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| hongbin | #startmeeting zun | 03:00 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 03:00:06 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 03:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 03:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'zun' | 03:00 |
| hongbin | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2016-12-13_0300_UTC Today's agenda | 03:00 |
| hongbin | #topic Roll Call | 03:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:00 | |
| Namrata | hi | 03:00 |
| pksingh | pradeep | 03:00 |
| kevinz | kevinz | 03:00 |
| Namrata | Namrata | 03:00 |
| eliqiao | hi | 03:00 |
| eliqiao | eliqiao | 03:00 |
| mkrai_ | Madhuri Kumari | 03:00 |
| shubhams | shubhams: | 03:00 |
| Wenzhi | Wenzhi | 03:00 |
| hongbin | thanks for joining the meeting Namrata pksingh kevinz Namrata eliqiao mkrai_ shubhams Wenzhi | 03:01 |
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| hongbin | #topic Announcements | 03:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:01 | |
| hongbin | 1. Welcome Pradeep to the core team | 03:01 |
| Wenzhi | welcome! | 03:01 |
| mkrai_ | Congratulations pksingh! | 03:01 |
| shubhams | Congrats Pradeep | 03:01 |
| eliqiao | great addition! | 03:01 |
| hongbin | pksingh: thanks for your contribution. it is good to have you in the core team | 03:01 |
| mkrai_ | Welcome | 03:01 |
| pksingh | thanks all :) | 03:01 |
| hongbin | #topic Review Action Items | 03:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:02 | |
| hongbin | 1. hongbin create a etherpad to discuss the zun core api (DONE) | 03:02 |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-core-api | 03:02 |
| hongbin | we will revisit this etherpad later in the agenda | 03:02 |
| hongbin | 2. hongbin start a ML to discuss the k8s integration bp (DONE) | 03:02 |
| hongbin | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-December/108569.html | 03:02 |
| hongbin | shubhams replied to the ML | 03:03 |
| hongbin | so, let's continue the discussion here | 03:03 |
| hongbin | #topic Kubernetes integration (shubhams) | 03:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Kubernetes integration (shubhams) (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:03 | |
| hongbin | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/k8s-integration The BP | 03:03 |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-k8s-integration The etherpad | 03:03 |
| hongbin | shubhams: want to drive this one? | 03:04 |
| shubhams | hongbin: Had discussion with mkrai_ and pksingh and we think that having a pod (or similar concept) within zun is better than just acting like a proxy | 03:04 |
| hongbin | shubhams: ack | 03:04 |
| shubhams | We want to know views of team as it will require considerable efforts and analysis if we do it | 03:04 |
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| hongbin | thoughts everyone? | 03:05 |
| diga | o/ | 03:05 |
| hongbin | welcome to the meeting diga | 03:05 |
| diga | hongbin: thnks :) | 03:05 |
| Wenzhi | acting like a proxy is definitely not a good idea | 03:05 |
| mkrai_ | +1 for it as I think behaving as proxy to any COE wouldn't add much value to zun | 03:06 |
| eliqiao | +1 for not using proxy as k8s | 03:06 |
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| hongbin | i also agree on this: no proxy | 03:06 |
| pksingh | and having purpose of comon interface for different coe will be defeated if we act like proxy | 03:06 |
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| hongbin | i think some team members also challenged the necessary to bring k8s to zun | 03:07 |
| shubhams | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-December/108735.html | 03:07 |
| sudipto | o/ sorry for being late. | 03:07 |
| mkrai_ | +1 pksingh | 03:07 |
| hongbin | sudipto: hey | 03:07 |
| sudipto | logged in from the car :) | 03:07 |
| hongbin | sudipto: :) | 03:08 |
| hongbin | sudipto: we just discussed the k8s integration bp | 03:08 |
| shubhams | Link I posted has the reasoning for our suggestion. Interested people can see :) | 03:08 |
| hongbin | sudipto: do you have any comment about that? | 03:08 |
| hongbin | shubhams: i think we can break this bp into two : 1. introduce pod, 2. k8s integration | 03:09 |
| shubhams | hongbin: agree | 03:09 |
| pksingh | hongbin: +1 | 03:09 |
| hongbin | shubhams: but we can start them in parallel | 03:09 |
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| shubhams | hongbin: And I think both should work in parallel | 03:09 |
| hongbin | #action hongbin split the k8s bp into two | 03:09 |
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| Wenzhi | if we introduce pod, do we need to introduce k8s's RC and service as well? | 03:10 |
| hongbin | Wenzhi: i don't think we should do it right now | 03:10 |
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| shubhams | Wenzhi: ATM, I dont think we should focus on having them | 03:10 |
| Wenzhi | ok | 03:11 |
| hongbin | the last question i have for all of you | 03:11 |
| hongbin | do you think if it is valuable to bring k8s to zun (since several poeple challenged this idea in before) | 03:11 |
| hongbin | just want to make sure if everyone think this is the right direction | 03:12 |
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| hongbin | any opposition point of view? | 03:12 |
| sudipto_ | I have POVs, but i am not hard bound. | 03:12 |
| mkrai_ | As of now I would say "no". When we have our own pod like concept we can eventually integrate k8s also without affecting the end users. | 03:13 |
| hongbin | sudipto_: yes, we would like to hear your point of view | 03:13 |
| sudipto_ | I feel that k8s integration is as good as asking people to use another abstraction on top of kubernetes and us chasing the kubernetes releases to have feature parity. | 03:13 |
| mkrai_ | All COEs will act yes the drivers and we can plug them in as per use. | 03:13 |
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| shubhams | I think having k8s is just optional , and not necessary for zun's success . | 03:14 |
| sudipto_ | yeah and i think the trade off is, whether we should work on optional features or the relatively important ones. | 03:14 |
| sudipto_ | but if there's a real need for k8s, i would like to hear that. | 03:14 |
| diga | hongbin: mkrai_ : Ultimate target is to use zun to provision/manage containers on top of Container infrastructure like k8s, docker swarm etc | 03:15 |
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| hongbin | ok | 03:16 |
| shubhams | hongbin: IIRC, when you came back from Barcelona Summit, you said that people are interested in k8s with zun. What was their motivation for this(if by any chance you could discuss in details) | 03:16 |
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| hongbin | shubhams: they just kept asking if zun support k8s | 03:17 |
| mkrai_ | diga: Initially we planned to integrate with k8s, swarm but now it seems people are not in favor of it | 03:17 |
| shubhams | hongbin: ok | 03:17 |
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| hongbin | shubhams: the one that really asked for k8s is other openstack team (i.e. trove). they wanted a unified api for different coe | 03:18 |
| sudipto_ | My take is, i am not opposed to supporting k8s but it's good to build on the docker driver to support composition of containers first. | 03:18 |
| diga | mkrai_: okay | 03:18 |
| mkrai_ | +1 sudipto_ | 03:19 |
| Wenzhi | sudipto_: agreed | 03:19 |
| sudipto_ | else we could have just stuck to being a gateway for the COEs | 03:19 |
| hongbin | ok, sounds like we should adjust the priority of the k8s bp? | 03:19 |
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| shubhams | hongbin: agree | 03:19 |
| kevinz | +1 sudipto_ | 03:19 |
| hongbin | right now, the bp is essential, let's drop it to medium? | 03:19 |
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| mkrai_ | +1 | 03:19 |
| diga | +1 | 03:19 |
| hongbin | done | 03:20 |
| hongbin | i will create a pod bp, which will be given a higher priority | 03:20 |
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| sudipto_ | +1 | 03:20 |
| hongbin | sounds good to everyone? | 03:20 |
| Wenzhi | good | 03:20 |
| hongbin | any other comment? | 03:20 |
| mkrai_ | Yes | 03:20 |
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| Qiming | +3 | 03:20 |
| diga | fine | 03:21 |
| hongbin | Qiming: :) | 03:21 |
| shubhams | hongbin: sounds good | 03:21 |
| hongbin | very good | 03:21 |
| pksingh | +1 | 03:21 |
| hongbin | next one | 03:21 |
| hongbin | #topic Support interactive mode (kevinz) | 03:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Support interactive mode (kevinz) (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:21 | |
| hongbin | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-interactive-mode The BP | 03:21 |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/396841/ The design spec | 03:21 |
| hongbin | kevinz: ^^ | 03:21 |
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| kevinz | Hi | 03:21 |
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| hongbin | kevinz: do you like to give an update for this one? | 03:23 |
| kevinz | This week I'm still working to give protocol,,,so I don't have much more update this week. Hope to submit first draft before next meeting | 03:23 |
| hongbin | kevinz: ack. that is fine | 03:23 |
| kevinz | Thanks~ | 03:23 |
| hongbin | next topic | 03:23 |
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| hongbin | #topic Should we hold a team meeting at 2016-12-27 UTC 0300? | 03:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Should we hold a team meeting at 2016-12-27 UTC 0300? (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:23 | |
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| mkrai_ | hongbin: Why we don't want to hold meeting? | 03:24 |
| shubhams | I will be available | 03:24 |
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| hongbin | it is xmas | 03:24 |
| pksingh | I am available too | 03:24 |
| shubhams | mkrai_: many people will be gone for new year leave (i guess) | 03:25 |
| sudipto | i will be off. | 03:25 |
| mkrai_ | I will be available :) | 03:25 |
| kevinz | I Will be off too | 03:25 |
| Wenzhi | available | 03:25 |
| sudipto | Going to thailand :) | 03:25 |
| pksingh | sudipto: :) | 03:25 |
| hongbin | ok, sounds like half of hte team members will not be available | 03:25 |
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| hongbin | let me ask another question | 03:26 |
| hongbin | #topic Should we hold a team meeting at 2017-01-03 UTC 0300? | 03:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Should we hold a team meeting at 2017-01-03 UTC 0300? (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:26 | |
| mkrai_ | available | 03:26 |
| hongbin | will everyone available at Jan 03? | 03:26 |
| sudipto | Available for that one :) | 03:26 |
| kevinz | Fine | 03:26 |
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| shubhams | available | 03:26 |
| pksingh | available | 03:26 |
| diga | yep | 03:26 |
| Namrata | available | 03:26 |
| hongbin | ok, then how about dropping the 12-27 one, then hold the 01-03 | 03:27 |
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| mkrai_ | Ok | 03:27 |
| sudipto | would you be available hongbin | 03:27 |
| pksingh | k | 03:27 |
| sudipto | ? | 03:27 |
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| hongbin | sudipto: i am not sure, it is a holiday at Canada :) | 03:27 |
| hongbin | sudipto: but Jan 03, i will be available | 03:27 |
| sudipto | hopefully not logging in from a motor vehicle like me right now :) | 03:28 |
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| hongbin | #agreed cancel the team meeting at 12-27 | 03:28 |
| hongbin | sudipto: :) | 03:28 |
| hongbin | ok | 03:28 |
| hongbin | #topic Open Discussion | 03:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:28 | |
| hongbin | there is an etherpad that needs to be discussed: #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-core-api | 03:29 |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-core-api | 03:29 |
| diga | hongbin: I would like to take this BP - https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/coe-integration | 03:29 |
| hongbin | we can do it right now, or leave it as homework | 03:29 |
| hongbin | diga: this bp is of priority "not" | 03:30 |
| diga | We need to generic layer may be based on the factory implementation | 03:30 |
| Qiming | just posted some comments to the core api | 03:30 |
| hongbin | diga: which means it is not in the recent roadmap, it is a long term idea | 03:30 |
| diga | hongbin: okay | 03:30 |
| hongbin | diga: however, you can work with mkrai_ shubhams pksingh for the k8s bp, it is one of the coe | 03:30 |
| diga | hongbin: anything I can start | 03:31 |
| diga | hongbin: okay | 03:31 |
| hongbin | Qiming: you are of color blue? | 03:31 |
| Qiming | I cannot read colors, :) | 03:31 |
| Qiming | yes, probably | 03:31 |
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| Qiming | my suggestion is to merge all container operations into a single URL | 03:32 |
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| hongbin | Qiming: you were suggestion: /containers/<ID>/actions/<ACTION> ? | 03:32 |
| Qiming | yes | 03:33 |
| hongbin | Qiming: ack | 03:33 |
| Qiming | http://developer.openstack.org/api-ref/compute/#servers-run-an-action-servers-action | 03:33 |
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| hongbin | others, thoughts? | 03:34 |
| hongbin | Qiming: i see. nova is designed the api in this way | 03:35 |
| pksingh | hongbin: i think action is part of the body? | 03:35 |
| Qiming | also, for these operations, maybe we should return 202 instead of 200 | 03:35 |
| hongbin | pksingh: yes, <action> is in the body | 03:35 |
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| hongbin | that means make them async? | 03:35 |
| Qiming | yes, they are inherently async operations | 03:36 |
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| hongbin | i see | 03:36 |
| mkrai_ | Qiming: the benefit is reduced no of APIs exposed? | 03:36 |
| Qiming | yes, mkrai_ | 03:36 |
| mkrai_ | Single API endpoint for all actions | 03:36 |
| Qiming | except for basic CRUD calls | 03:37 |
| mkrai_ | Yes got it | 03:37 |
| Qiming | a POST to the collection 'actions' means a creation of an action resource | 03:37 |
| pksingh | Qiming: isn't it confusing having same url for different controller actions? | 03:37 |
| Qiming | that is a more RESTful way to operate your resources | 03:38 |
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| Wenzhi | right | 03:38 |
| Qiming | it is different from CLI or GUI | 03:38 |
| Qiming | from CLI or dashboard, you can still present these operations in whatever way users appreciate | 03:39 |
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| Qiming | just my 2 cents for team to consider | 03:39 |
| csomerville | It might be worth asking the nova team if they're happy with that design decision. | 03:39 |
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| eliqiao | suggest to fellow API design as https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/API_Working_Group | 03:40 |
| eliqiao | s/fellow/follow/ | 03:40 |
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| pksingh | csomerville: +1 | 03:41 |
| hongbin | ok, i can create a bp for that first | 03:41 |
| Qiming | there was a patch #234994 proposing this idea | 03:41 |
| Qiming | however, it was stuck by some trivial things, and blocked by the tendency people loves "-1" a patch | 03:42 |
| csomerville | Was just discussing today how multiple actions to single URL in nova makes it more difficult to track feature usage by http access logs | 03:42 |
| hongbin | then, everyone can cast feedback to the bp (i.e. what is nova POV) | 03:42 |
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| Qiming | csomerville, reasonable concern though | 03:42 |
| mkrai_ | hongbin: Qiming How about raising ML with nova in subject? | 03:42 |
| Qiming | sounds tood | 03:43 |
| pksingh | mkrai_: +1 | 03:43 |
| Qiming | good | 03:43 |
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| hongbin | ok | 03:43 |
| hongbin | mkrai_: maybe raise it with API WG is more appropreciate | 03:43 |
| mkrai_ | Yes | 03:43 |
| hongbin | #action hongbin raise a ML with API WG to discuss the consolidate of actions into single URL | 03:44 |
| hongbin | at the same time, we can ping the nova channel to get more feedback | 03:44 |
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| hongbin | anything else to discuss? | 03:45 |
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| hongbin | sounds no more | 03:45 |
| hongbin | all, thanks for joining the meeting | 03:45 |
| hongbin | #endmeeting | 03:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 03:45 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 03:45:44 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 03:45 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-12-13-03.00.html | 03:45 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-12-13-03.00.txt | 03:45 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-12-13-03.00.log.html | 03:45 |
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| samP | hi | 04:01 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | samP: Hi | 04:01 |
| tpatil | samP: Hi | 04:01 |
| samP | hi Dinesh_Bhor | 04:01 |
| samP | hi tpatil | 04:01 |
| rkmrhj | samP: Hi | 04:01 |
| abhishekk | 0/ hi | 04:01 |
| samP | hi abhishekk | 04:02 |
| samP | shall we start? | 04:02 |
| abhishekk | yes | 04:02 |
| tpatil | yes | 04:02 |
| samP | #startmeeting masakari | 04:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 04:02:20 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is samP. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 04:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 04:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'masakari' | 04:02 |
| samP | Hi all | 04:02 |
| samP | Thank you all for attending to our first masakari IRC | 04:03 |
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| samP | First I would like to make quick intro from every one | 04:03 |
| tpatil | I think we should add weekly agenda on masakari wiki page | 04:04 |
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| tpatil | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Masakari | 04:04 |
| abhishekk | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Masakari#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 04:04 |
| samP | can we use the rollcall? | 04:04 |
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| samP | tpatil: sure, I will do that | 04:05 |
| samP | #action samP add add weekly agenda on masakari wiki page | 04:05 |
| abhishekk | samP: I have added some points for todays discussion | 04:05 |
| samP | abhishekk: thank you | 04:06 |
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| abhishekk | shall we start with the discussion? | 04:08 |
| samP | sure, | 04:08 |
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| tpatil | Let's start the discussion as per agenda | 04:09 |
| samP | we dont have opens bugs right? can we stat jump in to next? | 04:09 |
| abhishekk | yes | 04:09 |
| samP | sure | 04:09 |
| tpatil | Only one issue is open | 04:10 |
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| samP | #topic Discussion new features | 04:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discussion new features (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:10 | |
| tpatil | in fact there are 3 open issues but none is critical | 04:10 |
| samP | tpatil: OK, lets do it after this discussion | 04:11 |
| tpatil | samP: ok | 04:11 |
| samP | First, evacuate_all config option | 04:11 |
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| samP | now we dont evacuate VMs without HA flag, this option enable/disable the evacuation of all VMs | 04:12 |
| abhishekk | yes, we are using this option for host_failure flow | 04:12 |
| abhishekk | if this option is True then we should evacuate all the instances else only ha_enabled instances should be evacuated | 04:13 |
| tpatil | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/407538/ | 04:13 |
| abhishekk | IMO we should rename this option so that we can use for instance_failure flow as well | 04:13 |
| samP | abhishekk: agree, we have kind of same issue there | 04:14 |
| abhishekk | as of now in instance_failure we are only processing HA-Enabled instances | 04:15 |
| samP | how about rescue_all? | 04:15 |
| rkmrhj | rescue is other API name of nova. | 04:15 |
| abhishekk | right, we can decide about the config name in internal disscussion | 04:16 |
| samP | rkmrhj: ah,, thank you | 04:16 |
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| samP | In future, we are going to impliment custormize rescue patterns, | 04:17 |
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| samP | I think we need to define separate options for evacuate and instance_failure | 04:19 |
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| tpatil | samP: Let's add a new blueprint to describe about new feature | 04:19 |
| samP | such as, evacuate for all but instance_failure only for HA enable VMS | 04:19 |
| tpatil | also, we should add a litespec to describe how we are going to implement it | 04:19 |
| samP | tpatil: sure | 04:20 |
| samP | do we need a spec repo? or just document it someware? | 04:20 |
| tpatil | repo is better | 04:20 |
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| samP | OK, in future, spec repo is more useful. I'll try to get one | 04:21 |
| samP | #action create spec repo for masakari | 04:21 |
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| samP | are we going to create BP for "evacuate_all config option"? | 04:23 |
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| tpatil | I think blueprint should be enough for this change as design wise it's not a big change | 04:23 |
| samP | tpatil: agree | 04:24 |
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| tpatil | can we move to the next item | 04:25 |
| samP | any volunteer for that BP? | 04:25 |
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| abhishekk | I will do that | 04:25 |
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| samP | #action abhishekk crate evacuate_all config option BP | 04:26 |
| samP | abhishekk: thanks | 04:26 |
| samP | OK lets go to next item | 04:26 |
| abhishekk | samP: no problem | 04:26 |
| samP | item2: an we have one periodic task? | 04:26 |
| abhishekk | Ok, I will explain about this | 04:26 |
| abhishekk | Earlier we were planning to have two periodic tasks, | 04:26 |
| abhishekk | process_error_notifications, for processing notifications which are in error state | 04:27 |
| abhishekk | process_queued_notifications, for processing notifications which are in new state for long time due to ignored/missed by messaging server. | 04:27 |
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| abhishekk | but we can club this into one as in both the tasks we are going to execute the workflow again | 04:27 |
| abhishekk | this way we can eliminate the duplicate code | 04:27 |
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| tpatil | the question is, we can process both these tasks in a single periodic task | 04:29 |
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| tpatil | the only difference is in case of notification status is new, if the periodic task fails to execute the workflow , should the status be set to "failed" or "error"? | 04:29 |
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| tpatil | abhishekk: can you please explain the status transition that takes place during processing notifications | 04:30 |
| abhishekk | ok | 04:30 |
| abhishekk | process_error_notifications: | 04:31 |
| abhishekk | Error flow, error >> running >> error >> failed | 04:31 |
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| abhishekk | Success flow, error >> running >> finished | 04:31 |
| abhishekk | for process_queued_notifications: | 04:31 |
| abhishekk | Error flow, new >> running >> error | 04:31 |
| abhishekk | Success flow, new >> running >> finished | 04:31 |
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| abhishekk | In case of secnond periodic task it we set status to error then that will again be taken for execution by process_error_notifications | 04:32 |
| abhishekk | so we cab club this and have common flow like, | 04:32 |
| abhishekk | Error flow, new/error >> running >> error >> failed | 04:32 |
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| abhishekk | Success flow, new/error >> running >> finished | 04:33 |
| samP | Is there any flag to stop it at some point? | 04:33 |
| tpatil | abhishekk: Let's add a litespec to explain all these possible cases | 04:34 |
| abhishekk | no, these periodic tasks will run at regular interval | 04:34 |
| abhishekk | ok | 04:34 |
| samP | OK, lets discuss this further on the spec | 04:35 |
| samP | abhishekk: can I assign this spec to you? | 04:35 |
| abhishekk | samP: yes | 04:35 |
| samP | #action abhishekk create spc for merge periodic tasks | 04:36 |
| samP | abhishekk: thank you | 04:36 |
| samP | shall we move to next then? | 04:36 |
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| samP | item3: configurable workflow | 04:37 |
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| abhishekk | this is a new requirement | 04:37 |
| samP | is this configurable recovery patterns or smt else? | 04:37 |
| abhishekk | yes | 04:37 |
| samP | abhishekk: ok | 04:37 |
| tpatil | samP: configurable recovery patterns | 04:38 |
| samP | tpatil: thanks | 04:38 |
| tpatil | I think Kajinami explained you the problems we are having in the current design | 04:38 |
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| samP | tpatil: actually, I couldn't. we gonna meet tomorrow | 04:39 |
| tpatil | samP: Ok | 04:39 |
| tpatil | Post that discussion, let's finalize on the new requirement before we go ahead and add a new blueprint for it | 04:40 |
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| samP | tpatil: sure, I will discuss with this on ML with kajinami | 04:41 |
| samP | tpatil: we can have more details discuss on next meeting | 04:41 |
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| tpatil | samP: Sure | 04:41 |
| abhishekk | samP: we have one more item for discussion | 04:42 |
| samP | abhishekk: sure | 04:42 |
| abhishekk | Dinesh_Bhor will explain you about that | 04:42 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | ok I have a question that whether the workflow should be executed synchronously or asynchronously? | 04:42 |
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| samP | specific work flow or all of them? | 04:43 |
| abhishekk | Prticulary host_failure | 04:44 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | The problem is we want to mark the used reserved_hosts after the execution of host failure workflow as reserved=False | 04:44 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | For this we are passing that reserved_host_list dictionary to workflow for further execution. | 04:45 |
| samP | ah.. got it | 04:45 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | When the reserved_host is taken for evacuation, it is set to reserved_host['reserved'] = False. As the dictionary is mutable we get the updated dictionary after the execution of workflow. | 04:45 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | After the execution of whole workflow we are looping over through the reserved_host_list in manager.py and if the reserved_host is marked as false then we are getting the related object and marking it as reserved=False. | 04:45 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | The above solution is based on the assumption that we are executing the workflow synchronously. | 04:46 |
| tpatil | In future, if some one wants to contribute another driver say Mistral then the workflow might execute asychronously and you might not get the results from the workflow execution in engine, right? | 04:47 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | tpatil: yes, correct | 04:47 |
| tpatil | where you will can db apis to update reserve_host flag to False | 04:47 |
| tpatil | s/can/call | 04:47 |
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| tpatil | the current supported driver run on the local machine where engine is running. but in future any one can contribute new driver and we don't know whether it will return result or not. | 04:49 |
| samP | as tpatil said, if some one bring other driver to call this workflow, we can not do this synchronously | 04:49 |
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| tpatil | so the main question is how to set reserve_host flag to False after the instances are evacuated from the failover segment. | 04:50 |
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| tpatil | let's discuss the design offline but one thing is sure we cannot assume workflow to return results | 04:51 |
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| tpatil | samP: Do you agree? | 04:52 |
| samP | tpatil: yes, I am thing abt some kind of locking or intermediate state for it | 04:52 |
| samP | tpatil: agree, shall we raise a spec for this? | 04:53 |
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| tpatil | samP: yes | 04:53 |
| samP | tpatil: thanks | 04:53 |
| samP | Dinesh_Bhor: may I assign this spec to you? | 04:53 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | samP: yes | 04:54 |
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| samP | #action Dinesh_Bhor spec for synchronous/asynchronous work flows | 04:55 |
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| samP | any other discussion topics, if no lest move to #any_other_topics | 04:56 |
| samP | #topic AOB | 04:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: masakari)" | 04:56 | |
| samP | I will update masakari wiki with our release schedule. | 04:57 |
| samP | Our initial plan, we had milestone b1 on 12/9 | 04:58 |
| samP | since we have new topics to discuss, I would like this to extend this 12/16 | 04:59 |
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| rkmrhj | Sure. | 05:00 |
| samP | ok then. | 05:00 |
| tpatil | I think we should use LP milestone feature to figure out details of each milestone | 05:00 |
| samP | tpatil: sure | 05:01 |
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| abhishekk | thank you all | 05:01 |
| tpatil | samP: Thank you | 05:01 |
| samP | OK then, its almost time | 05:01 |
| Dinesh_Bhor | yes, thanks all | 05:01 |
| samP | please use ML openstack-dev[masakari] for further discussions | 05:02 |
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| samP | Thank you all | 05:02 |
| tpatil | Sure | 05:02 |
| tpatil | bye | 05:02 |
| samP | #endmeeting | 05:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 05:02 | |
| rkmrhj | bye | 05:02 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 05:02:16 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 05:02 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2016/masakari.2016-12-13-04.02.html | 05:02 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2016/masakari.2016-12-13-04.02.txt | 05:02 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2016/masakari.2016-12-13-04.02.log.html | 05:02 |
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| samP | Thank you all and bye | 05:02 |
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| yamamoto | #startmeeting networking_midonet | 07:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 07:00:41 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is yamamoto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 07:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 07:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking_midonet)" | 07:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking_midonet' | 07:00 |
| yamamoto | anyone here for the meeting? | 07:00 |
| yamamoto | #topic Agenda | 07:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Agenda (Meeting topic: networking_midonet)" | 07:01 | |
| yamamoto | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/NetworkingMidoNet | 07:01 |
| yamamoto | #topic Announcements | 07:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: networking_midonet)" | 07:01 | |
| yamamoto | we now have stable/newton branch | 07:01 |
| yamamoto | and 3.0.0 has been released. it doesn't have features we wanted though. | 07:02 |
| yamamoto | eg. lbaasv2 | 07:02 |
| yamamoto | #topic Bugs | 07:02 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (Meeting topic: networking_midonet)" | 07:02 | |
| yamamoto | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/networking-midonet/ | 07:02 |
| yamamoto | at this point gate seems ok | 07:03 |
| yamamoto | #link http://grafana.openstack.org/dashboard/db/networking-midonet-failure-rate | 07:03 |
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| yamamoto | as always i'll continue bug deputy | 07:03 |
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| yamamoto | #topic Open Discussion | 07:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: networking_midonet)" | 07:04 | |
| yamamoto | i'm going to attend PTG | 07:04 |
| yamamoto | that's all from me | 07:04 |
| * yamamoto waiting for a few minutes before closing the meeting | 07:04 | |
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| yamamoto | let's call it a day | 07:15 |
| yamamoto | bye | 07:15 |
| yamamoto | #endmeeting | 07:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 07:15 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 07:15:15 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 07:15 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_midonet/2016/networking_midonet.2016-12-13-07.00.html | 07:15 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_midonet/2016/networking_midonet.2016-12-13-07.00.txt | 07:15 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_midonet/2016/networking_midonet.2016-12-13-07.00.log.html | 07:15 |
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| eranrom | #start-meeting storlets | 08:02 |
| eranrom | #startmeeting storlets | 08:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 08:02:37 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is eranrom. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 08:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 08:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: storlets)" | 08:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'storlets' | 08:02 |
| eranrom | Hi | 08:02 |
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| akihito | Hi | 08:03 |
| eranrom | akihito: Hi! | 08:03 |
| akihito | Takashi is absent today.. | 08:04 |
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| eranrom | I see. So its only the two of us :-) | 08:05 |
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| eranrom | kota cannot make it as well. | 08:05 |
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| eranrom | Lets start then. | 08:05 |
| akihito | oh. ok. | 08:05 |
| eranrom | #topic Big-Tent | 08:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Big-Tent (Meeting topic: storlets)" | 08:05 | |
| eranrom | We will be on the agenda in next's week IRC meeting | 08:06 |
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| eranrom | A lot of work has been done, and I expect that the project will be approved (perhaps with some todos) | 08:07 |
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| eranrom | At any rate we still have a couple of pending patches that need to get in as part of the work we have done | 08:07 |
| eranrom | Would be good to merge them this week | 08:08 |
| eranrom | Most important is: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/394168/ | 08:08 |
| eranrom | then there is also the testr patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/394437/ | 08:08 |
| akihito | I think that is good. | 08:09 |
| eranrom | yep. | 08:09 |
| eranrom | I would still like to discuss with Kota python3 and the testr patch, but we can do it when he is available. | 08:10 |
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| eranrom | For the record, this etherpad has a summery as well as all details on the work done so far: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/storlets-big-tent | 08:11 |
| eranrom | This is what I have on the topic. | 08:11 |
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| eranrom | next? | 08:11 |
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| akihito | hmm. ok. sorry, I am not a core reviewr, so discussion is difficult. | 08:12 |
| eranrom | akihito: no worries! | 08:12 |
| eranrom | akihito: Do you plan on coming to the PTG? | 08:12 |
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| akihito | Yes. | 08:13 |
| eranrom | akihito: Great! | 08:13 |
| eranrom | I have seen that you have been working on the functional tests a lot. | 08:14 |
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| akihito | Thank you! I use java's FTs as a reference. | 08:15 |
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| eranrom | good. I guess they are not perfect, but surely a good starting point. | 08:15 |
| eranrom | Anything else for today? | 08:16 |
| akihito | Please advice if there are missing items. | 08:16 |
| akihito | I am nothing. | 08:16 |
| eranrom | akihito: sure will do. | 08:16 |
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| akihito | thank you! | 08:17 |
| eranrom | So we get back 40 minutes. | 08:17 |
| eranrom | Talk to you later. and thanks for joining. | 08:17 |
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| eranrom | #endmeeting | 08:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 08:19 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 08:19:01 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 08:19 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2016/storlets.2016-12-13-08.02.html | 08:19 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2016/storlets.2016-12-13-08.02.txt | 08:19 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2016/storlets.2016-12-13-08.02.log.html | 08:19 |
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| yanyanhu | #startmeeting senlin | 13:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 13:00:03 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is yanyanhu. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'senlin' | 13:00 |
| yanyanhu | hello, everyone | 13:00 |
| elynn | hi yanyanhu | 13:00 |
| yanyanhu | hi, elynn | 13:00 |
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| Qiming | o/ | 13:00 |
| yanyanhu | hello | 13:00 |
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| yanyanhu | hi, Ruijie_ | 13:01 |
| Ruijie_ | evening, yanyanhu | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | evening | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | lets wait for a while for other attenders | 13:01 |
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| yanyanhu | here is the agenda, please feel free to add topics | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/SenlinAgenda#Agenda_.282016-12-13_1300_UTC.29 | 13:01 |
| lvdongbing | hello, everyone | 13:02 |
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| yanyanhu | hi, lvdongbing | 13:02 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, lets start | 13:02 |
| yanyanhu | #topic ocata workitem | 13:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ocata workitem (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:02 | |
| yanyanhu | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/senlin-ocata-workitems | 13:03 |
| yanyanhu | ocata workitem | 13:03 |
| yanyanhu | Testing | 13:03 |
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| yanyanhu | will start to work on tempest API improvement after versioend request support is done | 13:03 |
| yanyanhu | and Ruijie_ has spent some time on rally test recently | 13:04 |
| Ruijie_ | asked that question in rally channel | 13:04 |
| yanyanhu | try to support more scenarios | 13:04 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:04 |
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| Ruijie_ | but didn't get answered | 13:05 |
| yanyanhu | ok | 13:05 |
| yanyanhu | so maybe we can use 'public' rather than 'private' network in nova server profile as a workaround temporarily | 13:06 |
| Ruijie_ | will try to update the network to "shared:true" | 13:06 |
| yanyanhu | then we need to find a better way to address this issue, e.g. creating specific network for test | 13:06 |
| yanyanhu | Ruijie_, that is also feasible I think | 13:06 |
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| Ruijie_ | if that can pass the test, then it's a netwrok problem | 13:07 |
| yanyanhu | I think you can refer to the "server" scenario in Rally | 13:07 |
| yanyanhu | I recalled there are some network related operations included | 13:07 |
| yanyanhu | Ruijie_, yes | 13:07 |
| Ruijie_ | yes, yanyanhu, will check it | 13:08 |
| yanyanhu | great, thanks a lot :) | 13:08 |
| yanyanhu | ok, next one, health management | 13:08 |
| Ruijie_ | my pleasure :) | 13:08 |
| yanyanhu | I think xinhui is in business travel this week | 13:08 |
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| yanyanhu | just sent a mail to Michael to seek oppotunity for more discussion on the following bp | 13:09 |
| yanyanhu | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/octavia/+spec/octavia-event-notifier | 13:09 |
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| yanyanhu | will wait for their feedback | 13:09 |
| Qiming | also, xinhui mentioned that she will work on integrating mistral into senlin when she is back | 13:10 |
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| yanyanhu | great | 13:10 |
| yanyanhu | maybe she can give us a quick introduction about mistral | 13:11 |
| yanyanhu | especially how it works with Senlin for HA scenario | 13:11 |
| Qiming | another thing I have been thinking of is about health detection | 13:11 |
| yanyanhu | yes? | 13:11 |
| Qiming | suppose I have a monitoring service deployed | 13:11 |
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| Qiming | from HA's perspective, it is equivalent to LBaaS | 13:12 |
| Qiming | I mean, it can help monitor the service availability from nodes | 13:12 |
| yanyanhu | ok | 13:12 |
| Qiming | we should enable this service to tell us that a specific node is unhealthy | 13:12 |
| yanyanhu | you mean we enable it (on behalf of user)? | 13:13 |
| Qiming | the question is, how that service is supposed to notify senlin? | 13:13 |
| yanyanhu | ummm, good question. Currently, we have listener | 13:14 |
| yanyanhu | but it is created within health policy I think | 13:14 |
| Qiming | several options: 1 send a message into zaqar, we listen to that | 13:14 |
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| Qiming | 2. send a message to the control plane message queue, just like nove-compute does | 13:14 |
| yanyanhu | looks like option1 is more reasonable | 13:15 |
| Qiming | however, the monitoring service is doing failure detection from business plane | 13:15 |
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| Qiming | 3. send a webhook API, invoking an operation in senlin | 13:15 |
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| Qiming | or directly invoke a senlin API | 13:15 |
| Qiming | but we don't have such an API yet | 13:16 |
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| yanyanhu | option3 is almost euqal to calling senlin API directly | 13:16 |
| Qiming | em, yep | 13:16 |
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| XueFengLiu | want to add? | 13:16 |
| yanyanhu | imho, option1 is the most flexible and safe one :) | 13:16 |
| Qiming | the only concern about option 1 is about zaqar's stability | 13:17 |
| elynn | I would prefer option 2.... | 13:17 |
| Qiming | its API is so .... weird to me, :D | 13:17 |
| yanyanhu | yes, that could be a issue | 13:17 |
| elynn | Since not every env deploy zaqar... | 13:17 |
| yanyanhu | :P | 13:17 |
| yanyanhu | honestly, Zaqar is really important is many cases | 13:17 |
| Qiming | okay, option 3 is left to me for vote? | 13:17 |
| Qiming | I agree | 13:18 |
| elynn | Yes, agree with you yanyanhu | 13:18 |
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| Qiming | so we should support that scenario | 13:18 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:18 |
| yanyanhu | and it also provides enough flexibility for user to control the workflow, including building the queue, let monitoring service to send message | 13:19 |
| Qiming | PATCH /v1/nodes/<node_id> {'node': {'status': 'DEAD'}} ? | 13:19 |
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| Qiming | not sure yet, but we can keep thinking about it | 13:19 |
| yanyanhu | mark a node to failed status manually :) | 13:19 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:20 |
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| Qiming | this is still a notification based failure detectin | 13:20 |
| yanyanhu | I believe all those options have their own use cases | 13:20 |
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| yanyanhu | yes | 13:20 |
| Qiming | in the other direction, there will be HTTP GET, ICMP ping operations to detect node failures | 13:20 |
| yanyanhu | the polling way | 13:21 |
| Qiming | in other words, we kinda "replicate" the health monitor function locally | 13:21 |
| Qiming | no matter we do LB or not | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | like a simple health monitor implemented inside senlin | 13:22 |
| Qiming | if we have that capability, we stop bugging the octavia team for fixing their bugs | 13:22 |
| Qiming | we don't duplicate things unless we HAVE TO | 13:23 |
| yanyanhu | agree | 13:23 |
| yanyanhu | maybe we can add those items we discussed to TODO list | 13:24 |
| Qiming | okay, just some random thoughts on buidling a comprehensive HA solution | 13:24 |
| yanyanhu | that is very helpful | 13:24 |
| Tracks16 | http://ilredentore.dynv6.net regards... | 13:24 |
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| Qiming | okay, will do that | 13:24 |
| yanyanhu | especially the message based notification | 13:24 |
| yanyanhu | great, thanks a lot | 13:24 |
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| yanyanhu | later, we can pick them up and file bp/spec for them | 13:25 |
| XueFengLiu | greate | 13:25 |
| Qiming | sure | 13:25 |
| XueFengLiu | great | 13:25 |
| yanyanhu | please feel free to claim it :) | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | ok, next one | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | document | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | no progress I guess | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | versioned request support | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | it is done now? | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | receiver notify support has been added I think | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | any other unfinished parts? | 13:27 |
| * Qiming is looking | 13:27 | |
| yanyanhu | thanks :) | 13:27 |
| Qiming | credential_create, credential_get | 13:27 |
| yanyanhu | ah | 13:27 |
| Qiming | credential_update | 13:27 |
| yanyanhu | those two are user invisible ones | 13:27 |
| Qiming | but they live on RPC interfaces | 13:28 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:28 |
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| Qiming | get_revision | 13:28 |
| Qiming | action_delete | 13:28 |
| Qiming | under review already? ^ | 13:28 |
| yanyanhu | guess so | 13:28 |
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| yanyanhu | let me check | 13:28 |
| Qiming | that's all | 13:28 |
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| XueFengLiu | action_delete need delete | 13:28 |
| yanyanhu | https://review.openstack.org/409409 | 13:29 |
| yanyanhu | has been there | 13:29 |
| Qiming | it is only about the object | 13:29 |
| XueFengLiu | the old need delete | 13:29 |
| Qiming | engine service is not yet changed | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | oh, here is the eng support | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | https://review.openstack.org/409411 | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | there is no action_delete API I think | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | XueFengLiu, yes | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | need to remove dead code | 13:30 |
| Qiming | ah, ... finally I understand what you said, XueFengLiu | 13:30 |
| XueFengLiu | yes ,api no need to do | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | :) | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | ok, will work on left ones | 13:30 |
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| yanyanhu | and hope to catch the ocata-2 release | 13:31 |
| XueFengLiu | ok | 13:31 |
| XueFengLiu | also checked ploicy/profile update | 13:31 |
| yanyanhu | then we can rename those "**2" service calls :) | 13:31 |
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| Qiming | yes, please, :D | 13:31 |
| XueFengLiu | two problems meraged | 13:32 |
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| yanyanhu | XueFengLiu, yes, saw your bug report | 13:32 |
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| yanyanhu | so those fixes have been merged | 13:32 |
| Qiming | you mean two patches merged? | 13:32 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, yes | 13:33 |
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| yanyanhu | https://review.openstack.org/409426 | 13:33 |
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| yanyanhu | and this one? | 13:33 |
| yanyanhu | https://review.openstack.org/409427 | 13:33 |
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| yanyanhu | XueFengLiu, did I miss anything? | 13:33 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, lets move on | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | container profile | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | haiwei is not here? | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | ok, lets skip it | 13:34 |
| Qiming | wait | 13:35 |
| yanyanhu | yes? | 13:35 |
| Qiming | #368539 has been abandoned | 13:35 |
| XueFengLiu | Sorroy, offline just now | 13:35 |
| XueFengLiu | move on | 13:35 |
| Qiming | and I have reworked that profile thing | 13:35 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, ah, right | 13:36 |
| Qiming | now we have a 'create' classmethod of Profile | 13:36 |
| yanyanhu | those two patches have been merged | 13:36 |
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| yanyanhu | that logic should stay in container profile rather than engine service call | 13:36 |
| Qiming | it is enabling us to do extra work in subclasses when a profile is created or deleted | 13:36 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:36 |
| Qiming | As I have left a TODO in the profile | 13:37 |
| Qiming | it is only capable of removing dependency from clusters today | 13:37 |
| Qiming | still needs to handle dependency on nodes | 13:37 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:37 |
| Qiming | I'm adding an item and assigning it to myself | 13:38 |
| Qiming | feel free to rob it from me, guys | 13:38 |
| yanyanhu | thanks :) | 13:38 |
| XueFengLiu | hh | 13:38 |
| yanyanhu | ok, next one, Events/Notifications | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, configuration options have been added? | 13:39 |
| Qiming | not yet | 13:39 |
| Qiming | or else line 27 could be removed | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | I see :) | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | noticed you're working on reorg the code of versioned request support in API layer | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | to remove those duplicated code for request parsing | 13:40 |
| Qiming | yes, adding that into etherpad now | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | by adding a util func | 13:40 |
| Qiming | line 21 | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | great, thanks | 13:40 |
| Qiming | yes, I hate duplicated codes | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | me too :) | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | doesn't look good | 13:40 |
| Qiming | the 'parse_request' function is very powerful | 13:40 |
| Qiming | it can build formalized primitives | 13:41 |
| Qiming | it can lookup class names for a request, instantiate it | 13:41 |
| Qiming | it can validate request using jsonschema | 13:41 |
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| yanyanhu | yes, almost everything is done there | 13:42 |
| Qiming | it can do version search based on the api_version in the context now | 13:42 |
| yanyanhu | maybe we can wrap it to a decorator :) | 13:42 |
| Qiming | thought about that | 13:42 |
| Qiming | problem is that not all APIs have the same collection of positional arguments and/or keyword arguments | 13:43 |
| yanyanhu | ah, right | 13:43 |
| Qiming | the creatoin of request objects would need those arguments | 13:43 |
| Qiming | it is not an easy job | 13:44 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:44 |
| yanyanhu | and it's not functional necessary | 13:44 |
| Qiming | also, decorators are not easy to override | 13:44 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:44 |
| Qiming | if a handler has a slightly different logic, you will need a different decorator? | 13:44 |
| Qiming | those are two reasons I refrained from decorators | 13:45 |
| yanyanhu | right, that will be a problem | 13:45 |
| yanyanhu | I see. | 13:45 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, so those are all items in the list | 13:45 |
| yanyanhu | anything missing | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | ok, lets move on | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | #topic Join Tacker IRC meeting to discuss Senlin based VDU support | 13:46 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Join Tacker IRC meeting to discuss Senlin based VDU support (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:46 | |
| yanyanhu | just remind, Tacker IRC meeting will be at 0530UTC | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | tomorrow | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | Dec.14th | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | anyone who is interested in it, please join it | 13:47 |
| * Qiming marking it in calendar now | 13:47 | |
| elynn | hmm, it is an important thing | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | will join it as well | 13:47 |
| elynn | would be 13:30 china time | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | I believe haiwei and xinhui will join it as well | 13:47 |
| elynn | How to join it? | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | yes, good time for us, haha | 13:47 |
| elynn | at openstack-meeting? | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | just join the meeting channel | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | I guess so :) | 13:48 |
| yanyanhu | will double confirm with haiwei tomorrow morning | 13:48 |
| yanyanhu | to see whether he needs any help | 13:48 |
| Qiming | cool, we will have a lot people making noises there I hope | 13:48 |
| yanyanhu | haha | 13:48 |
| yanyanhu | or a smooth discussion if we have concensus :) | 13:48 |
| Qiming | maybe bring sahdev in ? | 13:49 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, oh, right | 13:49 |
| yanyanhu | that will be great | 13:49 |
| yanyanhu | maybe you can send him a mail to ask him | 13:49 |
| elynn | too late for him I guess | 13:49 |
| Qiming | ah, yes | 13:49 |
| yanyanhu | yes, a little bit late | 13:49 |
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| Qiming | 10pm? | 13:50 |
| yanyanhu | I guess 12:30? | 13:50 |
| yanyanhu | he is in Austin? | 13:50 |
| Qiming | yes, Austin I think | 13:50 |
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| yanyanhu | if so, should be around 10:30pm? | 13:51 |
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| yanyanhu | can't recall the time difference between us | 13:51 |
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| yanyanhu | anyway, hope he can join it | 13:51 |
| yanyanhu | ok, next topic? | 13:51 |
| yanyanhu | #topic Ocata-2 release | 13:52 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ocata-2 release (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:52 | |
| Qiming | or we can sync with him at least, after the meeting | 13:52 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, sure | 13:52 |
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| yanyanhu | he is also the key of this work I think | 13:52 |
| yanyanhu | so everyone, ocata-2 release will be cut this week | 13:53 |
| Qiming | any high priority bugs ? | 13:53 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, just the one ethan is working on I guess? | 13:53 |
| Qiming | this one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/senlin/+bug/1648681 | 13:53 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1648681 in senlin "Don't set action to failed if acquire lock failed." [Critical,In progress] - Assigned to Ethan Lynn (ethanlynn) | 13:53 |
| yanyanhu | about the action lock acquiring | 13:54 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:54 |
| yanyanhu | this one | 13:54 |
| yanyanhu | other ones are not critical | 13:54 |
| elynn | patches are all submitted at least | 13:54 |
| elynn | need to modify the first patch a little bit. | 13:54 |
| Qiming | will look into them tomorrow | 13:54 |
| yanyanhu | elynn, great | 13:54 |
| Qiming | thx, elynn, acquire_1st_ready is useless now | 13:54 |
| yanyanhu | will check it as well. I think Qiming's comment on the first patch makes sense to me as well | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | we can just remove ***_1st_ready api | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | it will not be used after the new db api is added | 13:55 |
| elynn | The main purpose of these patches are remove acquire_lock retries, and let scheduler pick them up later. | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | elynn, yep | 13:56 |
| Qiming | that makes sense | 13:56 |
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| elynn | So that actions would get failed because of acquire lock failed. | 13:56 |
| yanyanhu | ok, I plan to cut the release on Thursday | 13:56 |
| Qiming | we will need to ensure that scheduler will try find some jobs periodically | 13:56 |
| yanyanhu | by the end of Thursday evening or Friday morning | 13:56 |
| Qiming | alright, will check if there are other things urgent | 13:57 |
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| yanyanhu | great, thanks a lot | 13:57 |
| yanyanhu | ok, open discussion now | 13:57 |
| yanyanhu | 2 minutes left... | 13:57 |
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| yanyanhu | #topic open discussion | 13:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:57 | |
| Qiming | still some patches open for review: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/project:openstack/senlin+status:open | 13:57 |
| yanyanhu | yes, maybe need to close some ones | 13:58 |
| yanyanhu | which are not active for a long while | 13:58 |
| Qiming | most of them are not critical I think | 13:58 |
| yanyanhu | and they can be restored if needed | 13:58 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, I see | 13:58 |
| yanyanhu | will check the list | 13:58 |
| Qiming | except for elynn's | 13:58 |
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| yanyanhu | yep | 13:58 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, great | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | only one minutes left | 13:59 |
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| Qiming | I'll complete the node dependency patch | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, great | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | will help to review | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | ok, time is almost over | 13:59 |
| Qiming | cool | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | lets release the channel | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | thanks all you guys for joinging | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | have a good night | 14:00 |
| yanyanhu | #endmeeting | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 14:00:04 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-12-13-13.00.html | 14:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-12-13-13.00.txt | 14:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-12-13-13.00.log.html | 14:00 |
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| saggi | #startmeeting karbor | 15:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 15:02:20 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is saggi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 15:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'karbor' | 15:02 |
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| yuval | hey | 15:02 |
| saggi | Hi everyone | 15:02 |
| chenying_ | hi | 15:02 |
| leon_wang | hi | 15:02 |
| zhonghua | hi | 15:02 |
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| chenying_ | Do we have any topics? | 15:03 |
| saggi | Doesn't look like it | 15:03 |
| saggi | #topic open discussion | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 15:03 | |
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| yuval | Well, I tried to fix the fullstack gate | 15:04 |
| yuval | At first I thought the move to ubuntu-xenial was the issue | 15:04 |
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| yuval | now it doesn't look like it | 15:04 |
| chenying_ | Yes It seam that the fullstack have failed for serval days. | 15:04 |
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| yuval | besides, heat was removed from devstack and is now an plugin | 15:05 |
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| yuval | I'll update our devstack to include it, but it doesn't solve the gate failure | 15:05 |
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| yuval | I assume something changed in devstack or devstack-gate | 15:07 |
| yuval | will continue working on it tomorrow | 15:07 |
| chenying_ | yuval Good job. | 15:07 |
| chenying_ | I have submitted a patch about purging deleted rows data. If you are free, you can review it. | 15:08 |
| yuval | I wasn't here last week, but if someone sees the gate fails - take a look, it is a high priority | 15:08 |
| yuval | don't assume someone else will take care of it for you | 15:08 |
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| chenying_ | yuval I thought it is a network isuue. | 15:09 |
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| chenying_ | yuval we note that there is a download error about a pip lib. | 15:09 |
| yuval | chenying_: has anyone tried contacting the infra team? send something to the mailing list? | 15:10 |
| chenying_ | yuval Have not yet. | 15:10 |
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| saggi | OK, Listen we are getting close to the Ocata deadline. | 15:11 |
| saggi | Things are still very much unstable | 15:12 |
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| saggi | I don't see a lot of bugs being opened or closed | 15:12 |
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| chenying_ | we may need pay more attention on bugfix. | 15:14 |
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| saggi | We need to pick up the pace | 15:14 |
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| yuval | and a reminder that https://review.openstack.org/348163 is a high priority for ocata | 15:16 |
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| chenying_ | Yuval I don't have any more comments about it. I more care about the refactoring plugins base on this patch. As you know, we need refactor all the plugins base on this one. including the eisoo plugins. | 15:19 |
| yuval | chenying_: we need to merge this one | 15:20 |
| yuval | chenying_: and base plugins on it | 15:20 |
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| yuval | chenying_: unless there are any other comments | 15:21 |
| chenying_ | I will give +1 on it, if there are not any comments for anyone else, we can merged it. | 15:22 |
| yuval | we have 18 more bugs in ocata besides that | 15:22 |
| chenying_ | yuval You mean that the bugs in luanchpad? | 15:23 |
| yuval | chenying_: yes | 15:23 |
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| chenying_ | yuval I already notes these bug. Some of them are bug, some of them is work task trace. | 15:24 |
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| chenying_ | yuval I will pay more attention on the real bug, and to fix it. | 15:25 |
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| yuval | chenying_: what is 'work task trace' | 15:26 |
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| yuval | what bothers me most, and maybe saggi will agree, is that over half of the bugs have no assignee | 15:27 |
| yuval | maybe zhonghua can comment as well | 15:28 |
| chenying_ | just use bug to trace the work want to do. It not a real bug in karbor. | 15:28 |
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| saggi | I agree, you all should look at the list and try and see what you are best suited to fix. | 15:30 |
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| chenying_ | Ok I will. If we have any questions about the bugs in the list, we can discuss it in irc. | 15:32 |
| saggi | OK, any other topics? | 15:32 |
| saggi | Thanks everyone! | 15:33 |
| saggi | #endmeeting | 15:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:33 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 15:33:51 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:33 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-12-13-15.02.html | 15:33 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-12-13-15.02.txt | 15:33 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-12-13-15.02.log.html | 15:33 |
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| stevemar | ping agrebennikov, amakarov, annakoppad, ayoung, bknudson, breton, browne, chrisplo, crinkle, davechen, dolphm, dstanek, edmondsw, edtubill, gagehugo, gyee, henrynash, hrybacki, jamielennox, jaugustine, jgrassler, knikolla, lbragstad, kbaikov, ktychkova, morgan, nisha, nkinder, notmorgan, raildo, ravelar, rderose, rodrigods, roxanaghe, samueldmq, shaleh, spilla, srwilkers, StefanPaetowJisc, stevemar, topol | 17:59 |
| raildo | o/ | 17:59 |
| samueldmq | hi | 17:59 |
| samueldmq | o/ | 17:59 |
| lbragstad | o/ | 17:59 |
| knikolla | o/ | 17:59 |
| dolphm | \o | 17:59 |
| ayoung | hey ho, lets go | 17:59 |
| stevemar | #startmeeting keystone | 17:59 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 17:59:50 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is stevemar. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:59 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 17:59 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 17:59 |
| dstanek | hi | 18:00 |
| * morgan doesn't want to meeeeet. | 18:00 | |
| * morgan is here though. | 18:00 | |
| rodrigods | o/ | 18:00 |
| stevemar | morgan: i feel you, i'm only half way through lunch | 18:00 |
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| morgan | stevemar: i need breakfast. | 18:00 |
| morgan | stevemar: and coffeeeeeeee | 18:01 |
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| stevemar | alright, let's kick things off | 18:01 |
| stevemar | #topic Announcements | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:01 | |
| stevemar | Cutting Ocata-2 this week! This is also spec freeze week, specs must merge now! | 18:01 |
| stevemar | errr, agenda: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting | 18:01 |
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| henrynash | hi | 18:01 |
| morgan | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting | 18:02 |
| stevemar | so i'm kinda concerned about the status of new features and the short release cycle | 18:02 |
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| stevemar | we've got 1 complete, 6 in progress, 4 not started | 18:02 |
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| stevemar | and ocata-2 is *this* week | 18:03 |
| samueldmq | stevemar: also those specs (whose haven't merged) are related to trusts, and ayoung is against | 18:03 |
| stevemar | samueldmq: ignore the specs for now | 18:03 |
| lbragstad | i have time blocked off for http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/keystone-specs/specs/keystone/ocata/pci-dss-password-requirements-api.html today and tomorrow | 18:03 |
| stevemar | these are approved ones | 18:03 |
| lbragstad | i plan to have something up to review this week | 18:03 |
| * samueldmq nods | 18:03 | |
| stevemar | See gerrit topics for where to start reviewing: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/156q820cXcEc8Y9YWQgoc_hyOm3AZ2jtMQM3zdDhwGFU/edit?usp=sharing | 18:03 |
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| stevemar | end of ocata-3 is only about 5-6 weeks away | 18:04 |
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| stevemar | theres no stopping it for holiday break either | 18:04 |
| stevemar | so i'm pessimistic on a lot of these | 18:04 |
| stevemar | especially the "not started" ones | 18:04 |
| dstanek | with all the policy discussions i haven't revisited my saml work, but i'll get on that this week again | 18:04 |
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| rodrigods | stevemar is going to be manager! | 18:05 |
| stevemar | theres also the fact that if everyone is heads down coding, then no one is reviewing | 18:05 |
| stevemar | :P | 18:05 |
| rderose | ravelar will help with extending user API, so we'll have something soon | 18:05 |
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| morgan | the MFA spec is on it's way (working on the migrations etc), but unfortunately, I have a move happening as well. | 18:05 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: since you're focusing on that one, perhaps shaddow mappings could be postponed ? | 18:05 |
| morgan | i'm trying to toss in reviews around coding and packing | 18:05 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: or you think you can do both ? | 18:05 |
| ayoung | mfa was close IIRC | 18:05 |
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| samueldmq | lbragstad: shadow mapping doesn't seem to be a small one | 18:05 |
| morgan | ayoung: mfa spec merged. just needs code | 18:06 |
| stevemar | this is just a heads up -- we can re-evaluate in a few weeks based on how much a specific feature affects critical paths | 18:06 |
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| samueldmq | stevemar: I am reviewing. no features on me | 18:06 |
| morgan | but it is ok if mfa slips, we can implement parts now and final code / enable next cycle if needed | 18:06 |
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| lbragstad | samueldmq i'm still planning on doing both - but i wanted to tackle the password requirements one first since horizon is expecting it | 18:06 |
| morgan | it isn't a ton of code | 18:06 |
| morgan | fwiw, expect a bit more code/reviews from me once i'm moved (next week) and over holidays | 18:07 |
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| stevemar | hopefully everyone has a few quiet last week or two (at work) before the holidays kick in and can review a bit more | 18:07 |
| samueldmq | lbragstad: gotcha | 18:07 |
| gagehugo | o/ | 18:07 |
| * morgan also has shade code to write/review | 18:07 | |
| stevemar | ocata-3 is Jan 23-27 | 18:07 |
| stevemar | at which point anything that isn't merged will get bumped to backlog/pike, or can ask for an exception | 18:08 |
| stevemar | anywho, i'm tired of acting like a PM for 8 minutes :P | 18:08 |
| stevemar | next topic! | 18:08 |
| stevemar | #topic Require domain_id when registering Identity Providers | 18:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Require domain_id when registering Identity Providers (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:09 | |
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| stevemar | rderose: ^ | 18:09 |
| rderose | In preparation for extending the user API and to help Horizon with domain admin support, | 18:09 |
| rderose | We want to replace the hardcoded 'Federated' domain with a real domain for federated users. | 18:09 |
| rderose | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/399684/ | 18:09 |
| rderose | The new domain will be related to the IdP (1:1) and thus, we'll require a domain_id when registering new IdPs. | 18:09 |
| rderose | To be backwards compatible, if the domain is not explicitly set via the API, we'll automatically create the domain and relate it to the IdP. | 18:09 |
| rderose | I'm just looking to get this reviewed, but let me know if you have any questions or concerns. | 18:09 |
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| stevemar | rderose: that sounds all good to me | 18:09 |
| stevemar | rderose: quick observation... | 18:09 |
| ayoung | I like this. Should have been this way from the get go | 18:09 |
| henrynash | ayoung: ++ | 18:10 |
| samueldmq | rderose: any specific question or something to discuss or just a "this is the status, needs review"? | 18:10 |
| dstanek | rderose: automatically create the 'Federated' domain right? | 18:10 |
| stevemar | rderose: what about auto-creating a domain with the same name if one isn't supplied when creating an idp? | 18:10 |
| morgan | as long as we avoid more magic domains like default | 18:10 |
| rderose | samueldmq: yeah, just want to bring into attention | 18:10 |
| samueldmq | rderose: ++ | 18:10 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: that can possibly be done with a migration | 18:11 |
| rderose | dstanek: auto create the IdP domain | 18:11 |
| morgan | if we can, in any way avoid it | 18:11 |
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| ayoung | rderose, the domain_id attribute on the IDP is going to be editable, right, so that people can munge things that they got wrong when creating IdPs? | 18:11 |
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| rodrigods | rderose, like the idea! | 18:11 |
| morgan | and by magic i mean "default:" being the ID | 18:11 |
| rderose | stevemar: it will create a domain and the name will be the IdP id | 18:11 |
| rderose | IdP doesn't have a name | 18:11 |
| stevemar | rderose: cool | 18:11 |
| morgan | so as long as it doesn't get magic ids on the new domain, i'm ok with it | 18:11 |
| dstanek | rderose: is that backward compatible? | 18:11 |
| ayoung | rderose, if there is a clash, if there is a domain already named that way, what do you propose? | 18:12 |
| rderose | ayoung: no updates | 18:12 |
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| dstanek | right now all idps share a domain namespace (err....kinda, if it were working) | 18:12 |
| rderose | ayoung: concerned about the implications of changing the domain | 18:12 |
| rderose | ayoung: so you'd have to delete and recreate the IdP | 18:12 |
| rderose | dstanek: yes, backwards compatible | 18:12 |
| ayoung | rderose, if I create the domain first, then create the IdP, and it creates a new domain, I guess delete the IdP and recreate with the new API | 18:12 |
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| morgan | rderose: that is... not great. can we provide an admin a mechanism to map the idp to a domain sideband in that case? | 18:12 |
| rodrigods | morgan, ++ | 18:13 |
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| ayoung | morgan, it is suboptimal, but it will also be rare | 18:13 |
| morgan | it would mean things change for user(s), but it's really letting the admin do something about it | 18:13 |
| ayoung | I say lets go with this for now, and add additional mechanisms as a follow on | 18:13 |
| stevemar | rderose: rather than answering this flurry of questions, can you map out the different cases that'll happen in an etherpad or in a spec or release note ? | 18:13 |
| dstanek | rderose: in an existing cloud with 2 idps will you migrate them to have two new domains? | 18:13 |
| rderose | morgan: what's the concern? if we create a domain for the IdP | 18:13 |
| dstanek | stevemar: ++ | 18:13 |
| morgan | rderose: if the domain exists | 18:13 |
| ayoung | BTW, do NOT cascade the delte | 18:13 |
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| ayoung | delete | 18:13 |
| rderose | dstanek: yes | 18:13 |
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| ayoung | if we delete the IdP, do not delete the domain | 18:14 |
| morgan | rderose: let the admin map the idp ito the domain. | 18:14 |
| morgan | also waht ayoung said. | 18:14 |
| ayoung | if there is a domain with the name that matches the IdP, grab it | 18:14 |
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| stevemar | rderose: address the migration case, the create case and the update case | 18:14 |
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| morgan | anyway. | 18:14 |
| ayoung | let me restart that | 18:14 |
| stevemar | *cough* etherpad for this *cough* | 18:14 |
| rderose | stevemar: will do | 18:14 |
| ayoung | when creating, if the idp_id matches an existing domain name, make that the domain for the IdP | 18:14 |
| stevemar | way too many combinations to flesh out in a meeting ayoung -- but i'll give you a quick go at it | 18:14 |
| ayoung | discuss after meeting. Lets get this one in | 18:14 |
| dstanek | etherpad: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-idp-domain-questions | 18:15 |
| stevemar | dstanek: ty | 18:15 |
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| stevemar | okay | 18:15 |
| ayoung | post in the code review, please | 18:15 |
| stevemar | ayoung: the code review being https://review.openstack.org/#/c/399684/ | 18:16 |
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| ayoung | I mean post response in the review request | 18:16 |
| ayoung | not in etherpad | 18:16 |
| ayoung | that is what review is for | 18:16 |
| stevemar | ayoung: can be easily done | 18:16 |
| stevemar | next topic | 18:16 |
| stevemar | #topic Role check from middleware | 18:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Role check from middleware (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:16 | |
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| stevemar | i think this is the only spec that is close to making the ocata cut-off | 18:17 |
| ayoung | this had 2 +2s, but I left it open | 18:17 |
| ayoung | there are not radical changes from last weekl | 18:17 |
| stevemar | are there any last minute dissenters on this one ? | 18:17 |
| ayoung | 1: better defaults | 18:17 |
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| ayoung | 2: allowing multiple roles per API | 18:17 |
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| morgan | i am not opposed to this. | 18:17 |
| stevemar | i think henrynash gave it his blessing | 18:18 |
| morgan | i think it is closest to the right direction for policy updates that has been proposed. | 18:18 |
| henrynash | indeed :-) | 18:18 |
| lbragstad | i had a bunch of comments - specifically around mapping things using the URLs, but dstanek ayoung edmondsw and I have been talking through it since Friday | 18:18 |
| morgan | i can add a +2 if you'd like. | 18:18 |
| ayoung | please do | 18:18 |
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| dstanek | yeah, i'll still not a fan of using URLs for this at all | 18:18 |
| stevemar | edmondsw: o/ | 18:18 |
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| ayoung | We can amend if there are new details | 18:18 |
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| morgan | ayoung: link? | 18:18 |
| ayoung | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/391624/ | 18:19 |
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| morgan | ty | 18:19 |
| edmondsw | ayoung have you made any of the changes we were discussing end of last week? | 18:19 |
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| ayoung | edmondsw, yes, I added in the multiple roles part | 18:19 |
| edmondsw | I was out yesterday, haven't looked | 18:19 |
| stevemar | fyi - i'm probably going to -2 the rest of the open specs | 18:19 |
| dstanek | RBAC by URL and policy by operational target | 18:19 |
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| samueldmq | dstanek: what is operational target ? | 18:19 |
| lbragstad | identity:get_user | 18:20 |
| ayoung | dstanek, I think what we can work toward over time is a closer mapping from URL to the existing policy rules | 18:20 |
| morgan | ayoung: done | 18:20 |
| dstanek | samueldmq: what we use in policy today | 18:20 |
| samueldmq | kk | 18:20 |
| edmondsw | samueldmq target = the resource you're acting on | 18:20 |
| morgan | ayoung: it is explicitly stated as ok since it's ongoing and such | 18:20 |
| ayoung | without some way to map that, though, we need to start with the URL | 18:20 |
| dstanek | edmondsw: it's not the resource it the operation you are doing | 18:20 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: you had the policy working group going on, does this align what that? | 18:20 |
| samueldmq | edmondsw: gotcha | 18:20 |
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| stevemar | lbragstad: i'll admit i haven't been keeping up with that one | 18:21 |
| lbragstad | stevemar we're starting from square one there | 18:21 |
| edmondsw | dstanek I'd say it's both | 18:21 |
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| dstanek | get user isn't a resource | 18:21 |
| edmondsw | user is a resource | 18:21 |
| dstanek | exactly | 18:21 |
| lbragstad | stevemar we want to define usecases on what the idea solution should be and we're (mainly dstanek and myself) still working on that | 18:21 |
| edmondsw | and policy can check attributes of the resource | 18:21 |
| dstanek | user is a specific instance of the get_user operation with additional context...namely the id you want to get | 18:22 |
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| samueldmq | lbragstad: nice, starting from usecases is always the right path | 18:22 |
| dstanek | as i understand it the RBAC is on the operation and the existing policy is on the resource | 18:22 |
| morgan | dstanek: ++ | 18:22 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: my concern is that we get ayoung working on this solution and then you and dstanek come up with another overhaul in a few months | 18:23 |
| morgan | that is what the core of this change is started | 18:23 |
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| dstanek | stevemar: for the policy meeting we have been going around in circles...just begining to have an architectural vision defined | 18:23 |
| edmondsw | dstanek, right... well, existing policy is on both operation and resource... that's what I'm saying | 18:23 |
| lbragstad | stevemar ^ yeah.. that's a problem, too | 18:23 |
| ayoung | stevemar, so, I don't think having the mechanism defined this way is super committing | 18:23 |
| dstanek | stevemar: that's my concern as well - that's why lbragstad and i have been trying to capture all the things | 18:23 |
| lbragstad | right now - i'd be happy if we could agree on a vision | 18:23 |
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| stevemar | ayoung: right, this is pretty isolated code, i liked that | 18:24 |
| ayoung | we can alwasy build better automation to tie oslo policy and RBAC together if we find they start to diverge | 18:24 |
| morgan | the split of operation and resource action aslo makes a lot of sense in general | 18:24 |
| ayoung | what is really lacking in code now is a mapping between URL and Role. | 18:24 |
| stevemar | ayoung: and i think this will take the Pike cycle as well right? | 18:24 |
| morgan | regardless of what policy meeting comes up with | 18:24 |
| ayoung | stevemar, I think that I can get a proof of concept of this workig in Ocata | 18:24 |
| morgan | since it's mostly an enhancement of what we do today | 18:24 |
| ayoung | the changes are pretty minimal: keystone server change needs to be updated to reflect the spec | 18:25 |
| morgan | it should give the policy folks more fidelity in definition even if there are changes. | 18:25 |
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| ayoung | keystone client is essentially a REST API | 18:25 |
| stevemar | OK, it sounds like we still have runway for dstanek and lbragstad to figure out if they can come up with something and live with the RBAC check in middleware regardless | 18:25 |
| ayoung | middleware needs to use the keystoneclient and cache | 18:25 |
| dstanek | morgan: i agree on the split. my biggest issue with the spec as-is is that we use the URL | 18:25 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: what else is there to use? | 18:26 |
| dstanek | stevemar: we already use the operation target - so know you have to know that an the URL | 18:26 |
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| dstanek | and to be honest i don't know the URLs for 95% of what i use in openstack | 18:26 |
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| dstanek | actually it's not just the URL you need, you also need to know what verb is going to be used | 18:27 |
| knikolla | almost everything is /<project_id>/resource/<resource_id> thankfully | 18:27 |
| morgan | dstanek: unfortuantely from middleware you can't easily map operation to url. | 18:27 |
| stevemar | dstanek: that's funny, i prefer looking at the APIs / URLs | 18:27 |
| knikolla | <resource_type>* | 18:27 |
| morgan | since middlweware is above the application | 18:27 |
| morgan | i also tend to prefer the URL vs the underlying method(s) like we have today | 18:27 |
| dstanek | morgan: yeah, i think there would have be be a mapping defined and i think it would be pretty easy to pull that out of routes | 18:28 |
| morgan | knikolla: there has been a real effort to remove <project_id> from URIs in projects | 18:28 |
| dstanek | at least in keystone | 18:28 |
| ayoung | dstanek, but the URL+VERB is what is documented | 18:28 |
| morgan | dstanek: in keystone is different then in nova | 18:28 |
| ayoung | not 100% of course | 18:28 |
| ayoung | as edmondsw was about to state, I am sure | 18:28 |
| edmondsw | dstanek stevemar's question is a good one, though... what other option do we have? How would middleware map from the Verb+URL of the request to something you would recognize? | 18:28 |
| morgan | dstanek: so, look at it from not-keystone perspective. | 18:28 |
| ayoung | but that is what is in the api-refs | 18:28 |
| dstanek | morgan: no, i agree we need to. i'm saying we should :-) | 18:29 |
| edmondsw | ayoung ++ | 18:29 |
| dstanek | so if i want to know if i can restart a vm i'll have to know the URL and the target to check? | 18:29 |
| morgan | i've always hated the policy file referencing the underlying methods | 18:29 |
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| morgan | URLs are far far more stable | 18:30 |
| knikolla | morgan: oh, cool. right now only glance doesn't have the project_id in the url. | 18:30 |
| edmondsw | dstanek but "you" aren't a user in that case... you're horizon or another client | 18:30 |
| ayoung | dstanek, yes, that is the contract | 18:30 |
| morgan | knikolla: nova was working on it | 18:30 |
| morgan | knikolla: and has made strides to support both | 18:30 |
| dstanek | edmondsw: i could be the user...what can i do with this token...right? | 18:30 |
| morgan | knikolla: and i think cinder is really the only other one.... the project id is in the token. | 18:30 |
| knikolla | morgan: now if they only supported a unified pagination method :) | 18:30 |
| morgan | knikolla: not now. | 18:31 |
| dstanek | i just think in general that a service should be responsible for what it's URLs mean and not everyone else | 18:31 |
| dstanek | RESTful and all that | 18:31 |
| morgan | knikolla: lets not derail this | 18:31 |
| edmondsw | edmondsw dstanek doubtful... a user would use a client, and that client would abstract this from them | 18:31 |
| morgan | dstanek: ah you're asking for something different then. not urls but also not what we have today | 18:31 |
| edmondsw | dstanek if the user is using the APIs directly rather than a client, then obviously they already understand APIs | 18:32 |
| * morgan still thinks URLs is most correct. | 18:32 | |
| samueldmq | put a description on it | 18:32 |
| samueldmq | action+url+description | 18:32 |
| dstanek | edmondsw: sure, but they also have to now the target so that case is moot | 18:32 |
| knikolla | edmondsw: they understand the type of resource and the action they want to do. | 18:32 |
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| edmondsw | dstanek knikolla of course they understand the target resource, but the middleware doesn't | 18:33 |
| dstanek | i know i want to list domains not /v3/domains/list or is it /v3/list/domains or /v3/domains? | 18:33 |
| dstanek | ok. so instead of making the serivce keep a mapping for the middleware to use we are making then keep a mapping that they have to jam directly into keystone? | 18:34 |
| edmondsw | dstanek so you go to openstackclient, right? and it can map Verb+URL information from the keystone API's response into something prettier if we want | 18:34 |
| samueldmq | {'action':'GET', 'url':' /v3/domains', 'description': 'List domains'} | 18:34 |
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| edmondsw | dstanek, but how would middleware know anything but the Verb+URL? | 18:35 |
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| dstanek | edmondsw: the service would somehow configure that mapping | 18:35 |
| samueldmq | so it's easy to operators to see what is the semantics on the operation | 18:35 |
| edmondsw | dstanek how? | 18:35 |
| ayoung | dstanek, I think, over time, we can do that | 18:36 |
| dstanek | edmondsw: simple was is config file, complex way is a callback, and i can probably think of other ways to do this | 18:36 |
| ayoung | but not out the gate | 18:36 |
| knikolla | keystone already has the service catalog, maybe services would expose a URL with mappings when registering to the catalog | 18:36 |
| morgan | dstanek: would you be ok with URLs and an addition to make it easier / friendlier down the line once you've thought of it | 18:36 |
| morgan | dstanek: so both could be done? | 18:36 |
| edmondsw | dstanek if you can solve that, then I don't see why we couldn't support 2 different formats... one that is Verb+URL and another based on that mapping, and let the caller determine which they want to provide/receive | 18:36 |
| morgan | i really think URLs is a correct method to use. | 18:36 |
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| ayoung | the router framework in Keystone, for example, gives us a logical place to link to the policy rule | 18:36 |
| morgan | even if we have another as well | 18:36 |
| dstanek | morgan: well right out of the gate how does nova upgrade? | 18:36 |
| ayoung | but that differs for every project | 18:36 |
| ayoung | so we do that manually to start | 18:36 |
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| dstanek | ayoung: yeah in keystone it's trivial to look up the route and inspect @protected | 18:37 |
| ayoung | we Need it at the URL level. the trick is to then map that to the policy rules, and that will take a lot of effort | 18:37 |
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| morgan | ayoung: ++ | 18:37 |
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| ayoung | dstanek, and I suspect that, over time, we could do the same for other projects | 18:37 |
| dstanek | ayoung: yeah, i'm just arguing who should own the mapping | 18:37 |
| ayoung | the way Nova does it, for example | 18:37 |
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| ayoung | dstanek, so, to start, we use good defaults on the ROles and punt on detailed mapping | 18:38 |
| ayoung | we can make a first hack using the api-ref | 18:38 |
| ayoung | but if most APIs require the Member role, we can focus on excludimng those that would be broken by an RBAC checjk | 18:38 |
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| ayoung | like discovery | 18:38 |
| dstanek | ayoung: keeping URLs? | 18:39 |
| ayoung | dstanek, we need to be able to report at the URL level | 18:40 |
| morgan | 20m left (timecheck) | 18:40 |
| ayoung | it is a requirement | 18:40 |
| ayoung | "what role do I need for this operation" | 18:40 |
| ayoung | we can change the mechanism, but that requirement has to be met | 18:40 |
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| dstanek | i'm just saying that the service should own the mapping and that is best left out of keystone - not that roles shouldn't be checked at the verb+url level | 18:41 |
| stevemar | thanks morgan | 18:41 |
| dstanek | we can continue in -keystone later if needed | 18:42 |
| stevemar | dstanek: we actually have time, only 1 topic left | 18:42 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: your topic, actually | 18:42 |
| dstanek | stevemar: no expired tokens? | 18:43 |
| morgan | i don't see jamielennox | 18:43 |
| stevemar | dstanek: no, i think jamie and i figured it out | 18:43 |
| stevemar | lets switch gears to your topic dstanek | 18:44 |
| stevemar | #topic versioning mapping | 18:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "versioning mapping (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:44 | |
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| dstanek | ayoung: when you ask "what role do I need for this operation" are you asking the service or keystone? | 18:44 |
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| dstanek | version mapping....i just wanted to get community thoughts on this | 18:44 |
| edmondsw | dstanek keystone | 18:44 |
| dstanek | we have mapping for federation right now that is nice, but has its warts | 18:45 |
| ayoung | dstanek, what does that mean? | 18:45 |
| dstanek | also maybe needs a feature or two | 18:45 |
| ayoung | Vesioning of what? APIS? | 18:45 |
| dstanek | would anyone be opposed to adding something in the mapping to indicated a version identifier? | 18:45 |
| morgan | dstanek: can you describe the use-case | 18:46 |
| dstanek | ayoung: not APIs. the mapping itself | 18:46 |
| dstanek | so some possible things that have been thrown around: | 18:46 |
| morgan | i'm not clear on the use. i'm sure it's not something i'm opposed to | 18:46 |
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| ayoung | dstanek, Federation mapping? | 18:46 |
| morgan | but i want to know what you're talking about | 18:46 |
| stevemar | ayoung: yes federation mapping | 18:46 |
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| dstanek | - fix the way to do indexed matching that that all remote matches are available | 18:46 |
| dstanek | - add the provisioning stuff that dolphm & lbragstad have talked about | 18:47 |
| stevemar | i think what dstanek is getting at is that if you create a new mapping and have something like {version: 2} in the payload, it'll go through a different set of rules ? | 18:47 |
| dstanek | - adding some extra features allowing mapping to grab data directly out of SAML instead of just the environment | 18:47 |
| ayoung | dstanek, ++ | 18:47 |
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| morgan | sure | 18:47 |
| lbragstad | stevemar ++ | 18:47 |
| morgan | no issues with that idea at all | 18:47 |
| ayoung | I am not 100% sure it is required, but it does let us deprecate features | 18:47 |
| dstanek | stevemar: yeah, and first step is to say the next version is an object and not a list | 18:48 |
| morgan | similar to fernet token types | 18:48 |
| stevemar | dstanek: how will you "grab data directly out os SAML" ? | 18:48 |
| morgan | just for the mapping. | 18:48 |
| morgan | wfm | 18:48 |
| morgan | dstanek: thanks for clarifying | 18:48 |
| lbragstad | stevemar that would probably come with native saml support | 18:48 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: okay, thought as much | 18:48 |
| dstanek | stevemar: in my saml work i have to recreate the shib mapping stuff already | 18:48 |
| dstanek | morgan: yep, just for mapping | 18:48 |
| stevemar | right right, it just looked funny when comparing it to today's functionality | 18:48 |
| morgan | it's fine to give versions for rulesets like that | 18:48 |
| morgan | just make sure it's usable | 18:49 |
| dstanek | ayoung: i would love the ability to deprecate anything we see as cruft :-) | 18:49 |
| morgan | :) | 18:49 |
| stevemar | dstanek: i think this is fine -- nova did similar things with block_mapping | 18:49 |
| morgan | dstanek: it's much the same as i want for auth in general | 18:49 |
| morgan | dstanek: so we can move auth data/types/payloads forward without breaking everyone | 18:49 |
| lbragstad | dstanek so - kind of related, but does that make the shadow mapping stuff dependent on introducing versioning first? | 18:49 |
| stevemar | dstanek: the engine mapper needs love, but if starting from scratch is easier, then go for it | 18:49 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: is that something i should look for soon or no? | 18:51 |
| dstanek | lbragstad: good question. i don't think it needs to be if you dn't change the behavior of existing mappings | 18:51 |
| dstanek | stevemar: i'll write up a spec today | 18:51 |
| dstanek | stevemar: if push comes to shove it can wait a release | 18:51 |
| stevemar | dstanek: why not piggy back that the existing mapping engine spec? | 18:51 |
| dstanek | stevemar: sure, i can do that | 18:52 |
| ayoung | dstanek, you might recall the jdennis had a pretty exhaustive mapping mechanism which he proposed a few years back | 18:52 |
| lbragstad | dstanek do we have a good reason to wait for mapping versions for provisioning? | 18:52 |
| stevemar | dstanek: i think it aligns with http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/keystone-specs/specs/keystone/ocata/shadow-mapping.html | 18:52 |
| morgan | timecheck 8 min left | 18:52 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: i thought versioning would make provisioning easier? | 18:52 |
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| stevemar | thats why you wanted to do it? | 18:52 |
| dstanek | ayoung: yeah, this would allow us to use other mapping engines like what he propesed. i actually was thinking of his demo when we were talking about this yesterday | 18:53 |
| ayoung | cool | 18:53 |
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| lbragstad | stevemar yeah - it probably would.. because you'd be able to create mappings with versions and that could imply auto provisioning | 18:53 |
| dstanek | stevemar: yes, among other reasons | 18:54 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: okay, so it would go versioning -> provisioning -> profit? | 18:54 |
| stevemar | dstanek rderose lbragstad thanks for all the federation work -- really nice to see it become a first class citizen | 18:55 |
| lbragstad | so in that case - provisioning would only work for mappings that have specific versions. | 18:55 |
| ayoung | 5 minute warning | 18:55 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: i'm open to either, i assumed you wanted it that way for ease of impl. | 18:55 |
| stevemar | rather than add a bunch of new checks to already hacky mapping code | 18:56 |
| dstanek | stevemar: ayoung inspired me to think about federation in a different way :-) | 18:56 |
| ayoung | Uh oh | 18:56 |
| stevemar | ayoung inspires all of us | 18:56 |
| lbragstad | stevemar that's true | 18:56 |
| knikolla | ++ | 18:56 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: i'll leave that call to you | 18:56 |
| dstanek | lbragstad: you and i can talk about that offline and come up with a strategy | 18:56 |
| stevemar | #topic open discussion | 18:56 |
| * lbragstad ponders | 18:56 | |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:56 | |
| stevemar | any last minute stuff n things? | 18:56 |
| lbragstad | well - we have a policy meeting tomorrow | 18:57 |
| rodrigods | just fyi... think we are close to have federated auth tests | 18:57 |
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| stevemar | i'll run the meeting next week, but probably cancel the one on the 27th | 18:57 |
| lbragstad | ok | 18:57 |
| dstanek | perfect | 18:58 |
| stevemar | i'll run the meeting on the 3rd again, half-expecting low attendance :) | 18:58 |
| samueldmq | makes senes | 18:58 |
| stevemar | i think we're all good | 18:58 |
| stevemar | thanks for coming folks | 18:58 |
| samueldmq | thanks stevemar | 18:58 |
| lbragstad | good meeting | 18:58 |
| samueldmq | thanks all | 18:58 |
| stevemar | see you next week, same bat-time, same bat-channel | 18:59 |
| samueldmq | :) | 18:59 |
| henrynash | pow! | 18:59 |
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| lbragstad | o/ | 18:59 |
| crinkle | o/ | 18:59 |
| stevemar | henrynash: bam! | 18:59 |
| stevemar | #endmeeting | 18:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 18:59:21 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-12-13-17.59.html | 18:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-12-13-17.59.txt | 18:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-12-13-17.59.log.html | 18:59 |
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| * stevemar feels clever for ending the keystone meeting the same way fungi ended the infra meeting last week | 18:59 | |
| fungi | thanks stevemar! | 19:00 |
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| fungi | infra team, assemble! | 19:00 |
| zara_the_lemur__ | o/ | 19:00 |
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| auggy | o/ | 19:01 |
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| zaro | O/ | 19:01 |
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| fungi | this week we have topics proposed by jeblair and auggy | 19:01 |
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| jeblair | auggy: ^5 | 19:01 |
| fungi | i'll give everyone another minute to file in while i finish last-minute prep | 19:01 |
| rcarrillocruz | o/ | 19:01 |
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| ianw | hello | 19:02 |
| clarkb | hello | 19:02 |
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| fungi | #startmeeting infra | 19:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 19:03:08 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:03 |
| olaph | o/ | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 19:03 |
| fungi | #topic Announcements | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
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| fungi | #info REMINDER: If you want to come hack on Infra things at the PTG a couple months from now in Atlanta, don't forget to sign up! | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link https://pikeptg.eventbrite.com/ | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link http://www.openstack.org/ptg | 19:03 |
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| fungi | i'm told there is plenty of travel assistance available too--if you need it don't be embarassed to ask for it | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link http://www.openstack.org/ptg#tab_travel | 19:03 |
| fungi | SpamapS asked if there would be zuul v3 goodness happening there, and unless the next ptl (if it isn't me) decides otherwise, i expect it to be a primary activity | 19:04 |
| fungi | i hope to have some semblance of an agendaish thing put together soon | 19:04 |
| * morgan needs to book a hotel for PTG things | 19:05 | |
| fungi | but really if there's anything infra-related you want to work on and you think at least one other person will be around to collaborate on it with you, we'll work it in somehow | 19:05 |
| fungi | as always, feel free to hit me up with announcements you want included in future meetings | 19:05 |
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| fungi | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:05 | |
| fungi | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-12-06-19.03.html | 19:05 |
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| fungi | pabelanger add openstackci::zuul_launcher puppet class | 19:06 |
| fungi | that was the only one we had | 19:06 |
| fungi | we're using that at this point, yeah? | 19:06 |
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| fungi | or are we still going through the openstack_project module for it? | 19:06 |
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| fungi | hrm, yeah i don't see any recent changes of pabelanger's, open or merged, for puppet-openstackci | 19:07 |
| clarkb | I think zaro and pabelanger mentioned that is still todo | 19:07 |
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| pabelanger | o/ | 19:08 |
| fungi | oh, there's pabelanger! | 19:08 |
| pabelanger | fungi: clarkb: yes, on the list to start today | 19:08 |
| fungi | should i just push that reminder back on the stack for now? | 19:08 |
| pabelanger | sorry for dragging this on | 19:08 |
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| fungi | no apologies needed | 19:08 |
| fungi | #action pabelanger add openstackci::zuul_launcher puppet class | 19:08 |
| fungi | we can revisit next week | 19:08 |
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| pabelanger | Yes, will have patches ready before then | 19:09 |
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| fungi | awesome. thanks! | 19:09 |
| fungi | #topic Specs approval | 19:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:09 | |
| fungi | #info APPROVED "Zuul v3: use Zookeeper for Nodepool-Zuul protocol" | 19:09 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/305506 "Zuul v3: use Zookeeper for Nodepool-Zuul protocol" spec update | 19:09 |
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| fungi | that's even less scary now that we're actually using zk in nodepool.o.o already ;) | 19:10 |
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| jeblair | yay! and i'll shortly clear the zuulv3->master merge so we can start working on it | 19:10 |
| fungi | #info "Newton testing on Xenial" spec moved to implemented | 19:11 |
| fungi | [and there was much rejoicing] | 19:12 |
| fungi | #info "Automate Creating Branches" spec moved to implemented | 19:12 |
| fungi | i also have proposed to mark the artifact signing spec as implemented | 19:12 |
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| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/409906 "Artifact signing is now implemented" change | 19:13 |
| fungi | though there's one last outstanding documentation change it's waiting on reviews for: | 19:13 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/409905 "Document documenting rotated signing keys" change | 19:13 |
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| fungi | if anybody thinks of any other specs in the approved list that can be moved to abandoned or implemented, please give me a heads up | 19:14 |
| fungi | #topic Specs approval: PROPOSED "Zuul v3: update with Ansible role information" spec update (jeblair) | 19:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED "Zuul v3: update with Ansible role information" spec update (jeblair) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:14 | |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/381329 "Zuul v3: update with Ansible role information" spec update | 19:14 |
| jeblair | i think this is ready for approval; and with it, we should be able to actually write the bit of zuulv3 that runs ansible jobs for real | 19:15 |
| rcarrillocruz | i like the fact it leaves the door open for requirements.yaml | 19:16 |
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| rcarrillocruz | +1 from me | 19:16 |
| fungi | yeah, seems like a great fleshing out of the missing bits for the ansible portion of the spec | 19:17 |
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| fungi | anybody have any immediate questions about it they want to raise here? | 19:18 |
| fungi | #info The "Zuul v3: update with Ansible role information" spec update is open for Infra Council vote until 19:00 UTC Thursday, December 15. | 19:18 |
| jeblair | thanks! | 19:18 |
| fungi | if you come up with questions, obviously follow up in the review linked above | 19:18 |
| fungi | #topic Priority Efforts | 19:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:19 | |
| fungi | just a side note that the xenial job transition spec which was a priority effort was, as i mentioned, moved to implemented | 19:19 |
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| clarkb | yes after a long week of staring at yaml this is now done | 19:20 |
| fungi | though the publish jobs for the specs site raced, so it doesn't reflect it at the moment | 19:20 |
| fungi | i'm going ahead and removing it from the priority efforts section of our agenda now | 19:20 |
| fungi | thanks clarkb for driving that, and to everyone who helped write and review changes for it | 19:21 |
| jeblair | clarkb: thanks! | 19:21 |
| clarkb | its worth noting that there is apparently a libvirtd realloc issue that e-r is tracking on xenial. (This is why we test like this) | 19:21 |
| pabelanger | indeed, thanks for that | 19:21 |
| fungi | and it's now officially off the agenda ;) | 19:22 |
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| fungi | i don't see any priority effort updates for this week, aside from the zuul v3/nodepool specs mentioned above | 19:22 |
| jeblair | clarkb: that's a "nice" reminder that this is actually a thing, despite all the stuff we pip install, etc. :) | 19:22 |
| fungi | oh, though i guess... | 19:22 |
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| fungi | #topic Priority Efforts: Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers | 19:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts: Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:23 | |
| fungi | as of friday i guess? this is more or less working | 19:23 |
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| clarkb | I think pabelanger said there is a known oustanding issue to be corrected by next daemon restart | 19:23 |
| fungi | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2016-December/004972.html Upcoming Nodepool changes | 19:24 |
| jeblair | yeah, i've proposed the merge of the zuulv3 branch to master | 19:24 |
| jeblair | and after that lands, i will switch the prod machines back to running from master | 19:24 |
| fungi | nodepool 0.3.1 (final pre-zk release) was tagged a couple hours ago be jeblair | 19:24 |
| fungi | er, by | 19:24 |
| pabelanger | clarkb: yup | 19:24 |
| clarkb | I =2'd it but didn't approve so that we can check the integration tests first | 19:24 |
| jeblair | and after that, we'll restart | 19:25 |
| clarkb | but otherwise it looked fine to me | 19:25 |
| jeblair | clarkb: good call | 19:25 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/410357 "Merge feature/zuulv3 into master" change | 19:25 |
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| fungi | anything else need saying about this? | 19:26 |
| fungi | oh, i remember... does the zk merge effectively drop snapshot image support for now? | 19:26 |
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| jeblair | fungi: yes | 19:27 |
| fungi | i assume snapshot images still work in 0.3.1 | 19:27 |
| clarkb | correct | 19:27 |
| fungi | so that'll be a big warning when we release 0.4.0 or whatever i guess | 19:27 |
| clarkb | it was integration tested too up to taht point | 19:27 |
| clarkb | so pretty confident it was working in 0.3.1 | 19:28 |
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| fungi | i recall there was mention of adding support for telling nodepool to use a pre-built image instead of trying to build one. i'm guessing that's not on the roadmap for 0.4.0, is it? | 19:29 |
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| jeblair | fungi: i think it's something we should support, but it's not in our critical path for infra atm so isn't on the immediate roadmap. | 19:30 |
| clarkb | it would probably be a farily straightforward change though if someone wanted to make it | 19:30 |
| fungi | i guess the messaging around it will be that we recommend 0.4.0 for anyone who can use dib-built diskimages, and those who rely on snapshot images should continue to pin to <0.4.0 | 19:30 |
| clarkb | basically a nodepool.yaml edit to provider images with an image uuid | 19:30 |
| clarkb | and teach nodepool to not talk to zk if thats set | 19:30 |
| clarkb | or something | 19:30 |
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| jeblair | clarkb: yep | 19:30 |
| jeblair | it's mostly a matter of *not* doing things :) | 19:31 |
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| fungi | cool, just wanted to make sure i was clear on the point at which we were dropping support for that, since i know it's been mildly contentious | 19:32 |
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| jeblair | also, if anyone wants to write support for that, it can definitely be done in the new system | 19:32 |
| fungi | and if nothing else, we have a recommended feature implementation should someone miss it so much that they want to hack on the alternative solution | 19:32 |
| fungi | yeah, that | 19:32 |
| jeblair | and the same holds true for snapshot builds | 19:33 |
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| fungi | anybody want to talk about anything else having to do with the nodepool work on zookeeper-connected workers? | 19:33 |
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| fungi | thanks jeblair and pabelanger for getting that into place last week (and to everyone else who worked on it up to now as well) | 19:34 |
| ianw | i spent a bit of time looking at the centos7 zookeeper story again -> https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zookeeper-epel7 | 19:35 |
| ianw | we'll keep working on it | 19:35 |
| fungi | oh, right, so that nodepool 0.4.0 and zuul v3 can continue to be packaged? | 19:35 |
| fungi | that looked like a crazy dep chain | 19:36 |
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| ianw | yeah, it's turtles all the way down | 19:36 |
| pabelanger | Ya, hoping to help with the zookeeper effort for centos :) | 19:36 |
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| ianw | i have a "package", that's a zk release stuffed into an rpm | 19:37 |
| fungi | presumably it's all been packaged on debian, so should be packagable on centos as well (if there's enough elbow grease on hand) | 19:37 |
| clarkb | ya debuntu has packages | 19:38 |
| fungi | #link https://packages.debian.org/sid/libzookeeper-java where the dep chain starts to show up | 19:38 |
| pabelanger | fedora rawhide has zookeeper RPM, so all the bits are there, just need to get it into epel | 19:39 |
| pabelanger | I've been using that locally, works as expected | 19:39 |
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| fungi | oh, so mostly a backporting challenge then, bot a lot of specfiles that need to be written from scratch? | 19:39 |
| fungi | s/bot/not/ | 19:39 |
| pabelanger | right | 19:39 |
| jeblair | bot a lot indeed | 19:39 |
| fungi | it's a botload | 19:39 |
| fungi | #topic possible hosting for a nova bugs dashboard (auggy) | 19:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "possible hosting for a nova bugs dashboard (auggy) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:40 | |
| fungi | #link http://45.55.105.55:8082/bugs-dashboard.html current nova bugs dashboard | 19:40 |
| auggy | yes! we chatted in #openstack-infra about this | 19:41 |
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| auggy | i just wanted to check on what you all need from me in order to evaluate this request | 19:41 |
| fungi | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-December/108872.html Useful metrics? | 19:41 |
| fungi | (related ml thread) | 19:41 |
| auggy | basically we have this dashboard we use that markus wrote and hosted, and we just want it centralized so it's not depending on a single person | 19:41 |
| auggy | so i thought i'd ask if it made sense to have you all host it, but if you have other suggestions then I'm open to that too | 19:42 |
| fungi | #link https://github.com/markuszoeller/openstack/blob/master/scripts/launchpad/bugs_dashboard.py Creates a HTML file which can be used as a dashboard for cleanup tasks of the bug management. | 19:42 |
| auggy | It's a python script that runs via cron on the hour that makes some read only queries to launchpand and then renders the results to html | 19:42 |
| auggy | thx fungi ! | 19:43 |
| auggy | it's also potentially usable by other openstack projects but i'm not sure how custom our bug queries are in that code | 19:43 |
| fungi | we have this... | 19:44 |
| JayF | auggy: just as a note, Ironic has http://ironic-divius.rhcloud.com -- I don't know where the source is that generates that though. It looks like yours covers our use case + maybe more. | 19:44 |
| fungi | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/puppet-bugdaystats/tree/manifests/site.pp | 19:44 |
| fungi | could likely call it from an adjacent cron | 19:44 |
| jeblair | i think the infrastructure is run by and for all the openstack projects, so these should absolutely be run centrally. any project should feel free to propose changes to infra systems to add things like this. :) | 19:44 |
| clarkb | my preference would be to incorporate wahtever we do into bugday, we can evolve it if we need to, but seems like every project has their own one of these thigns and if we had to host a different one for each project well thats not really scalable | 19:44 |
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| jeblair | clarkb: collaboration, if possible would be nice | 19:45 |
| clarkb | (neutron had similar things at one point that did get incorporated into bugday fwiw) | 19:45 |
| jeblair | clarkb: this seems a little different than bugday though | 19:45 |
| fungi | #link https://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/bugdaystats | 19:45 |
| jeblair | clarkb: are you thinking of the neutron reviewday thing? | 19:45 |
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| clarkb | jeblair: ya | 19:45 |
| fungi | yeah, neutron's thing is a gerrit dashboard url generator run as part of reviewday | 19:46 |
| clarkb | ya using bug info as an input iirc | 19:46 |
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| fungi | well, sure, reviewday itself is also doing lp queries to line reviews up with open bugs, blueprints, et cetera | 19:46 |
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| auggy | so if you want me to look at bugday or another tool you already have and see about integrating this into that then i can do that and then come back | 19:46 |
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| fungi | bugday has graphs of bug status changes over time but is currently short-duration and high-frequency updates | 19:48 |
| persia | Is the scale issue about execution resources, or maintenance over time? | 19:48 |
| clarkb | right, I guess my point is I think its ok to fix deficiencies in bugday so that it works for the larger set of use cases | 19:48 |
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| clarkb | like neutron has done | 19:48 |
| clarkb | and potentially ironic and nova could do | 19:48 |
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| fungi | persia: more about target audience/use case i think | 19:48 |
| jeblair | yeah, any integration with existing tools would be great as collectively we can spend time on making fewer tools better rather than all writing the same tool over | 19:48 |
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| jeblair | however, i'd rather see us running 5 redundant tools centrally than 5 redundant tools in random hosting places | 19:49 |
| persia | So, one tool with per-project views? | 19:49 |
| fungi | i think sdague also makes a good point that we have a lot of tooling built around graphite now, and bugday is relatively simple and could stand to be redone in something more inline with our present toolset too | 19:50 |
| jeblair | yeah, bugday -> graphite would be pretty easy | 19:50 |
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| fungi | so maybe this script could seed a new bugstat project of some kind that can repace the bugday use cases as well with some graphs once someone wants to implement that part of it | 19:51 |
| auggy | yeah i could work with markus to set it up in an openstack repo under infra or wherever you all think is best | 19:51 |
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| fungi | with graphite/grafana we can easily accommodate the old bugday use case (what did our squash impact look like in a 24 hour period) along with longer trending bug managers want to see | 19:52 |
| persia | With nova workflow, but for selectable project? | 19:52 |
| auggy | well that's the work that would have to be done on it | 19:52 |
| fungi | it wouldn't be the first time nova's workflow for something got adopted by a ton of other projects ;) | 19:53 |
| auggy | i haven't looked to see how specific the lp queries are but potentially one could specify them seperately to match their bugs | 19:53 |
| fungi | so i'm not going to push for adding more to bugday unless this is the start of a bugday v2 reimplementation anyway | 19:53 |
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| auggy | eg, what queries do you want to go with which tabs kind of thing | 19:54 |
| auggy | kk how about i work with markus to set this up as an openstack-infra repo project thingy? | 19:54 |
| auggy | and then do some work to make it more project universal? | 19:54 |
| fungi | but running this from a cron in the bugdaystats::site class and adding a tab on status.o.o for it or whatever seems fine to me | 19:54 |
| fungi | auggy: i think that sounds like a fine plan | 19:55 |
| fungi | anyone disagree? | 19:55 |
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| jeblair | sgtm | 19:56 |
| pabelanger | ++ | 19:56 |
| auggy | thanks :) | 19:56 |
| fungi | #agreed The current Nova bug dashboard authors are welcome to import their work into a new Infra repo and then work on making it generalized for other projects' use. | 19:56 |
| fungi | once that step is done, we can get more into the weeds on how to automate deployment and where to link/display it | 19:56 |
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| fungi | #topic Open discussion | 19:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:57 | |
| fungi | 2.5 minutes to go | 19:57 |
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| pabelanger | meeting next week? or holidays? | 19:57 |
| clarkb | and week after and weke after | 19:58 |
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| pabelanger | wfm | 19:58 |
| EmilienM | I didn't know infra folks would take holidays :-D | 19:58 |
| * EmilienM runs | 19:58 | |
| clarkb | I am likely to be around all but the 27th | 19:58 |
| fungi | lesee... | 19:58 |
| * jeblair trips EmilienM before he can get to the door | 19:58 | |
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| fungi | yeah, i'm here at least for the 20th and can chair | 19:58 |
| jeblair | i should be around | 19:59 |
| ttx | I would appreciate some reviews on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/408284/ and friends, to close that before the holidays | 19:59 |
| clarkb | my brother works weekends and has monday's and tuesdays off so that stretch of 25-27 will likely be family time | 19:59 |
| fungi | i will likely be in a car for much of the 27th so maybe we should cancel that one unless someone wants to chair for me? | 19:59 |
| jeblair | i don't plan on being around from 26-30 | 19:59 |
| fungi | i'll be available to chair again on january 3 | 19:59 |
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| EmilienM | just a random question: who is here during that time? in case something breaks hard | 19:59 |
| fungi | so yeah, let's plan to cancel the meeting for the 27th | 20:00 |
| ttx | safe bet | 20:00 |
| fungi | oh, and we're out of time! | 20:00 |
| fungi | thanks everyone | 20:00 |
| fungi | #endmeeting | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 20:00:21 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-12-13-19.03.html | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-12-13-19.03.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-12-13-19.03.log.html | 20:00 |
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| ttx | o/ | 20:00 |
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| dims | o/ | 20:00 |
| dtroyer | o/ | 20:00 |
| EmilienM | o/ | 20:00 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 20:00 |
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| ttx | flaper87, fungi, johnthetubaguy, mordred, stevemar: around ? | 20:00 |
| ttx | thingee is excused, busy parenting | 20:00 |
| johnthetubaguy | o/ | 20:00 |
| * fungi never left | 20:01 | |
| ttx | sdague and mtreinish told me they would likely be a bit late | 20:01 |
| * fungi never leaves | 20:01 | |
| ttx | We have quorum | 20:01 |
| ttx | #startmeeting tc | 20:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 20:01:19 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tc' | 20:01 |
| * edleafe hides in the back | 20:01 | |
| ttx | Hi everyone! | 20:01 |
| stevemar | o/ | 20:01 |
| mordred | o/ | 20:01 |
| ttx | Our agenda for today: | 20:01 |
| ttx | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee | 20:01 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 20:01 |
| ttx | (remember to use #info #idea and #link liberally to make for a more readable summary) | 20:01 |
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| ttx | dolphm: around ? | 20:01 |
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| * ttx starts with the second topic to give time for dolphm to maybe join us | 20:02 | |
| ttx | #topic Some early contribution stats for Ocata (ttx) | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Some early contribution stats for Ocata (ttx) (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:02 | |
| ttx | I ran some stats last week to look into early Ocata cycle contributions | 20:02 |
| ttx | to try to see if we had projects that were very affected by recent changes at various companies | 20:02 |
| ttx | It's still pretty early (not much data), but there are early signs | 20:02 |
| * stevemar is eager to hear about this data | 20:03 | |
| dolphm | ttx: yes | 20:03 |
| ttx | Figured I should share | 20:03 |
| ttx | I compared changes merged during first 5 weeks of Mitaka (including Thanksgiving) with first 5 weeks of Ocata | 20:03 |
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| ttx | to have comparable timeframes in terms of holidays and such | 20:03 |
| ttx | And tried to ponder the results with Mitaka -> Newton trends, to isolate Ocata data | 20:03 |
| ttx | I only looked up projects that are used in 10%+ of installs (according to user survey) | 20:03 |
| ttx | Most affected project is clearly Designate, with a -63% drop between first weeks of Ocata and first weeks of Mitaka | 20:03 |
| * Rockyg slides in next to edleafe and waves hi | 20:03 | |
| ttx | (while activity in Newton had increased +35% compared to Mitaka !) | 20:03 |
| ttx | Other Ocata visibly-affected projects included: | 20:04 |
| * smcginnis notes the goals of the shorter cycle may also have some impact there. | 20:04 | |
| ttx | smcginnis: yes, that is a good caveat indeed | 20:04 |
| ttx | Nova (-6% while activity in Newton was +30% compared to Mitaka) | 20:04 |
| ttx | Cinder (-25% while activity in Newton was +7% compared to Mitaka) | 20:04 |
| * edleafe waves back | 20:04 | |
| ttx | Rally (-48% while Newton was only -9% compared to Mitaka) | 20:04 |
| ttx | Keystone (-31% while activity in Newton was only -3% compared to Mitaka) | 20:04 |
| ttx | Those ^ mostly due to attrition in changes proposed, not really to core bandwidth | 20:05 |
| ttx | so might point to what smcginnis just said | 20:05 |
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| ttx | Sahara (-44% while Newton was only -7% compared to Mitaka) | 20:05 |
| ttx | Infrastructure (-15% while activity in Newton was +20% compared to Mitaka) | 20:05 |
| ttx | Telemetry (-41% while Newton was down -12% compared to Mitaka) | 20:05 |
| ttx | Those ^ mostly due to attrition in core reviews, since changes were still proposed | 20:05 |
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| ttx | Some other projects have a ~50% drop but the reduced activity started in Newton, so not exclusively an Ocata artifact: | 20:05 |
| ttx | Glance (-58% but Newton was already down -32%) | 20:05 |
| ttx | Heat (-52% but Newton was already -20%) | 20:05 |
| ttx | Docs (-48% but Newton was already -25%) | 20:05 |
| ttx | Other projects are doing relatively well, or are even in good shape (Oslo, Manila) | 20:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | the docs one seems a massive concern to me | 20:06 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: probably part of a larger trend | 20:06 |
| flaper87 | johnthetubaguy: well, glance too, tbh | 20:06 |
| stevemar | johnthetubaguy: they all seem like massive concerns to me :) | 20:06 |
| ttx | I'll refresh those stats once we have more data, and keep you posted. | 20:06 |
| dims | ++ stevemar | 20:06 |
| edleafe | ttx: did you count nova and nova-specs together? Or just nova? | 20:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | stevemar ++ | 20:06 |
| flaper87 | the core team keeps shrinking and so do contributions | 20:06 |
| ttx | edleafe: just nova | 20:06 |
| flaper87 | stevemar: my point exactly | 20:06 |
| dhellmann | ttx: do you have the latest numbers on core reviewer team attrition? | 20:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: so I forgot the doc split out... ignore me a little | 20:07 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I just have our notes | 20:07 |
| dhellmann | ok, those should be up to date afaik | 20:07 |
| ttx | raw data at https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/iFoG829Xig for those playing at home | 20:08 |
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| sdague | o/ | 20:08 |
| dhellmann | it would be interesting to match up the review stats changes with the team stats changes to see if there's any correlation | 20:08 |
| dhellmann | as flaper87 said, we keep seeing folks step down from core teams | 20:08 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I tried, it's not as clear-cut as I thought it could be | 20:08 |
| ildikov | johnthetubaguy: ttx: on the docs one, some parts of the docs is moved back to project repos, which can lead to changing numbers regarding the OS Manuals activities too | 20:09 |
| dhellmann | though I've also noticed a few teams enrolling new members | 20:09 |
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| ttx | ildikov: yes, good point | 20:09 |
| EmilienM | on a positive side, a lot of projects still have good progress | 20:09 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ildikov: yeah, thats what I was attempting to say above after remembering it, its tricker/better than it looks | 20:09 |
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| dhellmann | it would also be interesting to see if the individual contributors who are doing less work in project X are doing more work in project Y, so focus is changing (versus leaving entirely) | 20:10 |
| ildikov | johnthetubaguy: yeap, more complex to follow that this way | 20:10 |
| ttx | The only project that is seriously in danger is Designate imho, so maybe we could communicate a bit more about it | 20:10 |
| dhellmann | that would be more complicated ot produce, though | 20:10 |
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| * flaper87 will look at the data in more detail | 20:11 | |
| * dims spots the drop in "Fuel" | 20:11 | |
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| dhellmann | ttx: I think some of those longer term trends show projects in trouble, too | 20:11 |
| ttx | Once we reach the holidays I'll refresh the data | 20:11 |
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| ttx | dhellmann: yes | 20:11 |
| dhellmann | just not as suddenly | 20:11 |
| ttx | that should give us a better sample | 20:11 |
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| ttx | Anyway, I thought you would appreciate a heads-up | 20:12 |
| ttx | Next topic ? | 20:12 |
| flaper87 | yeah | 20:12 |
| dims | thanks ttx dhellmann this is definitely helpful | 20:12 |
| flaper87 | ttx: thanks for the data | 20:12 |
| EmilienM | beside recent layoffs, do we know other reasons of such changes? | 20:12 |
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| mordred | pretty much layoffs | 20:12 |
| EmilienM | I've also seen people moving their focus on something else | 20:12 |
| ttx | EmilienM: foir the Ocata oddities, definitely the "staffing changes" | 20:12 |
| fungi | from infra's perspective, it's almost all employment-related challenges | 20:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | "staffing changes" is probably more accurate | 20:13 |
| ttx | for the larger trends, disaffection for boring infrastructure plays a bit | 20:13 |
| dhellmann | yes, it's not just folks losing jobs, some companies are keeping their engineers, but putting them on other projects | 20:13 |
| dims | right dhellmann | 20:13 |
| mordred | ++ | 20:13 |
| ttx | ok, back to our schedule | 20:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | so we are certainly "less cool" in the hype curve sense | 20:13 |
| ttx | #topic Do not allow data plane downtime during upgrades | 20:13 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Do not allow data plane downtime during upgrades (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:13 | |
| ttx | I think it was renames since | 20:14 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/404361 | 20:14 |
| ttx | renamed* | 20:14 |
| ttx | dolphm: o/ | 20:14 |
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| ttx | I think the recent split version is technically fine... | 20:14 |
| ttx | I'm just struggling understanding *what* that level of granularity really brings us | 20:14 |
| dhellmann | yes, thanks for doing that | 20:14 |
| ttx | like the motivation behind adding it | 20:14 |
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| dolphm | o/ | 20:14 |
| ttx | Could you give an example of a deployer question that tag would answer ? | 20:14 |
| ttx | Or which project we expect to strive to reach that specific level (rather than directly reach for zero-downtime or zero-impact upgrades) | 20:15 |
| dolphm | i see them as parallel paths for projects to pursue | 20:15 |
| dolphm | so, assuming your project has basic upgrade capabilities... | 20:15 |
| ttx | ah, classify them in terms of backend effects rather than frontend effects ? | 20:15 |
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| dolphm | the next two steps you can pursue in parallel are either rolling upgrades (intermixing service versions) OR testing to ensure that your "controlled resources" (VMs, networks, data storage, etc) do not become unavailable at any point during the upgrade process | 20:16 |
| ttx | ok, got it | 20:17 |
| dims | i like the step-by-step approach dolphm | 20:17 |
| ttx | other questions ? | 20:17 |
| dhellmann | I got a little confused in the discussion of neutron issues | 20:17 |
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| * flaper87 had the same question as ttx and it's now answered | 20:17 | |
| dhellmann | it sounds like some backends are always going to be disruptive during upgrades? | 20:17 |
| sdague | except, we already test controlled resources work when the control plane is offline | 20:17 |
| dhellmann | if that's the case, would neutron every be able to have this tag? | 20:17 |
| dolphm | dhellmann: neutron or not, there are likely pluggable choices in every project that will cause you to sacrifice certain features of the upgrade process (feature support matrix, anyone?) | 20:18 |
| mordred | dhellmann: I believe that's backend specific | 20:18 |
| sdague | dhellmann: I guess the question is whether that's a product of neutron architecture, or backends | 20:18 |
| sdague | ovs has specific issues when restarting iirc | 20:18 |
| dhellmann | mordred : right, but the tag only applies to a deliverable, with no metadata to indicate that it may not always work as advertised | 20:18 |
| ttx | one could argue that dropping packets is thing healthy networks do :) | 20:19 |
| mordred | dhellmann: that's an _excellent_ point | 20:19 |
| flaper87 | and it applies to type:service | 20:19 |
| dolphm | dhellmann: my thinking is that if there is *a* well tested, ideally default configuration upstream that can satisfy all these requirements, then the project deserves the tag | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | yes, I don't think we guarantee no packet loss even in normal operation without an upgrade in progress, do we? | 20:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, the tag used to be there is *a* way and its clear what that is | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | dolphm : ok, I haven't had a chance to review the latest draft, is this issue covered in the text? | 20:19 |
| fungi | also depends a lot on how far into the controlled infrastructure those guarantees extend | 20:20 |
| dhellmann | maybe by saying that any caveats have to be documented? | 20:20 |
| dolphm | dhellmann: the notion of only requiring a single happy path? no | 20:20 |
| dhellmann | dolphm : "at least one happy path" | 20:20 |
| sdague | I do have concerns about splitting this out - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/404361/3/reference/tags/assert_supports-accessible-upgrade.rst - because we already do that in default testing, unless I'm misunderstanding | 20:20 |
| dolphm | dhellmann: (no, but) i think the notion of a happy path applies to all the upgrade tags, not just this one | 20:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | sdague: certainly plan A was to keep it together, but there were issues or "redefining" the existing tag | 20:21 |
| sdague | http://docs.openstack.org/developer/grenade/readme.html#basic-flow | 20:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | s/or/of/ | 20:21 |
| fungi | while i'm not a fan of the "control plane" and "data plane" terminology, it does seem a bit out of place to make data plane guarantees about projects which are mostly control plane | 20:21 |
| dhellmann | dolphm : ok, that's fair. Maybe we can get that clarified in an update | 20:21 |
| sdague | johnthetubaguy: it's not really redefining, it is being explicit a thing that was an implicit piece of this | 20:22 |
| dolphm | fungi: perhaps projects need to be able to apply for a tags with a "not applicable to me" status? | 20:22 |
| ttx | sdague: there may be a gap between "verify resources are still working after upgrade" and "verify resources were not changed in any way after upgrade" | 20:22 |
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| dhellmann | and "verify resources are still working *during* the upgrade" which is what this says, right? | 20:22 |
| sdague | ttx: their may be, but the intent was that was the check we've been running for 4 years | 20:22 |
| fungi | dolphm: hrm... maybe i guess | 20:22 |
| sdague | maybe 3 years | 20:22 |
| ttx | sdague: do all projects check that ? | 20:23 |
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| EmilienM | ttx: not afik | 20:24 |
| sdague | ttx: right now, I doubt it | 20:24 |
| ttx | There are two dimensions: availability and integrity | 20:24 |
| sdague | but the intent is there | 20:24 |
| ttx | We test availability and that is what dolphm baked into the base tag | 20:24 |
| dhellmann | intent would be sufficient if we didn't already have a bunch of projects claiming the existing tag | 20:24 |
| ttx | The other tag requires integrity | 20:24 |
| ttx | (i.e. the resource has not been altered) | 20:24 |
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| ttx | but fungi has a point | 20:25 |
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| ttx | it bleeds a bit into data-side implementation | 20:25 |
| sdague | fungi: so the reason that we need to make those guaruntees, is that they are easy to screw up | 20:25 |
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| fungi | it's sort of like having a tag that says nova upgrades won't cause it to tell libvirt to reboot your instances, i guess? | 20:25 |
| sdague | fungi, or delete them | 20:26 |
| mordred | yah | 20:26 |
| flaper87 | fungi: yup | 20:26 |
| dhellmann | or pause them | 20:26 |
| sdague | which it did back in essex at times | 20:26 |
| ttx | (Timeboxing this to 5 more minutes, since it feels like it could use a bit more iterations on the review) | 20:26 |
| sdague | because replumbing in existing stuff and not modifying it needs to be front and center | 20:26 |
| fungi | so this ends up being more about making sure that control plane services don't tell data plane services to take destructuve actions during a control plane upgrade | 20:27 |
| sdague | right, that consumer workloads in your cloud will be fine as you upgrade your openstack infrastructure around them | 20:27 |
| mordred | fungi: that's my understanding | 20:27 |
| dolphm | fungi: sdague: mordred: ++ | 20:27 |
| fungi | whereas we can't make general guarantees about those data plane services themselves | 20:27 |
| dims | "end user created resources still continue to function during and after upgrade"? | 20:28 |
| fungi | since we don't produce them | 20:28 |
| sdague | which gives you a lot more confidence that you can upgrade your cloud without destroying all your users | 20:28 |
| fungi | so it's not "libvirt won't reboot your instances during a nova upgrade" and more "nova won't tell libvirt to reboot your instances during a nova upgrade" | 20:28 |
| persia | Although ideally user services cannot identify an upgrade is happening, reducing the chance a crash there is upgrade-related. | 20:28 |
| dolphm | overall, the spirit of this whole effort is basically "i should be able to upgrade openstack continuously without impacting my customers / workloads / etc" | 20:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | fungi: thats my take | 20:29 |
| dhellmann | fungi : right | 20:29 |
| dims | right dolphm | 20:29 |
| sdague | dolphm: yeh, definitely | 20:29 |
| ttx | ok, looks like we can iterate on the review and converge to something around "no destructive actions" | 20:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | dolphm: +1 | 20:29 |
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| ttx | dolphm: Maybe iterate on the review and come back next week ? | 20:29 |
| dolphm | ttx: ++ | 20:29 |
| sdague | I just want to make sure that we don't make our taxonomy of that so complex, given that "upgrade that destroys my workloads" isn't really worth even talking about | 20:30 |
| ttx | ok, thanks, I understand it a lot better now | 20:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | sdague: +1 thats totally a worry | 20:30 |
| sdague | that's my basic objection, I feel like it makes the upgrade tag pointless because it doesn't give the fundamental table stakes we should expect | 20:30 |
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| johnthetubaguy | might be worth the cost of dropping the tag from everyone and making them re-apply | 20:31 |
| dolphm | sdague: i feel that's the slipperly slope i'm on with this new tag, especially because it's no longer a linear series of milestones (at least, not necessarily) | 20:31 |
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| sdague | and I'd rather clarify that the the table stakes are real, and prune some projects from it if we have to | 20:31 |
| ttx | then you fall in the "redefine existing tag" rathole | 20:31 |
| sdague | ttx: sure | 20:31 |
| fungi | i could get behind merging this expectation into the normal upgrade tag | 20:31 |
| sdague | but since when are all tags idempotent? | 20:32 |
| ttx | but yeah, let's continue that discussion on the review | 20:32 |
| fungi | "expectation we failed to call out explicitly" | 20:32 |
| ttx | Having an idea of which projects would be dropped would help | 20:32 |
| sdague | fungi: yep, we made an oversight, lets fix it | 20:32 |
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| mugsie | well, all of them | 20:32 |
| dhellmann | it's not that all tags are immutable, it's that this appeared to add a large new expectation to an existing tag without documentation that all of the projects using the tag met the requirement | 20:32 |
| flaper87 | dhellmann: ++ | 20:32 |
| mugsie | as none of the test that everything works *during* the upgrade | 20:33 |
| dolphm | dhellmann: ++ | 20:33 |
| mugsie | none of them* | 20:33 |
| sdague | mugsie: it's testing, nothing tests everything | 20:33 |
| sdague | testing is about representative use cases and verifying them | 20:33 |
| sdague | see: halting problem :) | 20:33 |
| mugsie | nova's grenade test does not test a vm is accessable *during* the upgrade phase | 20:33 |
| ttx | we could set them up as separate tags with the goal of removing the simpler version once it's all obsoleted | 20:33 |
| sdague | mugsie: yes it does | 20:33 |
| fungi | having some tests before making this change might still be in order | 20:33 |
| mugsie | during? | 20:34 |
| sdague | mugsie: define during | 20:34 |
| dhellmann | sdague : while the new version of nova is being installed and started | 20:34 |
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| dhellmann | including any database changes | 20:34 |
| mugsie | while the nova services have the code replaced and restarted | 20:34 |
| sdague | dhellmann: so... I don't know that you can build infrastructure that guaruntees that because you are racing | 20:34 |
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| ttx | ok, I'll have to cut this one short and ask to continue on the review. This is clearly not ready for immediate merging anyway | 20:35 |
| dhellmann | sdague : which may not be a big deal for nova, but it appears to be *the* case where neutron would fail to meet these requirements | 20:35 |
| sdague | we test pre shutdown, during shutdown, post upgrade | 20:35 |
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| sdague | dhellmann: yeh... the neutron ovs issue is one that would need thought | 20:35 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ack, let's move on | 20:35 |
| sdague | part of it is going to require architecture inspection + testing | 20:35 |
| ttx | #topic Driver teams: remaining options | 20:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Driver teams: remaining options (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:35 | |
| sdague | to know if the tests are an acurate reflection of reality | 20:35 |
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| ttx | stevemar distilled the discussion from last week down to 4 remaining options: | 20:36 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/403826 (fallback) | 20:36 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/403829 (grey, amended) | 20:36 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/403836 (soft black) | 20:36 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/403839 (soft white) | 20:36 |
| ttx | I did a pass at optimizing "grey" to try to address fungi's concerns with it | 20:36 |
| stevemar | (really 3 options, fallback is just that) | 20:36 |
| ttx | (basically reducing the risk of it being abused as a registry of drivers where you want to place brands) | 20:36 |
| ttx | Not sure what's next step | 20:36 |
| fungi | yeah, i'm +1 on it now. while still not my preference, i can see it working out | 20:36 |
| ttx | I could quickly set up a Condorcet to help us order those | 20:36 |
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| ttx | if you feel that's sueful | 20:37 |
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| flaper87 | mmh | 20:37 |
| ttx | or just vote on them | 20:37 |
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| flaper87 | what about we all vote for our preference first ? | 20:37 |
| flaper87 | and eventually vote for the second prefered option | 20:37 |
| ttx | yeah, let's try that -- setting up that condorcet with all your email addrseses is not fun | 20:37 |
| stevemar | might be worth seeing what neutron/cinder/nova folks feel, or the folks working on the drivers | 20:37 |
| flaper87 | preferred* | 20:38 |
| EmilienM | flaper87: yes | 20:38 |
| ttx | stevemar: I'm not saying approving it | 20:38 |
| stevemar | of course not | 20:38 |
| ttx | I'm saying having a good candidate | 20:38 |
| mtreinish | o/ | 20:38 |
| fungi | stevemar: can you encourage them to respond to the ml thread or jump in here? | 20:38 |
| sdague | stevemar: especially neutron folks, as this is driven a bit from that community | 20:38 |
| stevemar | fungi: smcginnis chimed in last week | 20:38 |
| fungi | the point of bringing it to the ml first is so they could weigh in more easily | 20:38 |
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| fungi | yep, smcginnis did. but in general feedback on the ml was pretty minimal | 20:39 |
| fungi | most responses were from tc members :/ | 20:39 |
| stevemar | just re-iterating the fact that if we're coming up with a solution then we should include the people it'll affect. i can certainly try to encourage them | 20:39 |
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| smcginnis | I think it makes sense for the tc to vett the options here, then have the teams chime in on a ML thread. | 20:39 |
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| smcginnis | Once things are narrowed down a little, that might help focus the dicussion. | 20:39 |
| dims | ttx : can we check if anyone still wants to pursue the 2 soft reviews? if not we can prune them | 20:39 |
| flaper87 | the grey option seems to have 7 votes already | 20:39 |
| stevemar | smcginnis: we already did a first pass, there are 3 options now-ish | 20:40 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so from a Nova view, it says using established plugin interfaces, Nova doesn't have one for drivers, which keeps things as they are today (in a good way) | 20:40 |
| ttx | grey has a majority of +1 now, so we could refine it over the week and push it back to the thread for further discussion ? | 20:40 |
| flaper87 | ttx: was writing just that | 20:40 |
| fungi | maybe if we go forward with a non-binding vote and ping the ml thread with a "this is what the tc is leaning toward" update... | 20:40 |
| ttx | fungi: yes | 20:40 |
| smcginnis | stevemar: Yep. Just thinking it might be good to start a thread saying the TC sees options x or y as possible, we'd like team input. Or something like that. | 20:40 |
| dims | ttx : ++ | 20:40 |
| mordred | ttx: sooooo ... combining our thinking about this topic with the previous topic ... | 20:40 |
| flaper87 | fungi: ttx ++ | 20:40 |
| stevemar | ttx: yeah, its probably easier to present one choice instead of three | 20:41 |
| ttx | re: upgrades ? | 20:41 |
| mordred | I could see a point in the future where we might want to be able to give a rolling-upgrade tag to drivers | 20:41 |
| mordred | yah | 20:41 |
| mordred | like "nova has no-downtime upgrades as aproject, and libvirt and xen also do as drivers, but nova-docker doesn't" _for_instance_ | 20:41 |
| ttx | mordred: the trick is in-tree drivers, would all have to pass | 20:41 |
| ttx | (a worthwhile goal, but maybe would hinder in-tree drivers a bit) | 20:42 |
| mordred | ttx: no clue - this is purely an inthefuture thought - but I'd think we'd want to be able to enumerate and tag them | 20:42 |
| fungi | yeah, tags are per-deliverable or per-team | 20:42 |
| mordred | yup | 20:42 |
| mordred | we should not block anything on this thought | 20:42 |
| mordred | just a thought I had for future mulling | 20:42 |
| fungi | we'd need to adjust the tag data model further | 20:42 |
| ttx | OK, I'll take that one back to the ML | 20:42 |
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| mordred | because it might take a while to figure out :) | 20:42 |
| sdague | I think that if reality is complicated, and we need to break out descriptions of what things work with what drivers, that's fine. We need to not be too stuck on existing boundaries of tags. | 20:42 |
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| dhellmann | yeah, I'd rather we just use lots of words to say things where binary flags fall short | 20:42 |
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| ttx | #action ttx to push "amended grey" back to the ML for final discussion before approval | 20:43 |
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| ttx | moving on | 20:43 |
| dhellmann | there's a bit of feedback from JayF about the API restriction causing issues for ironic, too | 20:43 |
| sdague | tags, like anything else, are high level approximations of reality. They are fine as long as you realize they are low fidelity approximations, and dangerous the moment you believe your frictionless spherical elephants are real :) | 20:43 |
| ttx | #topic Relaxing IRC meeting policy | 20:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Relaxing IRC meeting policy (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:43 | |
| ttx | There was a thread about IRC meeting rooms, which concluded with: | 20:43 |
| ttx | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-December/108604.html | 20:44 |
| ttx | Some of the proposed actions may increase the silo-ing in some teams, so I wanted to run those past you first | 20:44 |
| ttx | First action is to remove artificial scarcity by creating more meeting rooms, which will result in more concentration of meetings. | 20:44 |
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| ttx | Pretty much everyone agreed that's a necessary evil now, so we went ahead and created #openstack-meeting-5 last week | 20:44 |
| ttx | Second action is to remove the requirement of holding team meetings in common channels | 20:44 |
| ttx | (and allow team meetings in team channels) | 20:44 |
| ttx | This one is slightly more questionable, as it reduces external exposure and reinforces silos | 20:44 |
| ttx | So I wanted to check that it was OK with you before proceeding (as you were mostly silent on that thread) | 20:45 |
| mtreinish | I'm not really a fan of that second thing | 20:45 |
| mtreinish | for the reasons you mentioned | 20:45 |
| ttx | (alternatively, we could try first part and wait a bit before doing anything on the second part) | 20:45 |
| mtreinish | I also don't idle in all the project channels :) | 20:45 |
| mordred | I mean ... I'm also not a fan of the second thing - but the Big Tent has brought us enough teams that have effectively no interaction that forcing folks into arbitrary meeting rooms also seems weird | 20:45 |
| sdague | mordred: yeh | 20:46 |
| johnthetubaguy | given timezone differences, and everything else, as long as its logged and open, we have got the main things | 20:46 |
| dims | mtreinish : those of us working across a bunch of things don't like it BUT those who exclusively live in a couple of channels would love it | 20:46 |
| mordred | however, I do get pinged in random meetings sometimes | 20:46 |
| johnthetubaguy | mordred: +1 | 20:46 |
| stevemar | mtreinish: it causes a whole lot of scheduling pain for a "regular" meeting channel | 20:46 |
| ttx | I'm pinged in random meeting rooms about twice a day | 20:46 |
| fungi | at least that many for me as well | 20:46 |
| sdague | I also am not sure the expecting people to idle everywhere is the right expectation anyway | 20:46 |
| EmilienM | people who want to join a meeting just /join the channel and that's it? how is it a problem and how does it create silos? we should let people working together and avoid private meetings, that's all | 20:46 |
| dtroyer | I think if you are having the meeting in a project channel you simply will not be able to assume random folk will see a ping | 20:46 |
| stevemar | ttx: mordred wouldn't that mean you get pinged in project channel rooms instead ? | 20:46 |
| dhellmann | I'm probably pinged once a week or so; sometimes more | 20:46 |
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| ttx | it feels people will miss my awesome insights by hiding in channels I don't lurk in :) | 20:46 |
| mtreinish | dims: right, that's the reinforcing silos thing | 20:47 |
| stevemar | ttx: lurk in more channels ;) | 20:47 |
| ttx | stevemar: but would miss them | 20:47 |
| JayF | The only weirdness about holding a meeting in a project channel is that it makes for a very strange experience should a first time user drop into IRC mid-meeting. | 20:47 |
| dhellmann | sdague : ++ | 20:47 |
| johnthetubaguy | sdague: yeah, if nothing else, it feels very timezone silly to me | 20:47 |
| dims | JayF : true | 20:47 |
| ttx | stevemar: difficult to keep track | 20:47 |
| fungi | i also get pinged many times a day in random project channels too, yes, but only high-profile ones i happen to idle in (probably others too i just don't see them since i'm not there) | 20:47 |
| dhellmann | JayF : yes, that's a concern I had, too | 20:47 |
| Rockyg | I think new teams or teams applying for big tent should be in a meeting channel until they have some momentum | 20:47 |
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| EmilienM | dtroyer, dhellmann: imho, if you miss a ping, that's not a big deal. Most of our problems can be solved async. versus during an irc meeting | 20:47 |
| smcginnis | If someone needs to jump out of a meeting to ping someone in that person's specific project channel asking them to join - I don't see that as any kind of major burden. | 20:48 |
| stevemar | Rockyg: i was thinking the opposite :) | 20:48 |
| dhellmann | EmilienM : yeah, I'll start expecting more email on the -dev list :-) | 20:48 |
| ttx | smcginnis: feels almost like a PTG | 20:48 |
| smcginnis | :) | 20:48 |
| fungi | going back to the time when most everything happened in #openstack-dev, #openstack-meeting provided a quiet haven to host an irc meeting without people popping in interrupting with off-topic randomness | 20:48 |
| sdague | honestly, it wouldn't be bad if that meant the expectation wasn't that you were in 4 meeting channels, but instead you were in #openstack-dev when active, and that was the common ping bus | 20:48 |
| smcginnis | sdague: +1 | 20:49 |
| ttx | sdague: +1 | 20:49 |
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| dims | agree sdague | 20:49 |
| Rockyg | sdague, +1 | 20:49 |
| johnthetubaguy | sdague: good point | 20:49 |
| ttx | maybe we could relax one and reinforce the other | 20:49 |
| EmilienM | TC should help projects to work together. If teams want to use their own channels, go ahead. I don't think we should make a rule for that | 20:49 |
| mtreinish | EmilienM: it already is a rule | 20:49 |
| flaper87 | I'd bee ok with projects having meetings in their own channels if possible | 20:49 |
| ttx | EmilienM: not a rule, just allowing it (currently irc-meetings prevents it) | 20:49 |
| sdague | I also kind of wonder if part of the issue is the awkwardness of drilling into meeting archived content | 20:49 |
| flaper87 | and then for random pings just use -dev | 20:49 |
| dims | ++ flaper87 | 20:50 |
| fungi | i'd strongly discourage teams having meetings in their own channels, but expect that many of them who think it's a cool idea at first will switch to wanting to have them in a separate channel from their general discussion channels eventually | 20:50 |
| ttx | ok, I think we can proceed with relaxing the gate check at least and altering MUST -> SHOULD in some literature | 20:50 |
| Rockyg | The reason I'd like new eams to be in meeting channel is they tend to be more single vendor. I;ve see good things happen when a veteran openstacker jumps into the middle of one of those meetings because of trigger words | 20:50 |
| EmilienM | (I'm personally not in love with IRC meetings, specially in distributed teams. I think most of our problems can be solved by email or gerrit) | 20:50 |
| cdent | sdague++ | 20:50 |
| cdent | irc logs are not great | 20:50 |
| fungi | and i don't want to see us adding #openstack-nova-meeting and #openstack-cinder-meeting and so on | 20:51 |
| dims | Rockyg : you mean why is this random person messing with us? :) | 20:51 |
| Rockyg | Uh, yeah, that's it, dims | 20:51 |
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| ttx | Anyway, if you care one way or another, please chime in on thread, otherwise i'll probably go ahead and implement it | 20:51 |
| flaper87 | EmilienM: yup | 20:51 |
| ttx | We need to move to Open discussion, a few things to cover there | 20:51 |
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| ttx | #topic Open Discussion | 20:52 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:52 | |
| mordred | Rockyg: ++ | 20:52 |
| ttx | 1/ Joint BoD+TC meeting around PTG | 20:52 |
| ttx | The Board would like to have a Board+TC meeting around the PTG | 20:52 |
| ttx | They propose to hold the joint meeting on Friday afternoon | 20:52 |
| ttx | Since most teams will run for 2 or 2.5 days anyway, I think that's doable | 20:52 |
| ttx | We could push back and ask to hold it on Sunday afternoon instead, but I'm not a big fan of 6-day work streaks | 20:52 |
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| ttx | Also it's not really an issue if some TC members end up being busy elsewhere | 20:52 |
| ttx | not as if all board members would be present | 20:52 |
| fungi | obviously this impacts attendees who panned to work on vertical team stuff for the full 3 days | 20:53 |
| ttx | opinions / strong feelings ? | 20:53 |
| EmilienM | Sunday is usually the day spent on travels :-/ | 20:53 |
| fungi | er, planned | 20:53 |
| johnthetubaguy | afternoon means one more hotel day for me, I gess | 20:53 |
| EmilienM | fungi: right | 20:53 |
| johnthetubaguy | EmilienM: I was thinking that too | 20:53 |
| dtroyer | Given that choice, I'd much prefer Friday | 20:53 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: sunday too probably | 20:53 |
| dims | was waiting for a decision on this to book flights... | 20:53 |
| ttx | fungi: not so many teams plan to do full 3 days | 20:53 |
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| mordred | if we're going to have one of these co-located friday afternoon, it would be great if it was treated as important on the board side - it often feels like we lose people for the TC section of board meetings | 20:53 |
| EmilienM | it also means most of people would need to travel on Saturday. | 20:53 |
| fungi | good to know | 20:53 |
| sdague | ttx: well, the nova team does | 20:53 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: true | 20:54 |
| sdague | and we | 20:54 |
| ttx | but yes, some will and I guess it's fine to prioritze that over the joint BoD/TC | 20:54 |
| dims | ++ mordred | 20:54 |
| sdague | we've got a few nova core members that are in this pool :) | 20:54 |
| ttx | mordred: I can make that clear | 20:54 |
| fungi | mordred: in this case instead of leaving mid-day and skipping the joint meeting, those people will just not come there at all i guess? | 20:54 |
| flaper87 | if we're having it on the PTG, I guess I'd prefer it on Friday | 20:54 |
| EmilienM | +1 for Friday | 20:54 |
| flaper87 | this is the first PTG and I'd like to first see how it pans out | 20:54 |
| stevemar | i'm okay with sunday afternoon only because it's easy to get to ATL; but friday works too | 20:54 |
| mordred | I'm going to be tired and would prefer to go home, but will show up at the meeting. I'll be annoyed if I show up at the meeting and it's a ghost town. nobody wants a grumpy monty in a room | 20:54 |
| flaper87 | instead of adding more days to it | 20:54 |
| fungi | or is the board planning to have a board meeting before the joint meeting again too? | 20:54 |
| ttx | fungi: they will yes | 20:55 |
| sdague | mordred: right, it does feel like a Friday afternoon is going to be sparse | 20:55 |
| EmilienM | (can't we make it during an evening in a piano bar?) :-) | 20:55 |
| ttx | sdague: they come to town exclusively for that day though | 20:55 |
| dims | ++ EmilienM | 20:55 |
| dhellmann | from what I saw, most of the board wasn't planning to come to the ptg for any other reason | 20:55 |
| flaper87 | EmilienM: with some rum | 20:55 |
| fungi | oh, so friday attendees get to choose between vertical team ptg stuff and board meeting as well | 20:55 |
| ttx | sdague: so I don't think they would come to ATL just for the morning | 20:55 |
| ttx | but who knows | 20:56 |
| ttx | OK, I'll communicate that back. It's not mandatory anyway | 20:56 |
| sdague | so, personally either I guess is fine. The flights from here are pretty direct. As long as we nail it down soon | 20:56 |
| EmilienM | fungi: you, stevemar and me are PTL, it would be hard for us to make a choice :-/ | 20:56 |
| dhellmann | I'm slightly more in favor of Sunday, but I understand the objections to the long week that would cause. | 20:56 |
| ttx | We can sync before so that if you are stuck in a room, your views are represented | 20:56 |
| sdague | dhellmann: yeh, I would say I would lean Sunday | 20:56 |
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| flaper87 | ttx: I know it's not mandatory but if it'll happen, it kinda feels that way | 20:56 |
| fungi | EmilienM: at least my team's assigned ptg days are monday/tuesday (yours as well?) harder for stevemar | 20:56 |
| flaper87 | if you know what I mean | 20:56 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 on knowing soon, I expect most folks are booking pre new year, I believe I am meant to | 20:56 |
| mtreinish | dhellmann: I'm leaning the same way | 20:56 |
| flaper87 | I feel it's part of my job as TC member to attend | 20:57 |
| flaper87 | and I want to be there | 20:57 |
| johnthetubaguy | what about Monday? | 20:57 |
| johnthetubaguy | its a cross project thing? | 20:57 |
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| mordred | monday is bad for horizontal team things | 20:57 |
| stevemar | fungi: it's just a bit of time anyway, i can break away from keystone-y stuff for a bit | 20:57 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: the horizontal stuff only has 2 days, can't burn one | 20:57 |
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| johnthetubaguy | mordred: true | 20:57 |
| fungi | EmilienM: though ptg is also after ptl elections, so maybe none of us will be ptls by then ;) | 20:57 |
| dhellmann | johnthetubaguy : a different set of TC members wouldn't be able to attend in that case :-) | 20:57 |
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| ttx | ok, I'll start a -tc thread on that | 20:57 |
| EmilienM | fungi: we are verticial | 20:57 |
| ttx | 2/ Progress on Amend reference/PTI with supported distros (https://review.openstack.org/402940) | 20:57 |
| ttx | EmilienM wanted to unblock this review | 20:57 |
| stevemar | fungi: that's the hope! :P | 20:57 |
| EmilienM | fungi: who knows? :-) | 20:57 |
| sdague | ttx: I guess the second question is is this a normal 3 hour cross section? Or are we talking about the whole day? | 20:57 |
| EmilienM | stevemar: talk for you :P | 20:58 |
| ttx | #action ttx to start a thread on the -tc list to see what is most popular | 20:58 |
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| fungi | EmilienM: oh, for some reason i thought the deployment teams ended up on monday/tuesday as well | 20:58 |
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| dhellmann | sdague : half day | 20:58 |
| stevemar | :) | 20:58 |
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| sdague | 2-5 on Friday is one thing, all day friday is different | 20:58 |
| * dims will be missing kid2's bday 2 years in a row | 20:58 | |
| ttx | sdague: Friday afternoon | 20:58 |
| sdague | ok | 20:58 |
| EmilienM | fungi: it was and it changed | 20:58 |
| ttx | or Sunday afternoon | 20:58 |
| EmilienM | ttx: thx for bringing it up again | 20:58 |
| fungi | EmilienM: i should pay closer attention | 20:58 |
| EmilienM | ttx: I see zero blocker now for this change to be accepted | 20:58 |
| mordred | my main concern is that I'm looking forwrad to the PTG being super productive - and I don't want to fall into the trap of turning it in to a second summit by cramming additional things in if we can help it | 20:58 |
| sdague | mordred: yeh... | 20:59 |
| ttx | mordred: yes, not looking forward another 6-day thing | 20:59 |
| sdague | we did try to make this different | 20:59 |
| ttx | which is why I lean towards Friday | 20:59 |
| EmilienM | fungi: no worries, we changed it very recently. Main reason: tripleo is not horizontal and we need to attend horizontal sessions (infra, etc) | 20:59 |
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| flaper87 | mordred: my thoughts exactly | 20:59 |
| sdague | ttx: or a 5 day thing fo being double book | 20:59 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: do we have the option of just saying "no, we'll be busy all week"? | 20:59 |
| sdague | honestly, I think my actual preference is not to do it at all there :) | 20:59 |
| ttx | EmilienM: difficult to switch focus | 20:59 |
| johnthetubaguy | is it crazy to consider a virtual joint meeting instead? | 20:59 |
| EmilienM | ttx: sounds like we're running out of time. Maybe next meeting | 20:59 |
| EmilienM | ttx: or maybe I'll ping people to review it. | 21:00 |
| ttx | EmilienM: yeah, that | 21:00 |
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| ttx | that way we can finalize it next week quickly | 21:00 |
| ttx | flaper87: same for https://review.openstack.org/398875 | 21:00 |
| flaper87 | ttx: sounds good | 21:00 |
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| ttx | Also if someone could tell me how useful https://review.openstack.org/406696 is, I would appreciate it | 21:00 |
| flaper87 | ppl, read ^ | 21:00 |
| dims | dhellmann : ++ | 21:00 |
| ttx | And we are out of time | 21:01 |
| stevemar | o\ | 21:01 |
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| EmilienM | ttx: bonne nuit! | 21:01 |
| ttx | #action ttx to finalizer the Friday/Sunday decision in a -tc ML thread | 21:01 |
| fungi | do we have a tentative agenda for the meeting? wondering if this is to continue the board discussion on accepting other languages, making emerging trendy technologies first class citizens and restructuring project governance, or other stuff | 21:01 |
| fungi | oh, out of time | 21:01 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 21:01:37 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-12-13-20.01.html | 21:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-12-13-20.01.txt | 21:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-12-13-20.01.log.html | 21:01 |
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| ttx | fungi: I'll raise a thread so that we make progress on it this week | 21:01 |
| fungi | thanks ttx! | 21:01 |
| dims | thanks ttx | 21:02 |
| christx2 | scientific group meeting is on? | 21:02 |
| b1airo | yep! | 21:02 |
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| martial | christx2: that is the plan :) | 21:02 |
| priteau | Hello! | 21:02 |
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| b1airo | #startmeeting scientific-wg | 21:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Dec 13 21:02:21 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is b1airo. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: scientific-wg)" | 21:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'scientific_wg' | 21:02 |
| ttx | christx2 blairo: sorry for overrunning | 21:02 |
| christx2 | cool, listening - christoph - london, uk | 21:02 |
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| b1airo | no probs ttx | 21:02 |
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| b1airo | hi christx2 ! | 21:02 |
| b1airo | #chair martial | 21:02 |
| openstack | Current chairs: b1airo martial | 21:02 |
| trandles | hello all o/ | 21:03 |
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| * ildikov is lurking :) | 21:03 | |
| b1airo | hi there Time | 21:03 |
| b1airo | *Tim (sorry!) | 21:03 |
| trandles | lol, np | 21:03 |
| b1airo | agenda is at #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Scientific_working_group#IRC_Meeting_December_13th_2016 | 21:04 |
| lizhong | Hi all, I am Lizhong working with Martial from NIST | 21:04 |
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| b1airo | greetings lizhong, welcome | 21:04 |
| b1airo | GPUs and Virtualisation: | 21:04 |
| b1airo | Getting set up for virtualising GPU hardware | 21:04 |
| b1airo | Performance optimisation and further topics | 21:04 |
| b1airo | Monitoring round-up | 21:04 |
| b1airo | Review gathered notes on wiki at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/ScientificWGMonitoringAndTelemetry | 21:04 |
| powerd | evening / morning b1airo et al! | 21:04 |
| b1airo | oneswig is an apology for today | 21:04 |
| b1airo | howdy powerd | 21:04 |
| b1airo | ok let's get into it then | 21:05 |
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| martial | b1airo: asked Lizhong to join as he is the coder of the Dmoni software so he will be able to comment/describe it if needed | 21:05 |
| b1airo | #topic GPUs and Virtualisation | 21:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "GPUs and Virtualisation (Meeting topic: scientific-wg)" | 21:05 | |
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| powerd | ok so i've made a start at the GPUs investigation | 21:06 |
| b1airo | thanks martial - i take it lizhong has already seen the etherpad from last couple of weeks? | 21:06 |
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| powerd | we put a K80 and a K2 in to a system in our lab and have passthrough working now | 21:06 |
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| powerd | just put a quick blog post together this afternoon - i'll update the wg wiki with the address | 21:06 |
| b1airo | powerd, did you end up starting an etherpad or anything yet? | 21:06 |
| martial | b1airo: yes, he contributed even | 21:06 |
| rbudden | hello | 21:07 |
| b1airo | i have just dug up some notes that we had and also some that Joe Topjian from Cybera passed on - i think we could make a pretty good start to some proper docs with these | 21:07 |
| b1airo | g'day rbudden o/ | 21:07 |
| b1airo | powerd, cool - i will take an action to start an etherpad and share | 21:08 |
| powerd | not started an etherpad | 21:08 |
| b1airo | #action b1airo to start GPUs on OpenStack etherpad | 21:08 |
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| b1airo | (that should probably be "GPUs in OpenStack" - oh well) | 21:09 |
| b1airo | so powerd , did you have any problems with your setup? | 21:09 |
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| b1airo | we've been doing the GPU passthrough thing for a fairly long time in prod now - ~2.5 years | 21:10 |
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| jmlowe | from what I remember of our chat the passthrough works great but there is no way currently to virtualize a pci switch? | 21:11 |
| b1airo | anyone else doing GPUs with OpenStack ? | 21:12 |
| jpr | can I ask a naive question. when you use GPU within an OS instance, I assume you mean it's seen as a HW accelerator like on the compute side, or is this something about the instances graphics | 21:12 |
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| jmlowe | I'm in the attempt to wrestle money free to purchase some gpus stage | 21:12 |
| b1airo | jmlowe, well not strictly true - you can tell qemu to emulate a particular pci/e topology, but i haven't played with it much yet - lot's of manual XML-ing required | 21:12 |
| jmlowe | I'm aiming for a 1U with 4x p100's | 21:13 |
| b1airo | jpr, good question - we should aim to have docs answering this sort of thing up front | 21:13 |
| powerd | The starting point of some instructions have been added to: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/ScientificWGGPUs | 21:13 |
| jmlowe | b1airo: ok, might be possible but certainly not baked in | 21:13 |
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| powerd | No - no real problems setting up. But only starting to look at the perf now. | 21:14 |
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| powerd | We'll have P100 in the lab by the end of the week so will be giving that a spin too | 21:14 |
| jpr | @powerd: thanks. that's clear | 21:14 |
| b1airo | jmlowe, correct - and also, i'm not even sure whether the emulated pci topology is the problem for e.g. CUDA P2P | 21:14 |
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| b1airo | it could actually be PCIe ACS | 21:14 |
| lizhong | In our team, we have someone did passthrough with OpenStack. The GPU appears in the VM, however it fails when you start a GPU program. | 21:15 |
| b1airo | jpr, going back to your question - we use GPU passthrough both for GPU compute and to accelerate grpahics, e.g. with VirtualGL | 21:15 |
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| b1airo | lizhong, we have seen those sort of problems plenty - the two primary issues that cause that appear to be either hypervisor support (i.e. not new enough qemu/kvm) or a driver in the host already bound to the device | 21:17 |
| b1airo | do you know what hypervisor version you were using? | 21:17 |
| jpr | @b1airo: ah, so do you use that under the hood of the instance to make it think it has GPU hardware or within the context of the instance via the virtualgl support for graphics at the user level | 21:19 |
| lizhong | I don't know the exact version, but I'll let my colleague know. | 21:19 |
| b1airo | powerd, what hypervisor platform are you using? | 21:19 |
| lizhong | thanks | 21:19 |
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| leong | fyi.. there is a talk in Barcelona about GPU on openstack. | 21:19 |
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| leong | #link Barcelona Presentation about GPU: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9DmE_oUo5I | 21:20 |
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| rbudden | FWIW, we have K80s and P100s currently that I may try and integrate in OpenStack at some point, but no immediate plans since they are under heavy us through interactive/batch/reservation jobs. If there’s some interesting research/tests to be done I could snag some time on the debug node | 21:20 |
| b1airo | jpr, from inside the instance. particularly for HPC desktops, we have a cluster focusing on characterisation and visualisation, so accelerated rendering is important for many of those use-cases and with a virtual desktop on the cluster all data on the PFS is local | 21:20 |
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| b1airo | rbudden, cool - we're about to get a rack full of P100 (PCIe) nodes, so far I haven't had any confirmation of anyone using them in pass-through, so crossing fingers at this point! | 21:22 |
| powerd | lizhong/b1ario - we saw that hang on workload with previous versions of OS/KVM ourselves also. Using centos 7 with liberty which works fine. Will be updating to Mitaka soon too and will report back. | 21:22 |
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| b1airo | powerd, i assume you are getting the virt stack from another repo though? | 21:23 |
| b1airo | the RHEV equivalent for centos maybe? | 21:23 |
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| jmlowe | rbudden: b1airo: I'd love to hear how it goes with the p100's | 21:24 |
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| b1airo | leong, thanks for reminding me about that talk - if i recall correctly that was more about Intel's GPU virtualisation specifically? | 21:24 |
| leong | b1airo: yup | 21:24 |
| jpr | @b1airo: nice! thanks. | 21:25 |
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| powerd | virt stack is either epel or standard centos core - i'd need to go double check (or RDO) | 21:25 |
| b1airo | leong, what is the target use-case for that? VM graphics acceleration? | 21:26 |
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| leong | graphics virtualization... | 21:28 |
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| b1airo | i have seen some work on the libvirt-dev list to add support for virtualisation-able (i.e. device multiplexing) NVIDIA gear too | 21:28 |
| leong | can be used for media transcoding or hpc use cases as well... | 21:28 |
| b1airo | DNNs? (sorry, just playing buzz-word bingo) ;-) | 21:29 |
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| jmlowe | virtualizing the gpu's, this is new to me, I also need the buzzwords to google | 21:30 |
| b1airo | so one problem that we have not yet solved with using host device based accelerators like GPUs in OpenStack is that it turns nodes into unicorns | 21:30 |
| b1airo | e.g. i've got a bunch of hypervisors with 2x K1 or 2x K2, which equates to 4 or 8 usable (passthrough-able) GPUs and thus 4-8 GPU-enabled cloud instances that can run on that node | 21:31 |
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| leong | there is some related work in the dev community | 21:31 |
| martial | so if we can get the GPU passed through we can share it :) and then nvidia themselves created docker-nvidia to split the GPU into multiple sub systems https://github.com/NVIDIA/nvidia-docker | 21:31 |
| leong | this one is about adding support to xenapi | 21:32 |
| leong | #link XenAPI/GPU: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/280099/ | 21:32 |
| b1airo | that's all fine until we realise that those GPU instances are often only lightly utilised and we have a bunch of excess compute+memory capacity on the node | 21:33 |
| b1airo | the problem is, i have not yet figured out a way with nova-scheduler to always have room for GPU instances but also let regular CPU-only instances onto the node | 21:33 |
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| b1airo | i'm guessing there are not that many people who have felt that problem yet though | 21:36 |
| b1airo | or just don't care because they only have a few GPU nodes anyway | 21:36 |
| powerd | another thing I plan to look into is bitfusion for virtualising the GPUs - could be useful for this VDI-like requirement | 21:37 |
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| b1airo | bitfusion? don't think i've seen that | 21:37 |
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| goldenfr_ | yea the 2nd one for us, only a few GPU nodes so its not a huge issue yet | 21:37 |
| lizhong | I didn't some benchmarking for GPU with baremetal, KVM and Docker. Baremetal and docker get really better performance than KVM. If we have baremetal + GPU on OpenStak would be really nice. | 21:37 |
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| priteau | b1airo: you want more CPU overcommit on the GPU nodes, but only when there are GPU instances running? | 21:37 |
| rbudden | b1airo: agreed. i believe we tend to ignore the CPUs on the GPU nodes | 21:37 |
| lizhong | Sorry for type. I DID some benchmarking for GPU with baremetal, KVM and Docker. Baremetal and docker get really better performance than KVM. If we have baremetal + GPU on OpenStak would be really nice. | 21:37 |
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| rbudden | essentially we schedule no CPU jobs during GPU jobs. the GPU jobs get a portion of the CPU based on the number of GPUs assigned. | 21:38 |
| powerd | www.bitfusion.io - not opensource but we'll give it a spin anyway. | 21:38 |
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| b1airo | looks suspiciously magic | 21:39 |
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| b1airo | lizhong, that's interesting about your benchmarking - the papers i have read all indicate KVM with passthrough is or is almost BM performance | 21:39 |
| jmlowe | lizhong: which version of qemu? | 21:39 |
| b1airo | of course, you need to have pinning, numa topology, etc. so perhaps that is difference you saw? we have seen very bad perf degradation for GPU heavy workloads on KVM without that tuning | 21:40 |
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| lizhong | b1airo, actually that's possible, if it's a tuned KVM | 21:42 |
| b1airo | also, you can have baremetal GPU on OpenStack, you just need an Ironic cloud with GPUs in the nodes - i'm not sure what the hardware discovery and scheduling support is like though | 21:42 |
| b1airo | powerd, what perf tests are you planning? | 21:43 |
| rbudden | b1airo: true, we have our GPUs controlled through Ironic, although we don’t do anything fancy on the scheduling side since SLURM handles that | 21:44 |
| rbudden | we do have a flavor for the GPUs so we can boot independant images if necessary | 21:44 |
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| powerd | So we are planning on performing some of the host <-> gpu transfer speeds/latencies, linpack and a couple of others. anything to add? | 21:45 |
| priteau | b1airo: for baremetal you can add extra_specs to your flavor and use that for scheduling on a specific node type | 21:45 |
| powerd | we'll add more GPUs and try node to node / GPUDirect (on a single host, then across fabric too) | 21:46 |
| b1airo | priteau, ah cool | 21:46 |
| martial | b1airo: 13 minutes to go | 21:47 |
| b1airo | and to answer your earlier question about mixing GPU-enabled and CPU-only instances on the same hypervisor, i just always want to be able to launch n GPU instances (where n is # of GPUs in the node), but otherwise i'm happy to fill available capacity | 21:48 |
| b1airo | (this is for general purpose cloud usage, not specifically HPC, so lots of idle dev instances and light desktop acceleration stuff) | 21:48 |
| b1airo | powerd, excellent - that's the problem i'm currently stuck on! | 21:49 |
| martial | what is the wiki page where people can add their notes on the GPU work ? | 21:49 |
| b1airo | ok, that was useful (for me anyway!). martial lizhong did you want to cover off anything about Dmoni | 21:49 |
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| powerd | good - guess i'll be stuck there too so soon enough ;) | 21:49 |
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| b1airo | martial, i will draft an etherpad and share so that everyone can edit | 21:50 |
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| martial | I see a lot of what is needed to be known is already in https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/ScientificWGMonitoringAndTelemetry | 21:50 |
| b1airo | #topic Monitoring round-up | 21:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Monitoring round-up (Meeting topic: scientific-wg)" | 21:50 | |
| martial | lizhong entered this content on the etherpad at the time | 21:50 |
| priteau | b1airo: it sounds a bit tricky. There may be a combination of nova-scheduler filters and their config to do it, but I don't know it! | 21:50 |
| martial | we have started the discussion on adding the code to github | 21:51 |
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| martial | so that people can see how it works | 21:51 |
| martial | we have also discussed the release of our prototype BDaaS VM that relies on DMoni | 21:51 |
| b1airo | priteau, i had some ideas i discussed with Joe Topjian (Cybera) a long while back - will add them to the etherpad | 21:52 |
| b1airo | would be good to get your thoughts | 21:52 |
| martial | lizhong is the main engineer on this tool, so I will let him comment | 21:52 |
| b1airo | martial, sounds good | 21:52 |
| b1airo | BDaaS = big data ? | 21:52 |
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| martial | b1airo: yes | 21:53 |
| martial | we started the work to provide a mean to run a VM with builtin BD tools within our stack on a sequestered set of data | 21:54 |
| lizhong | Dmoni is cluster monitoring tool targeting specific application running in a cluster | 21:54 |
| lizhong | like Hadoop, Spark, etc. | 21:54 |
| martial | and we wanted to know the benchmarking of different algorithms under different paradigms at the "step" level | 21:55 |
| jmlowe | from now on I will be pronouncing bdaas as badass | 21:55 |
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| b1airo | jmlowe, i have a sticker on my laptop that says BADaaS, but it means something else - i don't even know what, it was just fun o_0 | 21:57 |
| martial | so Dmoni was created to give us additional hooks into the benchmarking layer | 21:57 |
| lizhong | Dmoni differs from Ganglia and other cluseter monitoring tools which collect all system info | 21:57 |
| b1airo | martial, the BDaaS thing might be interesting in the context of the scientific datasets activity area | 21:57 |
| martial | b1airo: happy to discuss it obviously | 21:57 |
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| b1airo | sorry - just been distracted by a security incident on my cloud | 21:59 |
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| b1airo | someone spamming from it, the joys of having a research user-bae | 22:00 |
| martial | b1airo: uncool | 22:00 |
| b1airo | time to wrap it up | 22:00 |
| martial | yep 5pm | 22:00 |
| jmlowe | glad to see it happens to everybody | 22:00 |
| b1airo | thanks all!! | 22:00 |
| martial | (well here :) ) | 22:00 |
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| b1airo | #endmeeting | 22:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Dec 13 22:00:39 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scientific_wg/2016/scientific_wg.2016-12-13-21.02.html | 22:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scientific_wg/2016/scientific_wg.2016-12-13-21.02.txt | 22:00 |
| martial | thanks all | 22:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scientific_wg/2016/scientific_wg.2016-12-13-21.02.log.html | 22:00 |
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| rbudden | see ya’ll later! | 22:01 |
| christx2 | bye | 22:01 |
| priteau | bye all | 22:01 |
| priteau | b1airo: will you send the etherpad link by email? | 22:01 |
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| b1airo | priteau, yes | 22:02 |
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| priteau | b1airo: thanks! | 22:03 |
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