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| johnthetubaguy | #startmeeting XenAPI | 15:02 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 11 15:02:15 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is johnthetubaguy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:02 | |
| johnthetubaguy | hello all | 15:02 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'xenapi' | 15:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | who is around today? | 15:02 |
| thouveng | hi | 15:02 |
| matel | hi | 15:02 |
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| johnthetubaguy | cool, so lets get cracking | 15:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic Blueprints | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Blueprints (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:03 | |
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| BobBall | Sorry guys | 15:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | anyone got anything to chat about blueprints? | 15:03 |
| thouveng | yes :) | 15:03 |
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| johnthetubaguy | cool, fire away | 15:04 |
| thouveng | I added a link to an etherpad and I don't know if it is a good practice | 15:04 |
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| BobBall | Could you just link to the bp thouveng ? | 15:04 |
| BobBall | in here I mean | 15:04 |
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| BobBall | I'm being thick and can't find it | 15:04 |
| thouveng | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/pci-passthrough-xenapi | 15:05 |
| thouveng | and the link to ehterpad is https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/pci-passthrough-xenapi | 15:05 |
| BobBall | Perfect | 15:05 |
| BobBall | that's right isn't it johnthetubaguy ? | 15:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, that looks good | 15:05 |
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| thouveng | ok cool. | 15:06 |
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| johnthetubaguy | are there any bits you want to discuss in that? | 15:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | or just get a general review? | 15:07 |
| thouveng | just a general review for the moment | 15:07 |
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| BobBall | I think it LGTM - but that might be because we've discussed it outside of the BP | 15:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | what is all the hiding of PCI devices? | 15:08 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I thought all the hiding is implemented inside nova? | 15:08 |
| BobBall | I'll let you answer thouveng - but if you want me to step in, let me know | 15:08 |
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| thouveng | yes please go because I didn't get the question sorry | 15:09 |
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| johnthetubaguy | thouveng: you say about passing a "hide" option to pciback module, why is that? | 15:09 |
| BobBall | In order to do PCI pass through for PV guests in xen (and stably for HVM guests) the devices should use the pciback driver in dom0 to make sure dom0 doesn't use them for other things | 15:10 |
| BobBall | Therefore they need to be "hidden" from the normal kernel boot so pciback can collect them | 15:10 |
| BobBall | hence pciback.hide=(device_id) on the kernel command line | 15:10 |
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| BobBall | the KVM approach is to change the module dynamically but that's a little less stable - and yuo still have to enumerate the devices in nova.conf anyway | 15:11 |
| BobBall | so the two might as well be combined | 15:11 |
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| johnthetubaguy | OK, so I am not sure I understand what is going there, I know there is a whilelist that tells nova which devices it can pass to a guest, and in the flavor we tell nova which devices to pass to a specific server | 15:12 |
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| BobBall | Post-whitelist, KVM will try to disconnect the device from dom0 and attach it to the KVM-equivalent of the pciback driver | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, I see | 15:13 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so we have to disconnect some set of device from dom0, and thats what we are updating? | 15:13 |
| BobBall | All we're saying is we'll do that at boot time since that's better practice - particularly for xen | 15:13 |
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| BobBall | yes - but they are not "disconnected", just never connected to dom0, as it's a dom0 kernel option | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | right | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | so this is moving into host aggreates, and the config file is going away | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | does that create an issue? | 15:14 |
| BobBall | what is moving into host aggregates? | 15:14 |
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| BobBall | and what config file? do you mean the whitelist option in nova.conf? | 15:15 |
| BobBall | but no, I'm sure it won't create a problem | 15:15 |
| thouveng | there are two different things to configure pci passthrough. The whitelist is just used bu the compute node. | 15:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yes, the configuration in nova.conf is going into the DB | 15:16 |
| BobBall | well - the compute node uses the whitelist to report to the scheduler what it can provide, right? | 15:16 |
| thouveng | so I think that it doesn't create any issue since we just replaced the white list by the boot command line detection. | 15:16 |
| thouveng | BobBall: yes | 15:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | that includes the white list I think | 15:16 |
| BobBall | that won't be a problem | 15:16 |
| BobBall | I think :P | 15:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | erm, except the user now specifies the whitelist through an administration API? | 15:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | as in rest API | 15:16 |
| BobBall | That won't be possible in the current thinking - and possibly isn't possible _at all_ with Xen | 15:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | hmm, so thats what we decided at the summit for PCI passthrough, oh dear... | 15:18 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so, its not all bad right… as long as you expose more PCI devices than you want in your nova based whitelist | 15:18 |
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| BobBall | true | 15:18 |
| BobBall | so it migth need to be an intersection of the two | 15:18 |
| BobBall | i.e. you have to configure in dom0 to expose it | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool, I think we are good | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, +1 | 15:19 |
| BobBall | and then nova can only use it if it's both there and in the whitelist | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | expose some in dom0, then you can configure some of those in the dymanic whitelist, it all wokrs | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | yup | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool | 15:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | any more blueprint stuff? | 15:19 |
| BobBall | It might be possible with newer versions of xen btw - so Augusta or beyond - which use Xen 4.2+ | 15:19 |
| BobBall | but not with existing versions (which don't have xl pci-set-assignable stuff) | 15:20 |
| BobBall | -xen +XenServer | 15:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ah, OK | 15:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | good to know | 15:20 |
| thouveng | nice | 15:20 |
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| BobBall | Does that make sense thouveng? I think that's right? | 15:20 |
| thouveng | yes I think so | 15:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I would just get in there, and throw up some code, and we can help you through it | 15:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | all sounding really good :) | 15:21 |
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| BobBall | good good | 15:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic Docs | 15:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Docs (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:22 | |
| johnthetubaguy | any news? | 15:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic QA | 15:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "QA (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:22 | |
| johnthetubaguy | matel: want to update us on the tempest gate work? | 15:22 |
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| matel | Yep, nodepool is not prepared for server restarts | 15:23 |
| matel | so I'm proposing a patch, so that this concept fits in. | 15:23 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I am looking at the other side, so assuming we get nodepool sorted, and we have a VM setup, what can we do | 15:23 |
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| johnthetubaguy | at the same time, going to see what I can do with config drive to get IPs into it, inside rax cloud | 15:23 |
| matel | If that's ready, 2 more items left on the list: 1.) prepare the instance for snapshotting 2.) come up with a localrc. | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | yep | 15:24 |
| matel | Yes, config drive would save us some reboots | 15:24 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I am kinda looking at (2), in theory anyways | 15:24 |
| matel | Apart from that, an email will go to the infra list with our ideas. | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | bobball: how is making tempest stable going? | 15:24 |
| matel | Hopefully today. | 15:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | matel: some fine work | 15:25 |
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| BobBall | in the RS cloud just waiting for Mate to collect the logs so we can try and figure out why it's not working properly up there but it works better here | 15:25 |
| BobBall | anyway | 15:25 |
| BobBall | I've got a whole heap of changes stuck waiting for review needed to get tempest stable + fast enough | 15:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | BobBall: is that full tempest failing or smoke too? | 15:26 |
| matel | Bob - what's up with changing to raring? | 15:26 |
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| BobBall | smoke in RS cloud fails | 15:26 |
| BobBall | That's what I was just going tos ay - but I want suacy | 15:26 |
| BobBall | saucy* | 15:26 |
| BobBall | anyway - the hopefully last issue is a kernel bug in precise | 15:26 |
| matel | Oh, so you say we should try saucy? | 15:26 |
| BobBall | which we've just confirmed as a kernel bug | 15:26 |
| BobBall | yeah | 15:26 |
| BobBall | saucy is newer | 15:26 |
| BobBall | new = good, right? | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | something like that | 15:27 |
| matel | I'm a bit confused, soucy is the latest? | 15:27 |
| BobBall | Maybe raring is good enough | 15:27 |
| BobBall | yes | 15:27 |
| BobBall | raring = 13.04 | 15:27 |
| matel | It's not true in the software world. | 15:27 |
| BobBall | saucy = 13.10 | 15:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | matel: what is in your XVA at the moment? | 15:27 |
| matel | A debootstrapped install. | 15:27 |
| matel | wait a sec... | 15:27 |
| BobBall | Anyway - the kernel bug in precise causes a semaphore to be held when the userspace program finishes | 15:27 |
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| BobBall | causing all sorts of things to fail randomly | 15:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | nasty | 15:28 |
| BobBall | like lsof or lvs or anything really | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | eek, nice | 15:28 |
| BobBall | which in turn (very disappointingly) means that tempest fails | 15:28 |
| matel | john: which xva are you asking? | 15:28 |
| matel | john: gimme url. | 15:28 |
| BobBall | I thought all XVAs were precies? | 15:28 |
| BobBall | precise* | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | matel: the one in your script in gerrit? | 15:28 |
| matel | Ah, OK, I thought that you are interested in the package list. | 15:28 |
| matel | So yes, that's a precise. | 15:29 |
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| johnthetubaguy | OK, so there is (3) update xva to latest ubuntu | 15:29 |
| matel | Guys, should we agree to go for saucy? | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | we should go for whatever works for you locally at the moment | 15:29 |
| BobBall | anyway - the frustrating thing is that for some reason we don't seem to hit this kernel issue if we don't have one of my changes... but other things in tempest randomly fail without it | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | lol | 15:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | that sucks | 15:30 |
| BobBall | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60253/ is the one that fixes some real nova failures and seems to somehow expose the kernel bug | 15:30 |
| matel | that's not lol, Bob is loosing his hair. | 15:30 |
| matel | So, Saucy? | 15:30 |
| matel | Bob? | 15:30 |
| BobBall | It's true. I have pulled most of it out in the last week. | 15:30 |
| BobBall | I say yes matel | 15:31 |
| BobBall | no point sticking on precise IMO | 15:31 |
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| johnthetubaguy | you make it go so fast… you hit a kernel bug | 15:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | it happens to us all | 15:31 |
| matel | Okay, I will go for that as well. | 15:31 |
| BobBall | either saucy or just say "sod it" and go for centos like the rest of the infra jobs ;) | 15:31 |
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| matel | john - do you know if anyone is on saucy? | 15:31 |
| BobBall | but that's a bigger change | 15:31 |
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| BobBall | I'm happy with trying raring if it's easier - e.g. exists in RS | 15:31 |
| matel | Yep, I am afraid of the unknowns. | 15:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | I duno, can't remember what we use, don't think its ubuntu | 15:31 |
| matel | Okay, let's go with raring. | 15:32 |
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| BobBall | RS are standardising on Debian moving forward | 15:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | raring is fine for now | 15:32 |
| matel | wheezy? | 15:32 |
| matel | Bob, do you think, wheezy would be a good option? | 15:32 |
| BobBall | not sure which one matel ... antonym did tell me, but I can't remember | 15:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | BobBall: thats all I remember, debian | 15:32 |
| BobBall | but debian vs ubuntu yes | 15:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | but some folks want centos, but hey | 15:33 |
| matel | I'm just afraid of being the only team on the edge. | 15:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, lets just pick something that works | 15:33 |
| BobBall | maybe it was sid - Rackspace like being on the edge ;) | 15:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | if it falls over, we pick something else righ | 15:33 |
| matel | The problem is the cost of these probes, John. | 15:33 |
| matel | It's quite expensive, so thinking for a while is a good idea. | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | sure, but we know precise is broken, I would rather with pick an LTS, but whatever works for now | 15:34 |
| BobBall | Can we just remove the XVA and run a dozen or so smokes overnight to see if raring works? | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | BobBall: +1 | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | anyways | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | lets move on I think | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | not precise as precise is broken for us, seems OK for now | 15:34 |
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| johnthetubaguy | but lets leave that for now | 15:35 |
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| johnthetubaguy | we need the nodepool working first | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | lets get a failing test rather than no test | 15:35 |
| matel | will add you to the reviewers. | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool, sounds good | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | any bugs that people want to talk about? | 15:35 |
| BobBall | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60808/ is always fun | 15:36 |
| BobBall | got a very weird thing happening | 15:36 |
| BobBall | but it's not the cause of the kernel bug | 15:36 |
| BobBall | basically we get kernel messages | 15:36 |
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| BobBall | saying the device is in use by nova when we're trying to unplug it | 15:36 |
| BobBall | and it leaks grant entries | 15:36 |
| BobBall | which isn't a "problem" - but something that's very weird | 15:37 |
| BobBall | the device _does_ unplug | 15:37 |
| BobBall | because the next loop sees it as inactive then it's ok | 15:37 |
| BobBall | but compounded it might cause a problem | 15:37 |
| BobBall | after hundreds of the g.e.'s leak | 15:37 |
| BobBall | so I was trying to fix it with sync's and direct access to disks | 15:37 |
| BobBall | all of which should prevent it | 15:37 |
| BobBall | but it's not :( | 15:37 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, might run out of handles or something... | 15:38 |
| johnthetubaguy | hmm | 15:38 |
| BobBall | not handles - but Xen will get very unhappy | 15:38 |
| BobBall | I assert the changes I've made are good changes and worthwile to have | 15:38 |
| BobBall | which is why I haven't pulled them | 15:38 |
| BobBall | but they haven't fully fixed the issue I'm seeing | 15:38 |
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| BobBall | and I can't explain why because everything is so disconnected it's impossible to trace back to the nova code that's causing this | 15:38 |
| BobBall | AND it only happens in parallel tempest at random times too | 15:39 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yuck | 15:39 |
| BobBall | But maybe it'll be fixed by upgrading to the latest version of Ubuntu | 15:39 |
| BobBall | And if it's not, we can just wait for 14.04 :) | 15:39 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, sounds nasty, would PVHVM be better? | 15:40 |
| BobBall | can't run that in RS cloud | 15:40 |
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| BobBall | I assume you mean HVM rather than PVH | 15:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | true, damm half working nested virt | 15:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, HVM with PV drivers, but we can't do that either, I assume | 15:41 |
| BobBall | PVH will be cool when it exists | 15:41 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 | 15:41 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool, so lets move on... | 15:41 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic Open Discussion | 15:41 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:41 | |
| johnthetubaguy | anything else for today's meeting? | 15:42 |
| annegentle | Doc Bug Day 12/20 -- next Friday | 15:42 |
| annegentle | follow the sun! | 15:42 |
| BobBall | regarding direct IO for writing config drive you just commented John - I don't have a bug that I can say is fixed by this, which is why it doesn't have a link | 15:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | ah, my last day at work, that sounds like a good time to help update docs, I will but that in my diary | 15:43 |
| BobBall | the change is one that we should be doing, but the symptoms I saw weren't fixed by this | 15:43 |
| annegentle | It would be great to clean up/consolidate the Xen doc bugs, I think they're mostly tagged accurately. https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bugs?field.tag=xen | 15:43 |
| annegentle | johnthetubaguy: yeah the timing is pretty cool. My team is gonna put in a movie in the afternoon :) | 15:43 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #action johnthetubaguy sort out doc bugs on doc day | 15:44 |
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| johnthetubaguy | cool, so I guess we are all done? | 15:45 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #endmeeting | 15:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:48 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 11 15:48:02 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:48 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2013/xenapi.2013-12-11-15.02.html | 15:48 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2013/xenapi.2013-12-11-15.02.txt | 15:48 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2013/xenapi.2013-12-11-15.02.log.html | 15:48 |
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| thingee | who wants to be in jgriffith's shoes for 55 mins? | 16:06 |
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| winston-d | DuncanT: ? | 16:06 |
| thingee | DuncanT? | 16:06 |
| thingee | ha | 16:06 |
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| avishay | thingee: ? | 16:07 |
| avishay | :) | 16:07 |
| zhaoqin__ | thingee: you host the meeting today? | 16:07 |
| caitlin56 | +1 thingee | 16:07 |
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| avishay | thingee: you're the only one on the agenda...does it make sense to discuss in a limited forum? | 16:07 |
| winston-d | thingee: +2 | 16:07 |
| zhiyan | +1 thingee | 16:07 |
| jungleboyj | Where is everybody? | 16:08 |
| avishay | jungleboyj: beats me | 16:08 |
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| thingee | #startmeeting Cinder | 16:09 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 11 16:09:36 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is thingee. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:09 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:09 |
| jungleboyj | avishay: Everyone is bailing out here for Christmas already. Not be just an IBM thing. :-) | 16:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:09 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'cinder' | 16:09 |
| thingee | hi all | 16:09 |
| bswartz | woop | 16:09 |
| xyang__ | hi | 16:09 |
| joel-coffman | hey | 16:09 |
| zhaoqin__ | hello | 16:10 |
| jungleboyj | Howdy! | 16:10 |
| bswartz | better late than never | 16:10 |
| thingee | agenda today folks https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/CinderMeetings | 16:10 |
| avishay | bswartz: not always :) | 16:10 |
| winston-d | o/ | 16:10 |
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| thingee | thingee: you have the floor | 16:10 |
| avishay | haha | 16:10 |
| thingee | #topic Ideas with extensions | 16:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ideas with extensions (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:10 | |
| thingee | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/cinder-extensions | 16:10 |
| jungleboyj | Oh no, thingee is talking to himself. | 16:11 |
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| avishay | thingee: so an extension could add a new flow, or inject into existing flows, yes? | 16:11 |
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| thingee | inject into an existing flow | 16:12 |
| avishay | yes | 16:12 |
| avishay | or a new one, right? | 16:12 |
| thingee | so that's debatable. I thnk things get more complex then. | 16:12 |
| avishay | i see | 16:12 |
| kmartin | so reading the etherpad, does multi-attach fall into core since its part of "attach it" basic function | 16:13 |
| thingee | because you could end up with different results | 16:13 |
| zhiyan | kmartin: hehe i asked same question on the summit, but seems it isn't | 16:13 |
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| caitlin56 | If it is a new flow, how do users know when to invoke it and how? If you are modifying a flow, how do you allow two exensions to modify the same flow? | 16:13 |
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| avishay | where would retype go? it's related to types, but it has it's own flow. where does migration go? replication can definitely inject into create_volume. | 16:13 |
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| thingee | caitlin56: exactly. there maybe other extensions injecting to that flow...and then you got a whole mess if an extension just does a new flow. | 16:15 |
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| thingee | sorry guys, ym irssi session is really laggy atm | 16:15 |
| winston-1 | i like the idea 'core feature should be avaiable (cannot be disabled/turned off) everywhere'. | 16:16 |
| caitlin56 | thingee: that's my concern, the phrase "injection" brings back ancient memories of DOS TSR routines. | 16:16 |
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| jungleboyj | +1 winston-1 | 16:16 |
| thingee | winston-d: +1 | 16:16 |
| thingee | avishay: so I see migration as a new flow that could be registered with the manager. | 16:16 |
| bswartz | DOS TSR routines: -1000 | 16:17 |
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| avishay | thingee: OK so that's what i meant by an extension adding a new flow | 16:17 |
| rushiagr | hey hi all! | 16:17 |
| avishay | rushiagr: hi | 16:17 |
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| thingee | avishay: Thanks. I just need a good example to get to that point :) | 16:17 |
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| avishay | thingee: :) | 16:18 |
| thingee | so harlowja and I have been talking about ways to inject beginning and end | 16:18 |
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| thingee | that's pretty simple | 16:18 |
| avishay | i like the idea in terms of code, the DB is where it gets tricky (and also conflicting extensions as caitlin56 mentioned) | 16:18 |
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| * DuncanT forgot the meeting, sorry | 16:19 | |
| thingee | when you talk middle..I have this sort of silly idea that you take the the core tasks...whatever task is in the middle, you inject before that. I think this might lead to problems where the core tasks can change..and then extensions would break. | 16:19 |
| avishay | need tempest tests that try all combinations? | 16:19 |
| caitlin56 | avishay: we can learn from past mistakes, the key is to prevent extension X from modifying the chain as previously modified by extension Y while assuming it was unmodifed. | 16:19 |
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| thingee | You have things like FC zone manager that'll basically need to change how attach/detach works. | 16:20 |
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| avishay | caitlin56: thingee: yep | 16:20 |
| hemna | thingee, do you have a wiki on what it means to be an extension and how one codes it up? I'm not clear on the distinction. | 16:21 |
| thingee | anyways, this is kind of what I've been throwing around. | 16:22 |
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| rushiagr | I agree, we don't have good docs to explain what an extension is | 16:22 |
| thingee | hemna: not yet. I wanted to start with just rexplaining my idea since there was a big disagreement at the summit | 16:22 |
| caitlin56 | henma: there isn't anything I could find. That might be a first step -- fully document what is there today. | 16:22 |
| thingee | I wanted to start with everyone agreeing what is core | 16:22 |
| thingee | if we can agree on what core is, the rest are extensions to cinder. | 16:23 |
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| hemna | well I thought the real disagreement was simply around disallowing extensions to touch/change the db schema | 16:23 |
| avishay | thingee: your list of core seems good to me | 16:23 |
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| caitlin56 | henma: with some solid examples on a wiki page there might be less opposition to specific restrictions. Show us how it would work with the restriction. | 16:24 |
| thingee | hemna: yeah and I just want people on the same page of what core is. I really see the future of cinder is mostly just talking about extensions. Very rarely does something new come into core..it's just improvements to core mostly. | 16:24 |
| avishay | hemna: i agree that it would be cool to not have them change schema, but i think we need a better alternative than joins or metadata | 16:24 |
| hemna | avishay, +1 | 16:24 |
| avishay | not that i have any bright ideas :) | 16:25 |
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| hemna | heh | 16:25 |
| hemna | the FC Zone Manager is a grey area | 16:25 |
| hemna | which makes it a good discussion point | 16:25 |
| thingee | avishay: my only concern is when you have extensions changing the model schema to say volumes. What happens when that plugin gets disabled... | 16:25 |
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| hemna | thingee, could be a use at your own risk documentation issue | 16:26 |
| thingee | Neutron is dealing with that right now since vendors dictate what the core table schemas look like. | 16:26 |
| bswartz | Where can I read about why multi-attach can't be part of core? | 16:26 |
| hemna | thingee, disabling in that case breaks cinder | 16:27 |
| hemna | once you enable one of those plugins it can't get disabled, unless there is a migration that gets run on disable ? | 16:27 |
| avishay | is this blocking multi-attach? | 16:27 |
| hemna | pain | 16:27 |
| thingee | avishay: no. This will not block anything because of how fast it's progressing. Extensions should continue with development. | 16:28 |
| caitlin56 | One question I have: could you define an extension that made some new type of volume available where you could *only* access that volume with the extension? | 16:28 |
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| avishay | thingee: ok good | 16:28 |
| thingee | avishay: the problem will just get worse, but we'll get there when we get there. | 16:28 |
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| avishay | thingee: we have to rewrite all the code anyway for taskflow, and all the unit tests for mock :) | 16:29 |
| thingee | caitlin56: I see that volume still part of the basic idea of what cinder thinks a volume is. it just has added information with it. | 16:29 |
| thingee | if you cinder list, it shows up. | 16:29 |
| thingee | you do* | 16:29 |
| caitlin56 | So you use extensions to add new operations/etc., not totally new things that surpass the base. That's livable, especially if well explained on a wiki page. | 16:30 |
| jungleboyj | That makes more sense to me. | 16:30 |
| thingee | ok so it sounds like no one disagrees with this and I'm ok with continuing to spend time with find alternatives to joins, what to do with extensions that require a complete rewrite of a flow like FC zone manager attach/detach...and provide a useful example of how this all works. | 16:31 |
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| avishay | thingee: sounds good to me | 16:31 |
| thingee | the persistent data thing I'm really unsure about atm. | 16:31 |
| caitlin56 | at the summit avishay discussed the idea of having a new type of volume that would be the passive end of a mirrored relationship. Is that something that an extension could handle? | 16:31 |
| DuncanT | bswartz: That discussion about multi-attach being core has popped up many times, and come out with several different answers. Not sure the discussion has been documented anywhere. A big part of it not being core is that many installations might want to turn it off, since it is hard to use correctly and *will* generate support load and data corruption | 16:31 |
| bswartz | DuncanT: thanks for the explanation | 16:32 |
| thingee | DuncanT: +1 | 16:32 |
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| avishay | caitlin56: the passive volume will not be visible to users, so maybe that will ease things? | 16:32 |
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| caitlin56 | avishay: interesting, I'd like to hear how you use it if it isn't visible, but after this topic is finished. | 16:33 |
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| thingee | #todo thingee needs to figure out 1) ext persistent data 2) work with ext that require redoing an entire flow 3) provide a useful example | 16:33 |
| avishay | caitlin56: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/icehouse-cinder-continuous-volume-replication-v2 | 16:33 |
| thingee | thanks folks for the input | 16:33 |
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| avishay | thingee: thanks for the effort | 16:34 |
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| thingee | if anyone is interested with working on this with me, please ping me | 16:34 |
| winston-1 | another impact of extension is that they sometimes modified internal RPC APIs | 16:34 |
| avishay | winston-1: mmm good point | 16:34 |
| thingee | winston-1: yes good point. noted on the etherpad | 16:35 |
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| thingee | #topic icehouse-2 progress | 16:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "icehouse-2 progress (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:35 | |
| winston-1 | even if you can turn off some extension, but it already modified RPC APIs, which means backwards compatibility is messed up | 16:35 |
| thingee | DuncanT: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/cinder/+spec/filtering-weighing-with-driver-supplied-functions | 16:35 |
| thingee | I think you started on this from discussions yesterday? | 16:35 |
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| DuncanT | thingee: Yup, I've got the evaluatior done, the filter itself seems to work. Unit test still need sorting, but I'm waiting for Avisay's branch to be merged since he re-wrote them all | 16:36 |
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| rushiagr | winston-1: so should we just disallow extensions to make backward incompatible changes? | 16:37 |
| thingee | DuncanT: do you mind marking that as started? | 16:37 |
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| DuncanT | Sure | 16:37 |
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| DuncanT | Done | 16:37 |
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| thingee | thanks | 16:38 |
| caitlin56 | rushiagr: extensions will need to *add* methods. And those methods would be disabled/disappaear when the extension is disabled. But they shouldn't *change* an existing method. | 16:38 |
| thingee | avishay: you're waiting jenkins failures for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/44881/ ? | 16:38 |
| thingee | volume retype | 16:38 |
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| avishay | thingee: just put up a new version that addressed all issues so far (i think). yea, jenkins sucks today. | 16:38 |
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| rushiagr | caitlin56: oh | 16:38 |
| avishay | thingee: it works and is ready for re-review | 16:39 |
| rushiagr | caitlin56: thats messy | 16:39 |
| thingee | great, so everyone should help out out on the retype review. :) | 16:39 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/44881 | 16:39 |
| thingee | is Abhishek here? | 16:39 |
| avishay | :) | 16:39 |
| rushiagr | caitlin56: err.. that can make things messy while disabling extensions | 16:40 |
| avishay | thingee: Refactor code for delete volume using TaskFlow 0.1 ? | 16:40 |
| thingee | avishay: yes. | 16:40 |
| thingee | alright going to assume not | 16:41 |
| jungleboyj | thingee: avishay I will try to look at 44881 later today. | 16:41 |
| avishay | thingee: as far as i understood, all taskflow-related work is blocked on the create_volume patch currently in the queue | 16:41 |
| avishay | jungleboyj: thanks! | 16:41 |
| thingee | jungleboyj: thanks. I should too since I already went through it once and have an env ready | 16:41 |
| thingee | #Open topic | 16:41 |
| thingee | #topic open topic | 16:41 |
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| thingee | :) | 16:41 |
| thingee | so any bps people want to discuss? | 16:42 |
| winston-1 | avishay: will review retype tomorrow, err, later today | 16:42 |
| avishay | winston-1: thanks a lot | 16:42 |
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| winston-1 | thingee: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/cinder/+spec/deprecate-chance-and-simple-schedulers | 16:42 |
| avishay | we should also give create_volume w/ taskflow a high priority. it looks ok to me, but i'm not an expert. | 16:42 |
| rushiagr | avishay: I'll have a look at it too. I always found reasons to skip reviewing it so far :) | 16:43 |
| avishay | rushiagr: awesome | 16:43 |
| * jungleboyj needs to look at some of the longer patches soon. | 16:44 | |
| hemna | avishay, I reviewed the taskflow -> 0.1.1 yesterday and it looks good minus a few minor tweaks | 16:44 |
| thingee | winston-1: looks like you were the one stopping it :) https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60690/ | 16:44 |
| winston-d | thingee: i'm working on a patch to actually replace chance/simple scheduler with filter scheduler. | 16:45 |
| avishay | hemna: yep saw that | 16:45 |
| thingee | oh ok | 16:45 |
| hemna | I'll try looking at the retyping review today | 16:45 |
| avishay | winston-d: is it clear which filters to use in those cases? everything except capablities? | 16:45 |
| winston-d | thingee: not really sure if anyone still using chance/simple scheduler | 16:45 |
| thingee | winston-d, avishay: I noticed the replace the schedulers isn't in I-2 | 16:46 |
| avishay | thingee: it is now :) | 16:46 |
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| winston-d | avishay: i think every filters in default filter list should be included, even capablities filter. it's about weigher | 16:47 |
| hemna | has jgriffith mentioned when he is getting to the brick work ? | 16:47 |
| DuncanT | I'm going to make my usual point about back-compatibility here... | 16:47 |
| avishay | BTW, all, please stop rechecking...poor jenkins is broken, it won't help and only adds load | 16:47 |
| thingee | winston-d, avishay: ok so this bp captures deprecating...is there another for replacing with filter? | 16:47 |
| xyang__ | winston-d: do you know why the filters are in two different folders in cinder | 16:48 |
| thingee | hemna: I was wondering that myself...I have not heard anything on it yet | 16:48 |
| avishay | thingee: so winston-d's suggestion is not to deprecate, but replace them with filter scheduler under the covers | 16:48 |
| avishay | DuncanT: ^ | 16:48 |
| thingee | avishay: got it | 16:48 |
| hemna | I spoke with him at the start of I-1, and he said he slated it for I-1, but I guess he got busy | 16:48 |
| DuncanT | avishay: That's fantastic, as long as running config don't stop running, I'm entirely happy | 16:49 |
| avishay | DuncanT: yea sounds good to me too | 16:49 |
| winston-d | xyang__: yes, i do. i can explain that offline in #openstack-cinder if you like | 16:49 |
| xyang__ | winston-d: ok, thanks | 16:49 |
| hemna | DuncanT, did you get a chance to write the BP on the scheduluer driver methods as discussed at HK ? | 16:49 |
| thingee | bswartz: do you need anything for https://blueprints.launchpad.net/cinder/+spec/multiple-capability-sets-per-backend ? | 16:49 |
| DuncanT | hemna: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/cinder/+spec/filtering-weighing-with-driver-supplied-functions ? | 16:50 |
| hemna | nice | 16:50 |
| hemna | thanks | 16:50 |
| winston-d | avishay, DuncanT replacing scheduler patches should be ready in a day or 2. | 16:50 |
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| avishay | bswartz: i like that BP | 16:50 |
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| DuncanT | winston-d: I've got patches in a holding pattern waiting on Avishay's unit test rewrite to land | 16:51 |
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| avishay | winston-d: cool. note also that 'chance' has that silly ignore_hosts thing...not sure if it needs to stay | 16:52 |
| avishay | thingee: since you're the resident mock expert, can you review that one and free up DuncanT ? | 16:52 |
| thingee | avishay: are you going to pass the bp onto winston-d then? | 16:52 |
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| thingee | avishay: sure | 16:53 |
| avishay | thingee: yep | 16:53 |
| winston-d | avishay: i prefer no -> 'ignore_hosts', force_hosts | 16:53 |
| avishay | thingee: BTW, mock is a million times better than mox | 16:53 |
| thingee | avishay: I think dosaboy has taught me a thing or two from previous reviews with mock, but I'll take it :) | 16:53 |
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| avishay | thingee: :) | 16:53 |
| thingee | bswartz: ping me later about the bp? or jgriffith whenever he wakes up :) | 16:54 |
| avishay | thingee: reassigned to winston-d | 16:54 |
| winston-d | thingee, DuncanT, avishay, hemna do you guys really want to make scheduler aware pools inside one back-end? | 16:54 |
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| bswartz | thingee: sorry I got distracted | 16:55 |
| avishay | winston-d: i think it will help scalability | 16:55 |
| bswartz | thingee: yes I'm working on that one | 16:55 |
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| thingee | winston-d: I'm not sure I follow. Though I've worked / reviewed a little with scheduler. | 16:56 |
| winston-d | pools inside back-ends, small pools inside pools, smaller poools ... | 16:56 |
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| DuncanT | winston-d: I'm not sure of the point, but I do remember there being talk of it | 16:56 |
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| winston-d | thingee: well, whether there's oone pool or multiple pools within a back-end, it's transparent to scheduler, for now. | 16:57 |
| avishay | bswartz: can you update the BP with its motivation please? | 16:57 |
| bswartz | winston-d: almost | 16:57 |
| bswartz | avishay: yes | 16:57 |
| winston-d | DuncanT, bswartz do you remember if we have any consensus about that? | 16:57 |
| thingee | avishay, bswartz: yeah I just want to know if its been started yet | 16:57 |
| thingee | it was marked unknown | 16:57 |
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| bswartz | it's transparent until the scheduler picks the wrong backend and there's a failure | 16:58 |
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| hemna | winston-d, the pools are part of volume types for our backend | 16:58 |
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| xyang__ | winston-d: one backend should be able to manage multiple pools | 16:58 |
| winston-d | xyang__: i'm fine with that, but not sure if pools should be expose to Cinder | 16:58 |
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| bswartz | here's one motivation: suppose a backend has 2 pools with 50GB space each -- it reports 100GB capacity to the scheduler, if the scheduler sends a 100GB create request, it will fail. It would be better if the backend could just report that it has 2 pools of 50GB each | 16:59 |
| thingee | alright lets take the discussion for pools into #openstack-cinder | 17:00 |
| thingee | we're out of time | 17:00 |
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| bswartz | that's a simple example, there are more complicated ones -- I'll update teh BP though | 17:00 |
| thingee | #endmeeting | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 11 17:00:08 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2013/cinder.2013-12-11-16.09.html | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2013/cinder.2013-12-11-16.09.txt | 17:00 |
| thingee | thanks all! | 17:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2013/cinder.2013-12-11-16.09.log.html | 17:00 |
| winston-d | thingee: thx! | 17:00 |
| hemna | bswartz, can't the scheduler send in the volume type in the request to the driver ? | 17:00 |
| * hartsocks waves | 17:00 | |
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| hartsocks | #startmeeting VMwareAPI | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 11 17:01:07 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is hartsocks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)" | 17:01 | |
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| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'vmwareapi' | 17:01 |
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| hartsocks | who's around? | 17:01 |
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| garyk | hi | 17:01 |
| tjones | hi | 17:01 |
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| tjones | not to rub it in - but vmware has food trucks here this morning :-D | 17:01 |
| rgerganov | hello | 17:01 |
| hartsocks | heh. | 17:02 |
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| tjones | i should say vmware palo alto | 17:02 |
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| garyk | nice - was there one with potatoes on a stick? | 17:02 |
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| tjones | not that one | 17:02 |
| garyk | :) | 17:02 |
| tjones | french toast, biscuits and grazy, egg sandwiches | 17:02 |
| hartsocks | I had food trucks come by my house sometimes, but my neighbors complained. | 17:03 |
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| hartsocks | :-) | 17:03 |
| tjones | not to hijack the meeting | 17:03 |
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| hartsocks | *lol* s'okay | 17:03 |
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| hartsocks | I've not posted the agenda in a while because it's always the same... | 17:04 |
| hartsocks | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/VMwareAPI#Agenda | 17:04 |
| hartsocks | We're in the part I call "salutations" | 17:04 |
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| hartsocks | You like that I officially made banter part of the official meeting agenda :-) | 17:04 |
| tjones | lol | 17:04 |
| dims | o/ | 17:04 |
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| garyk | \o/ | 17:05 |
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| rgerganov | \m/ | 17:05 |
| hartsocks | (╯°□°）╯ | 17:05 |
| garyk | ok, that wins. | 17:05 |
| hartsocks | I totally stole that one. | 17:06 |
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| hartsocks | So, we need to get any blueprints we want included in Icehouse-2 ready to go in the next 7 days. | 17:06 |
| hartsocks | #topic blueprints | 17:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)" | 17:06 | |
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| hartsocks | I've been working on a list... | 17:07 |
| hartsocks | I've identified 4 bp for icehouse 2…. | 17:07 |
| hartsocks | in no particular order... | 17:07 |
| hartsocks | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack/?searchtext=vmware-image-cache-management | 17:07 |
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| garyk | quick update on that one | 17:07 |
| hartsocks | garyk: I think that's yours... | 17:07 |
| hartsocks | cool | 17:08 |
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| garyk | at the moment it is blocked. we are in the process of making the libvirt code generic and then hopefully that will free up this one | 17:08 |
| garyk | it will require a rebase in a few days time and then it is ready for review | 17:08 |
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| garyk | patches are https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova+branch:master+topic:bp/vmware-image-cache-management,n,z | 17:09 |
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| zhiyan | hello folks, this my first time to join vmwareapi weekly meeting. i'm very interesting to allow vmware driver support ova image, so can i get some time in open discussion part? i have some question around it to like get your inputs..thanks | 17:09 |
| garyk | please note that this is all based on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/52630/ (which has been in review for a very very very …very long time) | 17:09 |
| garyk | zhiyan: wecome | 17:10 |
| zhiyan | garyk: sorry to interrupt your discussion, but i have one queston on image-cache | 17:10 |
| zhiyan | garyk: hello | 17:10 |
| hartsocks | zhiyan: cool, we have open discussion every week at the last 10 minutes or so. | 17:10 |
| garyk | zhiyan: sure, please ask | 17:10 |
| zhiyan | hartsocks: hello | 17:10 |
| hartsocks | zhiyan: obviously go ahead if it's on topic. | 17:11 |
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| zhiyan | garyk: you know currently we see image always a file, but i see image it's resource | 17:11 |
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| garyk | zhiyan: not sure i understand. can you please elaborate? | 17:11 |
| zhiyan | garyk: in libvirt's cache fetching and cache manger, we alway use "file" approach to do handle that, for example, release image just always means delete file | 17:12 |
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| garyk | ah, ok. here is is similar | 17:12 |
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| garyk | when a vm is spawned we check if the image is on a datastore. if not then we load it from glance. for example a linked clone image. the vm then uses this when it spawns | 17:13 |
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| garyk | when these images are no longer used they should be aged similarly to those with libvirt - it ensures that these files do not checw up all of the disk on the datastore | 17:13 |
| zhiyan | but maybe we need some handler to handle image fetching and release. for example, if we do some zero-copy approach to prepare template/cached image, we should using some particular approach to remove image from datastore | 17:14 |
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| garyk | that is something which we are working on in glance at the moment | 17:14 |
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| hartsocks | zhiyan, garyk: maybe you guys could chat about this in #openstack-vmware or #openstack-nova later? This seems like implementation level discussion. I encourage it but we have 5 other BP I want to at least touch on today. :-) | 17:14 |
| garyk | sure - please see https://review.openstack.org/#/c/58883/ | 17:15 |
| zhiyan | hartsocks: sure :) | 17:15 |
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| hartsocks | np | 17:15 |
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| hartsocks | To recap the caching BP. I found 2 other BP with the keyword "cache" in the name. I think that probably causes some inquiries. | 17:16 |
| hartsocks | So far I don't see these as related in any real way. | 17:16 |
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| hartsocks | But, we may have to clarify things to core-reviewers who are in a hurry, so be prepared. | 17:16 |
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| hartsocks | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/vmware-vsan-support | 17:17 |
| hartsocks | vuil: ping? | 17:17 |
| tjones | if he's not here - i recall that at our last standup he said he is just adding tests | 17:17 |
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| hartsocks | cool. | 17:18 |
| tjones | so it seems on track for i-2 | 17:18 |
| garyk | at the moment Vui has posted a wip patch | 17:18 |
| garyk | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/53976/ | 17:18 |
| garyk | this is progressing nicely | 17:18 |
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| vuil | sorry I just got in | 17:18 |
| hartsocks | We just need the BP to be targeted and ready for review by next week. | 17:18 |
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| hartsocks | The patch can be WIP for a few more weeks. | 17:18 |
| hartsocks | vuil: talkin' about ya' | 17:18 |
| garyk | hartsocks: not sure i understand. what needs to be ready for review? | 17:19 |
| hartsocks | The BP | 17:19 |
| vuil | Isn't it approved? | 17:19 |
| hartsocks | We need to have the Blueprints out of draft, approved, and in progress. | 17:19 |
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| hartsocks | Yep. This one is approved so we're in good shape there. | 17:20 |
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| hartsocks | Sounds like it's making good progress too. | 17:20 |
| vuil | yep | 17:20 |
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| hartsocks | Next up... | 17:20 |
| hartsocks | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/oslo/+spec/pw-keyrings … | 17:20 |
| hartsocks | which is actually an Oslo BP... | 17:20 |
| hartsocks | We were going to leverage this for getting our passwords out of the .conf files. | 17:21 |
| hartsocks | Looks like this is stalled. | 17:21 |
| hartsocks | We will have to take over this BP or propose an alternate. I've put that on my plate to follow up on. | 17:21 |
| tjones | ohhh - what i said about you working with rado on sso was wrong oops. 2 diff issues | 17:21 |
| tjones | i'll let him know | 17:21 |
| tjones | got confused | 17:22 |
| hartsocks | There is an SSO thing over in keystone. | 17:22 |
| tjones | yes i get it now | 17:22 |
| rgerganov | one way to avoid usernames/passwords in clear text is to use SSO tokens | 17:22 |
| hartsocks | 2 approaches 1 problem... | 17:22 |
| tjones | yes | 17:22 |
| hartsocks | rgerganov… yep… that's what the Keystone Federation thing is about... | 17:22 |
| * hartsocks digs for link | 17:22 | |
| hartsocks | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Keystone/Federation/Blueprint | 17:23 |
| dims | hartsocks, python-openstackclient has keyring support, may be there's something can be extracted from there | 17:23 |
| hartsocks | This is something I planned on coordinating for icehouse-3 at the soonest. | 17:23 |
| hartsocks | dims: cool! | 17:23 |
| dolphm | (that bp is probably going to be dropped as it's being replaced with several other blueprints with narrower scope) | 17:23 |
| hartsocks | Federation? | 17:23 |
| dolphm | yes | 17:23 |
| rgerganov | ok, but we can add support for VMware SSO tokens before the federation happens, right? | 17:23 |
| hartsocks | What we need at the Nova driver level is to hook SAML tokens into the driver. | 17:24 |
| rgerganov | hartsocks, right | 17:24 |
| hartsocks | .. er… security context. | 17:24 |
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| hartsocks | I had hoped to lift authentication concerns out of the driver altogether and do SSO "the right way" | 17:24 |
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| hartsocks | #action follow up on SSO with rgerganov, hartsocks, and dolphm | 17:25 |
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| rgerganov | hartsocks, ok we can continue the discussion after the meetings | 17:25 |
| hartsocks | we should probably chat and do an etherpad on this one. I'll document what I have so far. | 17:25 |
| hartsocks | I have 2 more Blueprints that I'm tracking... | 17:26 |
| hartsocks | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/autowsdl-caching | 17:26 |
| hartsocks | Which I'm breaking into 2 phases… 1 will be a naive CLI tool | 17:26 |
| hartsocks | which I'll post shortly. | 17:27 |
| hartsocks | Phase 2 will be the "auto" part which will make the WSDL repair seamless to the driver's admin. | 17:27 |
| hartsocks | But I need to figure out how to work with Oslo for that (that's new for me). | 17:27 |
| hartsocks | Last up... | 17:28 |
| hartsocks | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/config-validation-script | 17:28 |
| tjones | is that for i-2? | 17:28 |
| hartsocks | tjones: that's currently owned by you | 17:28 |
| tjones | feel free to take it :-D | 17:28 |
| hartsocks | ah, nope... | 17:28 |
| hartsocks | it's i-3 | 17:28 |
| tjones | yeah that's what i was thinking too | 17:28 |
| hartsocks | Could you assign it to me? | 17:28 |
| hartsocks | I currently have no privs on it. | 17:29 |
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| hartsocks | I did chat with ogelbukh last week. | 17:30 |
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| hartsocks | They are actually making a fair bit of progress on the static validation component. | 17:30 |
| hartsocks | There will need to be a service-level validation component … that's left unimplemented and probably needs some discussion. | 17:30 |
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| hartsocks | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/w5BwMtCG6z | 17:31 |
| hartsocks | So… that's all the BP I'm currently tracking for the team. | 17:31 |
| hartsocks | Do we need to track others? | 17:31 |
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| hartsocks | nice 30 minute mark and I managed to list all of them! Sorry for the rush. | 17:32 |
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| tjones | sursure | 17:34 |
| tjones | sure | 17:34 |
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| garyk | hartsocks: i think that next week we should try and track the glance and cinder ones too - but we can take that offline | 17:34 |
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| hartsocks | okay cool. I know they have some things in progress but I've not researched them yet. | 17:34 |
| hartsocks | anything else before we move to bugs? | 17:34 |
| hartsocks | #topic bugs | 17:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)" | 17:35 | |
| hartsocks | I have 7 bugs I'm tracking for the team that are at priority High or Critical... | 17:36 |
| hartsocks | heh… my report script links only reviews tho... | 17:36 |
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| hartsocks | #link https://review.openstack.org/52630 | 17:36 |
| hartsocks | #link https://review.openstack.org/43270 | 17:36 |
| hartsocks | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1180044 | 17:37 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1180044 in nova "nova failures when vCenter has multiple datacenters" [High,In progress] | 17:37 |
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| hartsocks | there… I'll link the bugs in here. | 17:37 |
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| hartsocks | garyk: that's yours… | 17:37 |
| garyk | yea, that one has been in review for a very long time… it is critcial for backports and sadly we missed the boat for the stable havana | 17:37 |
| hartsocks | bummer. | 17:38 |
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| garyk | uoside is i get to rebase it once every week or so | 17:38 |
| hartsocks | I should be able to do more reviews now. I wanted to pull this one and do functional testing on it. | 17:38 |
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| hartsocks | BTW: I will do my bug reports once a week in conjunction with this meeting now. It's probably more topical that way. | 17:39 |
| garyk | ok | 17:39 |
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| hartsocks | This bug is so important it's actually listed twice on my report :-) | 17:39 |
| hartsocks | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1230047 | 17:40 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1230047 in nova "VMware: spawning large amounts of VMs concurrently sometimes causes "VMDK lock" error" [High,In progress] | 17:40 |
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| hartsocks | garyk: you *again* … | 17:40 |
| tjones | im back - macbook crashed. | 17:40 |
| tjones | yes i will transfer the BP to you - that;s the last thing i saw for me | 17:40 |
| hartsocks | tjones: cool, I have no privs on that BP until you do so I can't alter it. | 17:41 |
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| tjones | hatsocks: i am sure you have moved on. but could you spilt that into 2 BP? Once for service validation and one for config validation? | 17:41 |
| hartsocks | tjones: I'm listing the 6 tip priority bugs right now. | 17:41 |
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| hartsocks | tjones: yeah, I'll do that and document BP dependencies once I can edit it. | 17:42 |
| tjones | L0D | 17:42 |
| tjones | :-D | 17:42 |
| hartsocks | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/58598/ | 17:42 |
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| hartsocks | this concurrent downloads thing is just languishing… so I guess we all need to focus on this one a bit. | 17:43 |
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| hartsocks | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1246848 | 17:43 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1246848 in nova "VMWare: AssertionError: Trying to re-send() an already-triggered event." [High,In progress] | 17:43 |
| garyk | i have dealt with that (and it works pretty well). just need to get it reviewed…. | 17:43 |
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| garyk | the concurrent downloads that is | 17:43 |
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| hartsocks | yeah, I think reviews are the #2 priority after getting any icehouse-2 BPs that are still un-approved marked as 'approved' | 17:44 |
| hartsocks | Or maybe these are both #1 priorities :-) | 17:45 |
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| hartsocks | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1258179 | 17:45 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1258179 in nova "VMware: timeouts due to nova-compute stuck at 100% when using deploying 100 VMs" [High,In progress] | 17:45 |
| tjones | hartsocks: this one is still stuch with -2 from russellb. i've addressed the issues he raised but i need the -2 removed for people to review it https://review.openstack.org/#/c/56287/ | 17:45 |
| hartsocks | ugh. | 17:45 |
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| hartsocks | #action ping russellb on bug/1251021 | 17:46 |
| hartsocks | I've got only 2 more "high" to us priority bugs… these are marked "medium" to the nova community... | 17:46 |
| hartsocks | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1257038 | 17:47 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1257038 in openstack-vmwareapi-team "VMware: instance names can be edited, breaks nova-driver lookup" [High,In progress] | 17:47 |
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| hartsocks | That one needs reviews. | 17:47 |
| hartsocks | It's a Nova to vCenter robustness issue… I filed it because right now we use the vCenter name for the VM to link the VM to Nova's control. That's fragile. | 17:48 |
| garyk | this one has actaully been addressed by https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60259/ | 17:48 |
| hartsocks | Fortunately the fix is nice and backwards compatible. | 17:48 |
| garyk | the patch proposed by sidarth closes a edge case when the value is not set. issue here is the cpu spike | 17:48 |
| hartsocks | Well, I took a moment to talk about this one here because I'm sure it's not clear what I'm complaining about in the bug. | 17:49 |
| hartsocks | The "edge case" is what I'm complaining about. | 17:49 |
| garyk | so https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59571/ make it really robust | 17:49 |
| garyk | yup, agreed. | 17:50 |
| hartsocks | right. | 17:50 |
| hartsocks | actually, I feel I should never have approved the design we shipped in Havana. The vCenter name for an instance is a "vanity" kind of thing. It's far too easy to change and it makes vCenter hard to use. | 17:50 |
| hartsocks | but that's a longer discussion. | 17:50 |
| hartsocks | I classed it as Medium, but I would like to see the change backported … it should be backportable all the way through Grizzly. | 17:51 |
| tjones | yes! and it's an easy one (for once) | 17:51 |
| hartsocks | It's a longer range type of fix though and nobody's going to be unable to deploy OpenStack on vCenter without it. | 17:52 |
| hartsocks | last bug on my short list: | 17:52 |
| hartsocks | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1213269 | 17:52 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1213269 in openstack-vmwareapi-team "_check_if_folder_file_exists only checks for metadata file" [High,In progress] | 17:52 |
| hartsocks | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/48544/ | 17:53 |
| tjones | i broke minesweeper | 17:53 |
| tjones | with that one | 17:53 |
| hartsocks | nice! | 17:53 |
| tjones | i'll get back on it | 17:53 |
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| tjones | yeah! actually i was happy as it caught something my testing did not! | 17:53 |
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| hartsocks | So that's all the bugs I have in priority order. | 17:53 |
| tjones | any new ones to triage? | 17:54 |
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| zhiyan | open discussing? :) | 17:54 |
| hartsocks | #link http://goo.gl/pTcDG | 17:54 |
| hartsocks | Man, I just cleaned up those triage area. I'll run triage later. | 17:55 |
| tjones | *answers my own question* #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1259981 | 17:55 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1259981 in nova "VMware: factor out the management of unit numbers" [Undecided,New] | 17:55 |
| tjones | just one | 17:55 |
| hartsocks | Okay. | 17:55 |
| hartsocks | Let's do triage outside the meeting this week. | 17:55 |
| tjones | ok | 17:55 |
| hartsocks | #topic opendiscussion | 17:55 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "opendiscussion (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)" | 17:55 | |
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| hartsocks | We have #openstack-vmware for any other discussion that won't fit into the meeting BTW. | 17:56 |
| zhiyan | thanks hartsocks | 17:56 |
| zhiyan | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/vmware-ova-support | 17:56 |
| garyk | how do we get the food trucks to my side of the world? | 17:56 |
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| zhiyan | for save time, i posted my text at there | 17:56 |
| tjones | :-D i can send you a picture | 17:56 |
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| zhiyan | thanks for your input! | 17:57 |
| hartsocks | zhiyan: nice. Sorry to have cut the open discussion part short this week. We have a deadline next week. | 17:57 |
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| zhiyan | hartsocks: sure, np at all | 17:57 |
| hartsocks | Just a reminder if you have a BP that isn't *approved* for Icehouse-2 by this time next week you might not make it at all no matter how far along your code is. | 17:58 |
| hartsocks | I know there's a general policy to −2 anything that is milestone targeted but the BP isn't approved. So just watch for that, it can ruin your release cycle. | 17:58 |
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| hartsocks | zhiyan: yeah, I think this is one of the glance BP that garyk mentioned … I should probably track those for the team too... | 17:59 |
| hartsocks | This one isn't targeted for icehouse-2 either... | 18:00 |
| hartsocks | it is approved tho' | 18:00 |
| hartsocks | whoops… out of time. | 18:00 |
| zhiyan | hartsocks: yes, and i think this work should involve glance and nova both | 18:00 |
| tjones | moving to #openstack-vmware | 18:00 |
| hartsocks | We're over in #openstack-vmware for anything you're not 100% belongs on #openstack-nova | 18:00 |
| hartsocks | #endmeeting | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 11 18:01:00 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2013/vmwareapi.2013-12-11-17.01.html | 18:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2013/vmwareapi.2013-12-11-17.01.txt | 18:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2013/vmwareapi.2013-12-11-17.01.log.html | 18:01 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | hi! | 18:02 |
| RajeshMohan | Hi | 18:02 |
| SridarK | hi | 18:02 |
| yisun | hi | 18:02 |
| gduan | Hi | 18:02 |
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| olkonami | hi | 18:02 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK, RajeshMohan yisun gduan olkonami: Hi | 18:02 |
| SumitNaiksatam | BrianTorres-Gil: there? | 18:03 |
| BrianTorres-Gil | Hi Sumit, yes I'm here. | 18:03 |
| SumitNaiksatam | great | 18:03 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #startmeeting Networking FWaaS | 18:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 11 18:03:54 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is SumitNaiksatam. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking_fwaas' | 18:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | thanks everyone for joining | 18:04 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | the main agenda for today's meeting was to sync up with the PTL, my understanding was that he was going to join this meeting | 18:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | however, i don't see mark on IRC | 18:05 |
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| SridarK | Hmm! should we wait for a bit to see if he will join | 18:06 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | yeah | 18:06 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | so i just pinged the -neutron channel | 18:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | don't see him there either | 18:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bummer :-( | 18:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic service_type framework | 18:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "service_type framework (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:07 | |
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| SumitNaiksatam | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60699/ | 18:08 |
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| gduan | I submitted code review | 18:08 |
| SumitNaiksatam | garyduan thanks for patch | 18:08 |
| gduan | working on unit test | 18:08 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok great | 18:08 |
| gduan | I see tempest test are failing | 18:08 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | ok, tests are failing on what? | 18:09 |
| gduan | in fact, gate-neutron-python27 | 18:09 |
| gduan | I guess it's unit test issue | 18:09 |
| gduan | I will fix it, no problem | 18:09 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok | 18:09 |
| SumitNaiksatam | its breaking existing UT? | 18:10 |
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| gduan | right | 18:10 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok, that should be easier than tempest :-) | 18:10 |
| gduan | seems like, I will double check | 18:10 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok thanks | 18:10 |
| SridarK | i heard from one of my colleagues (pcm_) that he was seeing a lot issues with tox (if he upped the memory to 8G on his VM) things were okay | 18:10 |
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| SridarK | perhaps something to check - not sure if u have the same issue | 18:11 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: yes, i was following that | 18:11 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: however, gduan's tests are failing in the gate | 18:11 |
| SridarK | ok | 18:11 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: and that infra should be set up properly | 18:11 |
| SridarK | true, stand corrected | 18:11 |
| SumitNaiksatam | its a regression | 18:11 |
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| gduan | we need tempest on this review too, right? | 18:12 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: absolutely | 18:13 |
| gduan | ok | 18:13 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: we need it for existing resources and api, and anything new that we add | 18:13 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: however, we have to first get the feature merged before the tempos tests can be merged | 18:13 |
| SumitNaiksatam | its a kind of a chicken and egg | 18:13 |
| gduan | ok. I will add unit test first. | 18:14 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: yeah, thats a good start (rather must :-P) | 18:14 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | okay, i was still hoping that mark would join before we go to the next item in the agenda | 18:15 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Service Objects | 18:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Service Objects (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:16 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: how is this coming along? | 18:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/fwaas-customized-service | 18:16 |
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| yisun | had most code, but stuck on some db access issues | 18:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: ok | 18:17 |
| yisun | still trying to find out reason | 18:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: do we still plan to target this for Icehouse? | 18:17 |
| yisun | I will try | 18:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok | 18:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: the reason i ask is, the blueprint's series goal is not set | 18:17 |
| yisun | really, I did it once | 18:18 |
| yisun | ok, I will set it again | 18:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: this will not show up on the PTL's radar if the series goal and milestone target is not set | 18:18 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: i had requested gduan to convey this to you last week | 18:18 |
| yisun | I will put I3 | 18:19 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: ok | 18:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: that said i am not trying to push you for this | 18:19 |
| yisun | :-) | 18:19 |
| yisun | But I may need some help to fix the DB | 18:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: since you wanted to get this in, i want to make sure that the procedural issues are taken care off correctly | 18:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: and things don't slip through the cracks | 18:20 |
| yisun | no problem | 18:20 |
| yisun | My current issue is that if the zone can not get in ice houst | 18:20 |
| yisun | then we may have to push all to J | 18:20 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: good segue | 18:20 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic zones | 18:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "zones (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:20 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/fwaas-zones-api | 18:21 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: per last meeting, general feeling was to keep this in discussion for I and target patch for merge in J | 18:21 |
| yisun | ok | 18:22 |
| SumitNaiksatam | this is so that we don't introduce too much feature churn, and avoid disrupting the ongoing efforts on Neutron stabilization and parity for nova networking | 18:22 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | we also need to do our bit in terms of tempest tests | 18:22 |
| RajeshMohan | Sridar/others: Can we meet f2f on this? | 18:23 |
| SumitNaiksatam | BrianTorres-Gil: you were not in the meeting last time, hope you are in the loop on this | 18:23 |
| RajeshMohan | Just want to split the work so that I can start working on it | 18:23 |
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| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: RajeshMohan: Hoping we can do this tomorrow on the tempest tests | 18:23 |
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| RajeshMohan | ok | 18:24 |
| RajeshMohan | Or we can chat after the meeting | 18:24 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: lets do it after this meeting | 18:25 |
| RajeshMohan | Sridar: Any updates from last week? | 18:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | okay, i guess BrianTorres-Gil is in silent agreement | 18:25 |
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| RajeshMohan | You said that you were updating the document - any help on that? | 18:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: i believe the plan was to discuss this week (but i will let SridarK respond) | 18:26 |
| SridarK | RajeshMohan: Still need to figure out on the dependencies - will sync with u | 18:26 |
| RajeshMohan | ok, thanks. | 18:26 |
| SridarK | hopefully tomorrow we can get to more clarity | 18:26 |
| BrianTorres-Gil | Yea, works for me | 18:27 |
| yisun | Sumit, sorry, I was driving, if we push zone to J, I may push service object to J too | 18:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | BrianTorres-Gil: ok thanks, i was just going to say that you were in silent agreement :-) | 18:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: okay, we can discuss | 18:28 |
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| yisun | summit, I'm not push it | 18:29 |
| yisun | We do need to have tempest done fist | 18:29 |
| yisun | I agree with everyone on it | 18:30 |
| yisun | making the system stable is more important | 18:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yisun: great, glad that we all agree on that | 18:30 |
| yisun | :-) | 18:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | the other two items on the blueprint agenda were FWaaS service insertion, and apply/commit operation | 18:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | there is nothing new here that we have not discussed within the team yet | 18:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so this was mostly discussion with the PTL | 18:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | any new developments/thoughts you want to add on this? | 18:32 |
| RajeshMohan | any updates on tempest? | 18:33 |
| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: On Service insertion - have been in discussion with colleagues as well and we are on board | 18:33 |
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| RajeshMohan | Sumit: last week you said you neeed some help | 18:34 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: thanks | 18:34 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: yes, help always welcome :-) | 18:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | let's discuss | 18:35 |
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| RajeshMohan | Sumit: ok | 18:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | btw, this patch was posted: | 18:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60190/ | 18:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | is gongysh around? | 18:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we already have a blueprint for this activity, to incorporate service insertion (not just router binding) | 18:36 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Service Insertion for Firewall | 18:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Service Insertion for Firewall (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:37 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/fwaas-service-insertion | 18:37 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | so the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60190/ will need to reconcile with this effort | 18:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i think gongysh is not around | 18:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok moving on | 18:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic bugs | 18:38 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:38 | |
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| SumitNaiksatam | i just noticed this: | 18:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1258438 | 18:38 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1258438 in neutron "Can't create a firewall per tenant" [High,Confirmed] | 18:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we need to fix this asap | 18:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | it seems that the bug reported has taken this up | 18:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | akihiro has confirmed it | 18:39 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | did anyone test with more than one tenant in their earlier tests? | 18:40 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i have to go back and check if there wasn't a UT for this case | 18:40 |
| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: I think Dan had done some of those tests | 18:41 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: okay | 18:41 |
| SumitNaiksatam | anyone has time to confirm this? | 18:41 |
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| RajeshMohan | I have tested with more than one client | 18:41 |
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| RajeshMohan | Initially | 18:41 |
| RajeshMohan | must be some new change | 18:41 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: you mean, more than one tenant, right? | 18:41 |
| RajeshMohan | Yes - I have demos working with more than one client - close to havana release though | 18:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: i think the check for limiting to one firewall per tenant went in later (but in Havana) | 18:42 |
| RajeshMohan | did we add any code to restrict number of firewall recently | 18:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: it was towards the end of havana | 18:42 |
| RajeshMohan | I must have missed that change | 18:43 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: if this bug is correct, it was that code which introduced the issue | 18:43 |
| SumitNaiksatam | at any, rate any one have time to verify this (you can follow up with the fix as well) | 18:43 |
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| RajeshMohan | I will confirm today | 18:43 |
| SumitNaiksatam | RajeshMohan: great, thanks! | 18:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: any plans on this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1250841 | 18:45 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1250841 in neutron "Move FWaaS Noop driver to unit tests directory" [Low,Triaged] | 18:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we have this marked for I2 | 18:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | would be nice to get it out of the way | 18:45 |
| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: will push a patch out soon | 18:45 |
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| SridarK | needed a few clarifications b4 getting it out - will reach out to u | 18:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: thanks | 18:46 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: we also have: https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1223472 | 18:46 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1223472 in neutron "firewall status does not become ACTIVE when a router does not exist" [Undecided,Triaged] | 18:46 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i believe we are waiting on the insertion to do this? | 18:46 |
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| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: I think some clarification needed to be provided | 18:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: ok | 18:47 |
| SridarK | need to jog my memory on this | 18:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: alright, lets track it for discussion next time | 18:48 |
| SridarK | will update - i recall that this was not an issue but let me clarify and take care of this | 18:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1222968 | 18:48 |
| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: thanks | 18:48 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1222968 in neutron "Namespace handling is missing in vArmour's FWaaS agent and driver" [Medium,In progress] | 18:48 |
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| yisun | I saw there is a fix | 18:49 |
| yisun | but it has been pushed out from rc1 by mark | 18:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok | 18:50 |
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| yisun | Sumit, what should be do about it? | 18:50 |
| SumitNaiksatam | if this is fixed, then we should invalidate this bug | 18:50 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | #topic vendor plugins/drivers | 18:51 |
| yisun | Gary submitted patch | 18:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "vendor plugins/drivers (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:51 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | #undo | 18:51 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Topic object at 0x39d5e10> | 18:51 |
| yisun | but is was not merged to rc1 | 18:51 |
| yisun | and it is marked as back port potential | 18:51 |
| gduan | SumitNaiksatam: we can discard this bug | 18:51 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: ok, you can invalidate it | 18:51 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic vendor plugins/drivers | 18:52 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "vendor plugins/drivers (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:52 | |
| gduan | SumitNaiksatam: we will cover it with another BP | 18:52 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | gduan yisun SridarK RajeshMohan BrianTorres-Gil: anything we need to discuss regarding your plans | 18:52 |
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| gduan | We have a BP for rework our fw driver as a plugin driver | 18:52 |
| SumitNaiksatam | is there any dependency or blocker for you to move forward? | 18:52 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: ok, bp link? | 18:53 |
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| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: will need to push our BP out to J with a dependency on Zones | 18:53 |
| gduan | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/varmour-firewall-plugin | 18:53 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: okay, got it | 18:53 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: thanks | 18:53 |
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| gduan | It depends on the service type framework BP | 18:54 |
| BrianTorres-Gil | We are spinning our wheels a lot trying to figure out some of the code and structure of Neutron. Still seeking a good developers guide. | 18:54 |
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| gduan | Might also depend on Service Insertion | 18:54 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: good, i think the PTL has also approved this for I3, so the loop is closed | 18:54 |
| SumitNaiksatam | BrianTorres-Gil: ok | 18:54 |
| SumitNaiksatam | BrianTorres-Gil: welcome to the world of open source :-P | 18:55 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | BrianTorres-Gil: let the rest of the team know if you need help with anything particular | 18:55 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK (and others in general): it will help to clearly state in your blueprint as to what the dependencies are | 18:56 |
| SumitNaiksatam | that will help us to prioritize features accordingly, and make their case | 18:56 |
| SridarK | SumitNaiksatam: ok will update the dependency | 18:56 |
| SumitNaiksatam | SridarK: can you add a dependency to the zones bp if appropriate? | 18:56 |
| SumitNaiksatam | thanks | 18:56 |
| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: similar can you please put a dependency on the service type framework and service insertion blueprints | 18:57 |
| gduan | SumitNaiksatam: just added | 18:57 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: thanks, don't see the dependency on service insertion | 18:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | anyway | 18:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | moving on | 18:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Open Discussion | 18:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Networking FWaaS)" | 18:58 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | we have a couple of mins | 18:58 |
| gduan | trying to find the BP :-) | 18:59 |
| SumitNaiksatam | anything to dicuss? | 18:59 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | gduan: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/neutron-services-insertion-chaining-steering | 18:59 |
| gduan | SumitNaiksatam: thanks | 18:59 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we didn't touch on tempest today, since that is on top of the mind and we are trying to collectively figure our way out | 19:00 |
| gduan | SumitNaiksatam: it might not be a dependency though | 19:00 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | but that is being targeted with high priority | 19:00 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok, thanks everyone for attending | 19:00 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | have good one, bye | 19:00 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #endmeeting | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:01 | |
| gduan | bye | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 11 19:01:07 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:01 |
| RajeshMohan | bye | 19:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_fwaas/2013/networking_fwaas.2013-12-11-18.03.html | 19:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_fwaas/2013/networking_fwaas.2013-12-11-18.03.txt | 19:01 |
| SridarK | bye | 19:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_fwaas/2013/networking_fwaas.2013-12-11-18.03.log.html | 19:01 |
| notmyname | swift meeting time | 19:01 |
| notmyname | #startmeeting swift | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 11 19:01:27 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is notmyname. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'swift' | 19:01 |
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| notmyname | agenda this week is light. https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Swift | 19:01 |
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| notmyname | who's here? | 19:02 |
| peluse | hola | 19:02 |
| torgomatic | avast, ye salty sea dog | 19:02 |
| portante | o/ | 19:02 |
| acoles | here | 19:02 |
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| cschwede | here | 19:02 |
| lincolnt | here | 19:02 |
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| notmyname | cschwede: now that I know we're online at the same time, I had to add a .mailmap entry for you recently (you had multiple addresses). please review and offer a patch if I chose the wrong one | 19:03 |
| notmyname | great, let's get started | 19:03 |
| notmyname | #topic 1.11.0 status update | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "1.11.0 status update (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:03 | |
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| notmyname | RC for 1.11.0 has been cut. tons of great stuff in it (See the changelog) | 19:04 |
| notmyname | it's currently living on the milestone-proposed branch | 19:04 |
| portante | great | 19:04 |
| portante | will it be final tomorrow? | 19:04 |
| notmyname | if nothing comes up in the next ~20 hours, we'll have our final 1.11.0 release | 19:04 |
| notmyname | the only thing that came up so far was the spninx versioning requirement change | 19:05 |
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| notmyname | since without it, new versions of sphinx (which -infra has installed) break | 19:05 |
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| notmyname | anything else know about anything else for 1.11? | 19:06 |
| portante | not from red hata | 19:06 |
| portante | s/a// | 19:06 |
| notmyname | acoles: cschwede: anything from our EU contingent? :-) | 19:07 |
| portante | acoles: wake up! | 19:07 |
| acoles | no | 19:07 |
| notmyname | heh | 19:07 |
| portante | we know its late. :) | 19:07 |
| cschwede | no :) | 19:07 |
| acoles | that was no to notmyname :) | 19:07 |
| notmyname | ok. if anything sees anything troubling, please let me know ASAP | 19:07 |
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| notmyname | #topic python-swiftclient | 19:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "python-swiftclient (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:08 | |
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| notmyname | moving on to the next thing... | 19:08 |
| notmyname | the client has had some patches languish and needs some lovin | 19:08 |
| notmyname | there are a couple of patches I'd like to see land in it https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Swift/PriorityReviews | 19:08 |
| notmyname | here's the plan I'm working towards: | 19:09 |
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| notmyname | (1) land those last 2 patches (2) cut the last 1.X rev (3) land the cert checking patch (4) cut the 2.0 rev | 19:09 |
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| notmyname | as to the other patches outstanding for python-swiftclient, most are stylistic changes or py3k changes (neither of which I consider high priority) | 19:10 |
| notmyname | any objections to this plan? | 19:10 |
| portante | none from red hat | 19:10 |
| cschwede | I think https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59673/ (one of those 2 last patches) needs only another opinion from someone else, should be easy to merge. | 19:11 |
| notmyname | ya, I think both are fairly easy patches to review | 19:12 |
| notmyname | I'll look for activity on these an start nagging if nothing has happened by the end of the week | 19:12 |
| notmyname | anything else on python-swiftclient? | 19:13 |
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| notmyname | ok. moving on... | 19:13 |
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| notmyname | #topic get_diskfile | 19:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "get_diskfile (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:14 | |
| portante | is gholt here? | 19:14 |
| notmyname | this is a change that portante has. | 19:14 |
| notmyname | portante: got a link? | 19:14 |
| portante | sec | 19:14 |
| notmyname | doesn't look like it | 19:14 |
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| portante | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60629/ | 19:14 |
| notmyname | thanks | 19:14 |
| portante | I don't look like that link, but there it is | 19:14 |
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| portante | gholt has placed a -1 on that patch, are there any other concerns with it? | 19:15 |
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| * torgomatic is entirely neutral | 19:15 | |
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| peluse | not sure I fully understand his concern | 19:15 |
| torgomatic | as long as storage policy index can make it down to the filesystem in a manner that nobody hates too much, I'm on board | 19:15 |
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| notmyname | portante: to summarize what I've heard on it, the get_diskfile change is something that woudl be expected to move over time, so this isn't good or bad, per se | 19:16 |
| portante | okay, but that is true for lots of the code | 19:16 |
| notmyname | portante: ie anyone writing a DiskFile would be expected to know what versions of swift they are compatible with | 19:16 |
| notmyname | portante: sure :-) | 19:16 |
| zaitcev | Frankly I don't see why an implementation cannot conform to the old style of parameters and then simply ignore device and partition. | 19:17 |
| portante | certainly, that is true today | 19:17 |
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| portante | it can, this is to line things up with twhat is coming with storage policies | 19:17 |
| portante | so that new parameters from the environment that are implementation specific land as kwargs only | 19:17 |
| peluse | and BTW, I have the patch almost ready that removes DATADIR and replaces with method func that takes index in and returns obj dir | 19:17 |
| portante | this is a very tight change, and one which all the other out of the tree consumers have to adjust to anyways today | 19:18 |
| portante | peluse: great | 19:18 |
| peluse | yup | 19:18 |
| peluse | yup to your first comment, not the 2nd one :) | 19:18 |
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| peluse | do we need to 'policiy'ize' ASYNCDIR as well? | 19:19 |
| notmyname | peluse: before we get there, let's finish up with portante's patch | 19:19 |
| peluse | asyndir-1, asyncdir-2, etc | 19:19 |
| peluse | sorry, jumping ahead | 19:19 |
| portante | notmyname: not much more we can discuss | 19:20 |
| portante | gholt is not here, so it is kinda mute | 19:20 |
| portante | moot | 19:20 |
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| portante | I am happy to move on to the next topic and just work this as best we can via -swift | 19:20 |
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| notmyname | portante: I'm on board with a,c,o, **kwargs. seems like it needs to go through normal review and land when it gets 2 +2s | 19:20 |
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| notmyname | ok, moving on...to "open" | 19:21 |
| notmyname | #topic open discussion | 19:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:21 | |
| notmyname | peluse: asyncdirs? | 19:21 |
| peluse | yes, question for portante mostly I guess, and torgomatic | 19:22 |
| peluse | just one for all policies or a dir per policy like we are doing with objects | 19:22 |
| lincolnt | What about the topic on the agenda: gatekeeper middleware (https://review.openstack.org/51228) ? | 19:22 |
| portante | I don't think we need to do it for asyncdirs, or quarantine for that matter, as the hash will always be different | 19:22 |
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| peluse | cool | 19:22 |
| torgomatic | lincolnt: I snuck that in there at about UTC 16:59:59, so we can just do that in open discussion :) | 19:23 |
| peluse | makes sense | 19:23 |
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| notmyname | lincolnt: whoops. sorry. I didn't reload my agenda page :-) | 19:23 |
| notmyname | lincolnt: I'll come back to that | 19:23 |
| torgomatic | there's plenty of time | 19:23 |
| lincolnt | ok | 19:23 |
| zaitcev | notmyname: Do you think we need more reviewers and if yes, are there any good ideas. I basically do nothing while I'm working on mem_backend for a,c and I feel like reviews pile up. | 19:23 |
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| notmyname | ok, let me organize this | 19:23 |
| notmyname | #topic async dirs | 19:24 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "async dirs (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:24 | |
| peluse | got my answer already :) | 19:24 |
| notmyname | peluse: clayg: torgomatic: peluse: any resolution here? yes or now? | 19:24 |
| notmyname | ok | 19:24 |
| peluse | answer is no (no need tomake changes there) | 19:24 |
| notmyname | peluse: at least for now. they may be needed at a later time | 19:25 |
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| peluse | I have it almost done so may submit with the patch and reviwers can decide, easy to back out | 19:25 |
| notmyname | ok | 19:25 |
| notmyname | #topic review backlog | 19:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "review backlog (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:26 | |
| notmyname | zaitcev: in general, ya, I'm somewhat worried about the review backlog | 19:26 |
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| notmyname | part of that has to do with the amount of reviews being done | 19:26 |
| notmyname | however, we have seen some recent movement as some of the core devs who weren't participating as much in the past did some more reviews (swifterdarrell) | 19:27 |
| torgomatic | someone should set up a graph of review-queue depth | 19:28 |
| portante | but for a healthy community we also need to be sure folks from different companies are reviewing others folks work | 19:28 |
| torgomatic | :) | 19:28 |
| notmyname | portante: yes, indeed | 19:28 |
| portante | it is not just about review backlog, it is also about getting the community mind share on changes | 19:28 |
| peluse | hear that | 19:29 |
| zaitcev | I agree with portante in abstract, but it's a luxury for me. I just grab any reviews I can complete, grab next, and it never ends. Can't even think what company backs what. | 19:29 |
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| notmyname | aside from one or two changes recently, I don't think this is actually a problem we face currently | 19:29 |
| notmyname | portante: do you disagree? | 19:29 |
| portante | it would be nice to see the data on the commits and how they were approved | 19:30 |
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| portante | but not that concerned right now | 19:30 |
| notmyname | ok | 19:30 |
| zaitcev | I think the only case when out-of-band sit-in-same-building authority forced a dubious patch in was Alex's DB cursors thing... And even in that case I doubt anyone would've caught that. BTW, IIRC it was ultimately fixed by a dude from HP. | 19:31 |
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| portante | we have partners who are not participating in the swift community because they don't feel it is open enough | 19:31 |
| notmyname | if anyone has ideas on how to do reviews differently, please let me know. let's be free with trying new things | 19:31 |
| portante | we are trying to change that | 19:31 |
| peluse | that's funny - not participating because they don't think its open enough is kinda part of the problem | 19:32 |
| notmyname | portante: every time I hear that complaint I ask for data and I haven't gotten any yet | 19:32 |
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| notmyname | peluse: +1 | 19:32 |
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| portante | agreed, but it is what it is | 19:32 |
| zaitcev | I do wonder if I could drum up more support or critique for the backends if I were physically in SF | 19:32 |
| notmyname | portante: I'd also be happy to talk to anyone about that if it would help | 19:33 |
| zaitcev | I used to work in RH office in Sunnyvale, which is somewhat close. | 19:33 |
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| portante | yes, and I have recommended that | 19:33 |
| notmyname | zaitcev: yes, we all need to get on your db backends reviews (myself included) | 19:33 |
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| zaitcev | Tangentially re. community, remember this dude who posted a Ceph back-end | 19:34 |
| notmyname | yes | 19:34 |
| peluse | notmyname: maybe a peridic 'review-fest' online event or something... | 19:34 |
| clayg | zaitcev: I'm looking at the ceph one, but I'm not expert - it takes time | 19:34 |
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| zaitcev | We told him "go to a separate repo". I'm wondering if he understood it right re. making sure he uses stable APIs and like a welcome test case, and not just giving him a cold shoulder. | 19:34 |
| clayg | zaitcev: same for db backends - I don't have a strong vision for what it *should* look like - everything you've got seems sane | 19:34 |
| zaitcev | https://review.openstack.org/60215 - Babu Shanmugam | 19:35 |
| clayg | zaitcev: I think chmouel should be able to keep in on the right page | 19:36 |
| cschwede | zaitcev: i think chmouel is in contact with him | 19:36 |
| peluse | same company right? | 19:36 |
| clayg | cschwede: beat ya! | 19:36 |
| clayg | enovance | 19:36 |
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| zaitcev | okay | 19:36 |
| notmyname | ya, I'm happy that it came from a company that has already been very good at working with upstream swift | 19:36 |
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| notmyname | but it did get jumped on pretty quickly. not incorrectly, but it may have been seen as harsh or sudden. I'm glad to hear chmouel and cschwede can help guide it | 19:37 |
| notmyname | ok, let's move on to lincolnt's topic | 19:37 |
| notmyname | #topic gatekeeper middleware | 19:38 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "gatekeeper middleware (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:38 | |
| torgomatic | alright, so there's this patch here that adds a new, mandatory middleware: https://review.openstack.org/51228 | 19:38 |
| notmyname | lincolnt: what do you have? | 19:38 |
| lincolnt | We just noticed it, wanted to discuss, might be related to our https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/MetadataSearch topic | 19:38 |
| tomesh | so why this middlware must be the first one? | 19:38 |
| acoles | its my patch | 19:39 |
| lincolnt | tomesh and I here, form HP | 19:39 |
| lincolnt | from | 19:39 |
| clayg | i thoguth it had to be the second after catch_errors | 19:39 |
| notmyname | oh, sorry, it is torgomatic's topic, not lincolnt | 19:39 |
| tomesh | sure, the second one sorry. | 19:39 |
| torgomatic | yeah, I should have put my name on it | 19:39 |
| * torgomatic is lazy sometimes | 19:39 | |
| torgomatic | anyhow, when the (mandatory) gatekeeper middleware isn't in the pipeline, this patch adds it | 19:40 |
| tomesh | my concern is with the metadata search middleware | 19:40 |
| torgomatic | tomesh: I don't think this is related to search, sorry | 19:40 |
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| tomesh | so we offer search on both custom metadata as well as system metadata | 19:40 |
| lincolnt | We will be capturing additional system metadata on requests to add to the TBD metadata DB for searching | 19:40 |
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| torgomatic | and when gatekeeper isn't second in the pipeline, this patch moves it | 19:41 |
| torgomatic | that's what I want to get thoughts on: the automatic moving of middlewares | 19:41 |
| torgomatic | IMO, if an operator writes their pipeline in a particular order, we should respect that | 19:41 |
| tomesh | I agree | 19:41 |
| torgomatic | like if someone sticks mempeek at index 0 to look for memory leaks | 19:41 |
| torgomatic | but I don't want to send acoles off on a snipe hunt if other folks think that gatekeeper should get relocated | 19:42 |
| zaitcev | torgomatic: I still cannot find it, what's the review # | 19:42 |
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| torgomatic | zaitcev: https://review.openstack.org/51228 | 19:42 |
| clayg | 51228 | 19:42 |
| torgomatic | the code in question is in swift/proxy/server.py | 19:42 |
| lincolnt | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/51228/ | 19:43 |
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| portante | I believe the proxy server, and really any WSGI servers needs control of the beginning and end of the pipeline | 19:43 |
| torgomatic | so basically what I'm after here is: should Swift re-order middleware or not? | 19:43 |
| portante | catch_errors is the one that I think needs to be mandatory | 19:44 |
| clayg | portante: i like to turn off catch_errors in dev sometimes (so lazy) | 19:44 |
| portante | I don't think it should reorder middleware that is definable in the configuration file | 19:44 |
| notmyname | torgomatic: in some cases I can see that it should (eg cache after ratelimit) | 19:44 |
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| portante | clayg: sure, so have a proxy-serves section switch for that | 19:44 |
| notmyname | in other cases, no. eg I have my own custom middleware where I want/need it | 19:44 |
| acoles | portante: sure, but if gatekeeper is config definable and someone screws up then sysmeta gets leaked | 19:44 |
| clayg | I think that dynamic pipelines patch had a good idea in this regard - you can either ask for the pipeline to be auto ordered or you can say explicitly what you want | 19:45 |
| lincolnt | So, related to metadata search: How can new middleware like ours grab new system metadata like (say) x-container-sysmeta-target-container-pointer if it strips it off before our middleware later in the pipe sees it? | 19:45 |
| notmyname | ya, I want alpha_ori to resurrect that patch | 19:45 |
| portante | but I don't think we are talking about arbitrary middleware, we seem to be talking about how to define the environment that middleware lives in in a WSGI server for swift | 19:45 |
| portante | so if we are trying to prevent headers, why wouldn't we foorce that to the beginning of the pipeline? | 19:46 |
| acoles | lincolnt: gatekeeper just strips from incoming client request (which is why it needs to be at start of pipe) | 19:46 |
| torgomatic | portante: because I might want to profile the whole middleware chain, including gatekeeper | 19:46 |
| portante | and how would the administrator know their middleware isn't at the beginning> | 19:46 |
| torgomatic | and if you force gatekeeper in front of my profiler, I can't do that | 19:46 |
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| portante | so then we need to do the profiling differently | 19:47 |
| portante | but how many other middlewares will we want to force to the front there? | 19:47 |
| portante | profiling seems to be internal type stuff | 19:47 |
| portante | so are we talking about internal mechanism or general middleware? | 19:47 |
| torgomatic | I'm talking about general stuff... if I type out a pipeline with a bunch of stuff in it in a particular order, I want the proxy to just do it | 19:48 |
| portante | and it will | 19:48 |
| torgomatic | not if we move gatekeeper around | 19:48 |
| portante | why think of it as middleware? | 19:49 |
| notmyname | two modes: (1) explicit and warn if it's not up front and (2) auto-manage where it moves things | 19:49 |
| portante | torgomatic: there is lots of code in WSGI handling that won't get profiled with profiling middleware | 19:49 |
| torgomatic | more concretely, if I have "pipeline = thing-one thing-two catch_errors gatekeeper", the proposed patch will turn that into "pipeline = catch_errors gatekeeper thing-one thing-two" | 19:49 |
| notmyname | how abotu that ^ | 19:49 |
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| portante | torgomatic: in this proposed scenario catch_errors and gatekeeper are not middleware | 19:50 |
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| tomesh | right. why does the getkeeper need to be second | 19:50 |
| torgomatic | notmyname: Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I'll make it configurable!" Now they have 2^N problems. | 19:50 |
| portante | they would be part of WSGI | 19:50 |
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| notmyname | torgomatic: sure sure :-) | 19:50 |
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| portante | tomesh: catch_errors is a generic error handling thing for the pipeline, also adds txid | 19:51 |
| tomesh | sure | 19:51 |
| * clayg search for gatekeeper in pep333 | 19:51 | |
| portante | gatekeeper is about preventing user specified reserved headers from entering in to the WSGI handling | 19:51 |
| tomesh | my question is why do we force getkeeper to be the second middleware | 19:51 |
| tomesh | I understand | 19:51 |
| torgomatic | portante: ...but they're not? WSGI stuff isn't usually subject to me goofing it up, but these modules are | 19:52 |
| portante | so that catch-errors can be first | 19:52 |
| tomesh | and I support this functionality | 19:52 |
| portante | torgomatic: what? | 19:52 |
| tomesh | but why does it NEEDs to be second? | 19:52 |
| notmyname | make gatekeeper first but let it whitelist earlier middleware? | 19:52 |
| torgomatic | portante: eventlet.wsgi or Apache or whatever is outside the scope of things I can fix by patching Swift, but gatekeeper isn't, so I want it to be examinable | 19:53 |
| portante | tomesh: so that no other middleware will be affected by user attempts to set reserved headers | 19:53 |
| acoles | notmyname: worth considering, but issue concerns catch_errors too | 19:54 |
| tomesh | but if we have a middleware that needs to see the reserved headers | 19:54 |
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| portante | tomesh: the point is that those middlewares need to be assured that if a reserved header is present it cames from other middleware and not set by the user | 19:54 |
| acoles | tomesh: the reserved headers should never be set by a clinet | 19:54 |
| acoles | client | 19:54 |
| portante | torogmatic: why isn't gatekeeper? | 19:55 |
| lincolnt | We want our metadata search middleware to be in front of gatekeeper so we catch system metadata that gatekeeper (with this patch) would strip off, e.g. the example x-container-sysmeta-target-container-pointer | 19:55 |
| lincolnt | (my name example) | 19:55 |
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| torgomatic | portante: because it lives in the Swift source tree, and gets packaged with Swift | 19:55 |
| portante | lincolnt: why? | 19:55 |
| portante | torgomatic: how much of swift do you want examinable? | 19:56 |
| portante | just gatekeeper? | 19:56 |
| portante | what about ther est of the wsgi code in common? | 19:56 |
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| portante | why would gatekeeper be any different from that | 19:56 |
| lincolnt | Isn't it a use case that the general mecahnism being added, to store any new system metadata, might be metadata that someone could want to search on? Like custom metadata | 19:56 |
| notmyname | I don't think we've got a consensus here (or will get one in the next 4 minutes). so let's move the discussion to #openstack-swift and the patch review | 19:56 |
| portante | okay | 19:56 |
| torgomatic | sure | 19:57 |
| notmyname | but now we all know what's at stake, so go review the code :-) | 19:57 |
| acoles | ok. btw thanks folks for the reviews and interest | 19:57 |
| notmyname | acoles: I think you've got a lot of interest :-) | 19:57 |
| portante | and have done a good job with this | 19:57 |
| notmyname | #topic open discussion (redux) | 19:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (redux) (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:57 | |
| notmyname | anything else to bring up in the last 3 minutes? | 19:58 |
| peluse | EC | 19:58 |
| notmyname | s/2/3 | 19:58 |
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| peluse | doubt can do it in 3 min thogh :) | 19:58 |
| notmyname | heh | 19:58 |
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| peluse | we can pick it up on regular IRC | 19:58 |
| notmyname | ok | 19:58 |
| tsg | works | 19:58 |
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| notmyname | next meeting is scheduled for Dec 25. I propose we skip it | 19:58 |
| peluse | how come? | 19:59 |
| peluse | :) | 19:59 |
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| notmyname | any objections? | 19:59 |
| torgomatic | none here | 19:59 |
| peluse | sounds good | 19:59 |
| notmyname | if so, have the meeting without anyone else ;-) | 19:59 |
| portante | none here, so we'll need again in the new year, happy new year! | 19:59 |
| zaitcev | international audience | 19:59 |
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| notmyname | ok, off to -swift and gerrit for EC and gatekeeper discussions | 19:59 |
| notmyname | thanks for coming | 19:59 |
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| notmyname | #endmeeting | 19:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 11 19:59:55 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2013/swift.2013-12-11-19.01.html | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2013/swift.2013-12-11-19.01.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2013/swift.2013-12-11-19.01.log.html | 20:00 |
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| stevebaker | #startmeeting heat | 20:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 11 20:00:08 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is stevebaker. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:00 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:00 | |
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| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'heat' | 20:00 |
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| stevebaker | #topic rollcall | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "rollcall (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:00 | |
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| shardy | o/ | 20:00 |
| bgorski | o/ | 20:00 |
| randallburt | o/ | 20:00 |
| tims | o/ | 20:00 |
| arbylee | o/ | 20:00 |
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| andersonvom | o/ | 20:00 |
| spzala | hi | 20:00 |
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| stevebaker | dolphm: ping heat meeting | 20:00 |
| sdake_ | o/ | 20:00 |
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| SpamapS | ~o~ | 20:00 |
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| dolphm | \o/ | 20:01 |
| lakshmi | o/ | 20:01 |
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| asalkeld | o/ | 20:01 |
| pshchelo | \o/ | 20:01 |
| zaneb | it's bizarre having this meeting in the middle of the day | 20:01 |
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| sdake_ | are you in the us now zane? | 20:01 |
| stevebaker | zaneb: close the curtains | 20:01 |
| pshchelo | no less bizzare at 10 pm | 20:01 |
| zaneb | pshchelo: no, 10pm is normal for me | 20:02 |
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| stevebaker | #topic Adding items to the agenda | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adding items to the agenda (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:02 | |
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| stevebaker | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/HeatAgenda | 20:02 |
| stevebaker | should we talk heat-core nomination? that seems to be the vigorous discussion of the week | 20:02 |
| skraynev_ | hello all | 20:03 |
| kebray | \o | 20:03 |
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| sdake_ | might as well stevebaker | 20:03 |
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| stevebaker | shardy: if/when dolphm show up we can talk management-api dependencies | 20:04 |
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| asalkeld | I think we should at least periodically check to see if we need add/remove people | 20:05 |
| dolphm | stevebaker: o/ | 20:05 |
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| shardy | stevebaker: Ok, did I miss a discussion on that? | 20:05 |
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| stevebaker | specifically https://blueprints.launchpad.net/keystone/+spec/service-scoped-role-definition | 20:05 |
| shardy | I thought we were going to use normal policy rules until the service scoped token stuff gets worked out | 20:05 |
| stevebaker | #topic management-api dependencies | 20:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "management-api dependencies (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:05 | |
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| zaneb | asalkeld: it's supposed to be reviewed once per cycle. we should be looking to add people more often than that though, I agree | 20:05 |
| shardy | stevebaker: I got blocked on bug #1256983 but we're merging that now | 20:06 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1256983 in heat/havana "[OSSA 2013-035] Heat ReST API doesn't respect tenant scoping (CVE-2013-6428)" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1256983 | 20:06 |
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| stevebaker | shardy: that is what I thought too, but https://blueprints.launchpad.net/heat/+spec/management-api has https://blueprints.launchpad.net/keystone/+spec/service-scoped-role-definition as a dependency. It looks like we can remove that | 20:06 |
| shardy | dolphm: How is the service scoped role stuff going, still in discussion AFAICT? | 20:06 |
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| shardy | stevebaker: Ok, I think maybe I added that when we were working out the options | 20:07 |
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| dolphm | shardy: yes. as always, there's several proposed solutions with contention among them | 20:07 |
| stevebaker | lol | 20:07 |
| shardy | dolphm: Ok, so we shouldn't be blocking on it then, maybe plan to migrate to it for K? | 20:07 |
| dolphm | shardy: ++ definitely shouldn't be a blocker from developing new APIs | 20:08 |
| shardy | dolphm: and use a policy rule which overrides the default scoping for Icehouse? | 20:08 |
| dolphm | shardy: i don't follow the question? | 20:08 |
| dolphm | shardy: if you want to be super-safe, i'd suggest publishing a policy for new APIs that simply deny all access, forcing deployers to utilize keystone broken approach, or wait for a better solution from keystone | 20:09 |
| shardy | dolphm: I'm just explaining my proposed workaround, which is to define an "is service admin" policy rule, which enables a user to e.g list all stacks for all tenants | 20:09 |
| shardy | that might be "heat_admin" role in the "admin" tenant or somehting, configurable in the policy | 20:09 |
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| dolphm | shardy: ++ | 20:09 |
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| shardy | dolphm: Ok, cool, thanks | 20:09 |
| stevebaker | right | 20:10 |
| shardy | stevebaker: Ok, so I can make progress on this now, as soon as https://review.openstack.org/#/c/61455/ lands | 20:10 |
| dolphm | shardy: i definitely encourage service-specific admin-style roles... nothing in policy prevents you from requiring such arbitrary roles | 20:10 |
| stevebaker | #topic Unassigned icehouse-2 blueprints | 20:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Unassigned icehouse-2 blueprints (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:10 | |
| stevebaker | #link https://launchpad.net/heat/+milestone/icehouse-2 | 20:11 |
| stevebaker | if you sort by assignee you'll see 7 unassigned bps for i-2 | 20:12 |
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| stevebaker | if there are no takers they will just be kicked to i-3 at some point | 20:13 |
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| shardy | and a critical unassigned bug, is that really critical sdake_ ? | 20:13 |
| shardy | I'd say "high" myself | 20:13 |
| zaneb | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/heat/+spec/parameter-nested-schema <- maybe tspatzier wants that one? he is away atm but has been working on related stuff | 20:13 |
| sdake_ | shardy seems like a security issue but if you want to make high thats fine with me | 20:13 |
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| stevebaker | zaneb: we should wait until his return | 20:14 |
| SpamapS | Critical, to me, is "Heat's mission is compromised entirely by this bug." | 20:14 |
| sdake_ | ya, when i see security problems, i see them as critical | 20:15 |
| shardy | sdake_: If it's critical, someone needs to take it, but IMO it's not critical, as there are several workarounds, e.g re-enable selinux in the userdata | 20:15 |
| sdake_ | so we have different defintions ;0 | 20:15 |
| stevebaker | asalkeld: is this a dupe of what has already been implemented? https://blueprints.launchpad.net/heat/+spec/notification-support | 20:15 |
| asalkeld | yeah | 20:15 |
| sdake_ | shardy i'll change the prioirty | 20:15 |
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| stevebaker | to me, critical is heat is completely broken | 20:15 |
| randallburt | oh whoops. I just grabbed that one stevebaker asalkeld | 20:15 |
| shardy | stevebaker: +1 | 20:15 |
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| stevebaker | if it is an actual security bug it should be flagged as such | 20:15 |
| sdake_ | cves are always critical in the bug tracker | 20:15 |
| randallburt | but if the works already done... | 20:15 |
| SpamapS | sdake_: security is orthogonal to importance. | 20:16 |
| sdake_ | bug already changed to high stop beating up on me please ;) | 20:16 |
| SpamapS | I mean to clarify for all, not beat on you. | 20:16 |
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| stevebaker | but I'm wondering, should it be flagged as security? | 20:16 |
| sdake_ | i dont think it should be flagged as security - since the vms don't work atall with selinux enabled ;) | 20:17 |
| stevebaker | ok, fair enough | 20:17 |
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| sdake_ | hard to have a security bug if it doesn't allow a vector of attack :) | 20:17 |
| SpamapS | sdake_: not working at all == 0 risk == security wins: fatality! | 20:17 |
| asalkeld | I think we need a bp for migrating to oslo.messaging ? | 20:18 |
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| sdake_ | asalkeld +1 | 20:18 |
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| stevebaker | #action asalkeld to raise a bp for migrating to oslo.messaging | 20:18 |
| SpamapS | bp? | 20:19 |
| SpamapS | that's a bug IMO | 20:19 |
| SpamapS | Continuing to use oslo-incubator stuff that has a real library is a bug. | 20:19 |
| stevebaker | I don't think it matters, just something to track it | 20:19 |
| zaneb | SpamapS: the distinction is as spurious as ever | 20:19 |
| stevebaker | #topic Repurposing of the stack/resource status columns - related to stack convergence | 20:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Repurposing of the stack/resource status columns - related to stack convergence (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:19 | |
| SpamapS | bps have specs. That's the distinction. | 20:19 |
| shardy | The advantage of bugs is they are allowable as backports to stable.. | 20:19 |
| stevebaker | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/heat/+spec/stack-convergence | 20:19 |
| shardy | something to bear in mind when deciding which to choose ;) | 20:20 |
| sdake_ | we don't want to backport oslo.messaging into stable! | 20:20 |
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| stevebaker | andersonvom: want to take this one? | 20:20 |
| andersonvom | stevebaker: sure | 20:20 |
| shardy | sdake_: I'm not saying we do, just in general, consider if you might want to when deciding bp vs bug | 20:20 |
| sdake_ | shardy ya that makes sense - just going off your original cue ;0 | 20:21 |
| andersonvom | so, the problem there is that when retrieving the current status of all resources, the 'status' attributes of stack and resources become ambiguous | 20:21 |
| andersonvom | and we end up having no proper place to store that information | 20:21 |
| asalkeld | SpamapS, i prefer bugs over bp too, but just too late (made the bp) | 20:21 |
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| zaneb | andersonvom: ambiguous in what way? | 20:21 |
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| SpamapS | asalkeld: thats the other distinction.. "it was already done one of the two spurious ways. ;)" | 20:22 |
| andersonvom | zaneb: the current 'status' attributes of stack/resource is really in reference to the action, not the objects themselves | 20:22 |
| shardy | andersonvom: The stack status relates to the state of the stack, each resource has it's own status, which you're updating | 20:22 |
| SpamapS | andersonvom: why would we want to store the status that is already in the external resource? | 20:22 |
| SpamapS | andersonvom: it is out of date the moment we store it. | 20:23 |
| shardy | the combination of which might change the stack status (not action) | 20:23 |
| asalkeld | is there a way to delete a bp? | 20:23 |
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| zaneb | so, 'status' is that status of the last action | 20:23 |
| zaneb | s/that/the/ | 20:23 |
| andersonvom | shardy: true. but a similar problem happens there as well: after I complete all the syncing, the action completes, but we have no way of telling what the current stack "health" is | 20:24 |
| stevebaker | asalkeld: Definition -> Obsolete and remove the Milestone target | 20:24 |
| andersonvom | zaneb: yes! | 20:24 |
| zaneb | I'm not clear what the issue is with that though | 20:24 |
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| * zaneb is way behind on ML posts, sorry :( | 20:24 | |
| shardy | Yeah, so if we allow e.g heat stack-update --check, the result would be UPDATE, FAILED if any resources are polled and found to be in a FAILED state | 20:25 |
| randallburt | asalkeld, stevebaker I superseded the duplicate notifications bp if that's what you're looking to do. | 20:25 |
| asalkeld | sure | 20:25 |
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| shardy | andersonvom: I agree we *could* separate the last lifecycle action status from the last polled status, but I'm not sure what that gains us, if the polling is user initiated | 20:25 |
| stevebaker | randallburt: so did I ;) | 20:25 |
| randallburt | double superseded! | 20:26 |
| stevebaker | like betamax | 20:26 |
| andersonvom | shardy: we may want to have a background task constantly updating the stacks, for example | 20:26 |
| andersonvom | shardy: that way, it would be easy to spot when something fails | 20:26 |
| shardy | andersonvom: Ok, then you keep triggering an update and look for the result of that update | 20:26 |
| SpamapS | I do like the idea of a background updater that can be optimized using notifications. | 20:27 |
| shardy | andersonvom: The result is still either COMPLETE or FAILED | 20:27 |
| SpamapS | But that info is _extremely_ different from the status of the actions requested by the user. | 20:27 |
| randallburt | andersonvom: yuck. I would prefer this be part of the stack owner's monitoring tbh. we've had hard times with bg threads and it gets worse now that multi-engine is landing | 20:27 |
| stevebaker | landed | 20:28 |
| randallburt | yup. | 20:28 |
| randallburt | jasond makes progress even when he's on vacation ;) | 20:28 |
| zaneb | shardy++, randallburt++++++ | 20:28 |
| shardy | randallburt: +1 | 20:28 |
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| stevebaker | so what is the resolution to this topic? | 20:29 |
| shardy | But there is still a valid use case for the check-update, which is not continuous monitoring | 20:29 |
| shardy | it's to figure out what will happen if you do a converge | 20:29 |
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| arbylee | shardy: If you run a stack update, it feels odd to see a stack's state as UPDATE_FAILED, when it successfully performed it's action. An update was called and the latest resource status was retrieved and stored | 20:29 |
| randallburt | to be clear, though. I got no issue with an api method that says "check the status of the things and update stack state as a result" | 20:29 |
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| randallburt | shardy: yes, that. | 20:29 |
| shardy | arbylee: Ok, so maybe you have a new action called "CHECK", or something? | 20:30 |
| shardy | arbylee: what you call the action doesn't really matter, its the status you're interested in | 20:30 |
| randallburt | my suggestion was to add a STATE attribute to resources and do "something better" in the v2 api | 20:30 |
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| SpamapS | hrm | 20:30 |
| shardy | randallburt: So have state and status? That seems confusing | 20:30 |
| andersonvom | shardy: I guess what arbylee is saying is that it becomes ambiguous in a sense that an actual failure of the action will also be represented as FAILED | 20:30 |
| SpamapS | So I think background threads have been painted in a bad light for no good reason. | 20:31 |
| arbylee | shardy: right, but the status column still seems to represent the status of the ACTION. If I see CHECK_FAILED, or any other verb here, it's ambiguous whether the call itself failed, or a resource is down | 20:31 |
| randallburt | shardy: well, kinda. to me, status was "how did the last operation go" and state would be a stop gap, so if, for v1 we just update status then I'm not too fussed as long as its documented. | 20:31 |
| zaneb | randallburt: that name would be problematic | 20:31 |
| shardy | SpamapS: because they've regularly bitten us with horrible eventlet related bugs? | 20:31 |
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| SpamapS | shardy: that is a bug, yes. But there are really solid answers to that kind of problem. | 20:32 |
| randallburt | zaneb: sure, just and example. | 20:32 |
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| randallburt | could be called "FOO", but the gist is that I think we need to separate operational status from downstream resource state in v2 | 20:32 |
| SpamapS | Like having the "stack crawler" just be a client. | 20:32 |
| stevebaker | would this issue all go away if we just make check and converge part of the same action? | 20:32 |
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| SpamapS | A client that subscribes to notifications from external sources that have such things available, and otherwise polls. | 20:33 |
| shardy | randallburt: I think nova does the opposite? They have Status, then several States related to Task/Power | 20:33 |
| zaneb | SpamapS: if the engine has multiple background threads then it needs to be scaled out differently. If we have to do that, we should either do it in a different binary or, preferably, punt it to something external | 20:33 |
| randallburt | stevebaker: iIRC we discussed that a bit at the summit, but it was generally agreed that I wanted to be able to see state without converging | 20:33 |
| SpamapS | zaneb: yes I am saying do it in a different binary. But don't punt it. | 20:33 |
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| randallburt | s/I/we | 20:33 |
| SpamapS | also it is worth looking at what Curvature does | 20:34 |
| SpamapS | though I suspect that just updates on user demand | 20:34 |
| arbylee | stevebaker: do you mean to only have a converge call? What would trigger someone to call this action? I saw check/sync as the indicator that a converge needs to occur | 20:34 |
| andersonvom | stevebaker: that may not be ideal since the user may not want to "fix" the stack immediately. or, in the case of bg proc, it may not be good to do converge it automatically | 20:34 |
| andersonvom | s/do converge/converge/ | 20:35 |
| SpamapS | So what if check is external and we have a place for external things to annotate resources? | 20:35 |
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| SpamapS | Because "converge" is going to go and poll reality anyway. | 20:35 |
| shardy | andersonvom: But why is it bad for a stack to go into a FAILED state, then be converged into COMPLETE again whenever the user chooses? | 20:35 |
| tims | SpamapS I would highly suspect Curvature just updates on user demand | 20:35 |
| andersonvom | shardy: I think that's what we want to do, right? ;) | 20:36 |
| SpamapS | COMPLETE is a misnomer if there isn't an action to COMPLETE. Something else like STEADY would be more accurate. | 20:36 |
| randallburt | andersonvom, shardy yes, I think that's what we want to do, but this first step is letting me see if the stack and reality are different. I want the ability to know that and then *optionally* converge. | 20:37 |
| shardy | andersonvom: I'm saying I'm still not clear on why we need state and status | 20:37 |
| andersonvom | shardy: the only "problem" with failing a check (or whatever action) is that we will never know if the action itself failed, or just the resource was down or in an innapropriate state | 20:37 |
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| shardy | When andersonvom Yes you do, by looking at the resource states, and by the reason provided | 20:37 |
| randallburt | andersonvom: and for the v1 api, I think we can just use status and say "the last operation doesn't reflect reality anymore" | 20:37 |
| shardy | s/^When// | 20:37 |
| SpamapS | shardy: I agree with Anderson. There is an action which we want to know the outcome of, and an overall resource status which has an entirely different set of data associated (like how fresh is that perceived status?) | 20:37 |
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| shardy | SpamapS: But it's the exact same data we use when declaring the outcome of a resource action | 20:38 |
| shardy | e.g check_create_complete | 20:38 |
| shardy | we'll be polling the exact same thing | 20:38 |
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| randallburt | SpamapS: +1 but dunno if we *have* to do that now, rather than get what we want within the confines of v1 and then expand that in v2 | 20:38 |
| SpamapS | shardy: it is the same data, but at a different time and in a different context. | 20:38 |
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| tims | andersonvom: would there be different states possible more granular than "failed"? | 20:39 |
| andersonvom | tims: possibly. we may want to point out that a resource is misconfigured, for instance | 20:39 |
| shardy | SpamapS: That's why I'm saying, if it's user initiated, it's in the context of the most recent user initiated action, which is to trigger syncing the world's state with the stack | 20:39 |
| randallburt | s/what we want/something reasonably effective for the use case | 20:39 |
| randallburt | shardy: so the proposal is (CHECK, FAILED)? | 20:40 |
| SpamapS | shardy: that makes sense, I agree they are only slightly different at any one time. | 20:40 |
| zaneb | so wouldn't the check call just poll everything and return its results? why are we talking about having to store this in the DB where the state usually goes? | 20:40 |
| shardy | I guess it doesn't matter that much either way, but won't it be confusing if a resource is UPDATE_COMPLETE_FAILED? | 20:40 |
| shardy | randallburt: No I'm saying just update the stack without changing the definition, but triggering the check_update_complete logic, then set UPDATE_FAILED | 20:41 |
| SpamapS | zaneb: I think it could work either way so we might want to try and fit it into use cases. | 20:41 |
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| shardy | randallburt: but if folks want the action named something other than update, fair enough | 20:41 |
| shardy | All we are doing is updating, either the resource definition, state, or both | 20:41 |
| andersonvom | shardy: I'm fine with using UPDATE, since that's what it really is | 20:41 |
| SpamapS | There's also a problem in that if we store it in the DB, then we can't run checks concurrent with creates / updates | 20:41 |
| shardy | SpamapS: IMO, that is a good thing ;) | 20:42 |
| andersonvom | SpamapS: yes, but that's by design | 20:42 |
| randallburt | I disagree its an UPDATE in the current semantics, but we're close so I won't fuss ;) | 20:42 |
| shardy | SpamapS: Everything will be serialized by the stack lock anyway won't it? | 20:42 |
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| SpamapS | shardy: I have a user here at HP that spins up stacks that take 30 - 45 minutes to create.. it would be useful to start checking state before that completes. | 20:43 |
| SpamapS | shardy: only if we need to change the stack. | 20:43 |
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| SpamapS | Otherwise let the DB present the consistent view of the stack to the check thread. | 20:43 |
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| zaneb | btw the way we report states ('<ACTION>_<STATUS>') in the v1 API sucks, and I'd be all in favour of augmenting it in v1 and replacing it in v2 | 20:43 |
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| randallburt | zaneb: ++ | 20:43 |
| stevebaker | can we wind this topic up and move on? Maybe carry on in #heat after the meeting | 20:44 |
| randallburt | stevebaker: good plan | 20:44 |
| shardy | zaneb: +1 | 20:44 |
| zaneb | I blame cfn | 20:44 |
| andersonvom | shardy zaneb SpamapS: so, do we all agree that it's going to be UPDATE_FAILED with the appropriate reason? | 20:44 |
| SpamapS | I blame gnomes. | 20:44 |
| shardy | Can people add the v2 API related suggestions to the wiki please? | 20:44 |
| stevebaker | FOO_IN_PROGRESS is problematic in v1 | 20:44 |
| SpamapS | andersonvom: no, -> #heat post meeting. :-/ | 20:44 |
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| stevebaker | #topic heat-core nomination | 20:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "heat-core nomination (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:44 | |
| shardy | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Heat/Blueprints/V2API | 20:44 |
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| stevebaker | so I don't think we have a problem with evaluation criteria on who to nominate for core | 20:45 |
| zaneb | next topic! | 20:45 |
| shardy | ha | 20:45 |
| zaneb | ;) | 20:45 |
| stevebaker | but we do need to increase the core team size, and that seems to come down to motivating people to do reviews | 20:46 |
| shardy | stevebaker: So, I agree re *our* criteria, but the point of my ML thread was to communicate those to people working hard on reviews hoping to become core | 20:47 |
| shardy | I'd rather avoid a huge debate on that again now tho ;) | 20:47 |
| zaneb | is the limiting factor really motivation? | 20:47 |
| stevebaker | its a project-wide problem, people have many intrinsic and extrinsic motivators for doing reviews | 20:47 |
| zaneb | getting up to speed with the whole codebase takes a long time and is really hard | 20:48 |
| randallburt | so given that we've discussed the criteria on the ML, I suppose the next step is take those and start looking for folks that meet or are soon to meet them and start getting nominations together? | 20:48 |
| zaneb | I think that slows us down much more than people not being motivated to do reviews | 20:48 |
| SpamapS | Vote the way you want. We don't have to debate it really. | 20:48 |
| stevebaker | zaneb: true | 20:48 |
| zaneb | I think we're blessed with lots of really motivated contributors | 20:48 |
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| SpamapS | Jun Jie Nan btw, is my next suggestion for core. | 20:49 |
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| SpamapS | "nanjj" | 20:49 |
| sdake_ | I'd like to point out our current criteria; https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Heat/CoreTeam | 20:49 |
| stevebaker | zaneb: btw you might want to make more of your +0 reviews -1 or +1. Apart from juking your stats, I often miss good comments from you because they are +0, not -1 | 20:49 |
| shardy | I think bgorski has been doing some excellent work too | 20:50 |
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| stevebaker | +1 on bgorski | 20:50 |
| SpamapS | we can vote on ML, but just for sake of discussion, that's who I think will have the most positive impact | 20:50 |
| zaneb | stevebaker: I like to bikeshed on the reviews, but I don't like to -1 unless there's a good reason | 20:50 |
| shardy | nanjj has been doing a lot of reviews, but I'd like to see more non-cosmetic review comments | 20:51 |
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| randallburt | so nomination boils down to a ML post, yes? or do we need to discuss on IRC or something first? | 20:51 |
| SpamapS | zaneb: yes please, +0 is actually specifically "the bikeshed score" ;) | 20:51 |
| stevebaker | anyone in core can nominate anyone on the ML, then we vote | 20:51 |
| bgorski | shardy, stevebaker thx but I know I still needs to work harder to become the core | 20:51 |
| asalkeld | zaneb, +1 I like to leave comments with no +/- too | 20:51 |
| zaneb | I actually feel like it would be better if 1 person were in charge of nominating, so they can co-ordinate feedback to prospective candidates | 20:52 |
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| randallburt | so to bring this around to the topic at hand, does the action item boil down to "do an evaluation based on our criteria and bring forth candidates"? | 20:52 |
| zaneb | (PTL seems like the obvious choice for that) | 20:52 |
| andersonvom | zaneb: +1 on not −1'ing without a good reason | 20:52 |
| shardy | zaneb: I thought traditionally the PTL nominated, but I know anyone can if they want | 20:52 |
| randallburt | and/or get in touch with folks who have potential and give them feedback | 20:53 |
| stevebaker | anybody can, but I'll periodically review if anybody looks ready | 20:53 |
| zaneb | shardy: well, we copied a wiki page from Nova that said anyone can do it | 20:53 |
| stevebaker | and I am keeping an eye on it | 20:53 |
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| SpamapS | My take on -1's (and I'm sure you all already feel this) is that a) It can be taken back, b) it can be overridden, and c) it forces more action than +0. So if there is any inkling that a patch can be made better without inserting one's opnions (actual facts needed please) then I -1. | 20:53 |
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| shardy | zaneb: Yeah, but isn't that an openstack wide convention? | 20:54 |
| SpamapS | very cautious not to -1 for just my opinion though. | 20:54 |
| sdake | without a -1, nobody knows the patch needs more work when it may from the comments :) | 20:54 |
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| zaneb | so, e.g. if I think somebody is a good candidate for core but needs to work on a particular area, I'd like to contact the PTL and tell them that so they can give feedback if appropriate, or go ahead if they think my opinion is not important ;) | 20:54 |
| shardy | zaneb: Seems like its good that any -core *could* nominate, but it may be more useful if nominally the PTL is the conduit | 20:54 |
| randallburt | zaneb: +1 | 20:55 |
| randallburt | shardy: +1 as well | 20:55 |
| zaneb | what I don't want to do is contact everybody in core and say 'let's nominate so-and-so, but not yet' | 20:55 |
| sdake | our current mechanism is any core member can suggest a new core member -seems to work well so far | 20:55 |
| zaneb | shardy: every project is free to define their own process | 20:55 |
| SpamapS | I think holding a vote on somebody without discussing them with the rest of the dev community first (including that somebody) is also a mistake. | 20:55 |
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| randallburt | SpamapS: very much so. | 20:55 |
| SpamapS | So anyway, I think we all actually pretty much agree. | 20:56 |
| asalkeld | yip | 20:56 |
| SpamapS | Our criteria is a bit skewed, but that is o-k. Diverse opinions are a good thing. | 20:56 |
| stevebaker | feel free to contact me privately so I can contact potential nominees. | 20:56 |
| zaneb | ok, so let's say anyone in core can nominate, but they should talk to the PTL first? | 20:56 |
| stevebaker | 4 minutes | 20:56 |
| stevebaker | #topic open discussion | 20:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:56 | |
| sdake | well if thats the new process, change the wiki please | 20:56 |
| sdake | alhtough my take is we don't need to single thread on the ptl | 20:56 |
| stevebaker | you don't *have* to but you might want to | 20:57 |
| stevebaker | -1 votes might offend the nominee ;) | 20:57 |
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| stevebaker | not that that has happened yet | 20:58 |
| zaneb | if there are -1 votes the process is broken IMO | 20:58 |
| shardy | stevebaker: That is one of the main reasons I wanted to more openly discuss criteria, I don't want to be the one saying -1 when someone is nominated | 20:58 |
| sdake | typically I wouldn't expect a core member to suggest a new core that would get a -1 vote ;) | 20:58 |
| stevebaker | its happened in other projects | 20:58 |
| SpamapS | shardy: why not? | 20:59 |
| zaneb | stevebaker: every one I've seen later reversed their vote | 20:59 |
| shardy | I'd rather we align on what is expected, so we don't nominate folks who don't have consensus, and so folks who are candidates know what we expect | 20:59 |
| SpamapS | shardy: I value your -1 very much. :) | 20:59 |
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| zaneb | SpamapS: -1 on adding folks to core is a veto | 20:59 |
| randallburt | zaneb: I disagree. The nomination shouldn't be a "formality" IMO. We should discuss candidates openly and if its −1, then why is it −1. That feedback is valuable. | 20:59 |
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| shardy | SpamapS: Because I would prefer folks to get +1'd an in to core, when they are ready, without any confrontation or hurt feelings | 20:59 |
| SpamapS | right, none of us _wants_ to do that. | 20:59 |
| sdake | well, the wiki should be updated with whatever we want to use as a criteria - that way its written down and is a *commitment* to our criteria | 21:00 |
| stevebaker | #endmeeting | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 11 21:00:03 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2013/heat.2013-12-11-20.00.html | 21:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2013/heat.2013-12-11-20.00.txt | 21:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2013/heat.2013-12-11-20.00.log.html | 21:00 |
| stevebaker | to the #heat cave! | 21:00 |
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