Friday, 2014-03-21

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cyeoh	#startmeeting nova-api	00:00
openstack	Meeting started Fri Mar 21 00:00:35 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is cyeoh. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.	00:00
openstack	Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.	00:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:00
openstack	The meeting name has been set to 'nova_api'	00:00
cyeoh	Hi! Who's here today?	00:00
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mikal	Me!	00:00
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masayukig	hi	00:00
mikal	Can I sneak something onto the agenda at the end?	00:01
mrda	hi all	00:01
ivanzhu	hi	00:01
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cyeoh	mikal: sure, please put it on	00:01
alex_xu	hi	00:01
ken1ohmichi	hi	00:01
mikal	What's the agenda URL?	00:01
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cyeoh	#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/NovaAPI	00:01
mikal	Ta	00:02
cyeoh	#topic v2 on v3 POC progress	00:02
*** openstack changes topic to "v2 on v3 POC progress (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:02
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cyeoh	So I think we've mostly been busy on the tempest validation side or nova bugs this week	00:02
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cyeoh	so not much has moved on the POC in the last week	00:02
cyeoh	but I think there's another v2 on v3 case we might need to consider	00:02
cyeoh	and that is where there are semantic not output changes between a v2 and v3 method	00:03
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cyeoh	the only case I can think of at this time is potentially the flavor create call currently under discussion	00:03
cyeoh	where we may end up with the v3 flavor create automatically adding the tenant to the access list when the flavor is private	00:04
cyeoh	and the v2 version not doing that.	00:04
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cyeoh	we probably have 2 choices here - we have two versions of the call (maybe sitting in the same file but with a decorator to divert to the correct one for v2)	00:04
cyeoh	or we start passing version flags	00:04
cyeoh	personally I don't like the latter because I think the code gets more complicated in the long run	00:05
cyeoh	but the former has more code duplication	00:05
cyeoh	so I'm interested if anyone else has opinions/other ideas?	00:05
mrda	I think it might depend upon _how_ semantically different v2 and v3 are	00:05
cyeoh	mrda: so we just do it on a case by case basis?	00:06
mrda	actually, the decorator diversion would work in either case	00:07
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mrda	if we do need both approaches, we should have a preferred one, and only use the 2nd for a fallback	00:07
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cyeoh	yea I suspect that the flag is okayish if there is only a tiny semantic difference	00:08
ken1ohmichi	or new v2.1 behavor will be defined as the same as current v3 behavor	00:08
mrda	yes	00:08
cyeoh	but if there's a big difference and the implementation is quite different then we have separate function	00:08
mrda	I think that sounds right cyeoh	00:09
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: so I suspect we can't do that. It's the easiest for us to implement, but it does mean a bigger impact on users of the V2 api moving to V2.1	00:09
cyeoh	I guess we'd need more feedback depending on the change (for flavor-create specifically it might be ok)	00:10
ken1ohmichi	I guess v3 behavior is because it is useful, right?	00:10
cyeoh	yea its probably what we intended to do for v2, we just got it wrong	00:10
cyeoh	and now people like horizon depend on the wrongness	00:11
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ken1ohmichi	ok, I also will consider the implementation.	00:11
cyeoh	that sounds good - so for now I'm happy if we're able to say that we have a solution for these circumstances and I guess we'll just code up an example for the POC.	00:11
ken1ohmichi	for v2 behavior	00:11
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: thanks!	00:12
alex_xu	one more case, we won't proxy neutron call in v3, so in v3 we won't auto allocate network for instance, but in v2 we should keep auto allocate. So cyeoh is right, we should keep same behavior in v2.1	00:12
cyeoh	alex_xu: yea the auto allocation could well be another example. How we handle nova-network and neutron proxying in v3 is all a bit of a mess unfortunately	00:13
ken1ohmichi	alex_xu: that is a big impact	00:13
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cyeoh	at some point we're going to have to decide if nova-network is with us long term or not. And if it is if we have APIs like quotas whether we proxy those for neutron	00:14
cyeoh	or if they're just seen as nova-network specific APIs (this will upset some people)	00:14
ken1ohmichi	cyeoh: agreed, proxy seems necessary again..	00:14
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cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: yep, for neutron I suspect so	00:15
cyeoh	and we may have to have auto allocation as well.	00:15
cyeoh	was there anything else people wanted to talk about the v2 on v3 POC?	00:15
cyeoh	#topic API extensions used by public clouds	00:16
*** openstack changes topic to "API extensions used by public clouds (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:16
cyeoh	so last week we talked about asking the public clouds what API extensions they actually used so we would know what areas to concentrate on for the v2 on v3 POC	00:17
cyeoh	not sure if alaski is around today?	00:17
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cyeoh	I've emailed HP privately, but haven't heard anything back yet	00:17
mikal	Did you ping Phil Day?	00:18
cyeoh	mikal: yea thats who I sent an email to earlier this week	00:18
mikal	Cool, I think he's the right person to ask.	00:18
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clarkb	is that something you can have novaclient list for you?	00:18
* clarkb can give you the output if it is available as a user		00:19
cyeoh	clarkb: hrm I'm not sure. does novaclient have an option to query /extensions?	00:19
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cyeoh	so thinking about it now I'd guess we just need someone with access to the cloud that can do a get on /extensions	00:20
cyeoh	and that should give us the full list of what is deployed	00:20
clarkb	looks like there is a list-extensions	00:21
* clarkb tries this		00:21
cyeoh	clarkb: ah nice :-)	00:21
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cyeoh	ok so I think we should be able to get that same info for rackspace pretty easily too.	00:22
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cyeoh	clarkb: if you could put up the output you get somewhere we can get to that'd be great.	00:24
cyeoh	#topic API response validation in tempest	00:24
*** openstack changes topic to "API response validation in tempest (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:24
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: did you want to talk about this? I think its all making pretty good progress?	00:25
ken1ohmichi	yes	00:25
ken1ohmichi	now good progress	00:25
ken1ohmichi	we have a lot of patches for it: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/tempest+branch:master+topic:bp/nova-api-attribute-test,n,z	00:25
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clarkb	cyeoh: http://paste.openstack.org/show/73956/	00:25
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mrda	ken1ohmichi: I would say great progress! You and the team have achieved a lot!	00:26
cyeoh	clarkb: thanks!	00:26
ken1ohmichi	but nova contains 253 v2 APIs and we need more	00:26
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: wow! We have lots of reviewing to do :-)	00:26
ivanzhu	cyeoh: ken1ohmichi can we just verify the success respond code in the client?	00:26
ken1ohmichi	if not containing body, that is right	00:27
ken1ohmichi	if containing body, we need to verify body of response	00:27
ivanzhu	in many case the response code is the only difference between v2 and v3.	00:27
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ken1ohmichi	with jsonschema	00:27
ivanzhu	ken1ohmichi: yes	00:27
ken1ohmichi	ivanzhu: nice info,	00:28
cyeoh	so where the only difference is the response code we can probalby just have one json schema file and override the response code for v3	00:28
ivanzhu	I mean we don't check the response code in tests again	00:28
cyeoh	ivanzhu: so we only check the response code in the client if its a success response code	00:28
ivanzhu	cyeoh:yes	00:28
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mrda	ken1ohmichi: where is the list of v2 apis that aren't currently tested?	00:28
ivanzhu	then we can share the v2 tests code in v3 easily	00:29
masayukig	mrda: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmYuZ6T4IJETdEVNTWlYVUVOWURmOERSZ0VGc1BBQWc&usp=drive_web#gid=2	00:29
cyeoh	ivanzhu: so we can probably just do a generic - is it a success code in the test	00:29
mrda	I was assuming that https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/nova-api-attribute-test was the list, and from that it looked good :)	00:29
ken1ohmichi	masayukig: thanks	00:29
ken1ohmichi	mrda: right, thanks:)	00:29
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mrda	masayukig: thanks for the link	00:30
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cyeoh	#link https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmYuZ6T4IJETdEVNTWlYVUVOWURmOERSZ0VGc1BBQWc&usp=drive_web#gid=2	00:30
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cyeoh	anything else on the response validation?	00:31
ken1ohmichi	this task is not only for v2.1 but also current v2, so better to cover not only the defference.	00:31
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cyeoh	yes it is very useful to stop us from accidentally making changes to the v2 API as well	00:32
ken1ohmichi	sorry, please go ahead	00:32
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cyeoh	np	00:32
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cyeoh	#topic SDK port for v3 API	00:33
*** openstack changes topic to "SDK port for v3 API (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:33
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cyeoh	so this idea came from mikal - that we try before Atlanta to port some SDKs to use the v3 API	00:33
mikal	Want me to do my thing here?	00:33
cyeoh	mikal: please go ahead :-)	00:34
mikal	Earlier in the week I promised cyeoh that I’d try and get some numbers for SDK popularity from Rackspace public cloud. Noting that these numbers are for nova only, here’s what I got back:	00:34
mikal	- python-novaclient	00:34
mikal	- the Rackspace web dashboard	00:34
mikal	- jclouds	00:34
mikal	- pyrax	00:34
mikal	- libcloud	00:34
mikal	- fog	00:34
mikal	So, that’s the top six SDKs that Rackspace sees. If we’re interested in seeing how hard it is to implement v3 in SDKs, jclouds looks like a good place to start.	00:34
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cyeoh	are they both SDKs which have multiple cloud backends?	00:34
cyeoh	oops only one there ;-)	00:35
mikal	python-novaclient, the web dashboard an pyrax are all openstack specific IIRC	00:35
mikal	The others are more generic	00:35
mikal	And probably better examples for us anyways	00:35
mrda	libcloud supports about 20 clouds I think	00:35
cyeoh	yea I'd assume for the generic ones that they would have to abstract away all the openstack specific naming etc	00:35
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mikal	I believe so	00:36
mikal	Although I've used none of them	00:36
mikal	But I'm hoping that data is useful to you	00:36
mrda	so libcloud won't mark an interface as production unless there are > 2 providers, so as to enforce generic interfaces	00:36
cyeoh	mikal: yes very much so	00:36
mrda	mikal: good stuff!	00:36
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mikal	:)	00:36
cyeoh	mrda: so is jclouds something you think you could start looking at?	00:37
mikal	I need to run to another meeting, so unless people have questions I'm going to bail out	00:37
cyeoh	mikal: thanks for coming!	00:37
mikal	NP!	00:37
mikal	Laters	00:37
mrda	thanks mikal	00:37
mrda	cyeoh: potentially, but it is java :)	00:37
cyeoh	yea sorry ;-)	00:37
* cyeoh looks to see what libcloud is in		00:38
mrda	if we wanted to keep it python, libcloud would be the choice	00:38
cyeoh	so I don't think we need to keep it python, but it might be a lot faster for you if we did	00:39
mrda	cyeoh: yup	00:39
cyeoh	if libcloud looks really easy maybe then tackle that first and then look at jclouds?	00:39
mrda	I've been actively purging any java knowledge from my brain :)	00:39
cyeoh	:-)	00:39
mrda	so I might look at libcloud then	00:40
cyeoh	sounds good!	00:40
cyeoh	#topic API stability guidelines	00:40
*** openstack changes topic to "API stability guidelines (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:40
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cyeoh	so I put this on the agenda because of the flavor-create issue which came up yesterday	00:41
cyeoh	#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-March/030508.html	00:41
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cyeoh	there's some more info there, but basically we sort of accidentally made a backwards incompatible change to the V2 API back in October	00:42
cyeoh	and we've only recently realised that its broken Horizon which probably means we'll break client scripts	00:42
cyeoh	but the change has been running on continuous deployment clouds for a few months now	00:42
cyeoh	so a revert will hurt them if we take that route	00:43
mrda	I guess the question is, how big a deal is it if this is reverted before release. Some pain now, but less pain later?	00:43
cyeoh	I don't think we really have a consensus yet (and I don't think there was one in the Nova meeting)	00:43
cyeoh	mrda: yea that's not clear to me how much it will hurt the CD guys	00:43
cyeoh	I guess its an interesting data point that the bug report came from the horizon people, not someone using a public cloud	00:44
cyeoh	so maybe people who use rackspace/HP public clouds don't really use private flavors?	00:44
mrda	By definition, anyone doing CD is expecting change	00:44
clarkb	I'm not sure we can have private flavors in rax/hp public clouds	00:45
mrda	But anyone moving from H to I would like change minimised	00:45
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clarkb	they give us a list of flavors and thats what we get	00:45
cyeoh	ok so only people who are doing CD with private clouds would be affected, and I'd guess the list of people who do that is really short?	00:45
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cyeoh	so doing the revert may be the least pain solution after all. Does anyone here think that doing the revert would be really bad?	00:47
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mrda	I guess this issue highlights the importance of improving api test coverage. So it validates our tempest approach for the POC.	00:48
cyeoh	so embarassingly tempest did pick this up	00:49
mrda	whoops	00:49
cyeoh	and we knew on the Nova side it was backwards incompatible but thought it was ok	00:49
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cyeoh	and we changed the tempest test	00:49
cyeoh	I suspect this is a lesson to us that even when we think a small backwards incompatible change is harmless, that its probably not	00:50
cyeoh	and we just have to take a very hard line on pushing back on those changes	00:50
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cyeoh	there have been a few other cases in Icehouse when someone has attempted to do a "bug fix" based on what the documentation said rather than what we did, and fortunately we've said no in those cases	00:51
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alex_xu	cyeoh, whether we need promise something before release? everything wrong before release is bug?	00:51
cyeoh	alex_xu: so I think that brings up a good point around whether API interfaces (or changes) should be considered "experimental" for say once cycle	00:52
cyeoh	and communicate that well to users	00:52
cyeoh	so we have time to fix mistakes when we stuff up	00:52
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alex_xu	yea	00:53
ivanzhu	agree	00:54
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cyeoh	I guess its something we should bring up at summit.	00:54
mrda	cyeoh: +1	00:54
alex_xu	+1	00:54
cyeoh	#topic open discussion	00:54
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: nova-api)"		00:54
cyeoh	anyone have anything they want to bring up?	00:55
ken1ohmichi	in v2.1 PoC implementation, "create a server" API has been done. how to do PoC?	00:56
cyeoh	ok then. Thanks everyone for attending!	00:56
mrda	thanks cyeoh!	00:56
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: ah sorry, go ahead :-)	00:56
ken1ohmichi	If we use Tempest for PoC, many tests fails	00:56
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: what sort of failures?	00:57
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ken1ohmichi	because Poc implementation can cover some APIs.	00:57
ken1ohmichi	only	00:57
ken1ohmichi	we need to check Tempest result more deeply for PoC.	00:58
cyeoh	so I guess you can run it locally with a subset of tempest tests to confirm if your patch works	00:58
ken1ohmichi	yes, right. I am doing it now.	00:58
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ken1ohmichi	so how to prove PoC for the other people?	00:59
cyeoh	we have an experimental job queue - not sure if its meant for this sort of thing?	00:59
cyeoh	but if it is perhaps we could have one with a subset of tempest tests enabled	00:59
ken1ohmichi	good idea, will talk about it deeply later.	00:59
cyeoh	so we can demonstrate tempest runs that pass and explain why its only a subset	00:59
cyeoh	ken1ohmichi: sounds good	01:00
cyeoh	perhaps you could ping sdague about it?	01:00
ken1ohmichi	the time:-)	01:00
ken1ohmichi	ok, I will do it.	01:00
cyeoh	yep, we're out of time. ok thank you everyone!	01:00
ken1ohmichi	thanks all	01:00
masayukig	thanks	01:00
alex_xu	thanks all	01:00
cyeoh	#endmeeting	01:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings \|\| https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"		01:00
openstack	Meeting ended Fri Mar 21 01:00:46 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)	01:00
openstack	Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2014/nova_api.2014-03-21-00.00.html	01:00
openstack	Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2014/nova_api.2014-03-21-00.00.txt	01:00
openstack	Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2014/nova_api.2014-03-21-00.00.log.html	01:00
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DinaBelova	#startmeeting climate	15:00
openstack	Meeting started Fri Mar 21 15:00:06 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is DinaBelova. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.	15:00
openstack	Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.	15:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: climate)"		15:00
openstack	The meeting name has been set to 'climate'	15:00
bauzas	\o	15:00
DinaBelova	o/	15:00
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DinaBelova	casanch1 pcargnel dpamio pafuent casanch1 scroiset :)	15:00
pafuent	o/	15:00
DinaBelova	ok :)	15:00
DinaBelova	let's wait others and then start	15:00
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casanch1	o/	15:01
DinaBelova	o/	15:01
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DinaBelova	dpamio, scroiset - u here?	15:01
DinaBelova	well :)	15:02
DinaBelova	I'll start I think	15:02
bauzas	yup	15:02
DinaBelova	not to waste time	15:02
DinaBelova	ok	15:02
DinaBelova	so today's agenda is	15:03
DinaBelova	#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Climate	15:03
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DinaBelova	well, as usually, let's start with action items fro last meeting	15:03
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dpamio	I'm here sorry, biobreak	15:03
DinaBelova	#topic Action items from the last meeting + reviews queries	15:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Action items from the last meeting + reviews queries (Meeting topic: climate)"		15:03
DinaBelova	dpamio, don't worry	15:03
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DinaBelova	#link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/climate/2014/climate.2014-03-14-15.09.html	15:03
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DinaBelova	let's go quickly through action items	15:04
DinaBelova	cmart is now a little bit busy this week	15:04
DinaBelova	working on internal trainings	15:04
DinaBelova	as he said to me	15:04
bauzas	ok	15:04
DinaBelova	so: he just started thinking about tempest integration	15:04
DinaBelova	he asked little help -> I'll provide him some info about how it'll be better to implement that	15:04
bauzas	he could take example of unittests for Pecan	15:05
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DinaBelova	#action DinaBelova help cmart to implement Tempest Climate Testing	15:05
DinaBelova	bauzas, well, it's a little bit about infrastructure questions	15:05
pafuent	Or use Manila as inspiration	15:05
DinaBelova	like where to start	15:05
DinaBelova	and how to do that	15:05
DinaBelova	pafuent, great idea	15:05
pafuent	https://github.com/stackforge/manila/tree/master/contrib/tempest	15:05
DinaBelova	#info use Manila as example of how Tempest testing might be implemented in contrib	15:06
pafuent	Is similar to devstack integration	15:06
DinaBelova	pafuent, coolio	15:06
DinaBelova	thanks much	15:06
bauzas	anyway, we could discuss this in an etherpad	15:06
DinaBelova	bauzas, good idea	15:06
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bauzas	if cmart doesn't feel enough confident	15:06
bauzas	and that doesn't require to be all connected at a same time	15:07
DinaBelova	#info discuss Tempest testing (if needed) on etherpad to help cmart	15:07
bauzas	the best way would be to set the URL for description in the BP	15:07
bauzas	to the etherpad	15:07
DinaBelova	as for me and my action items - they were about assignments, so they were done quite easy :)	15:07
DinaBelova	bauzas, yep	15:07
DinaBelova	and about etherpads	15:07
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DinaBelova	bauzas, I guess you were quite busy this week	15:08
DinaBelova	am I right?	15:08
bauzas	:-)	15:08
DinaBelova	I'm about your action item	15:08
bauzas	is this smiley enough ? :-)	15:08
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DinaBelova	>>> create etherpad about designs and amend according BPs	15:08
DinaBelova	:)	15:08
DinaBelova	yes	15:08
DinaBelova	ok, will you do that?	15:08
bauzas	yup	15:08
DinaBelova	ok, great	15:08
bauzas	put me an action for this week	15:08
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DinaBelova	#action bauzas create etherpad about designs and amend according BPs and share links via ML	15:08
DinaBelova	ok	15:09
DinaBelova	so I guess that's it for this topic	15:09
DinaBelova	any questions related to it?	15:09
casanch1	yes	15:09
DinaBelova	cool	15:09
casanch1	which BPs?	15:09
DinaBelova	about: new steps in lease-creation workflow	15:09
bauzas	for the next architectures	15:09
DinaBelova	and lease state	15:09
DinaBelova	they were discussed last meeting	15:10
DinaBelova	that's only reassignment for this week	15:10
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casanch1	oh, I remember those topics now	15:10
DinaBelova	as bauzas had no opportunity to work on them this week :)	15:10
casanch1	thanks,	15:10
DinaBelova	casanch1, yep	15:10
DinaBelova	np	15:10
DinaBelova	#topic 0.1.1 status (proposal sbauza, TBC)	15:10
*** openstack changes topic to "0.1.1 status (proposal sbauza, TBC) (Meeting topic: climate)"		15:10
DinaBelova	ok	15:10
DinaBelova	#link https://launchpad.net/climate/+milestone/0.1.1	15:10
DinaBelova	that's current state of 0.1.1 features	15:10
DinaBelova	and just simple update	15:11
DinaBelova	I've got from foundation lawyers	15:11
DinaBelova	wait a minute	15:11
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bauzas	sure	15:11
DinaBelova	>>> We’ll run the search. It typically takes a week to get results from the lawyers.	15:12
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DinaBelova	by Lauren from board of directories	15:12
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DinaBelova	actually they don't work with not incubated projects :)	15:12
DinaBelova	so we're lucky :)	15:12
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DinaBelova	letter was ~2 days ago	15:12
bauzas	ok	15:13
DinaBelova	so we'll wait next Tuesday for result	15:13
DinaBelova	and after that we'll have no blocker here	15:13
DinaBelova	that's quite cool	15:13
bauzas	ok	15:13
DinaBelova	as for BPs / bugs for 0.1.1	15:13
DinaBelova	we have 4 BPs and 2 bugs to be merged to upstream	15:14
DinaBelova	to have all wanted for 0.1.1. released	15:14
bauzas	Pecan is about to be done	15:14
DinaBelova	well, I guess now that docs Bp is almost merged	15:14
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bauzas	unittests are in good progress	15:14
DinaBelova	bauzas, yes, I'm ok with your impl	15:14
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bauzas	we're still missing some controllers	15:15
casanch1	I'll upload the initial version of tenant->project today	15:15
DinaBelova	casanch1, cool!	15:15
DinaBelova	thanks	15:15
casanch1	have been working on that, and I'm still testing it	15:15
DinaBelova	bauzas, what controllers?	15:15
DinaBelova	casanch1, yep, that's quite needed to be done :)	15:15
bauzas	GET /leases is done	15:15
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bauzas	POST /leases is in progress	15:15
DinaBelova	oh, ok	15:15
casanch1	I also added the dependency to pafuet's BP about DB migrations	15:16
DinaBelova	well, I love what we have now	15:16
bauzas	I still need to do PUT/DELETE	15:16
DinaBelova	and how are we moving further	15:16
bauzas	and do the same for hosts	15:16
DinaBelova	casanch1, yes	15:16
DinaBelova	ok	15:16
DinaBelova	i guess we're almost where we should be now	15:16
DinaBelova	btw	15:16
DinaBelova	Barbican is going to move from stackforge to openstack	15:16
bauzas	saw that	15:17
DinaBelova	that's our chance to rename, I guess	15:17
bauzas	they're pretty lucky :)	15:17
DinaBelova	:)	15:17
bauzas	does it require a downtime ?	15:17
DinaBelova	#info monitoring of Barbican moving to OpenStack repos to get our chance for renaming	15:17
bauzas	I was thinking that no	15:17
DinaBelova	bauzas, yes	15:17
bauzas	oh	15:17
DinaBelova	oh	15:17
DinaBelova	well	15:17
DinaBelova	Sergey said it is	15:18
DinaBelova	well, if so, I need to check it one more time	15:18
bauzas	ok, Sergey is our source of trust :)	15:18
bauzas	I don't pretend to be as informative as Sergey ;)	15:18
pafuent	Why Barbican moving is important for the renaming thing?	15:18
DinaBelova	#action DinaBelova check one more time if Barbican folks need some maintenance for gerrit while their moving	15:18
bauzas	because that could be a dowtime period	15:19
DinaBelova	pafuent, because we need to stop gerrit	15:19
bauzas	downtime	15:19
DinaBelova	to rename / move some where	15:19
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DinaBelova	that's quite tough thing	15:19
pafuent	Ok	15:19
DinaBelova	so infra guys don't like doing it every time	15:19
DinaBelova	so we need some packs of changes	15:19
DinaBelova	to be done this time	15:19
DinaBelova	like barbican + climate stuff	15:19
DinaBelova	ok	15:19
DinaBelova	any questions related to this topic?	15:19
DinaBelova	well :)	15:20
DinaBelova	i guess no :)	15:20
DinaBelova	#topic Bugs on trunk	15:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs on trunk (Meeting topic: climate)"		15:20
bauzas	:)	15:20
DinaBelova	bauzasm as you proposed agenda	15:20
bauzas	ok, I'm currently being a bit busy	15:20
DinaBelova	what did you want to discuss here?	15:21
bauzas	because some of our Bull folks are trying to integrate Climate within another XLcloud portal	15:21
DinaBelova	wow :)	15:21
bauzas	which is Java-based	15:21
DinaBelova	I guess that's tough :)	15:21
bauzas	so they're currently working on delivering a Java SDK for Climate	15:21
DinaBelova	did you find some bugs while that integration?	15:21
bauzas	based on the REST API	15:21
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bauzas	indeed :)	15:22
DinaBelova	due to topic :?	15:22
DinaBelova	ok	15:22
DinaBelova	cool :)	15:22
bauzas	I'm deploying Climate against Havana	15:22
bauzas	that works pretty fine	15:22
DinaBelova	coool!	15:22
bauzas	they're focusing on PR usecase	15:22
DinaBelova	ok, will you file bugs?	15:22
DinaBelova	that you found?	15:22
DinaBelova	while that integration?	15:23
DinaBelova	or I need to guess them :)	15:23
DinaBelova	:D	15:23
bauzas	that's the thing	15:23
bauzas	I asked them to open lp bugs	15:23
DinaBelova	and they?	15:23
bauzas	that should be done in the next days	15:23
DinaBelova	ok, cool	15:23
bauzas	so, I'm just saying we'll have some bugs	15:23
bauzas	volunteers are welcome for fixing them :)	15:24
DinaBelova	#info new bugs filed in Launchpad soon due to Bull Climate testing	15:24
DinaBelova	ok, when we'll see them	15:24
DinaBelova	we'll assign them too :)	15:24
bauzas	the good news is, our Bull team would be keen to fix some of them :)	15:24
DinaBelova	:*	15:24
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bauzas	they are Polish, with the 2 meanings :D	15:25
DinaBelova	I'll be really glad	15:25
DinaBelova	:"D	15:25
DinaBelova	ok	15:25
DinaBelova	smth else to discuss here?	15:25
DinaBelova	:)	15:25
bauzas	so that was basically a FYI	15:25
DinaBelova	ok	15:25
DinaBelova	good to know	15:25
DinaBelova	I'm going to the next topic	15:25
bauzas	sure	15:25
DinaBelova	#topic Juno Summit	15:25
*** openstack changes topic to "Juno Summit (Meeting topic: climate)"		15:25
DinaBelova	well	15:25
pafuent	Wait	15:25
DinaBelova	I've got updates :)	15:25
DinaBelova	oh	15:25
DinaBelova	pafuent?	15:25
pafuent	https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/	15:25
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DinaBelova	ok, I wanted to mention it while open discussion	15:26
DinaBelova	will you wait a little?	15:26
pafuent	Ok	15:26
DinaBelova	ok	15:26
pafuent	Yep	15:26
DinaBelova	about Juno summit	15:26
DinaBelova	unfortunately we have no session voted for	15:26
DinaBelova	on summit	15:26
DinaBelova	but be prepared for paste bomb	15:26
bauzas	:)	15:27
bauzas	my screen can support it	15:27
casanch1	what is paste bomb?	15:27
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DinaBelova	There is, however, an opportunity to have a speaking platform at the Summit that you may want to pursue. New to the Atlanta Summit the #vbrownbag Tech Talks will be onsite. The TechTalks offer a forum for community members to give ten minute presentations. TechTalks have a small in-person audience and will be livestreamed in real time. Additionally the presentations are video recorded and published to YouTube. If you are interested in	15:27
DinaBelova	participating in the #vbrownbag TechTalks please complete this submission form: >...<	15:27
DinaBelova	from email letter :)	15:27
DinaBelova	from foundation :)	15:27
bauzas	that's not a paste bomb	15:27
bauzas	:p	15:27
DinaBelova	well, yes	15:27
DinaBelova	I was prepared for more :)	15:27
bauzas	2 lines, I'm disappointed :p	15:27
DinaBelova	:D:D:D	15:27
DinaBelova	sorry :)	15:27
DinaBelova	well, we have alternative :)	15:28
bauzas	a paste bomb is when you paste something big generating a bunch of IRC lines	15:28
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DinaBelova	I'll fill some form to participate in that tech talks	15:28
bauzas	that's worth it	15:28
DinaBelova	so I hope we'll have some nice videos from Juno summit :)	15:28
DinaBelova	#action DinaBelova fill form to participate in #vbrownbag Tech Talks	15:28
DinaBelova	ok	15:28
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DinaBelova	well, I guess that's it for this topic...	15:29
bauzas	maybe we could ask michael still to know why we haven't been selected	15:29
DinaBelova	I have no more news I guess	15:29
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DinaBelova	bauzas, well, good point	15:29
DinaBelova	I'll ask him	15:29
bauzas	maybe that's because of the proximity with design summit	15:29
DinaBelova	bauzas, why Michael btw?	15:29
DinaBelova	is he responsible for it?	15:29
bauzas	as per these discussions	15:29
bauzas	yey	15:29
DinaBelova	ok	15:29
bauzas	didn't you know that ?	15:29
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bauzas	there were 3 chairs for that Related OSS track	15:30
DinaBelova	they are all new responsible peaople every 6 months :D	15:30
DinaBelova	oh, ok	15:30
bauzas	OSS ^projects track	15:30
bauzas	and mstill was one of those	15:30
DinaBelova	#action DinaBelova ask Michael Still about reasons for rejecting of Climate talk	15:30
DinaBelova	ok	15:30
bauzas	there is a ML you can see	15:30
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DinaBelova	thanks for info	15:30
DinaBelova	bauzas, yeeeees	15:30
DinaBelova	well, forgot about it	15:31
bauzas	summit-chairs or something like that	15:31
DinaBelova	sorry	15:31
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DinaBelova	next topic?	15:31
bauzas	archives are open	15:31
bauzas	sure	15:31
DinaBelova	#topic Open discussion	15:31
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: climate)"		15:31
DinaBelova	well :)	15:31
bauzas	oh	15:31
bauzas	one secf	15:31
DinaBelova	pafuent:)	15:31
DinaBelova	https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/	15:31
DinaBelova	yes?	15:31
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bauzas	forgot to explicitely mention the track for climate at the design summit	15:31
DinaBelova	bauzas, cross-[roject one?	15:32
bauzas	yu	15:32
bauzas	yup	15:32
DinaBelova	yes	15:32
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DinaBelova	#info we'll try to have cross-project session on summit due to TC decision	15:32
DinaBelova	btw Monty likes idea to have it :)	15:32
DinaBelova	so I guess we'll hold one :)	15:32
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DinaBelova	and as for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/	15:33
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DinaBelova	bauzas, am I right that Swann won't have possibility to continue working on it?	15:33
pafuent	Yes, I need that patch in trunk in order to add the uses of trusts in PR	15:33
DinaBelova	I've -1'ed it due to trusts discussion	15:33
DinaBelova	needed for Pablo	15:33
DinaBelova	bauzas, do you know if Swann will finisj it?	15:34
DinaBelova	finish*	15:34
bauzas	DinaBelova: good question	15:34
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DinaBelova	well, as he sits next table to u :)	15:34
bauzas	he's currently not there	15:34
bauzas	:p	15:34
DinaBelova	probably u may ask when he'll :)	15:34
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DinaBelova	#action bauzas ask scroiiset status for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/	15:34
DinaBelova	well	15:34
DinaBelova	typos..	15:34
DinaBelova	anyway :)	15:35
bauzas	oh, he's just going back	15:35
DinaBelova	:D:D:	15:35
DinaBelova	so you may ask him right now :)	15:35
DinaBelova	we'll give u some time :)	15:35
bauzas	I have even something better :)p	15:35
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DinaBelova	wow :)	15:35
scroiset	o/	15:35
DinaBelova	scroiset, o'/	15:35
bauzas	scroiset: status of https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/ ?	15:36
DinaBelova	some news about https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/ ???	15:36
DinaBelova	I was first :P	15:36
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bauzas	nope, same sec :p	15:36
DinaBelova	ah	15:36
DinaBelova	:)	15:36
scroiset	no update since last discussion	15:36
DinaBelova	scroiset, am I right this change should be updated to work with trusts?	15:36
DinaBelova	scroiset, what do you need for testing?	15:37
DinaBelova	Paplo	15:37
DinaBelova	:(	15:37
scroiset	DinaBelova: yes, need to check with paplo	15:37
DinaBelova	Pablo's change?	15:37
DinaBelova	ok, pafuent, will you collaborate with scroiset for that aim?	15:37
pafuent	I fix the bug using this patch as a base	15:37
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DinaBelova	well, quite nice	15:38
pafuent	For me is ok in it actual state	15:38
DinaBelova	anyway, please collaborate	15:38
pafuent	Sure, no problem	15:38
scroiset	sure :D	15:38
pafuent	It's the idea	15:38
DinaBelova	pafuent, ok, so publish your change	15:38
DinaBelova	and we'll check it together	15:38
DinaBelova	:)	15:38
scroiset	yes please	15:38
scroiset	publish	15:38
DinaBelova	it's hard testing without change published :)	15:38
pafuent	The thing is that I need another change in master, so scroiset: Could you rebase your patch?	15:38
DinaBelova	#action pafuent publish fix for PR + trusts	15:39
scroiset	pafuent: okay	15:39
DinaBelova	#action scroiset rebase https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76830/	15:39
DinaBelova	ok :)	15:39
DinaBelova	nice :)	15:39
DinaBelova	smth else to discuss here?	15:39
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DinaBelova	well :)	15:39
pafuent	Reviews for alembic patch :)	15:39
DinaBelova	I guess no :)	15:39
DinaBelova	oh	15:39
DinaBelova	yeees	15:39
DinaBelova	#action scroiset, bauzas - please take a look on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/75181/	15:40
DinaBelova	now I'm ok with it :)	15:40
DinaBelova	so I need other opinions here too :)	15:40
casanch1	It'll be great if someone else can take a look at the notifications implementation	15:40
casanch1	:)	15:40
bauzas	:)	15:40
DinaBelova	and yep :) casanch1, you're right	15:40
scroiset	add me an action for the notification review	15:41
DinaBelova	#action scroiset, bauzas - please take a look on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/75189/	15:41
DinaBelova	smth else?	15:41
casanch1	thanks!	15:41
DinaBelova	maybe I forgot about smth?	15:41
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scroiset	yep, what is the status of pecan wsme ?	15:41
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DinaBelova	bauzas, please repeat ^^	15:42
DinaBelova	bauzas?	15:42
scroiset	ok, I'll read the logs ..	15:42
DinaBelova	ok, there are many things done and not so many needed to be done :)	15:42
DinaBelova	that's the best answer :)	15:43
DinaBelova	so I guess that's it :)	15:43
DinaBelova	bye :)	15:43
pafuent	bye	15:43
bauzas	bye	15:43
scroiset	bye	15:43
casanch1	bye!	15:43
DinaBelova	Argentina - have a nice day, France - have a nice weekend :)	15:43
DinaBelova	#endmeeting	15:43
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings \|\| https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"		15:43
openstack	Meeting ended Fri Mar 21 15:43:49 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)	15:43
openstack	Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/climate/2014/climate.2014-03-21-15.00.html	15:43
openstack	Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/climate/2014/climate.2014-03-21-15.00.txt	15:43
openstack	Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/climate/2014/climate.2014-03-21-15.00.log.html	15:43
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vishy	is anyone here for the Hierarchical State Meeting?	16:01
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vishy	* Multitenancy	16:01
tiamar	I am	16:01
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vishy	hi tiamar	16:02
tiamar	hi vishy	16:02
vishy	#startmeeting Hierarchical Multitenancy	16:02
openstack	Meeting started Fri Mar 21 16:02:11 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is vishy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.	16:02
openstack	Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.	16:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Hierarchical Multitenancy)"		16:02
openstack	The meeting name has been set to 'hierarchical_multitenancy'	16:02
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VINOD_	i too	16:03
raildo	i am	16:03
vishy	hi guys	16:03
VINOD_	hi	16:03
raildo	hi	16:03
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vishy	i ges tellesnobrega is not here?	16:04
vishy	* guess	16:04
vishy	#topic actions from last week	16:05
*** openstack changes topic to "actions from last week (Meeting topic: Hierarchical Multitenancy)"		16:05
raildo	vishy: no, he had to travel today, could not attend the meeting	16:05
vishy	so tellesnobrega put up his code	16:05
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vishy	I reviewed it and it looks pretty ideal to me	16:05
vishy	i made one comment about dot separating the hierarchical ids	16:05
vishy	but other than that it seems pretty simple and effective	16:05
vishy	did anyone else look at it?	16:06
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vishy	i also checked out VINOD's changes for quota management	16:07
tiamar	vishy: I did, I also share your opinion, I think we have time to improve it but I have doubts on to where it should go	16:07
vishy	and it also seems pretty simple	16:07
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VINOD_	vishy: ok	16:08
vishy	the advantage of this is the set of changes is actually pretty small	16:08
vishy	between my code telles code and VINOD I think we have a workable solution that is less than a few hundred lines of code	16:08
VINOD_	vishy: for quota management, i think not much changes are required..the only thing i guess is in quota tables, the project id should store the entire hierarchy like projA.projA1.projA2 instead of projA2	16:09
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vishy	right	16:09
vishy	I do have some code for storing a cache of project names from ids	16:09
vishy	and looking stuff up in keystone	16:10
VINOD_	ok	16:10
vishy	but it is based on grizzly code	16:10
vishy	so i need to update it	16:10
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VINOD_	vishy: But i guess one thing is still undecided is whether we should go with ids or names for project	16:11
VINOD_	i mean like projA.projA1 or <id of projA>.<id of projA1>	16:11
vishy	VINOD_: based on the discussion on the ML I think we have to keep storing ids	16:11
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vishy	VINOD_: we can however pass both names and ids in separate fields	16:12
VINOD_	vishy: I think its better to pass both..	16:12
vishy	which would make the id/name cache avoid calls back to keystone in many cases	16:12
vishy	I'm worried about storing both	16:12
vishy	because that means db migrations to add extra fields	16:12
vishy	etc.	16:12
VINOD_	vishy: yes, exactly and also avoids the problem if in case some where we need ids and some where we need names	16:12
vishy	so i think the idea would be we store ids	16:13
vishy	but keep an in memory map to names	16:13
vishy	which we can update from the data passed	16:13
tiamar	are project names immutable?	16:13
vishy	no	16:14
VINOD_	But why we need database migrations...keystone basing on the authentication scope can construct the names as well as ids by looking into its database and put them into the token	16:14
vishy	VINOD_: i mean in the other projects	16:14
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vishy	i.e. in nova instances table	16:14
vishy	we just store ids	16:14
VINOD_	oh!!!ok	16:14
vishy	not both	16:14
VINOD_	i got it	16:14
VINOD_	i was slightly confused	16:14
VINOD_	vishy: that's seems ok for me	16:15
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vishy	ok so I'm going to modify the wiki to explain the plan in more detail	16:15
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vishy	with links to sample code	16:15
VINOD_	great	16:15
vishy	#topic next steps	16:15
*** openstack changes topic to "next steps (Meeting topic: Hierarchical Multitenancy)"		16:15
vishy	#action vishy to update wiki with current plan	16:15
vishy	so the next thing is to figure out meetings for the summit	16:16
vishy	#topic summit sessions	16:16
*** openstack changes topic to "summit sessions (Meeting topic: Hierarchical Multitenancy)"		16:16
vishy	i think we need one session on adding hierachical projects to keystone	16:17
raildo	http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/62	16:17
schwicke	who of us is going there ?	16:17
vishy	which would include calcuating the inherited roles and passing two new fields to the clients: hierarchical_ids and hierarchical_Names	16:18
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vishy	there is a session proposed already for this	16:18
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vishy	there is also a session proposed to nova around domains and quotas	16:19
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vishy	http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/58	16:20
VINOD_	if i am right tiago will represent for nova about domains and quotas..right?	16:20
vishy	personally i would suggest we do a combined session where we discuss domains an projects	16:20
tiamar	I'm actualling not going to the summit - But Raildo and Telles will	16:20
VINOD_	tiamar: ok	16:21
vishy	i believe there was supposed to be a post about why we should keep domains and hierarchical projects?	16:21
vishy	i don't recall seeing that	16:21
raildo	vishy: I agree to discuss two subjects in the same session	16:21
vishy	i think raildo was going to put that together?	16:21
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raildo	vishy: I'd send an email but I thought I discuss here	16:22
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vishy	finally I think we need one session in common proposing the plan for all projects	16:22
vishy	#action vishy to propose a cross-project session about hierarchical multitenancy	16:23
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vishy	#topic why keep domains if we have hierarchical projects	16:23
*** openstack changes topic to "why keep domains if we have hierarchical projects (Meeting topic: Hierarchical Multitenancy)"		16:23
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vishy	raildo: lets discuss then	16:24
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raildo	vishy: I gathered some ideas about why keeping domains with hierarchical projects such as: In our case domains might be mapped to our big customers, and serve to group the tenants they own. In this case, the domain information would help determine whom to account for the used resources.	16:25
vishy	raildo: I don't see what advantage calling the big customer thing a "domain" vs just a "project"	16:26
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schwicke	raildo: Couldn't have phrased it any better	16:26
schwicke	it's the same for us.	16:27
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raildo	vishy: IMO This being 2 different concepts in OpenStack makes it easier to implement sophisticated algorithms of isolation and access control and delegation while maintaining backward compatibility.	16:27
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raildo	vishy: Federation needs domains to be used as containers of users, ie, we need domains to obtain multi-tenancy with keystone federated.	16:29
vishy	raildo: I think the major issue is that both keystone and other projects are not in support of passing around the domain id	16:29
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vishy	raildo: ok that one makes sense	16:29
vishy	raildo: that's what I've been thinking of domains as	16:30
vishy	containers of users	16:30
vishy	which would be a keystone only concept	16:30
raildo	vishy: sure	16:30
vishy	i.e. the other projects don't need to know about domains at all	16:30
vishy	which i think is way simpler	16:30
gabriel-bezerra	vishy: regarding other projects, it could store the domain id as the first domain in the hierarchy of the project id. I think they don't need a new database column just to store the domain id.	16:31
raildo	vishy: I do not think the concept of domains is complex, I believe it is even simpler than hierarchical projects.	16:32
gabriel-bezerra	* they could	16:32
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vishy	gabriel-bezerra: they could but i don't like tying projects to domains if they are containers for users	16:34
vishy	gabriel-bezerra: that woudl stop cross-comptany projects for example	16:34
tiamar	vishy: in keystone domains are also containers for projects	16:34
gabriel-bezerra	but aren't them also containers of projects? Can a project be shared among domains?	16:35
vishy	and i don't think it is any harder to just create a top level project matching the domain	16:35
vishy	gabriel-bezerra: my point is that they shouldn't	16:35
tiamar	vishy: there are a BP for chross-domain integration based on trusts	16:35
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vishy	gabriel-bezerra: but this is theoretical	16:35
vishy	I'm ok with them being the top-level and passed along	16:35
raildo	vishy: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/keystone/+spec/domain-trusts	16:35
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vishy	honestly i think that is way more complicated but if that's how the keystone devs want to do it thats ok with me	16:36
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vishy	having to walk up the hierarchy to get roles and then at the end of the chain check the domain	16:36
vishy	seems weird	16:37
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vishy	although dolph proposed implementing domains as a top-level project	16:37
vishy	with just a different flag	16:37
vishy	which seems fine to me	16:37
raildo	great	16:37
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raildo	vishy: I believe we can gain much more by keeping the two concepts together	16:38
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vishy	ok I will update the wiki with options on domains	16:41
vishy	I have to head out	16:41
vishy	is there anything else to discuss	16:41
vishy	#topic open discussion	16:42
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: Hierarchical Multitenancy)"		16:42
vishy	#action vishy to include domain options in wiki update	16:42
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VINOD_	vishy: nothing more from our side	16:43
tiamar	vishy: we could see on the roles in Telles code, what you think?	16:43
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vishy	sure	16:44
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tiamar	vishy: ok, we will do this	16:45
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vishy	#action tiamar to try to deal with role inheritance in telles code	16:48
vishy	ok thanks guys	16:48
vishy	#endmeeting	16:48
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings \|\| https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"		16:48
openstack	Meeting ended Fri Mar 21 16:48:19 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)	16:48
openstack	Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/hierarchical_multitenancy/2014/hierarchical_multitenancy.2014-03-21-16.02.html	16:48
openstack	Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/hierarchical_multitenancy/2014/hierarchical_multitenancy.2014-03-21-16.02.txt	16:48
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openstack	Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/hierarchical_multitenancy/2014/hierarchical_multitenancy.2014-03-21-16.02.log.html	16:48
raildo	thanks	16:48
tiamar	bye	16:48
raildo	bye	16:48
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gabriel-bezerra	bye	16:48
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schwicke	bye	16:48
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VINOD_	bye	16:50
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