacki | ++ | 18:28 |
| lbragstad | i think that'd be better than having one person dictate what we work on for the day | 18:29 |
| lbragstad | if folks have the same bug on their list, they can break out into a group and blitz that specific set of bugs | 18:29 |
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| lbragstad | so - who's taking point on the Doodle? | 18:30 |
| lbragstad | and sending the email? | 18:30 |
| knikolla | lbragstad: i can do that, but i have a flight in a few hours | 18:31 |
| hrybacki | I can construct the Doodle. knikolla lbragstad just give me the date/tiems | 18:31 |
| lbragstad | ok - let's do that now | 18:31 |
| lbragstad | if you have a date/time in mind, throw it out | 18:31 |
| lbragstad | rderose: already proposed Tuesday afternoons | 18:32 |
| hrybacki | how long specifically? | 18:32 |
| lbragstad | I don't think I'd go shorter than 3 hours | 18:32 |
| knikolla | lbragstad: i have no preferences. i am flexible on how i use my work hours. | 18:32 |
| hrybacki | okay, so maybe Tues, Wed, Thurs evenings | 18:32 |
| hrybacki | and Wed, Thurs mornings | 18:32 |
| hrybacki | so we'll always have had this meeting prior | 18:33 |
| lbragstad | so - nothing on monday or friday | 18:33 |
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| hrybacki | I think those are hard days | 18:33 |
| lbragstad | i would agree | 18:33 |
| hrybacki | Monday folks are catching up, Friday folks are winding down | 18:33 |
| hrybacki | both have higher probability of folks just being gone | 18:33 |
| lbragstad | hrybacki: so you're going to build a doodle with time slots for those days? | 18:33 |
| * hrybacki nods | 18:34 | |
| lbragstad | cool | 18:34 |
| knikolla | sounds good | 18:34 |
| hrybacki | I'll put a morning and an evening block for each day (less Tuesday) | 18:34 |
| lbragstad | do we want to have two sessions a week or just one? | 18:34 |
| hrybacki | start simple, grow complexity as it's needed | 18:34 |
| lbragstad | e.g. how many votes do folks get? | 18:34 |
| knikolla | lbragstad: one for now. after feature freeze we can have two maybe, since that will be the focus. | 18:35 |
| hrybacki | ++ | 18:35 |
| lbragstad | knikolla: ++ | 18:35 |
| lbragstad | I'd agree | 18:35 |
| lbragstad | let's get the format down and start proving that it works | 18:35 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: everyone in attendance gets one vote, cores get tie breaker rights? | 18:35 |
| lbragstad | only if needed i'd say | 18:35 |
| * hrybacki agrees | 18:35 | |
| lbragstad | but we do need cores to be there | 18:35 |
| knikolla | with a minumum of two cores | 18:36 |
| lbragstad | i can make any of those times work, | 18:36 |
| lbragstad | is there another core good with those days? | 18:36 |
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| samueldmq | Tuesdays morning? | 18:36 |
| samueldmq | oops, it's said (less Tuesday) | 18:37 |
| lbragstad | samueldmq: yep | 18:37 |
| hrybacki | I'm not opposed to ^^ | 18:37 |
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| samueldmq | well, I will do my best to be present | 18:37 |
| samueldmq | when do we start? | 18:37 |
| hrybacki | soon as we have the poll back | 18:37 |
| knikolla | samueldmq: awesome! much appreciated! | 18:37 |
| samueldmq | I wont complain to have things to review | 18:37 |
| lbragstad | if we agree on a day later this week, i would say immediately | 18:37 |
| samueldmq | and fix bugs, and make keystone better :) | 18:37 |
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| lbragstad | knikolla: hrybacki do you want to share the goal you have set? ;) | 18:38 |
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| samueldmq | 0-bugs in keystone by end of Queens | 18:38 |
| samueldmq | :p | 18:38 |
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| lbragstad | :) | 18:39 |
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| hrybacki | that would be phenomenal | 18:39 |
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| knikolla | hahaha | 18:39 |
| knikolla | including bug 968696? :P | 18:39 |
| openstack | bug 968696 in OpenStack Identity (keystone) ""admin"-ness not properly scoped" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968696 | 18:39 |
| hrybacki | LOL | 18:39 |
| * lbragstad hears a rewrite in the making | 18:39 | |
| samueldmq | ah well, we have that. | 18:39 |
| hrybacki | hush now about 'bug-who-shall-not-be-named' | 18:39 |
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| samueldmq | the thing is, if we work on getting the list of open bugs really small | 18:40 |
| samueldmq | it's just a matter of quickly triaging/attacking new bugs | 18:40 |
| * hrybacki nods | 18:40 | |
| lbragstad | yeah - it's a behavioral thing | 18:40 |
| samueldmq | so we will always keep it small, and easy to keep track of | 18:40 |
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| hrybacki | 'It is easier to stay fit than get fit' | 18:40 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: exactly | 18:40 |
| lbragstad | ideally - i think it would be great to get our bug queue down to 75 or less by the time we release Pike | 18:41 |
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| samueldmq | would be awesome | 18:41 |
| samueldmq | + much better docs | 18:41 |
| knikolla | with triaging and fixes should be doable | 18:41 |
| samueldmq | would be a good deal for this cycle | 18:41 |
| lbragstad | knikolla: ++ | 18:41 |
| hrybacki | that's a good gaol | 18:41 |
| hrybacki | goal* | 18:41 |
| lbragstad | we have a lot of work that is long-running, so filling the spaces with consistent and predictable bug work is a good thing to do | 18:42 |
| lbragstad | #action hrybacki to build and send out doodle to collect feedback for new bug day times | 18:42 |
| hrybacki | acl | 18:43 |
| hrybacki | ack | 18:43 |
| lbragstad | cool - hrybacki knikolla do either of you have anything else for office hours? | 18:43 |
| * hrybacki shakes his head | 18:43 | |
| knikolla | besides looking forward to it? :P | 18:44 |
| lbragstad | good answer | 18:44 |
| lbragstad | #topic open discussion | 18:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:44 | |
| lbragstad | floor is open | 18:44 |
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| hrybacki | I just want to say that after attending the upstream meetings for a couple months now things feel like they are going in positive direction :) Good job, team! | 18:44 |
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| lbragstad | hrybacki: thanks! | 18:45 |
| knikolla | hrybacki: :) | 18:45 |
| lbragstad | alright - well if we don't have anything else to go over, we can get some time back | 18:46 |
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| lbragstad | thanks for coming and look for hrybacki's note! | 18:46 |
| lbragstad | #endmeeting | 18:46 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:46 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 18:46:31 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:46 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2017/keystone.2017-06-20-18.00.html | 18:46 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2017/keystone.2017-06-20-18.00.txt | 18:46 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2017/keystone.2017-06-20-18.00.log.html | 18:46 |
| hrybacki | o/ | 18:46 |
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| fungi | commence infra team muster drill | 19:00 |
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| * zara_the_lemur__ waves | 19:00 | |
| AJaeger | o/ | 19:00 |
| clarkb | hello | 19:01 |
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| fungi | this week we have action items assigned to and topics proposed by clarkb, ianw, eumel8, ianychoi and... er... me! | 19:01 |
| ianw | o/ | 19:02 |
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| fungi | no general topics on the agenda, so i may wrap the meeting early if open discussion is not too heated | 19:02 |
| fungi | there's a tc meeting starting at 20:00 _and_ a board meeting starting at the same time i want to be able to dial into | 19:03 |
| fungi | also i believe we have some people travelling this week who won't be able to attend | 19:03 |
| fungi | #startmeeting infra | 19:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 19:03:48 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 19:03 |
| fungi | #topic Announcements | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:04 | |
| fungi | #info Don't forget to register for the PTG if you're planning to attend! | 19:04 |
| fungi | #link https://www.openstack.org/ptg/ PTG September 11-15 in Denver, CO, USA | 19:04 |
| fungi | as always, feel free to hit me up with announcements you want included in future meetings | 19:04 |
| fungi | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:04 | |
| fungi | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-06-13-19.02.html Minutes from last meeting | 19:04 |
| fungi | clarkb finish writing up an upgrade doc for gerrit 2.11 to 2.13 | 19:04 |
| fungi | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/gerrit-2.13.-upgrade-steps upgrade doc for gerrit 2.11 to 2.13 | 19:04 |
| fungi | still available to work on testing that on review-dev in a couple hours? | 19:04 |
| fungi | i'll be around to help however you need | 19:04 |
| mordred | o/ | 19:05 |
| clarkb | yup | 19:05 |
| fungi | though i may still be dialled into the board meeting and listening at the same time, depending on how long that ends up running | 19:05 |
| clarkb | if others are able to give that a look over in the next few hours that would be nice | 19:05 |
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| fungi | we can also talk through it during open discussion if we want | 19:05 |
| fungi | fungi start an infra ml thread about puppet 4, beaker jobs and the future of infra configuration management | 19:05 |
| fungi | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2017-June/005454.html Puppet 4, beaker jobs and the future of our config management | 19:05 |
| fungi | sorry that took a couple weeks, but everyone interested please follow up there | 19:05 |
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| fungi | #action ianw abandon pholio spec and shut down pholio.openstack.org server | 19:06 |
| fungi | (carrying that over so we don't forget) | 19:06 |
| ianw | not yet, sorry ... gate issues have had my attention | 19:06 |
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| fungi | perfectly fine! | 19:06 |
| fungi | it's not a hurry, just cleanup | 19:06 |
| fungi | #topic Specs approval: PROPOSED PTG Bot (fungi) | 19:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED PTG Bot (fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:06 | |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/473582 "PTG Bot" spec proposal | 19:06 |
| fungi | #info Council voting is open for the "PTG Bot" spec proposal until 19:00 UTC on Thursday, June 22. | 19:06 |
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| fungi | just a reminder, i gave that one the extra week since i only proposed it just before the meeting last week | 19:07 |
| fungi | i also have some initial changes proposed under that review topic i'll un-wip after it gets approved | 19:07 |
| fungi | #topic Specs approval: PROPOSED Provide a translation check site for translators (eumel8, ianychoi, fungi) | 19:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED Provide a translation check site for translators (eumel8, ianychoi, fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:07 | |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/440825 "Provide a translation check site for translators" spec proposal | 19:07 |
| fungi | i added this following conversation with ianychoi during the open discussion period in last week's meeting | 19:07 |
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| fungi | it seems to be ready enough for a vote; it's mainly just a change of direction on an already approved spec which ended up being untenable | 19:08 |
| fungi | any objections for putting it up for council vote until thursday? | 19:08 |
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| AJaeger | no objection by me | 19:09 |
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| fungi | #info Council voting is open for the "Provide a translation check site for translators" spec proposal until 19:00 UTC on Thursday, June 22. | 19:10 |
| fungi | #topic Priority Efforts | 19:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:10 | |
| fungi | clarkb: any interest in talking more about the gerrit upgrade plan during the meeting? | 19:11 |
| clarkb | sure | 19:11 |
| fungi | #topic Priority Efforts: Gerrit 2.13 Upgrade | 19:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts: Gerrit 2.13 Upgrade (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:11 | |
| fungi | worth noting, this is a version skip. always fun | 19:11 |
| clarkb | I've got the rough plan sketched out in that etherpad for upgrading review-dev to 2.13.7.ourlocalbuild | 19:11 |
| clarkb | yes because it is a version skip we cannot do online reindexing after upgrade, we have to do a full offline reindex before starting the service | 19:12 |
| fungi | and per an earlier meeting, we're choosing to roll forward with 2.13.x instead of 2.14.x for now | 19:12 |
| clarkb | so fungi and I will walk through that on review-dev in order to watch the reindex process | 19:12 |
| fungi | timeframe for offline reindexing in 2.10 and online in 2.11 suggests we should budget at least 4 hours of downtmie | 19:12 |
| clarkb | once that is done we will want to test services and scripts against 2.13. Particularly zuul as there may be new event types that we don't handle or otherwise want to handle btetter | 19:13 |
| fungi | (4 hours of downtime for the production review.o.o reindex i mean) | 19:13 |
| clarkb | ya don't expect review-dev to take that long | 19:13 |
| fungi | review-dev will likely be far faster | 19:13 |
| mordred | fungi: I know we discussed not-14 before - but I think I thought that was partially because going to 2.14 was going to be significantly more expensive ... | 19:13 |
| fungi | right | 19:13 |
| clarkb | as reindexing is on a thread per repo basis | 19:13 |
| clarkb | mordred: it would require java 8 which requires xenial (or at least not trusty) | 19:14 |
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| mordred | fungi: if we're going to have to do an offline reindex in this case, is it work reconsidering that? | 19:14 |
| fungi | mordred: yes, some much more significant changes in 2.14 which we didn't want to complicate the current progress with | 19:14 |
| mordred | clarkb: nod | 19:14 |
| mordred | kk. just making sure | 19:14 |
| clarkb | mordred: if we then go from 2.13. to 2.14 we should be able to do online reindex as part of that upgrade | 19:14 |
| fungi | and also because we already missed the boat on the 2.12 upgrade by deciding to refocus on 2.13 | 19:14 |
| clarkb | mordred: I think it is a good idea to separate the distro upgrade from the 2.14 upgrade as a result | 19:14 |
| mordred | clarkb: ah - ok . so this should be the last offline reindex we need to eat | 19:14 |
| mordred | clarkb: ++ | 19:15 |
| clarkb | mordred: hopefully | 19:15 |
| mordred | definitely agree | 19:15 |
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| fungi | so given how long it takes us to prepare for gerrit upgrades compared to their frequency of major releases, if we keep revising our plan to be whatever the latest major release is we may never upgrade | 19:15 |
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| fungi | and since we already have a lot of progress and 2.13 acceptance testing behind us, i'd rather not lose that momentum | 19:16 |
| clarkb | I also think that 2.13 has had a chance to mature (7 point releases) whereas 2.14 not so much yet | 19:16 |
| fungi | also there are a number of useful things we can do with 2.13 (and could have done with 2.12) that make the upgrade worthwhile even if it means we immediately begin planning for the next upgrade | 19:16 |
| mordred | ++ | 19:17 |
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| clarkb | so ya hopefully after today we can start poking at testing with zuul against review-dev and our hook scripts and the election roll geneartion and all that | 19:17 |
| fungi | like, enabling individual teams or the stable team to take care of the eol process, or simplifying the release automation | 19:17 |
| clarkb | then maybe in a week or two we can schedule an upgrade in production | 19:17 |
| clarkb | (trouble is we are getting to the fun aprt of the release cycle) | 19:18 |
| fungi | i don't mind if we get the upgrade details worked out and then have to put it on ice until a lull in release activity, even if that means between the ptg and summit | 19:19 |
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| clarkb | yup especially because momentum on process is here now | 19:19 |
| mordred | yah | 19:19 |
| clarkb | just somethign to be aware of as we get closer to being ready to upgrade production | 19:19 |
| fungi | #link https://releases.openstack.org/pike/schedule.html Pike Release Schedule | 19:20 |
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| fungi | _if_ we can swing it this cycle, it'll probably be in the next ~3 weeks | 19:20 |
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| clarkb | which is theoretically doable if we can get people testing it out on review-dev and making whatever changes we need to address bugs | 19:21 |
| fungi | given what we don't yet know and may uncover while running through this, i'm hesitant to commit to being able to upgrade before we get into the library final release window and things start picking up | 19:22 |
| fungi | so while it would be nice if it works out, i'm not going to get my hopes up | 19:23 |
| fungi | basically we'd need the details ironed out in the next 2 weeks and then a maintenance announcement with a week of advance warning since the outage (for the entire ci system) will be pretty lengthy | 19:24 |
| clarkb | ya | 19:24 |
| clarkb | I think better to not kill ourselves with that effort | 19:24 |
| clarkb | and instead be thorough | 19:24 |
| fungi | anyway, let's see what we figure out this week and i'll make sure we touch on the updates status in next week's meeting too at which point we may have a better idea as to how feasible it is | 19:24 |
| fungi | er, updated status | 19:25 |
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| clarkb | soudns good | 19:26 |
| fungi | having read through the etherpad, i'm wondering whether we need to disable puppet for gerrit? | 19:27 |
| fungi | (and disable puppet globally when we do teh real maintenance) | 19:27 |
| clarkb | fungi: my concern there is that puppet could update the war under us while we are in progress | 19:27 |
| clarkb | so basiclly we want to deactivate puppe ttehre until we get the change merged to reflect the right war | 19:27 |
| fungi | no, that's what i meant, but i missed that you already have it as the first step there | 19:28 |
| clarkb | I don't think I have the step of merge change to reflect war though | 19:28 |
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| fungi | good point, and that probably has to be done after disabling puppet but certainly before stopping any of the other services | 19:28 |
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| clarkb | well before starting pupept again at least | 19:31 |
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| fungi | oh, sure, can be done at either end | 19:31 |
| fungi | after makes the most sense i guess, since it's less to revert if we need to roll back | 19:32 |
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| fungi | our gerrit fork's tags are lagging behind too... | 19:33 |
| fungi | #link https://gerrit.googlesource.com/gerrit/+/v2.13.8 Gerrit 2.13.8 stable point release from April 26, 2017 | 19:34 |
| fungi | might make sense to confirm that still builds for us when we get time | 19:34 |
| clarkb | oh hrm do we want to push the upgrade a day and get ^ built | 19:34 |
| clarkb | I thought I double checked for tags and 2.13.7 was latest | 19:35 |
| fungi | i'm fine doing it that way too. i have even more time tomorrow to help (fewer meetings) | 19:35 |
| clarkb | I'm trying to get a changelog to see what 2.13.8 adds | 19:36 |
| fungi | i think we need to rebase all our tags onto that if we do | 19:36 |
| fungi | er, s/tags/backports/ | 19:36 |
| clarkb | https://www.gerritcodereview.com/releases/2.13.md#2.13.8 | 19:36 |
| clarkb | yes we'll need to rebase and merge the ~4 changes | 19:36 |
| clarkb | 2.13.8 includes jgit and performance fixes | 19:37 |
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| clarkb | my hunch is we probably do want those? | 19:37 |
| fungi | there are a few additional patches in the stable branch on top of that tag too | 19:37 |
| fungi | #link https://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/gerrit/log/?h=upstream/stable-2.13 our fork of Gerrit stable-2.13 | 19:38 |
| fungi | including some which look like bug fixes | 19:38 |
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| fungi | most recent is 2 days old | 19:38 |
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| clarkb | one thing is that if we have to delay for prod upgrade we may end up doing a point release upgrade on review-dev anyways just to get latest? | 19:39 |
| fungi | right, i would be cool doing one last minor update on review-dev before the production maintenance just to vet the latest stable state | 19:40 |
| clarkb | perhaps we should just bake that into our thinking for this upgrade process. Go to 2.13.7 now, start testing stuff like zuul against. Then do upgrade to 2.13.8/9/whatever closer to production upgrade then do 2.13.8/9/whatever in production | 19:40 |
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| fungi | sure, sgtm | 19:40 |
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| clarkb | I actually like that as I think the jump to 2.13 and testing that is the biggest concern right now | 19:41 |
| clarkb | then it will be easy to add on a different point release in the future. | 19:41 |
| fungi | upstream/stable-2.13 branch tip maybe | 19:41 |
| clarkb | ya | 19:41 |
| fungi | since they seem to apply fixes there far more often than they tag | 19:41 |
| clarkb | in that case lets stick with the original plan for review-dev for now | 19:42 |
| clarkb | that gets us moving on the testing front | 19:42 |
| clarkb | then we can incorporate a minor bump down the line when things are more firmed up for production | 19:42 |
| fungi | #agreed proceed with testing gerrit-v2.13.7.4.988b40f.war today, update to upstream/stable-2.13 branch tip and briefly re-test shortly before production upgrade maintenance | 19:42 |
| fungi | #topic Open discussion | 19:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:43 | |
| clarkb | DNS is really hurting us in osic. | 19:43 |
| fungi | we've still got about 15 minutes before the tc and board meetings start if anyone has anything else to bring up | 19:43 |
| clarkb | (message:"failed: Temporary failure in name resolution." OR message:"Temporary failure resolving" OR message:"wget: unable to resolve" OR message:"Could not resolve host") AND NOT message:"Could not resolve host: fake" AND tags:"console" is my logstash query | 19:43 |
| fungi | and yeah, sad dns | 19:43 |
| clarkb | I think that the problem is unbound's list of forwarders don't have priority/order so we are using ipv4 and ipv6 resolvers in osic | 19:44 |
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| clarkb | to hit ipv4 resolvers we have to go through PAT/NAT which I think is likely the cause of our troubles | 19:44 |
| fungi | did you consider my suggestion to have a udev rule rejigger unbound as soon as you get a v6 default route? | 19:44 |
| clarkb | I haven't yet | 19:45 |
| * fungi has no idea how terrible that might be | 19:45 | |
| clarkb | unbound-control does allow you to configure those things on the fly | 19:45 |
| clarkb | so we could have it remove resolvers from the existing list based on ipv6 coming up | 19:45 |
| ianw | oh, there is a period of no dns if you start all v6? | 19:45 |
| fungi | given the async nature of boot in general and v6 autoconfig in particular, i think triggering reconfiguraion off kernel events is about teh fastest solution you're going to get there | 19:46 |
| clarkb | ianw: more backrgound on that is my systemd unit file hack doesn't work because network-online comes up before we have working ipv6 because ipv4 is up | 19:46 |
| clarkb | ianw: so my check of "do we have ipv6" isn't working right | 19:46 |
| ianw | ahh, ok ... that makes sense, i guess :/ | 19:47 |
| clarkb | and we can't stop ipv4ing because github and gems and other things | 19:47 |
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| clarkb | another option is to set it in a nodepool ready script based on whether or not ipv6 is present at that point (it should be because nodepool will prefer ipv6) | 19:47 |
| ianw | ahh ... hence the discussions with mordred i'm guessing | 19:48 |
| clarkb | fungi: I think I have a preference for ^ because it is simple and straightforward | 19:48 |
| clarkb | fungi: though udev is likely workable as well | 19:48 |
| mordred | yah - I think doing it in a nodepool ready script is a great idea | 19:48 |
| fungi | udev addresses your concern of "how do you do this without a ready script and without zuul" | 19:48 |
| mordred | most of the other discussion is more for "how do we do this action in v3" - I think we've got great information at ready-script/pre-playbook time to do this well | 19:49 |
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| * ianw has no strong opinions, but is glad for such tenacity from clarkb investigating it! | 19:51 | |
| clarkb | I'll push up an update to ready script it as that is quick and easy | 19:52 |
| clarkb | well needs new images I guess | 19:52 |
| clarkb | but otherwise is quick and easy :) | 19:52 |
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| fungi | okay, i'm ending the meeting 5 minutes early to give anyone who wants to time to dial into the board of directors conference call and/or grab popcorn before the tc meeting in here on queens goals refinement | 19:54 |
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| mordred | fungi: I'm landing ... which is going to make my participatoin in the TC meeting a bit difficult | 19:54 |
| AJaeger | 5 mins is not enough to get popcorn ;/ | 19:54 |
| fungi | thanks everyone! | 19:55 |
| fungi | #endmeeting | 19:55 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:55 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 19:55:26 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:55 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-06-20-19.03.html | 19:55 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-06-20-19.03.txt | 19:55 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-06-20-19.03.log.html | 19:55 |
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| fungi | reminder, tc meeting on queens goals begins here in 4 minutes | 19:56 |
| mordred | fungi: I have not yet been ableto address the review comments on my goals - but am still interested in pursuing them and hope folks can assume the wording review things can be fixed | 19:56 |
| * mordred will also try to find wifi in the airport between flights- jbut just in case | 19:56 | |
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| fungi | k | 19:57 |
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| * fungi peers around for tc members | 20:00 | |
| thingee | hey everyone | 20:00 |
| ttx | o/ | 20:00 |
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| * ttx just back from his RL meeting | 20:00 | |
| thingee | we have a ttx | 20:00 |
| sdague | o/ | 20:00 |
| thingee | ttx: agenda has links to proposals | 20:00 |
| ttx | we do! Who is around? | 20:01 |
| fungi | just a heads up, there's also a board of directors conference call happening concurrent with this (i'm dialled in listening to that too) | 20:01 |
| sdague | thingee: can you put the link back in here? | 20:01 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 20:01 |
| thingee | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Agenda | 20:01 |
| ttx | #startmeeting tc | 20:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jun 20 20:01:42 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tc' | 20:01 |
| ttx | Let's start the recording | 20:01 |
| ttx | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Agenda | 20:02 |
| * dtroyer is alive | 20:02 | |
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| fungi | mordred indicated moments ago that his current flight is landing, but that he might be able to find wifi in the airport to talk about his goals partway into the meeting if all goes well | 20:02 |
| ttx | That makes 6 of us | 20:02 |
| ttx | #topic Review proposed Pike goals and come up with a proposed selection | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review proposed Pike goals and come up with a proposed selection (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:02 | |
| ttx | Basically Gerrit is a horrible way to select n out of m | 20:03 |
| ttx | We already have one goal selected/approved (split-tempest-plugins) | 20:03 |
| fungi | clearly we should be doing condorcet | 20:03 |
| ttx | fungi: it's not a lot better, apples to oranges | 20:03 |
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| ttx | I'm not sure how to address this, maybe we should give a personal view and see if there is convergence | 20:04 |
| ttx | I can start | 20:04 |
| sdague | yeh, it's more about conversation | 20:04 |
| ttx | The "continuing Py35 support" sounds a bit like we failed to reach the objectives and push it back to the next cycle | 20:05 |
| fungi | as i don't have a dog in most of those fights, i'm relying on this conversation to try and help me make up my mind ;) | 20:05 |
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| thingee | ttx: I thought we did well for unit tests. we're now continuing on with functional | 20:05 |
| thingee | was functional part of the previous goal release? | 20:05 |
| ttx | thingee: except the goal was to get functional test | 20:06 |
| ttx | not unit test | 20:06 |
| thingee | ah k | 20:06 |
| fungi | we're probably failing to capture there the bite-size chunks of progress slotted into each release cycle? | 20:06 |
| ttx | so rather than admit defeat today I would rather reflect at the end of Pike | 20:06 |
| sdague | fungi: yeh, python 3.5 ends up being big | 20:06 |
| dhellmann | well, it sounds like maybe some teams went off in a slightly wrong direction | 20:06 |
| ttx | I think interop and python 3.5 are priorities | 20:06 |
| thingee | ttx: agreed. We'll do that in the feedback like EmilienM has done | 20:06 |
| fungi | so pike goal was really py3k integration testing, queens goal is py3k unit testing? | 20:06 |
| ttx | So I'd like us to do at least the collections link | 20:07 |
| thingee | feedback thread* | 20:07 |
| sdague | dhellmann: interesting... is there data there? | 20:07 |
| dhellmann | fungi : unit testing was a "you may also want to do" thing for pike, but not specified for a future cycle | 20:07 |
| sdague | dhellmann: I guess I didn't realize that was the the case | 20:07 |
| ttx | and if we do touch tempest-plugins anyway, why not do full-discovery | 20:07 |
| dhellmann | sdague : well, apparently some of them are working on unit tests instead of functional tests? | 20:07 |
| dhellmann | though tbh, I haven't had time to review the progress recently, so that could be wrong | 20:07 |
| dtroyer | I agree on interop, I am wondering if new attention of this sort might be helpful in raising awareness across the community on the paste and policy situations? | 20:08 |
| ttx | My personal pick would be to only do 2: split-tempest-plugin and full-discovery | 20:08 |
| dtroyer | there is no doubt the py25 work needs to continue though | 20:08 |
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| dhellmann | do we have a sense yet of how many teams are likely to need to continue working on the py35 stuff? | 20:08 |
| sdague | ttx: the full-discovery actually feels vague to me | 20:08 |
| ttx | + look at the py35 gap at the end of Pike and see what we can do to help (R goal, or ad-hoc targets) | 20:09 |
| sdague | so, the thing I like about the policy in code proposal is that 2 teams have done it already, nova and keystone | 20:09 |
| ttx | sdague: It feels vague to me too... | 20:09 |
| fungi | openstack got a mention on the debian-python ml today in relation to filing bugs to track missing python3 support | 20:09 |
| * EmilienM late but here | 20:09 | |
| sdague | so there is demonstration of what complete looks like | 20:09 |
| dhellmann | I would rather say that py35 is just carried over and folks should keep working on it, if it's not finished this cycle. why wait for r? | 20:09 |
| sdague | and what the transition plan looks like | 20:09 |
| dtroyer | dhellmann: ++ | 20:09 |
| ttx | sdague: it just indicates that the work would happen in the tempest plugin, and since we force teams to look into those already (with split-tempest-plugin goal)... | 20:09 |
| sdague | I feel like the collection links & discovery are actually vague | 20:09 |
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| sdague | they don't demostrate having done it for any project yet | 20:10 |
| sdague | especially when there are concerns around microversioning the root document | 20:10 |
| sdague | which is non addressed | 20:10 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I meant "wait for R if we need to do another goal to complete it | 20:10 |
| sdague | I feel like goals are useful when it's already been done on N > 1 projects | 20:11 |
| EmilienM | sdague: +1 | 20:11 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ok. we need to be careful about that messaging, so that teams don't stop during queens | 20:11 |
| ttx | sdague: let's see if mordred is still around to clarify it | 20:11 |
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| dhellmann | sdague : yeah, we did say that relatively early on | 20:11 |
| dhellmann | we need examples, to prove out the idea | 20:11 |
| EmilienM | sdague: at least it helps to get directions and feedback (how it worked and how we can do better for other projects) | 20:11 |
| dhellmann | given that, do any of the other proposed goals have >1 example? | 20:12 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I would wait until end of Pike, then talk to teams who missed the mark and help them to get their stuff done ASAP | 20:12 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ++ | 20:12 |
| sdague | dhellmann: policy in code | 20:12 |
| fungi | if mordred does manage to pop in, it'll probably be in the second half of the hour i'm guessing | 20:12 |
| dhellmann | sdague : I know nova did that, who else did? | 20:12 |
| sdague | keystone | 20:12 |
| dhellmann | ok, cool | 20:12 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I just fear making it a Queens goal would be seen as a license to procrastinate | 20:12 |
| ttx | especially if voted on now | 20:12 |
| dhellmann | ttx: sure, makes sense | 20:13 |
| sdague | so, honestly, the python 3.5 work probably needs a different mechanism than decentralized team goals | 20:13 |
| dhellmann | similarly, saying 'we will revisit this for r' | 20:13 |
| ttx | Anyone wants to make a case for migrate-off-paste or moving policy in code ? | 20:13 |
| ttx | I felt like the policy goal was a bit heavy | 20:13 |
| sdague | it really needs project management, and harassing | 20:13 |
| fungi | might be reasonable to consider the pike py3k goal basically met (there are some notable services who couldn't get integration testing working yet, but on the whole most did) | 20:13 |
| ttx | sdague: we used to have a team | 20:13 |
| sdague | ttx: well, I'm arguing for policy in code, because 2 teams already did that | 20:13 |
| sdague | in single cycles | 20:14 |
| sdague | migrate-off-paste has the problem of not being proven yet | 20:14 |
| ttx | sdague: so you would suggest: policy-in-code and split-tempest-plugins ? | 20:14 |
| sdague | ttx: yes | 20:14 |
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| ttx | yeah, migrate-off-paste seems a bit early | 20:14 |
| fungi | starting to wonder whether, for these goals which touch almost every project, whether we should consider "mostly done" to be good enough | 20:14 |
| sdague | fungi: it depends on if mostly done is good enough | 20:14 |
| dhellmann | do we want to address the questions about what goes in tempest directly vs. what goes into a plugin as part of that goal? | 20:15 |
| sdague | with python 3.5... I'm not convinced that mostly done is | 20:15 |
| EmilienM | ttx: +1 on the 2 proposals | 20:15 |
| ttx | EmilienM: which ? | 20:15 |
| EmilienM | ttx: policy-in-code and split-tempest-plugins goals | 20:15 |
| dtroyer | mostly done might be good enough to carry the goal into the next cycle to complete it, but not to give the impression to stop working on it | 20:15 |
| fungi | if "most" projects met the goal, then the goal has fallen in scope to no longer being broadly cross-project after that | 20:16 |
| ttx | EmilienM: I fear that's a step up compared to Pike in terms of work needed, but otherwise agree they make good goals | 20:16 |
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| dhellmann | we still have some teams that haven't even responded to the py3 goal :-( | 20:16 |
| EmilienM | ttx: some projects already have met one of them (or both) - so we could at least start iterations for the projects who don't | 20:17 |
| dtroyer | do we know which projects have the heavy work yet to do for policy? or is it "all services not named keystone or nova"? | 20:17 |
| fungi | so taking the py3k example, the remaining projects who are now the only ones not tested running under python3.5 have an additional incentive to finish that work (they don't want to be seen as the only ones left behind) | 20:17 |
| smcginnis | I wonder if for these goals wet should identify a "team" that is willing to do the work for these projects that can't themselves. | 20:17 |
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| ttx | smcginnis, dhellmann: yes, was wondering if we should not take another approach | 20:17 |
| ttx | like form a pop-up release goal team | 20:18 |
| smcginnis | +1 | 20:18 |
| dhellmann | we tried it that way and teams pushed back on taking the patches. | 20:18 |
| ttx | that would actively push to get it done | 20:18 |
| sdague | smcginnis: so, honestly, is it that we need a team, or we need more active project management? | 20:18 |
| smcginnis | I think both. | 20:18 |
| ttx | dhellmann: they would still be "goals" and supposed to be prioritized in reviews | 20:18 |
| sdague | because honestly, bugging folks publicly on the request id thing (which is *much smaller* I realize) was really what got things moving | 20:18 |
| EmilienM | yeah both | 20:18 |
| ttx | sdague: yeah, that's what I'm coming to | 20:19 |
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| EmilienM | we need to work with ptls so they know what the community expects | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | maybe | 20:19 |
| rockyg | sdague, ++ and good job | 20:19 |
| * dhellmann doesn't have the time or energy to do that this cycle | 20:19 | |
| EmilienM | which is I think one of the good aspects of having goals: exposing what we want to do as a community | 20:19 |
| ttx | Just throwing goals at projects is not getting the optimal results | 20:19 |
| sdague | ttx: right, the goals definitely need active project management I think to be successful. | 20:20 |
| ttx | I still think we should bless release goals, so that teams know what's coming their way | 20:20 |
| EmilienM | maybe we could do the other way around and let PTLs vote on the goals? | 20:20 |
| ttx | sdague: I fear they also need people to help write patches | 20:20 |
| sdague | ttx: maybe, and that might be fine | 20:20 |
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| fungi | the ptls who don't bother to vote on goals will likely also be the ones who ignore or resist attempts to implement them as well | 20:20 |
| fungi | but i guess it's worth a try | 20:21 |
| ttx | frankly I'm surprised that even for simple goals ans answers we seem to be struggling | 20:21 |
| EmilienM | I don't thikn we can reach 100% of projects, I agree | 20:21 |
| sdague | ttx: it's about things falling through cracks | 20:21 |
| EmilienM | but we we work with those who contributed already | 20:21 |
| EmilienM | s/we we/if we/ | 20:21 |
| sdague | there is so much inbound being asked of teams, if someone's not helping paint picture of the next thing that is needed, no one knows to prioritize that review | 20:21 |
| EmilienM | maybe we can engage them more in this process (also they know better if the team has bandwith to work on it or not) | 20:22 |
| dhellmann | isn't that what we expect PTLs to do? | 20:22 |
| sdague | we expect ptls to do a lot | 20:22 |
| dhellmann | including delegate | 20:22 |
| EmilienM | dhellmann++ | 20:22 |
| sdague | yeh, well, not everyone is perfect | 20:22 |
| ttx | sdague: It's also easier to say "driving a goal is a meaningful contribution", than to say "every project must find a volunteer to cover that area this cycle" | 20:23 |
| EmilienM | we could think of having a Goal Liaison per project | 20:23 |
| sdague | ttx: that could be | 20:23 |
| EmilienM | and having a sub-team at TC making the connections and helping the liaisons | 20:23 |
| ttx | EmilienM: I fear that won't scale to smalkler teams | 20:23 |
| dhellmann | if people are being asked to do too much, I agree something needs to give. I just don't think it's the stuff that we claim is important to the whole community. | 20:23 |
| fungi | goal liaisons will also likely emerge organically if they're needed. the ptl is the goal liaison by default, and if they need to do so they should delegate that responsibility | 20:23 |
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| fungi | maybe _tracking_ who they are per team is helpful, i don't know | 20:24 |
| ttx | Driving a goal across ~40 projects is a very significant task though, so not sure inverting the model will be a lot more successful | 20:24 |
| sdague | so, I think if someone is tracking and reporting on the weekly (bi-weekly) progress of a goal it becomes more clear where things are getting lost. Without that highlighting it's tough. And it's also tough for new folks to know where they could help. | 20:25 |
| sdague | because without that the only people that know what needs to be done are the people that are probably the busiest ones on the teams | 20:25 |
| ttx | Seriously, we can't get anyone to update the goal status once, I'm not sure asking for biweekly reports would work a lot better | 20:25 |
| sdague | ttx: it is different | 20:26 |
| dhellmann | ttx: thought sdague was proposing that 1 volunteer would track that info | 20:26 |
| thingee | can't remember now, but did we get ack's from the ptls that we're being defaulted to owning the goal? | 20:26 |
| sdague | dhellmann: ++ | 20:26 |
| ttx | ah, ok | 20:26 |
| sdague | that's why it's different | 20:26 |
| ttx | so one champion | 20:26 |
| ttx | (or a set, I don't think it needs to be exclusive | 20:26 |
| fungi | thingee: do you mean before we approve them, or after? | 20:26 |
| ttx | ) | 20:27 |
| dhellmann | unfortunately, with the python 3 work, the main person who was driving the work before has gotten fed up with it and the TC sponsor (me) is embroiled in the dissolution of the docs team | 20:27 |
| thingee | fungi: after | 20:27 |
| sdague | which also gives the global view of what the most important next thing is | 20:27 |
| dhellmann | so, ENOTIME | 20:27 |
| ttx | dhellmann: which is arguably sort of a goal | 20:27 |
| fungi | thingee: yes, every project has to update the goal with their scope details | 20:27 |
| ttx | dhellmann: (the docs dissolution) | 20:27 |
| fungi | after it merges | 20:27 |
| dhellmann | ttx: yeah, I didn't file the paperwork because it seemed like more of an emergency than goal | 20:27 |
| sdague | right, and I think also points out that there can be really important things to be done that aren't goals | 20:28 |
| ttx | So, should we go back to the drawing table and ask on each of those proposal if there is one or more champions to actively project-manage it ? | 20:28 |
| ttx | I'm pretty sure that would clear a few | 20:28 |
| thingee | I agree with sdague that we need someone coordinating with the projects on the goals. | 20:28 |
| fungi | beyond just having a tc sponsor i guess | 20:29 |
| ttx | fwiw the release team has been trying to ask for replies by the deadline, but that's about as far as we went | 20:29 |
| sdague | ttx: yeh, that would be good next step | 20:29 |
| ttx | sdague: should we ask one for the already-approved goal as well, and demote it if there isn't anyone ? | 20:30 |
| sdague | ttx: yeh, that seems fair if we're asking for it | 20:30 |
| dhellmann | that seems fair | 20:30 |
| dtroyer | given the conversation around that goal, yes | 20:30 |
| thingee | if there isn't anyone, there's no sense in beating around the bush on keeping the goal. just log where we left off | 20:30 |
| sdague | thingee: ++ | 20:30 |
| ttx | sdague: would you say the main issue with getting that kind of stuff done is... writing the patch, or getting eyes/priorities on the resulting reviews ? | 20:31 |
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| fungi | yes, the approved goal needs a project management volunteer, i think | 20:31 |
| fungi | (though i suspect that won't be too hard to confirm in that one case) | 20:31 |
| EmilienM | what would be the expectation from the volunteer? | 20:31 |
| sdague | ttx: my experience is that most efforts touching > 1 project are lacking more on the project management side (meaning highlighting reviews and finding reviewers) than on the development side | 20:31 |
| ttx | #info Ask for one (or more!) champions for each goal, who would project-manage it to completion (and help/mentor people to do it) | 20:32 |
| sdague | and that you can speed up an effort by 2 - 3x by active project management | 20:32 |
| ttx | sdague: certainly. | 20:32 |
| EmilienM | I would be happy to help here if we set expectations | 20:32 |
| fungi | EmilienM: probably periodic communication to the community at large about the overall status (and checking in with some teams if needed to determine that status in some cases) | 20:32 |
| ttx | I feel like the champion approach is an incremental improvement, easy to set in place for Q | 20:33 |
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| EmilienM | it's worth trying and we can see how it works - I volunteer to champion 1 or 2 goals for Queens | 20:33 |
| ttx | sdague: would we stop asking each project to submit their status snippet, and use some wiki page / etherpad / ethercalc updated by the champion ? | 20:33 |
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| fungi | might make sense not to get too into the weeds on exact expectations for a goals champion until we see what works there | 20:33 |
| EmilienM | maybe we can take the opportunity to document what we're doing | 20:34 |
| EmilienM | fungi: fair enough | 20:34 |
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| sdague | ttx: yeh I think so | 20:34 |
| dhellmann | so we no longer want any acknowledgement from teams that they even see the goals? | 20:34 |
| ttx | (I like that it feels a bit less like throwing work at teams, since someone has to care enough to drive it) | 20:34 |
| sdague | it would also make the consolidated information be of the same quality between projects | 20:34 |
| dhellmann | it's going to be left up to 1 person to drive all of that? | 20:34 |
| fungi | i would worry that if we insist on bi-weekly status update e-mails to the dev ml, for example, that could be putting the cart before the horse | 20:34 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I think we still want PTLs to discuss the goals | 20:34 |
| dtroyer | I think we still want the ptl ACK, they need to be aware of what is going on around their projects | 20:35 |
| EmilienM | the goal champion would check with PTL goals status, collect and share blockers with the community | 20:35 |
| ttx | but the "goals response" process was less than a success this time around | 20:35 |
| EmilienM | maybe 2 goals are too much also | 20:35 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I felt like the reason people wouldn't submit them was more due to process friction than laziness or ignorance | 20:36 |
| dhellmann | I'm disappointed that the only way we can get people to collaborate on these things is to hound them. | 20:36 |
| thingee | if majority of projects did py3 unit tests versus functional tests, was there somehow miscommunication? | 20:36 |
| EmilienM | for the projects who haven't met the 2 goals, and haven't enough people, 2 is really too much imho | 20:36 |
| dhellmann | ttx: I only heard 1 person say there was any friction in the process. Did you hear that from others? | 20:36 |
| EmilienM | dhellmann: tbh, it's a bit the same in some projects (when being PTL) | 20:36 |
| EmilienM | dhellmann: (personal experience :-)) | 20:36 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I know of several who are TC members and didn't submit their goal response, we could ask them | 20:37 |
| * dhellmann looks at smcginnis | 20:37 | |
| ttx | My understanding is that iut's somethign you always set to prio 2 | 20:37 |
| ttx | I'll submit that tomorrow | 20:37 |
| ttx | heck, even the release management response was not immediate :) | 20:38 |
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| dhellmann | yeah, that guy was new ;-) | 20:38 |
| EmilienM | lol | 20:38 |
| fungi | i took embarrassingly too long to update infra's no-op entries on this cycles goals, but i did also reply to the ml thread explaining (certainly not making excuses for) my error :/ | 20:38 |
| ttx | dhellmann: but it's a fair point. I'd like people to know what they have to do without having to hound them | 20:39 |
| EmilienM | ttx: anyway. If we're looking for someone to project-manage one or 2 goals, I do volunteer to help | 20:39 |
| ttx | but I'm not sure a governance patch is the most frfictionless way to communicate that | 20:39 |
| ttx | EmilienM: you mean, whatever the goal ? | 20:39 |
| EmilienM | yea | 20:39 |
| ttx | The champion of champions :) | 20:40 |
| dhellmann | ok. let's find a better tool for having that conversation then, but I still think it's important for it to be a conversation | 20:40 |
| mriedem | honestly i need to be hounded | 20:40 |
| mriedem | with all of the stuff that's coming out of the TC lately, i lose track and start to go deaf to it | 20:41 |
| mriedem | and get the impression things are happening in a vacuum, which i know they aren't - they are being communicated in the ML, i'm just not reading everything in the ML anymore b/c i can't | 20:41 |
| mriedem | anyway, feel free to hound me at least | 20:42 |
| sdague | right, stop thinking about it as hounding, but as "there are a lot of demands on folks, I am here to make it easy on you and say this is the specific things I need from you this milestone" | 20:42 |
| mriedem | right, e.g. i needed sdague asking me to review global request id patches | 20:42 |
| mriedem | to keep those moving | 20:42 |
| ttx | OK, time check... Let me summarize a few findings so far | 20:42 |
| sdague | and knowing that the person with that ask has filtered out the noise so that it is really important | 20:42 |
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| ttx | #info Goals need champions to project-manage them to completion | 20:42 |
| dtroyer | so maybe one of the things we should be asking sponsor companies for are actual PMs as contributors and not forcing dev-types to do all of those things? | 20:43 |
| * mordred waves | 20:43 | |
| ttx | #info We'll ask for champions on proposed (and the already accepted) goal | 20:43 |
| EmilienM | dtroyer: interesting approach | 20:43 |
| ttx | #info Migrate off paste might be a bit early, a success story in one project is probably needed first | 20:43 |
| mriedem | placement isn't using paste.ini i don't think... | 20:44 |
| ttx | #info Python 3.5 should go to completion in Pike rather than being "extended" now to Queens | 20:44 |
| fungi | i'd be hesitant to ask for traditional "project managers" as we're likely to end up with people who don't know much about the community or how we operate flung into this, and nobody listening to them because nobody knows them | 20:44 |
| dhellmann | dtroyer : I am no longer of the mind that we want to rely on companies to provide any resources other than devs. We build up processes around them, and then they disappear. | 20:44 |
| ttx | #info Full-discovery sounds vague to a few | 20:44 |
| ttx | #info Policy into code & Split tempest plugins seem to general have support | 20:45 |
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| ttx | #info Only 2 goals for Queens is probably a reasonable target | 20:45 |
| ttx | Is that a good summary so far ? | 20:45 |
| thingee | ttx: I'll provide a follow up email to the list | 20:45 |
| fungi | this has been really helpful for me, thanks! | 20:45 |
| EmilienM | do we have examples of PMs involved (really) in OpenStack community | 20:45 |
| EmilienM | ? | 20:45 |
| dtroyer | it's the particular set of skills that I think we are looking for, the alternative is for the foundation to hire them? | 20:45 |
| EmilienM | ttx: yes, lgtm | 20:45 |
| ttx | EmilienM: I would consider myself a PM | 20:45 |
| dtroyer | solution: clone ttx | 20:46 |
| EmilienM | lol | 20:46 |
| fungi | EmilienM: that's part of the problem. the "traditional" project managers have mostly ended up in board working groups and then get frustrated at their inability to make traction herding development cats | 20:46 |
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| ttx | I feel like the work that sdague and dhellmann have done on some inter-project work is very close to PMing a goal | 20:46 |
| ttx | (also others) | 20:46 |
| thingee | EmilienM, dtroyer : I have my PMP cert from way back when | 20:47 |
| EmilienM | thingee: you lucky :D | 20:47 |
| fungi | yeah, "project managers" who have emerged from within our contributor community have been far more effective than those injected from outside | 20:47 |
| ttx | mordred: so you want to address the "vagueness" in the discovery stuff ? | 20:47 |
| mordred | a large portion of it seems to be the combination of detailing steps, following up on them, being able to explain "why" on each step and driving for buy in as you do it | 20:47 |
| ttx | Also, would you be its champion (and actually have time for it in Q ?) | 20:47 |
| thingee | EmilienM: dark times :) | 20:47 |
| thingee | learned a lot | 20:47 |
| ttx | s/so/do | 20:47 |
| dtroyer | I'm not knocking anyones work here, trying to highlight that dev skills and PM skills are different and only a few of us have good polished sets of both | 20:48 |
| ttx | 80% of PMing in OpenStack is beating the drum | 20:48 |
| dhellmann | dtroyer : that's fair. I just don't think "find more new people" is very realistic right now. | 20:48 |
| sdague | right, to be clear I'm talking about "project management" as a valuable task, which is different than project managers a roles | 20:48 |
| mordred | ttx: yes, I would be its champion. I mean, I'm going to be working on that topic regardless | 20:48 |
| ttx | yes | 20:49 |
| fungi | agreed, my answer was more to dtroyer's earlier suggestion of asking member companies to provide us with some project managers | 20:49 |
| thingee | maybe instead of saying project manager we keep going with champion or drum beater | 20:49 |
| mordred | thingee: ++ | 20:49 |
| dhellmann | dtroyer : I would rather find some existing contributors who want to expand and take on a new challenge, I guess. Someone who already has some cred. | 20:49 |
| fungi | thingee: dj! | 20:49 |
| ttx | mordred: The only difference is that by making it a goal, we make sure it's prioritized up for acceptance in every team | 20:49 |
| thingee | OpenStack champion no pmp or agile required | 20:50 |
| dtroyer | dhellmann: sure… the trick is (after watching how this works from the other side for two years now) is that isn't how resources are allocated in a lot of companies | 20:50 |
| mordred | ttx: yup. although it's honestly very little work per-project, so even if it's not a goal I doubt I'll be completely dead in the water or anything | 20:50 |
| ttx | sdague: did you want to ask mordred for clarification on discovery goal vagueness ? | 20:50 |
| dhellmann | dtroyer : and after watching all of the writers leave, I'm not sure relying on finding a bunch of new specialists is either :-/ | 20:50 |
| ttx | thingee: do you have everything you need for the next step ? | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | dtroyer : I mean, go for it, if you think there are people out there who'd be interested. I'm skeptical, but don't mind me. I'm also cranky today. | 20:51 |
| sdague | ttx: ah yeh | 20:51 |
| thingee | yes. I would like to understand more about the champion thing so it can be communicated on the list | 20:51 |
| thingee | ttx: ^ | 20:52 |
| thingee | or I can leave that out for now | 20:52 |
| sdague | mordred: I didn't see anything in there about the microversioning strategy for changing these root docs which impacts some projects | 20:52 |
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| rockyg | part of dtroyer, dhellmann the problem is as openstack gains adoption, contributing companies see less of a need to drive strategy, just keep cutsomers happy. much more tactical | 20:52 |
| ttx | thingee: I see the champion as the person who will push to get the goal completed, by providing help, keeping track of status, sometimes helping with the patches. | 20:53 |
| ttx | Currently we drop a goal and then pick it up at the end of the cycle and realize it's not done yet | 20:53 |
| mordred | sdague: fair question. the answer to that is that the contents of the links list is completely undefined other than "will have self link" - so the answer is "it's not" - and the consume side is "if there is a collections link, this is what it means" | 20:53 |
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| thingee | the champion should have some trust with core project reviewers as have seen the implementation of the goal too | 20:53 |
| ttx | And the scoreboard on the goal doc is not really enough to figure out the state, tbh | 20:54 |
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| thingee | rethink how we track goal progress | 20:54 |
| thingee | at a glance | 20:54 |
| sdague | mordred: I'm not sure I quite accept that in our current thinking on versioning. The contract has been any add or change requires versioning. I feel like there needs to be a story there before committing to it | 20:54 |
| thingee | ttx: thank you. I'm good | 20:54 |
| * thingee disappears into pdx | 20:55 | |
| ttx | thingee: I'm happy to review email drafts if you want me to | 20:55 |
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| mordred | sdague: ok. I'll write something on that topic. also, if it's not there, I've alreayd implemented "just pop crap off the url" for keystoneauth and have written it up for other api consumers too... | 20:56 |
| mordred | so if that's just the api people do, shrug. it'll be better than that behavior being hard-coded and not documented at least | 20:57 |
| ttx | alright, any other question / discussion on this topic ? | 20:57 |
| ttx | we have 3min left if needed | 20:57 |
| thingee | ttx: thanks | 20:58 |
| ttx | We did not exactly made progress in the direction I expected, but it's still progress | 20:58 |
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| ttx | make* | 20:58 |
| rockyg | ++ | 20:58 |
| ttx | I typo more at 11pm for some reason | 20:58 |
| fungi | i'm happy with it | 20:59 |
| ttx | #topic Open discussion | 20:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:59 | |
| EmilienM | ttx: thanks, it was good discussion | 20:59 |
| fungi | don't forget, tc office hours at 01:00 utc! i hope i'm not the only one this week, last week was lonely | 20:59 |
| ttx | Alright, that probably concludes our second adhoc meeting | 20:59 |
| ttx | fungi: I'll miss that one | 21:00 |
| fungi | i expected that ;) | 21:00 |
| dtroyer | fungi: I'm planning to be here | 21:00 |
| ttx | I should tour the doc and sprinkle TC office hours info where needed | 21:00 |
| ttx | Currently not so many people know they can reach out then | 21:00 |
| ttx | We should mention it on the project-team-guide | 21:00 |
| fungi | yes | 21:01 |
| * ttx makes a note | 21:01 | |
| ttx | OK, off time | 21:01 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:01 | |
| ttx | Thanks everyone | 21:01 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 21:01:08 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2017/tc.2017-06-20-20.01.html | 21:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2017/tc.2017-06-20-20.01.txt | 21:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2017/tc.2017-06-20-20.01.log.html | 21:01 |
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