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| nijaba | #startmeeting Ceilometer | 15:00 |
|---|---|---|
| nijaba | #meetingtopic Ceilometer | 15:00 |
| nijaba | #chair nijaba | 15:00 |
| nijaba | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/MeteringAgenda | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Nov 15 15:00:07 2012 UTC. The chair is nijaba. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ceilometer' | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | Current chairs: nijaba | 15:00 |
| nijaba | Hello everyone! Show of hands, who is around for the ceilometer meeting? | 15:00 |
| nijaba | o/ | 15:00 |
| dhellmann-afk | o/ | 15:00 |
| hungry-eglynn | o/ | 15:00 |
| *** dhellmann-afk is now known as dhellman | 15:00 | |
| dhellman | nick dhellmann | 15:00 |
| *** hungry-eglynn is now known as eglynn | 15:00 | |
| *** dhellman is now known as dhellmann | 15:00 | |
| * dhellmann needs more caffine | 15:00 | |
| yjiang5 | o/ | 15:00 |
| nijaba | #topic actions from previous meeting | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "actions from previous meeting (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:01 | |
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| nijaba | #topic dhellmann update versioning in ceilometer repo to match openstack standards | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "dhellmann update versioning in ceilometer repo to match openstack standards (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:01 | |
| jd__ | hi | 15:01 |
| dhellmann | the versioning work is done | 15:01 |
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| nijaba | nice! thanks a lot. | 15:02 |
| dhellmann | there's some sort of issue with the version number in the readthedocs.org build, which I have on my list to fix | 15:02 |
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| nijaba | ok. no need to track this as an action? | 15:02 |
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| dhellmann | I don't think so | 15:03 |
| timjr | howdy cowpokes :) | 15:03 |
| nijaba | #topic jd__ and nijaba to start preparing a video demo of ceilometer | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "jd__ and nijaba to start preparing a video demo of ceilometer (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:03 | |
| nijaba | no real progress there this week. re assigning for next week. | 15:03 |
| anniec | o/ | 15:03 |
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| nijaba | #topic jd__ and nijaba to start preparing a video demo of ceilometer | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "jd__ and nijaba to start preparing a video demo of ceilometer (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:03 | |
| nijaba | #action jd__ and nijaba to start preparing a video demo of ceilometer | 15:03 |
| nijaba | that's better :) | 15:03 |
| nijaba | #topic eglynn to writup a nova integration proposal to be discussed next week | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "eglynn to writup a nova integration proposal to be discussed next week (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:04 | |
| eglynn | the discussion with the nova folks is still ongoing, summarized here ... | 15:04 |
| nijaba | so we saw eglynn's message on the ml | 15:04 |
| eglynn | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/EfficientMetering/FutureNovaInteractionModel | 15:04 |
| timjr | I'll probably be submitting a metrics patch in a week or two... | 15:04 |
| nijaba | looks like nothing has been agreed on yet | 15:04 |
| timjr | but I'm not handling the billing use case at present | 15:05 |
| eglynn | TL;DR: lots of options, but definite push-back on the nova-compute RPC idea | 15:05 |
| nijaba | how do we get this to converge? | 15:05 |
| eglynn | (i.e. this is considered a private API) | 15:05 |
| eglynn | nijaba: a couple of the live options need buy-in fromt he nova folks | 15:05 |
| eglynn | if I don't get a response on the ML today, I'll bring it up at their weekly meeting this evening | 15:06 |
| timjr | this is the library I'll be using: https://github.com/timjr/tomograph | 15:06 |
| jd__ | and so far the only option that nova is ready to adopt is #1 | 15:06 |
| nijaba | would us putting this as a topic in a nova irc meeting help? | 15:06 |
| timjr | I'd love to talk with you guys about additional use cases (like billing) or improvements to it | 15:06 |
| nijaba | we need to converge sooner than later on this | 15:06 |
| eglynn | nijaba: I can propose this to vishy | 15:06 |
| eglynn | agreed, lets push for a quick agreemnt on the way forward | 15:06 |
| nijaba | sounds good. any other suggestions? | 15:06 |
| jd__ | timjr: sure, could you bring this back at the end of the meeting during open discussion? | 15:06 |
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| timjr | jd__: sure thing | 15:07 |
| jd__ | timjr: thanks :) | 15:07 |
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| jd__ | nijaba: I think eglynn summarized everything well :) | 15:07 |
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| nijaba | eglynn: do you want to action yourself for the nova irc meeting? | 15:08 |
| eglynn | #action eglynn propose agent item on ceilo interaction for nova IRC meeting | 15:08 |
| nijaba | thanks eglynn | 15:08 |
| nijaba | #topic nijaba to send an invite to fill the survey | 15:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "nijaba to send an invite to fill the survey (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:09 | |
| nijaba | I had to fight a bit with survey monkey, but the survey is now finaly out. | 15:09 |
| nijaba | 15 responses so far. we'll let it run until next meeting? | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | that sounds like a good idea | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | should be plenty of time | 15:09 |
| jd__ | +1 | 15:09 |
| nijaba | sandywalsh_: commented that the "features" were not clear enough for people outside the project | 15:10 |
| eglynn | yep, that's reasonable | 15:10 |
| nijaba | I think he is right | 15:10 |
| nijaba | so, I'll make a note for next cylce | 15:10 |
| sandywalsh_ | thanks | 15:10 |
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| nijaba | #action nijaba to close survey and publish result prior to next meeting | 15:11 |
| nijaba | #link http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/JNQ2PCJ | 15:11 |
| nijaba | could also be useful :) | 15:11 |
| nijaba | #topic asalkeld investigate diamond for use to generate stats | 15:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "asalkeld investigate diamond for use to generate stats (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:11 | |
| nijaba | I am afraid asalkeld is asleep | 15:11 |
| eglynn | yep, its his off-week | 15:11 |
| nijaba | anyone has comments on this topic? or should we reaction for next week? | 15:12 |
| jd__ | i'd say re-action | 15:12 |
| dhellmann | +1 | 15:12 |
| nijaba | #action asalkeld investigate diamond for use to generate stats | 15:12 |
| nijaba | That's all for last week's action, moving on... | 15:12 |
| nijaba | #topic Discuss synaps integration | 15:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discuss synaps integration (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:12 | |
| nijaba | eglynn: I think you had some interations with synaps folks, right? | 15:13 |
| eglynn | the Synaps folks are continuing their internal discussion, so no definite conclusion as yet | 15:13 |
| eglynn | but they are actively considering the idea | 15:13 |
| nijaba | it seems that they agree on using ceilometer, but not yet to fullyn join the project? | 15:13 |
| eglynn | I would say it'll take another day or two to play out, but yeah edging towards a looser link-up | 15:14 |
| nijaba | anyone from synaps online? | 15:14 |
| sandywalsh_ | eglynn: which specific part of using rpc is getting push back? The only thing I hear is using it for instrumentation. | 15:14 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: how much duplication of effort do you think that will produce? | 15:14 |
| eglynn | nijaba: bad time in their TZ | 15:14 |
| nijaba | eglynn: right... | 15:14 |
| eglynn | sandwalsh_ the idea of RPC being externally called (i.e. nova RPC message emitted by ceilo) | 15:15 |
| dhellmann | eglynn, nijaba: maybe we could arrange a separate meeting at a better time for them? | 15:15 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: yes, that's a good idea | 15:15 |
| nijaba | dhellmann: we should at least try | 15:15 |
| sandywalsh_ | eglynn: oh, yeah, that would be unnecessary | 15:15 |
| dhellmann | at least to discuss | 15:15 |
| nijaba | eglynn: do you want to take the action, or do you want me to? | 15:15 |
| eglynn | #action eglynn propose IRC meetup with Synaps folks to discuss collaboration model | 15:16 |
| nijaba | cool | 15:16 |
| nijaba | let's move on then | 15:16 |
| nijaba | #topic Tarball generation | 15:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tarball generation (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:16 | |
| nijaba | that's a topic from the last project meeting on tue | 15:16 |
| eglynn | sandywalsh_ it one of the options discussed here for ceilo to retrieve nova diagnostics http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2012-November/002791.html | 15:17 |
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| jd__ | was that a problem? | 15:17 |
| nijaba | eglynn gracfully replaced me as I was fighti with 3g and could not join (thanks!!) | 15:17 |
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| timjr | the nova rpc mechanism is not a robust interface... if things other than nova are going to call it, I think it needs a lot of work | 15:18 |
| sandywalsh_ | eglynn: I guess my fear is that ceilo is becoming a kitchen sink and losing focus. Yes, it could do diagnostics, but should it? | 15:18 |
| * nijaba sense a topic drift... | 15:18 | |
| dhellmann | yes, please, folks, let's stick with the agenda | 15:18 |
| sandywalsh_ | eglynn: two summits ago its focus was clear: billing, but now it's all things to all people | 15:18 |
| dhellmann | nijaba: what exactly is the issue with the tarballs? | 15:18 |
| eglynn | the actions from the project status meeting were ... ceilometer crew to ask for a ceilometer-tarball job and pimp up their grizzly roadmap | 15:19 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: agreed, nova rpc should only be used by nova | 15:19 |
| jd__ | c'mon folks, be nice :) | 15:19 |
| eglynn | i.e. ask the CI team to set up the ceilometer-tarball job | 15:19 |
| nijaba | eglynn: the last part being the next topic | 15:19 |
| dhellmann | we have a tarball job: https://jenkins.openstack.org/view/Ceilometer/job/ceilometer-sdist-tarball/ | 15:19 |
| dhellmann | is that the wrong one? | 15:19 |
| jd__ | yeah I think this has been resolved no? | 15:20 |
| nijaba | not sure. we should ask the infra team | 15:20 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: I'm not sure, I guess I should clarify that with ttx and/or infra team | 15:20 |
| nijaba | that's from last tue | 15:20 |
| nijaba | dhellmann: can you check with ttx/infra team? | 15:20 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: ok. it seems to be producing them with the correct version numbers now, too (maybe that was it?) | 15:20 |
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| eglynn | dhellmann: yeah, could have been if that was only resolved after the Tue status meeting | 15:21 |
| dhellmann | nijaba: sure, I can send an email | 15:21 |
| jd__ | log is there http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2012/project.2012-11-13-21.01.log.html | 15:21 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: yes, the version # change went in after that | 15:21 |
| jd__ | I think we got this covered already | 15:21 |
| nijaba | I guess a simple "hey, I think I have done everything right, can you check" would be nice | 15:21 |
| jd__ | but we can check | 15:21 |
| dhellmann | #action dhellmann to confirm with ttx that tarball job is correct | 15:21 |
| nijaba | thanks! | 15:21 |
| jd__ | thanks dhellmann | 15:21 |
| nijaba | #topic Transforming roadmap items into blueprints | 15:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Transforming roadmap items into blueprints (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:22 | |
| nijaba | that's another request from the project meeting | 15:22 |
| ttx | dhellmann: if it produces "ceilometer-2013.1.tar.gz" tarballs it's not using the right versioning algorithm. | 15:22 |
| nijaba | so I'll happily make sure we have a bp for each feature on the roadmap | 15:22 |
| eglynn | yep, so ttx primarily drives that meeting from the BP lists | 15:22 |
| jd__ | makes sense, we just need volunteers I guess | 15:22 |
| nijaba | and try to assign implementor when I know that | 15:22 |
| jd__ | nijaba: thanks! | 15:22 |
| ttx | shoud be now producing "ceilometer-2013.1~g2~20121115.234234.tar.gz" or something | 15:23 |
| eglynn | cool, then the BPs can be further fleshed out with details by the assigneee | 15:23 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ok, I'll ping you after the meeting to see if I can get better details about how to fix that | 15:23 |
| nijaba | #action nijaba to transform bp-less features into bp | 15:23 |
| ttx | dhellmann: sure. Might not even be on your side | 15:23 |
| nijaba | so I'll mark everyone that is high or medium as "approved" | 15:23 |
| yjiang5 | nijaba: where can we get the roadmap? | 15:24 |
| nijaba | please make sure that when you'll submit an implementation to mark "address bp #XXX" so that status is tracked | 15:24 |
| eglynn | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/EfficientMetering/RoadMap | 15:24 |
| nijaba | thanks eglynn | 15:24 |
| yjiang5 | thanks. | 15:24 |
| nijaba | ttx: how do you use bp from status tracking? | 15:25 |
| nijaba | do you just look at the global bp status? | 15:25 |
| nijaba | or do you do something fancier? | 15:25 |
| ttx | not really fancier. Mostly tracking implementation status | 15:26 |
| ttx | oh you mean do I use workitems ? no | 15:26 |
| nijaba | yeah, I was wondering :) | 15:26 |
| nijaba | ttx: thanks for clarifying | 15:26 |
| ttx | people can't get the status right, so i didn't even try workitems | 15:26 |
| nijaba | #agreed ceilometer team to use bp to track status of features | 15:27 |
| jd__ | like we had choice :) | 15:27 |
| nijaba | ok, I think we ran out of agenda topic | 15:27 |
| nijaba | jd__: lol | 15:27 |
| anniec | :) open discussion time? | 15:28 |
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| nijaba | #topic Open discussion | 15:28 |
| timjr | sorry for jumping in on you guys... I claim early morning brain | 15:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 15:28 | |
| jd__ | timjr: ;) | 15:28 |
| sandywalsh_ | question: should I expect some feedback on my Unified Instrumentation and Metering proposal? http://wiki.openstack.org/UnifiedInstrumentationMetering | 15:28 |
| timjr | sandywalsh_: I definitely thought the pictures were cool | 15:28 |
| sandywalsh_ | :/ | 15:28 |
| jd__ | lol | 15:28 |
| jd__ | better than nothing I guess | 15:29 |
| eglynn | sandywalsh_ I was using the "diagnostics" term loosely earlier | 15:29 |
| eglynn | (just to mean the kind of info that ceilo currently grabs from polling libvirt) | 15:29 |
| shengjie | hey guys, first time attending the meeting here, I want to get some feedback on my blueprint : https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ceilometer/+spec/hbase-storage-backend | 15:29 |
| timjr | so, I think we can meet most of yahoo's metrics needs with a 20-30 line patch to nova and smaller patches to the other components | 15:29 |
| timjr | I have a prototype working | 15:29 |
| timjr | so I think our stance is changing to one of, you guys can have our patch if you want it, but it's not gonna be that hard to maintain it in house either | 15:30 |
| nijaba | shengjie: I think it should depend on the multi-publisher blueprint | 15:30 |
| eglynn | timjr: wanna submit those 20.-30 lines as a draft patch? | 15:30 |
| anniec | asalkeld was asking us on progress on metering | 15:30 |
| anniec | so repost tim's link earlier here: https://github.com/timjr/tomograph | 15:30 |
| timjr | that tomograph library, https://git.corp.yahoo.com/timjr/tomograph, is a custom-made lib that makes the patch small | 15:30 |
| timjr | eglynn: definitely | 15:30 |
| anniec | sorry .. on monitoring i mean | 15:30 |
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| timjr | I wasn't sure... can people see the draft reviews? | 15:30 |
| anniec | asalkeld was asking us on progress on monitoring | 15:30 |
| timjr | a friend was saying I might be better off publishing a regular review but -1'ing it | 15:31 |
| shengjie | nijaba: how come? | 15:31 |
| eglynn | timjr: that would work too, and reach a wider audience | 15:31 |
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| anniec | if you guys can take look at the link of tomograph i just post, tim has a real nice screenshot on the trace graph and monitoring graph, it's kinda cool with small amount of patch to achieve our needs | 15:31 |
| nijaba | shengjie: I assume you want to use Hbase in parallel to the current storage, am I wrong? | 15:32 |
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| * eglynn looking | 15:32 | |
| sandywalsh_ | so, not sure what the answer here is ... we're going to maintain multiple notification consumers? | 15:32 |
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| dhellmann | shengjie: a Hbase backend sounds like a nice addition | 15:32 |
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| nijaba | dhellmann: as a replaqcement storage engine, or as parallel storage? | 15:32 |
| dhellmann | nijaba: as an option | 15:33 |
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| eglynn | instead of mongodb, not as well as, presumably ... | 15:33 |
| shengjie | dhellmann: I guess given the nature of hbase, it might go parallel, i dunno yet. | 15:34 |
| dhellmann | the idea with the storage plugin api was to let deployers choose a backend | 15:34 |
| nijaba | dhellmann: as an option at the same leve as sqlalchemy or mongo? ok | 15:34 |
| nijaba | then no need to depend and shengjie should go ahead with his impelmentation then? | 15:34 |
| shengjie | becoz store users/projects in hbase seems like an overkill, storing meter data is definitely a good use case | 15:34 |
| shengjie | yes, | 15:34 |
| sandywalsh_ | hello? was my previous topic skipped? | 15:35 |
| shengjie | i can go ahead and start the implementation | 15:35 |
| jd__ | nijaba: yeah hbase as a storage engine, nothing more :) | 15:35 |
| dhellmann | shengjie: a driver that talked to hbase could also talk to another backend for storing the user and project data | 15:35 |
| timjr | the approach taking by twitter folks, and presumably facebook too, is to have everything send stuff to scribe and then let scribe deal with forwarding it to things like hbase... it's worth considering | 15:35 |
| nijaba | so. should I make it as direction "aproved"? | 15:35 |
| jd__ | shengjie: did yousee my reply on the list? | 15:35 |
| anniec | sandywalsh_ seems like no one is looking at timjr and mine link either :P | 15:35 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh_: we had a lot of cross-talk, let us catch up | 15:35 |
| shengjie | dhellmann: yes, that's more like it | 15:35 |
| sandywalsh_ | anniec: seems to be a lot of that | 15:36 |
| eglynn | sandywalsh_ "we're going to maintain multiple notification consumers?" << not sure about the context on this | 15:36 |
| jd__ | nijaba: ah yes, I only changed "definition" to approved | 15:36 |
| dhellmann | anniec & timjr : I'll look at the code, but can't read and follow the meeting at the same time | 15:36 |
| sandywalsh_ | eglynn: my proposal | 15:36 |
| nijaba | jd__, shengjie: approved! | 15:36 |
| jd__ | great :) | 15:36 |
| nijaba | so, I propose we focus on sandywalsh_'s proposal now | 15:36 |
| eglynn | sandywalsh_ sorry yeah, I see the topic now | 15:36 |
| sandywalsh_ | anniec: I'd love to see the patch tim has put together though | 15:37 |
| shengjie | thanks, guys, i think we are done with Hbase backend now | 15:37 |
| timjr | yeah, I gotta clean it up a little first, but will post soon enough | 15:37 |
| timjr | I think people will really like the zipkin style tracing | 15:37 |
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| timjr | I had no idea that keystone's db backend was so screwy, for example | 15:37 |
| anniec | i like it. you got 1 | 15:37 |
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| sandywalsh_ | timjr: I've been talking with lucy about how the two might work ... need to learn more about it | 15:37 |
| timjr | lucy? | 15:38 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: from cloudkick | 15:38 |
| * sandywalsh_ searches for irc handle | 15:38 | |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: my first blush concern was using REST for logging messages ... Loggly was unable to handle that volume | 15:39 |
| timjr | if you have debug logging on, it is indeed quite some volume | 15:39 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: Lucy Mendel ... she was dealing with someone from Yahoo, thought it was you | 15:40 |
| timjr | I thought an elegant way to hook things like metrics, or ceilometer, up to nova was to just add a logging handler to the existing logging, and then maybe some more log messages | 15:40 |
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| timjr | that way people that don't use it won't have to care in the least | 15:40 |
| yjiang5 | sandywalsh_: if we have debugging logging, I'd suggest to seperate with other communication channel. | 15:40 |
| timjr | but it is kind of a hack | 15:40 |
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| sandywalsh_ | Consider my proposal in the ML thread this morning about notifiers having different handlers for different event types | 15:41 |
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| sandywalsh_ | that would work and no major changes | 15:41 |
| timjr | notifications, as they presently exist, are a little too high level for our use case | 15:42 |
| timjr | we want to know about rpc latencies and such | 15:42 |
| sandywalsh_ | but, again, we have the problem of instrumentation vs usage/stage ... which is what I need to understand from the ceilo team what the mandate is | 15:42 |
| timjr | but the main thing I'm here for, actually, is to see if people are still interesting in unifying metering with monitoring at all | 15:42 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: I'm currently working on rpc latencies in StackTach ... I have all the data in there now | 15:42 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: likewise | 15:43 |
| timjr | from the nova point of view, I can imagine people want as few hooks as they can get away with | 15:43 |
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| sandywalsh_ | timjr: my first approach was the Inflight Service, but now I know I can do it all with StackTach | 15:43 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: +1 | 15:43 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh_: I thought at the summit we agreed to work our way up from the bottom, so we're starting with sharing code for instrumentation, metering, monitoring, and publishing | 15:44 |
| yjiang5 | sandywalsh_: where can I get your rpc latency data? | 15:44 |
| sandywalsh_ | yjiang5: I'll be putting a branch to stacktach up early next week | 15:44 |
| yjiang5 | sandywalsh_: thanks. | 15:44 |
| sandywalsh_ | dhellmann: yes, which is why I wrote that proposal ... | 15:45 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh_: yes, so what part of the mandate do you need clarified? :-) | 15:45 |
| sandywalsh_ | dhellmann: to highlight the differing needs of instrumentation and monitoring/meterings/usage/etc | 15:45 |
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| dhellmann | we never finished the work on use cases that we started the last day of the summit, maybe we should finish documenting those? | 15:46 |
| sandywalsh_ | the proposal highlights that both requirements need different implementations and we shouldn't try to do both with one solution | 15:46 |
| sandywalsh_ | this is an echo of the current thread on the ML | 15:46 |
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| timjr | I definitely think it would be cool to unify the metering and the monitoring/metrics stuff, but I don't think I know the metering use case well enough to do it myself | 15:47 |
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| timjr | I will leave it to you guys to tell me why my interface won't work :) | 15:47 |
| sandywalsh_ | :) that's fair | 15:47 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: if you want to chat offline after this meeting about my rpc latency idea, I'm free | 15:47 |
| timjr | sure | 15:48 |
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| timjr | sandywalsh_: there's actually a dude working on zipkin tracing at rackspace | 15:48 |
| timjr | IRC nick dreid | 15:48 |
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| sandywalsh_ | timjr: must be with lucy's group | 15:48 |
| anniec | will be nice to find out who lucy's talking to at Yahoo | 15:48 |
| sandywalsh_ | so, ceilo group ... look forward to some feedback on unifying the two requirements :) | 15:49 |
| sandywalsh_ | anniec: I'll check my email after | 15:49 |
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| nijaba | ok. looks like we have some actions and running out of exchanges? | 15:50 |
| timjr | yep, out of exchanges :) thanks for letting me crash the meeting | 15:50 |
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| anniec | will be nice for this team to review sandywalsh_ and timjr 's proposal as action | 15:50 |
| eglynn | sandywalsh_ I'll try to respond to your mail on the list shortly | 15:51 |
| anniec | and give us some feedback | 15:51 |
| nijaba | timjr: open discussion is just meant for it! feel free to add topics to the meeting agenda too next time | 15:51 |
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| timjr | nijaba: thanks | 15:51 |
| sandywalsh_ | anniec: Lucy is in dreid's group and dreid was working with timjr :) haha | 15:51 |
| sandywalsh_ | eglynn: thanks | 15:51 |
| anniec | got it .. thanks! | 15:51 |
| timjr | by working with I guess he means we were on the zipkin IRC channel at the same time :) | 15:51 |
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| dhellmann | yes, please, give us some heads up when there's something to be reviewed before a meeting by putting it on the agenda! | 15:51 |
| sandywalsh_ | timjr: quite likely | 15:52 |
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| timjr | dhellmann: I posted it in a rush last night :) | 15:52 |
| dhellmann | timjr: np, then, just something to keep in mind :-) | 15:52 |
| timjr | dhellmann: please feel free to critique the code or whatever, I'd love to hear your opinion | 15:52 |
| timjr | I am still a bit of a python newb | 15:53 |
| nijaba | anything else (starting the 30 sec coundown)? | 15:53 |
| nijaba | countdown too... | 15:53 |
| nijaba | ok. looks like we are done for today! | 15:53 |
| nijaba | thanks everyone! | 15:53 |
| nijaba | #endmeeting | 15:54 |
| dhellmann | thanks! | 15:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 15:54 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Nov 15 15:54:01 2012 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:54 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2012/ceilometer.2012-11-15-15.00.html | 15:54 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2012/ceilometer.2012-11-15-15.00.txt | 15:54 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2012/ceilometer.2012-11-15-15.00.log.html | 15:54 |
| eglynn | thanks all | 15:54 |
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| dwalleck | qa folks assemble? | 17:00 |
| sdague | <= here | 17:00 |
| jaypipes | here | 17:00 |
| * dwalleck gets to be Iron Man | 17:00 | |
| dwalleck | Sorry, drunk on no sleep here :) | 17:01 |
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| davidkranz | here | 17:01 |
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| davidkranz | Shall we begin? | 17:02 |
| ravkumar_hp | hi | 17:02 |
| dwalleck | sure | 17:02 |
| sdague | davidkranz: go for it | 17:02 |
| davidkranz | #beginmeeting | 17:03 |
| jaypipes | #startmeeting qa | 17:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Nov 15 17:03:08 2012 UTC. The chair is jaypipes. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:03 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'qa' | 17:03 |
| davidkranz | #startmeeting qa | 17:03 |
| openstack | davidkranz: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress. | 17:03 |
| jaypipes | hehe | 17:03 |
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| sdague | :) | 17:03 |
| davidkranz | Should we go with the agenda I posted, or is there anything else to add? | 17:03 |
| jaypipes | davidkranz: nothing from me. | 17:04 |
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| sdague | davidkranz: I think the agenda looks good | 17:04 |
| dwalleck | the posted agenda looks good | 17:04 |
| sdague | the rest we can do in open discussion if things come up | 17:04 |
| davidkranz | Let's start with the small ones. | 17:04 |
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| davidkranz | I got zero response to the message about getting dev help to review significant new api tests. | 17:05 |
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| jaypipes | :( | 17:05 |
| sdague | davidkranz: are these existing reviews? | 17:05 |
| davidkranz | The one in the agenda has been sitting in the queue. | 17:05 |
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| davidkranz | Is any one in our group swifty enough to review it? | 17:06 |
| sdague | oh, the swift reviews | 17:06 |
| davidkranz | THe last patch grew it significantly. | 17:06 |
| ravkumar_hp | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15554/ ? | 17:06 |
| sdague | I honestly don't know anything about swift | 17:06 |
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| sdague | #topic swift tempest tests need review | 17:06 |
| ravkumar_hp | davidkrnz: we will test it out and review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15554/ | 17:07 |
| davidkranz | ravkumar_hp: Thanks! That is great. | 17:07 |
| ravkumar_hp | we need to have theste tests in as those are critical for gating | 17:07 |
| davidkranz | #topic Full tempest gate | 17:07 |
| sdague | so the way we've been handling this is devstack is that we ask devs from the team to provide reviews | 17:07 |
| dwalleck | I'm swiftly enough also, can take a look. I saw some comments from jaypipes, hadn't seen if those had already been addressed | 17:07 |
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| sdague | and if they +1 it enough then we take the word at it | 17:08 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: we've already asked notmyname and he gave a review on it, but no followup review IIRC. | 17:08 |
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| sdague | ok, I'll take a look at the review as well. | 17:09 |
| davidkranz | So that will move forward now. We can ask a specific question if we have it. | 17:09 |
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| davidkranz | Where do we stand on getting an "acceptance test" for swift up? | 17:10 |
| davidkranz | notmyname was very interested in that. | 17:10 |
| ravkumar_hp | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15554/ once checked in can be acceptance tests . right? | 17:11 |
| davidkranz | ravkumar_hp: Yes, part of one. | 17:11 |
| davidkranz | He was referring to a complete test that would be run to say that swift upstream was ready to be released. | 17:11 |
| davidkranz | That would not be a gate test. | 17:12 |
| sdague | davidkranz: honestly, I think that's probably something that needs to go back on the swift team | 17:12 |
| davidkranz | Until recently it was basically RAX qa that performed that function. | 17:13 |
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| davidkranz | sdague: Yes, you are right. | 17:13 |
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| davidkranz | About the full tempest gate. | 17:13 |
| ravkumar_hp | davidkranz: from hp , we will add some tests once the current one review is finished | 17:13 |
| sdague | so, tempest full gate.... | 17:14 |
| davidkranz | ravkumar_hp: Cool. | 17:14 |
| davidkranz | I added an hourly run with email to me. | 17:14 |
| jose-rax | we still run those tests, as well as new ones for features as they come down the pipe. cors headers for instance. | 17:14 |
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| jaypipes | jose-rax: which tests do you run? | 17:14 |
| davidkranz | jose-rax: I know. We wanted tests out in the open that are acceptance tests. | 17:15 |
| jaypipes | ++ | 17:15 |
| sdague | also +1 | 17:15 |
| jose-rax | pretty much everything | 17:16 |
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| jaypipes | jose-rax: I'm still not clear... everything that is in tempest, or something else? | 17:16 |
| davidkranz | jose-rax: Gigi said at the summit that you guys were going to put the tests up so we could cooperate on maintaining/improving them. | 17:16 |
| jaypipes | Rick_RS: heyo | 17:16 |
| sdague | so full tempest gate... :) has there been any progress there? a couple of folks on my team are going to get some cycles in the next couple weeks, so I was going to point them in that direction. | 17:17 |
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| sdague | but I don't want to be duping anyone else's work | 17:17 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: davidkranz mentioned above that there is now an hourly full run that emails him on failures | 17:17 |
| Rick_RS | jaypipes: hello | 17:17 |
| davidkranz | sdague: All we need are no flakies and acceptable run time. | 17:17 |
| davidkranz | There are no more volume failures as of yesterday. | 17:17 |
| dwalleck | sdague: depends on what you mean by full tempest gate. I'm opening blueprints for everything myself and my guys are working on | 17:17 |
| sdague | dwalleck: cool | 17:18 |
| jaypipes | davidkranz: good. those were the ones that were consistently hitting me locally. | 17:18 |
| sdague | davidkranz: great. | 17:18 |
| sdague | davidkranz: what's the run time clocking in at now? | 17:18 |
| davidkranz | jaypipes: There is still a server build flaky tha sdague is looking at. | 17:18 |
| dwalleck | which is admin tests, benchmarking/combining tests, and adding a benchmarking suite | 17:18 |
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| sdague | dwalleck: ok, cool. If you carve those off in interesting ways we can probably get some more hands on it. | 17:19 |
| davidkranz | sdague: About 25 minutes for full tempest without smoke. | 17:19 |
| sdague | davidkranz: oh, that's not too bad | 17:19 |
| davidkranz | smoke is another 6 minutes | 17:20 |
| dwalleck | It's actually mostly done, just waiting for approvals (for admin tests at least). These are things we already have, just trying to get them submitted | 17:20 |
| davidkranz | If we could parallelize we would run much faster with room to spare for more tests | 17:20 |
| jaypipes | dwalleck: did you follow my response about the policy.json determining the "adminness" of API calls? :) | 17:20 |
| davidkranz | dwalleck: Great! | 17:20 |
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| davidkranz | Let's finish Daryl's thread before moving on. | 17:20 |
| jaypipes | k | 17:21 |
| sdague | davidkranz: so I was kicking around an idea with mtreinish earlier about injecting log messages into nova when tests start / stop. One of the problems in looking through those logs with stack traces is having no idea what triggered them | 17:21 |
| dwalleck | jaypipes: I do, and for now we can go with your suggestion. I'd like to revist it later to make things more flexible, but it'll work for now | 17:21 |
| jaypipes | kk | 17:21 |
| sdague | dwalleck: cool, so best guess on when we'd see these things in the review queue? | 17:21 |
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| davidkranz | sdague: Yeah. More instrumentation will likely be needed. | 17:22 |
| sam-rax | davidkranz: we rely on the tempest swift tests for gating into our pipeline, however we have an exhaustive body of tests that are directed specifically at a deployed version of swift, not a devstack instance. | 17:22 |
| dwalleck | next week is thanksgiving so that makes things a bit weird, but certainly by the meeting the week afterwards | 17:22 |
| sdague | dwalleck: cool, sounds great | 17:22 |
| davidkranz | sam-rax: We discussed this at the configuration testing session. | 17:22 |
| Rick_RS | davidkranz: in regards to Gigi's commitment to putting the tests out in the community, we are working on it. We are in the process of doing some cleanup before we put them out there. | 17:23 |
| davidkranz | sam-rax: We just need a way to report the results of those tests back | 17:23 |
| davidkranz | Rick_RS: Great. We just wanted to get an idea of where things were because notmyname was asking about it. | 17:24 |
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| davidkranz | #topic parallel tempest | 17:24 |
| davidkranz | Is any one working on this yet? | 17:24 |
| dwalleck | I haven't had much luck with testtools at the moment | 17:25 |
| davidkranz | :( | 17:25 |
| dwalleck | Tinkering with just simply using eventlet, have a bit more success there | 17:25 |
| sdague | dwalleck: what were the testtools issues? | 17:26 |
| davidkranz | dwalleck: At this point we just need something that works. | 17:26 |
| dwalleck | But I thought others were working on a demo of what testtools would look like? | 17:26 |
| ravkumar_hp | dwalleck: that is nosetests using evenlet? | 17:26 |
| dwalleck | No, just using raw unittest with eventlet | 17:26 |
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| sdague | dwalleck: ok, so that's something I can have a couple folks look at soon. | 17:28 |
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| ravkumar_hp | dwalleck: does existing temptest tests need lot ot rework to use with eventlet? | 17:28 |
| dwalleck | ravkumar_hp: Not really. Regardless of what we do, we're going to have to remove our dependencies on Nose at some point | 17:29 |
| dwalleck | which is mostly skip decorators, tags, etc | 17:29 |
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| sdague | so mordred has been looking at converting nova over to non nose, I wonder what insights he has there. | 17:30 |
| notmyname | (sorry, just got back online) sam-rax: jose-rax: what would it take to get to get your swift-specific tests more open so that others can run them? | 17:31 |
| jaypipes | what testtools, testr (testrepository) gives us is more than parallel testing. It gives us ways to record previous test runs and timings as well as do regression testing locally... | 17:31 |
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| dwalleck | jaypipes: What type of timing does it provide? Per test timings? per request? | 17:32 |
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| jaypipes | per test | 17:33 |
| sdague | jaypipes: ok, so probably makes sense to do a port to testtools / testr regardless to see how that goes, even if there might be other approaches | 17:33 |
| jose-rax | notmyname: The idea is that they'll be part of what we put out there after we finish cleaning this stuff up. | 17:33 |
| sam-rax | notmyname: We are in the process of making things cleaner, removing some rax specific things (like billing, etc...) and ready to provide to the community | 17:33 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: yes, I gave a shot at it about 2 weeks ago but ran into issues and never got the time to email lifeless about them. | 17:33 |
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| notmyname | jose-rax: sam-rax: cool. I'd love to see them. been waiting for a while ;-) | 17:34 |
| sdague | jaypipes: well if you have work in progress, let me know. | 17:34 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: will do. | 17:34 |
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| davidkranz | Anything else on the previous topics? | 17:35 |
| mordred | sdague: hey | 17:35 |
| davidkranz | When th hourly run goes two days without failure we can decide whether to put in the full gate at 25 minutes. | 17:36 |
| mordred | sdague: yes - testtools/testr/fixtures/subunit toolchain is pretty often | 17:36 |
| notmyname | jose-rax: sam-rax: (we can take this to another channel if you want) what can I do to help facilitate getting the tests out? | 17:36 |
| sdague | often? | 17:36 |
| davidkranz | There are also easily 5 minutes of slow tests that could be turned off for most projects. | 17:36 |
| mordred | dwalleck: let me know if I can be helpful | 17:36 |
| Rick_RS | notmyname: we are executing on a plan to expedite this. we can talk some more off-line if you like. | 17:38 |
| dwalleck | davidkranz: "turn off" is a bit of a worrysome term. If it came to that, I think creating a secondary, non-gating job might be helpful | 17:38 |
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| notmyname | Rick_RS: awesome. me@not.com or in IRC. whatever is more convenient for you | 17:38 |
| davidkranz | dwalleck: There is already the hourly, and nightly job. | 17:38 |
| davidkranz | I just meant that some of the expensive server action scenarios could just be run on nova, for example. | 17:39 |
| davidkranz | And the periodic runs of course. | 17:39 |
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| davidkranz | The last topic was the status of the blueprints. | 17:40 |
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| Rick_RS | notmyname: we can do a f2f if you want. I sit in the compute area. | 17:40 |
| notmyname | Rick_RS: I sit in San Francisco ;-) | 17:41 |
| jaypipes | LOL | 17:41 |
| jaypipes | lmao | 17:41 |
| * jaypipes buys Rick_RS a plane ticket out to SFO ;) | 17:42 | |
| sam-rax | notmyname: I have some open QE SDT reqs on my team if you want. :-D | 17:42 |
| Rick_RS | notmyname; duh... I'll send you some information later. | 17:42 |
| jaypipes | :) | 17:42 |
| sam-rax | notmyname: But seriously, what Rick_RS said, we can chat later offline if you want, but we honestly are working on it, just need to extricate some things and clean it up properly before sharing..... | 17:42 |
| notmyname | ok, cool. I'm really happy to hear that. please let me know how I can help. It's a huge need for others in the swift community | 17:43 |
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| davidkranz | sdague: I think the blueprints cover what we discussed at the summit. | 17:43 |
| sdague | davidkranz: you want to take a pass at prioritizing them, and putting targets on them? | 17:44 |
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| davidkranz | We should take up with the ci group the issue of coordinating status of real-cluster testing out side of jenkins. | 17:45 |
| davidkranz | sdague: OK, I will do that. Do you mean targets like Grizzly-1, etc? | 17:45 |
| sdague | davidkranz: agreed, but that's just one of them, and I honestly think that it's lower priority than a lot of the others | 17:45 |
| sdague | davidkranz: yeh, it might be nice to give ourselves goals that line up with the milestones | 17:46 |
| sdague | davidkranz: what group can modify those fields? | 17:46 |
| davidkranz | sdague: OK, but it doesn't make sense to give a target unless there is also an assignee :) | 17:46 |
| sdague | davidkranz: agreed | 17:46 |
| sam-rax | +1 that. :-) | 17:46 |
| davidkranz | sdague: I presume tempest administrators? | 17:46 |
| sdague | priority can be set without an assignee though | 17:46 |
| jaypipes | davidkranz: tempest-drivers | 17:47 |
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| davidkranz | sdague: Sure. | 17:47 |
| sdague | and maybe incent folks to take a look at some of them :) | 17:47 |
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| jaypipes | davidkranz: you are an admin so feel free to give others admin access if you want | 17:47 |
| jaypipes | sdague: none of us are innocent. | 17:47 |
| * jaypipes snickers | 17:47 | |
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| sdague | jaypipes: :P | 17:47 |
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| davidkranz | sdague: I'll add you. | 17:48 |
| sdague | davidkranz: cool | 17:48 |
| * jaypipes would like to help more if he wasn't waist-deep in writing Chef Spec tests :( | 17:48 | |
| davidkranz | Anything else? | 17:49 |
| jaypipes | not from me | 17:50 |
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| davidkranz | Counting 30 seconds. | 17:50 |
| sdague | I'm good | 17:50 |
| longshot | 40 seconds turkish | 17:51 |
| jose-rax | 50 seconds turkish | 17:51 |
| davidkranz | jaypipes: I guess you can end the meeting. | 17:51 |
| jaypipes | #endmeeting | 17:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 17:51 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Nov 15 17:51:52 2012 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:51 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2012/qa.2012-11-15-17.03.html | 17:51 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2012/qa.2012-11-15-17.03.txt | 17:51 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2012/qa.2012-11-15-17.03.log.html | 17:51 |
| sdague | davidkranz: it's actually sdague-b not sdague, that's my other id | 17:52 |
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| sdague | if you can drop sdague and add sdague-b that would be great | 17:52 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: lol, yeah, your "other" id... | 17:52 |
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| sdague | jaypipes: yeh, it was supposed to make things simpler :) | 17:52 |
| jaypipes | :) | 17:53 |
| davidkranz | sdague: You can do it yourself now :) | 17:53 |
| sdague | davidkranz: oh, true | 17:53 |
| jaypipes | best laid plans and all that.. ;) | 17:53 |
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| sdague | davidkranz: actually, not an admin, so unless you make me one I can't :) | 17:56 |
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| mordred | admin of? | 20:21 |
| * mordred might be an admin ... | 20:21 | |
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| * dansmith watches a tumbleweed roll by | 21:02 | |
| * sdague yells boo! | 21:02 | |
| russellb | ohai | 21:03 |
| russellb | vishy: ping | 21:04 |
| vishy | hi | 21:04 |
| vishy | russellb: want to lead this one? | 21:04 |
| russellb | sure | 21:04 |
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| russellb | #startmeeting nova | 21:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Nov 15 21:04:42 2012 UTC. The chair is russellb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:04 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova' | 21:04 |
| russellb | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/Nova | 21:04 |
| russellb | There's the agenda ... who's here? | 21:05 |
| alexpilotti | hi huys | 21:05 |
| dansmith | <-- here in body, at least | 21:05 |
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| * jog0 says hi | 21:05 | |
| mikal | Ahoy! | 21:05 |
| russellb | comstud: here? cells on deck first | 21:05 |
| sdague | <-- here | 21:05 |
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| * devananda waves | 21:06 | |
| russellb | k, we'll skip cells and wait for comstud | 21:06 |
| russellb | #topic state of the baremetal driver | 21:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "state of the baremetal driver" | 21:06 | |
| russellb | devananda: hey, want to give an update on this one? | 21:06 |
| comstud | sorry | 21:06 |
| comstud | lunchies | 21:06 |
| devananda | russellb: sure | 21:06 |
| russellb | comstud: no problem, we'll do cells next | 21:06 |
| devananda | two more patches landed last night, total of 3 now | 21:06 |
| devananda | there are two more large-ish ones, and a few tiny ones, left | 21:07 |
| devananda | big one is replacing the baremetal driver code | 21:07 |
| devananda | after that is adding the pxe functionality to it | 21:07 |
| russellb | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+topic:bp/general-bare-metal-provisioning-framework,n,z | 21:07 |
| devananda | meanwhile i've also been working on devstack integration | 21:07 |
| devananda | and formulating a plan with the CI team for how to get it all going | 21:07 |
| devananda | to be shared shortly with the dev list (waiting on approval from the NTT guys) | 21:08 |
| russellb | has there been much feedback on the next big one? | 21:08 |
| devananda | little to none | 21:08 |
| devananda | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/11354/ | 21:08 |
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| vishy | the big one is a little tough because there aren't any real users of the old baremetal code | 21:09 |
| russellb | #help need reviews on the next big baremetal driver patch | 21:09 |
| vishy | so it is hard to say if it is breaking anything | 21:09 |
| russellb | vishy: so shouldn't have qualms about removing it if nobody uses it ... | 21:09 |
| russellb | could do a post on openstack@ just in case | 21:09 |
| vishy | but perhaps breakage doesn't matter for that reason | 21:09 |
| russellb | at least we'd have something to point to and say "well, we tried to see if it mattered ..." | 21:09 |
| russellb | we can also clearly define it in release notes | 21:09 |
| devananda | vishy: i can at least say that the _new_ code works :) | 21:09 |
| vishy | yes i propose a quick message to openstack-operators | 21:09 |
| vishy | and/or openstack | 21:09 |
| russellb | great, who's going to send the message? | 21:10 |
| vishy | and reviews can stick to style / code-smell | 21:10 |
| rmk | I dont even think the old baremetal code works | 21:10 |
| vishy | devananda? | 21:10 |
| vishy | my guess is that it doesn't | 21:10 |
| rmk | it cant work, we pass args from compute it into it that it cant accept | 21:10 |
| devananda | vishy: i haven't heard anyone say anything about the ol code working | 21:10 |
| russellb | devananda: you good for putting out a post just making sure nobody freaks out that we rip out the old stuff? | 21:10 |
| russellb | well if it's that bad ... i guess no message needed | 21:10 |
| devananda | russellb: sure. destinations are just openstack@ and openstack-operators@ ? | 21:11 |
| russellb | yeah | 21:11 |
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| russellb | a message still wouldn't hurt | 21:11 |
| rmk | I know this because we didn't update it a number of times when we changed driver calls for everything else | 21:11 |
| russellb | want to show the ops that we care about them :-) | 21:11 |
| rmk | message is always good but I'd say its very safe to rip it out | 21:11 |
| dansmith | rmk: I updated it for no-db-virt :) | 21:11 |
| russellb | #action devananda to post to openstack/openstack-operators about removing old baremetal code, just to make sure everyone is good with it | 21:11 |
| russellb | alright, anything else on baremetal? lots of movement since last week. | 21:12 |
| devananda | that was the high level stuff | 21:12 |
| rmk | dansmith: cool -- do you know if all the entry points from compute match the required number of args? Unless someone changed it recently I dont think it does | 21:12 |
| russellb | yeah, anything deeper we should hit on the -dev list | 21:12 |
| dansmith | rmk: no idea, but the tests seem to run | 21:12 |
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| rmk | interesting | 21:12 |
| russellb | devananda: just want to hit status here to make sure it keeps moving | 21:13 |
| devananda | :) | 21:13 |
| russellb | alright, let's talk cells! | 21:13 |
| comstud | ok | 21:13 |
| russellb | #topic cells status | 21:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "cells status" | 21:13 | |
| russellb | comstud: you're up | 21:13 |
| comstud | i spent a number of days breaking out the scheduling filter/weighting into code that was currently somewhat shared with the host scheduler. all of the base stuff landed including the host scheduler changes and new weighting plugin stuff | 21:14 |
| comstud | cells has been rebased against that stuff that landed (master, really)... | 21:14 |
| comstud | i broke out the filtering/weighting scheduler stuff in cells into its own review | 21:14 |
| russellb | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+topic:bp/nova-compute-cells,n,z | 21:14 |
| comstud | all of this lowers the main review down to < 4000 lines now (still large) | 21:14 |
| comstud | anyway... was in rebase hell for a while with all of the FLAGS -> CONF changes... | 21:14 |
| comstud | but I addressed a number of comments in the initial feedback | 21:14 |
| comstud | and those reviews are up | 21:15 |
| comstud | next is... trying to clarify some of the basic routing stuff. | 21:15 |
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| comstud | and seeing if I can make the code make more sense there | 21:15 |
| comstud | w/ better doc strings | 21:15 |
| russellb | yeah, that would help me :) | 21:15 |
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| russellb | code seems sane, but docstrings, and some overview on how the routing works would be useful for folks diving into it | 21:15 |
| comstud | yep | 21:15 |
| russellb | #action russellb to do another pass on reviewing the updated cells patches | 21:16 |
| comstud | I think I've thought of a way to clean it up | 21:16 |
| russellb | we're going to need at least one other person to do a deep dive into nova-cells to get these reviews done | 21:16 |
| comstud | then it becomes more obvious even without docstrings, but we'll see | 21:16 |
| zykes- | how's cells with quantum integration btw? | 21:16 |
| comstud | cells works with a global quantum | 21:16 |
| comstud | and individual nova-network's in each cell | 21:16 |
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| russellb | anyone else want to volunteer to start doing a deep dive in this code to help the review along? | 21:17 |
| comstud | except there's some stickiness if you use different networks in different cells right now | 21:17 |
| zykes- | comstud: quantum v2 ? | 21:17 |
| comstud | that needs addressed | 21:17 |
| comstud | zykes-: ya | 21:17 |
| comstud | we use it | 21:17 |
| comstud | :) | 21:17 |
| zykes- | ok | 21:17 |
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| vishy | comstud: ? nova-network shouldn't be necessary with v2 | 21:17 |
| vishy | it proxied to quantum in v1 | 21:17 |
| russellb | #help need one more nova-core reviewer to volunteer to start reviewing the cells patches | 21:17 |
| vishy | but v2 the api nodes should be calling quantum directly.. | 21:17 |
| comstud | does network_api handle it ? | 21:18 |
| vishy | comstud: yeah | 21:18 |
| zykes- | what's the diff though in cells and aggregates if I can ask ? | 21:18 |
| comstud | it should be fine then | 21:18 |
| comstud | configure network_api in each child cell appropriately | 21:18 |
| vishy | zykes-: cells each have their own db and queue | 21:18 |
| comstud | the only thing that will not work potentially is the API extension | 21:18 |
| vishy | aggregates are groups of hosts in a single installs | 21:18 |
| comstud | if you point API cells and child cells at same quantum, then you're ok | 21:18 |
| russellb | cells contain aggregates | 21:18 |
| comstud | but that's a limitation right now | 21:18 |
| zykes- | vishy: ok, so aggregates are within that | 21:19 |
| russellb | would be good to keep a documented set of limitations somewhere | 21:19 |
| comstud | agree | 21:19 |
| russellb | not sure where ... | 21:19 |
| jog0 | devref? | 21:19 |
| russellb | jog0: but it's a user doc, really | 21:19 |
| russellb | maybe wiki.openstack.org for now while it's still moving a lot | 21:19 |
| russellb | anything else on cells? | 21:20 |
| comstud | in any case.. that's about all i have. probably the largest issues (just understanding how the routing works) will be addressed shortly. | 21:20 |
| jog0 | russellb: works for me, but long term openstack-manuals sounds like the right home | 21:20 |
| russellb | jog0: agreed | 21:21 |
| russellb | #topic bugs | 21:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs" | 21:21 | |
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| russellb | #link http://webnumbr.com/untouched-nova-bugs | 21:21 |
| russellb | only 20 untouched bugs, very nice. | 21:21 |
| russellb | many thanks to those putting time into triage. if we all just get a few issues here and there, we'll stay on top of them | 21:21 |
| sdague | did mikal create his cookie report? | 21:21 |
| mikal | Yep, please hold | 21:21 |
| mikal | http://www.stillhq.com/openstack/nova/triage-20121116.txt | 21:22 |
| mikal | So, we're not as good as last week, but still ok | 21:22 |
| mikal | Mostly that's cause russellb has fallen off the wagon... | 21:22 |
| dansmith | woohoo! | 21:22 |
| sdague | mikal steals all the cookies | 21:22 |
| russellb | mikal gets this week's triage gold star | 21:22 |
| mikal | Heh | 21:22 |
| mikal | Its still not all the nova-core people doing triage | 21:22 |
| mikal | Hint hint | 21:22 |
| comstud | i've got a focus right now, sorry :) | 21:22 |
| comstud | +different | 21:23 |
| mikal | Its ok | 21:23 |
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| mikal | I shall just mock you | 21:23 |
| russellb | #help please help triage nova bugs! Even just a few would be awesome. | 21:23 |
| comstud | ok :) | 21:23 |
| russellb | cool, anything else on bugs? | 21:23 |
| russellb | i actually have one thing on bugs | 21:23 |
| russellb | We have 4 active nova security bugs (private) that need nova-core attention | 21:23 |
| russellb | please look at these bugs (and don't discuss them here): https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1074343 https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1070539 https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1069904 https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1058077 | 21:24 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1074343 in nova "ec2 describe instances does not filter by project_id" [Undecided,Incomplete] | 21:24 |
| russellb | unless the bug is already public, heh | 21:24 |
| sdague | heh | 21:24 |
| russellb | #topic grizzly-1 | 21:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "grizzly-1" | 21:24 | |
| russellb | Alrighty, grizzly-1 is one week out | 21:24 |
| dansmith | uvirtbot: loose lips sink ships! | 21:24 |
| uvirtbot | dansmith: Error: "loose" is not a valid command. | 21:24 |
| dansmith | hrm | 21:25 |
| russellb | #link https://launchpad.net/nova/+milestone/grizzly-1 | 21:25 |
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| russellb | so, let's take a look at status of some of these things | 21:25 |
| alexpilotti | we have a few things on the Hyper-V side that we'd like to have in for G-1 if possible | 21:25 |
| russellb | alexpilotti: ok, is there a blueprint or a bug? | 21:26 |
| alexpilotti | russellb: we have a bp, let me fetch it | 21:26 |
| dansmith | russellb: were you going to target no-db-virt for G-1? | 21:26 |
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| dansmith | I think we can call it done, right? | 21:26 |
| russellb | dansmith: yeah, we can, link? | 21:26 |
| sdague | russellb: the audit's going to be a couple weeks past G-1, I just moved it to G-2 | 21:26 |
| devananda | is there a chance the remaining baremetal patches might land before G1? | 21:26 |
| russellb | sdague: ok great thanks | 21:26 |
| dansmith | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/no-db-virt | 21:26 |
| russellb | devananda: it's possible ... don't want to rush the reviews just to meet grizzly-1 though, since we're still early in grizzly | 21:27 |
| devananda | ack | 21:27 |
| alexpilotti | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/grizzly-hyper-v-nova-compute | 21:27 |
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| russellb | dansmith: done | 21:27 |
| dansmith | thanks | 21:28 |
| alexpilotti | for the moment we have ConfigDriveV2 implemented | 21:28 |
| russellb | alexpilotti: so is everything for this blueprint up for review? | 21:28 |
| vishy | alexpilotti: really should split the features into individual blueprints | 21:28 |
| vishy | instead of 1 blueprint for all features | 21:28 |
| alexpilotti | russellb: the BP is still generic, we have to update it, I know | 21:28 |
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| alexpilotti | vishy: I'm going to do it ASAP, in the next days | 21:29 |
| russellb | yeah, hard to target if it doesn't have a defined endpoint | 21:29 |
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| russellb | alexpilotti: ok, well if you get a blueprint for config drive support, we can target that, that will probably go in for grizzly-1 | 21:29 |
| alexpilotti | anyway on the Nova side we don't have too much, we are targeting mainly Grizzly | 21:29 |
| alexpilotti | for Quantum | 21:29 |
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| alexpilotti | russellb: ok tx | 21:30 |
| russellb | gotcha. | 21:30 |
| alexpilotti | mikal: can I please ask you to re-approve the review? | 21:30 |
| alexpilotti | mikal: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15743/ | 21:30 |
| mikal | Sure | 21:30 |
| russellb | is Mate Lakat here? don't know the status of that xenapi volume driver blueprint | 21:30 |
| alexpilotti | mikal: since you approved I had to rebase and fix 2 lines | 21:30 |
| mikal | Yep, I'll re-review this morning | 21:30 |
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| russellb | xenapi-volume-drivers seems to be stalled | 21:31 |
| russellb | vishy: know anything on that one? | 21:31 |
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| russellb | guess we can just bump early next week if needed | 21:31 |
| vishy | there are a bunch of reviews in | 21:31 |
| vishy | but not done | 21:31 |
| russellb | k | 21:32 |
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| russellb | #topic Open Discussion | 21:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion" | 21:32 | |
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| russellb | #help nova-core: review queue is longer than ideal, please help knock it down | 21:32 |
| vishy | ok i have an idea on that point | 21:32 |
| vishy | might be crazy | 21:32 |
| russellb | i like how this is starting | 21:33 |
| vishy | what if we allowed certain people to have +a access to subdirectories | 21:33 |
| russellb | so, if it only touched say ... nova/virt/libvirt/* ? | 21:33 |
| vishy | right | 21:33 |
| sdague | is that doable in the current ci system? | 21:33 |
| alexpilotti | vishy: +1 :-) | 21:33 |
| vishy | sdague: no i asked | 21:33 |
| vishy | but we could do it through convention | 21:33 |
| vishy | does that seem useful? or just a crazy idea | 21:34 |
| sdague | sure, I suppose. It does bring up a question of creating consistent quality across the project | 21:34 |
| dansmith | seems like we kinda already have that | 21:34 |
| mikal | Are there really that many extra reviewers that would add? | 21:34 |
| vishy | it isn't for extra reviewers | 21:34 |
| russellb | seems potentially useful ... but if you trust someone enough to approve nova/virt/libvirt/, we should be able to trust them to approve anything that is within their comfort zone | 21:34 |
| dansmith | in that, if they hyperv guys propose something, everyone mostly trusts them that it's the right thing, as long as it doesn't break anything, right? | 21:34 |
| russellb | dansmith: yeah, that's what I do on those patches :-) | 21:35 |
| vishy | it is so alexpiloti can approve stuff in virt/hyperv/ without having to go track down two core members to +2 a | 21:35 |
| alexpilotti | russellb: I keep adding beers for you ;-) | 21:35 |
| russellb | but his +1 is effectively that to me already | 21:35 |
| dansmith | right | 21:35 |
| vishy | sure but we need a core member to take the time and go push the button | 21:35 |
| russellb | if I see that a domain expert has already reviewed it, i spend much less time on it | 21:35 |
| russellb | true | 21:35 |
| russellb | but it doesn't take that long :) | 21:36 |
| vishy | maybe we just need to get better about pushing the button | 21:36 |
| dansmith | I dunno, I think that's opening the doors a bit, | 21:36 |
| vishy | :) | 21:36 |
| russellb | and it's good to have at least a 1 minute sanity check | 21:36 |
| vishy | fair enough, just wanted to throw the idea out | 21:36 |
| sdague | vishy: we do, but at the end of the day it's going to be a core member that might have to do an emergency fix. So it seems like they should have looked at it at some point :) | 21:36 |
| dansmith | even if it's just to small stylistic things and conventions we avoid elsewhere but aren't in hacking.py | 21:36 |
| vishy | i have a general topic to bring up as well | 21:36 |
| dansmith | sdague: ++ :) | 21:36 |
| vishy | cross tenant apis | 21:37 |
| vishy | currently we have things like all_tenants=True for admins | 21:37 |
| vishy | so some things an admin can do across tenants | 21:37 |
| vishy | is this correct / useful? | 21:37 |
| vishy | this sort of plays into the tenant_ids in urls for future versions of the api | 21:38 |
| vishy | and whether that is good or bad | 21:38 |
| russellb | i thought there was no concept of a tenant specific admin | 21:38 |
| russellb | and that an admin in keystone was admin of the world | 21:38 |
| * russellb must just not understand the question | 21:39 | |
| vishy | yeah i'm discussing how we fix that | 21:39 |
| mikal | Well, we still want super-admins right? | 21:40 |
| mikal | I see that as useful functionality | 21:40 |
| russellb | oh, ok. | 21:40 |
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| vishy | mikal: useful yes | 21:40 |
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| jog0 | presumably we want both tenant admin and operators(super-admin) | 21:40 |
| mikal | jog0: that would be good | 21:40 |
| vishy | but the question is should operators be using the normal urls | 21:40 |
| vishy | can an operator access http://api/<other-tenant-id>/servers | 21:41 |
| vishy | or just: | 21:41 |
| jog0 | wouldn't using the normal urls make it harder to do cross tenant operations? | 21:41 |
| vishy | http://api/<my-tenant-id>/servers?all_tenants=True | 21:41 |
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| vishy | jog0: yes | 21:42 |
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| vishy | anyway something to chew on | 21:43 |
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| jog0 | according to the keystone readme, a role is "a first-class piece of metadata associated with many user-tenant pairs" | 21:43 |
| jog0 | I am not sure where admin fits in to that | 21:43 |
| russellb | might be a good candidate for an openstack-dev thread to get more attention | 21:44 |
| jog0 | russellb: +1 | 21:44 |
| sdague | sounds like a good plan | 21:44 |
| sdague | on the subject of openstack-dev.... | 21:44 |
| sdague | new other topic - http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2012-November/002889.html - was hoping to get some other eyes on this thread | 21:45 |
| sdague | it's i18n again | 21:45 |
| russellb | i18n in the API itself seems evil | 21:45 |
| russellb | but i'm an ignorant american | 21:45 |
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| sdague | yeh... the problem is when you're an operator in .cn, assuming english, isn't often an option | 21:46 |
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| sdague | anyway, just wanted to have people take a look and discuss out there. Not let it just wither on the vine | 21:47 |
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| * russellb tends to just listen to the people that live elsewhere and this is a big issue for them | 21:47 | |
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| jog0 | while talking about ML threads: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2012-November/002822.html | 21:47 |
| russellb | aw, how'd i miss that | 21:48 |
| russellb | i don't have a strong opinion on it. my gut reaction is to say leave a default quota in place, but i wouldn't fight it if enough people thought it made sense to have no quotas by default | 21:48 |
| russellb | anything else? or we'll #endmeeting | 21:49 |
| eglynn | #topic ceilometer/nova interaction as discussed on the ML #link http://wiki.openstack.org/EfficientMetering/FutureNovaInteractionModel | 21:49 |
| jog0 | russellb: while I would like to change it, I don't have a strong opinion on it either. was hoping to get more feedback | 21:50 |
| russellb | ooh, good one eglynn | 21:50 |
| russellb | #topic ceilometer/nova interaction as discussed on the M | 21:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ceilometer/nova interaction as discussed on the M" | 21:50 | |
| eglynn | we need to get closure/convergence on that thread | 21:50 |
| russellb | #topic ceilometer/nova interaction as discussed on the ML | 21:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ceilometer/nova interaction as discussed on the ML" | 21:50 | |
| russellb | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/EfficientMetering/FutureNovaInteractionModel | 21:50 |
| eglynn | so the question for you nova folks, is either option #4a or #5 a runner? | 21:50 |
| russellb | eglynn: yeah ... i took a step back to see where everyone took it. there were a lot of different opinions flying aorund. | 21:50 |
| eglynn | (both require buy-in from nova) | 21:50 |
| eglynn | yep, lots of noise on the thread | 21:51 |
| vishy | i'm leaning towards #5 | 21:51 |
| russellb | i guess i'd like to look closer at what 4a does, and figure out if it's something that could just be a part of nova-compute | 21:51 |
| vishy | that was the define a common interface that each driver could implement as a library right? | 21:52 |
| russellb | vishy: so we'd distribute 2 copies of the virt layer? | 21:52 |
| eglynn | vishy: cool | 21:52 |
| eglynn | russellb: my concern about 4a is the seperate daemon complicating deployment | 21:52 |
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| russellb | eglynn: that's why i was saying we could look at adding whatever it does to the existing daemon | 21:52 |
| eglynn | russellb: yeah, but the timeliness issue is a worry | 21:53 |
| russellb | i don't think i fully get 5 ... | 21:53 |
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| eglynn | (as in there seem to be just fairly weak guarantees on the period_tasks) | 21:53 |
| russellb | eglynn: correct | 21:53 |
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| vishy | the only realy difference between 4 and 5 is nova-compute-pollster lives in ceilo instead of nova | 21:53 |
| eglynn | russellb: any hazy around 5 may be my fault | 21:54 |
| russellb | the frequency they run is directly affected by how long they take | 21:54 |
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| russellb | so, what does this library from nova have in it | 21:54 |
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| russellb | in #5 | 21:54 |
| vishy | an implementation of an interface defined by cielo | 21:54 |
| russellb | does it contain the virt drivers? | 21:54 |
| eglynn | a cut-down subset of the hypersior driver API | 21:54 |
| vishy | like get_bw_for_period | 21:54 |
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| vishy | instance_exists() | 21:55 |
| vishy | etc. | 21:55 |
| russellb | ah ok ... | 21:55 |
| russellb | and then nova-compute could consume this same library then? | 21:55 |
| eglynn | yep, all read-only, non destructive | 21:55 |
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| eglynn | sure | 21:55 |
| russellb | for the bits it uses too | 21:55 |
| eglynn | though the versioning might be oriented to external consumers | 21:55 |
| russellb | sure. | 21:55 |
| eglynn | (slowly evolving, stable) | 21:55 |
| russellb | that doesn't seem so evil ... i just don't want to see duplicated virt code | 21:56 |
| eglynn | cool | 21:56 |
| vishy | since that piece needs to exist regardless | 21:56 |
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| eglynn | yep | 21:56 |
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| eglynn | so, provisional good vibes around option #5? | 21:56 |
| vishy | we could define that api first before deciding where the daemon will live | 21:56 |
| alexpilotti | my 2 cents: 5 seems to leave more control to Nova on the interface / mixin that needs to defined | 21:56 |
| russellb | eglynn: yeah, i think so ... | 21:57 |
| alexpilotti | in Hyper-V we have quite cool APIs handled via WMI, so both 4a and 5 are not an issue | 21:57 |
| russellb | pending letting it simmer a bit, and going into more detail on what it would look like, etc | 21:57 |
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| eglynn | cool | 21:57 |
| russellb | eglynn: thanks for bringing that up | 21:58 |
| russellb | anything else? we have a whole 2 minutes | 21:58 |
| eglynn | OK, so we'll look at fleshing out that API definition on the ceilo side to keep the ball rolling | 21:58 |
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| alexpilotti | eglynn: what's the deadline for the ceilo / nova integration? | 21:58 |
| eglynn | alexilotti: probably G-2 | 21:59 |
| eglynn | (we're sitting out G-1) | 21:59 |
| russellb | seems reasonable | 21:59 |
| eglynn | cool | 21:59 |
| alexpilotti | wow, cool. Can't wait to have it done. | 21:59 |
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| russellb | alright, then. thanks everyone | 22:00 |
| russellb | #endmeeting | 22:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 22:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Nov 15 22:00:07 2012 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2012/nova.2012-11-15-21.04.html | 22:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2012/nova.2012-11-15-21.04.txt | 22:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2012/nova.2012-11-15-21.04.log.html | 22:00 |
| eglynn | thanks all! | 22:00 |
| devananda | let's take a minute or two break before starting db meeting :) | 22:00 |
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| russellb | oh real quick | 22:01 |
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| russellb | nova folks ... next week is a holiday in the US on meeting day | 22:01 |
| russellb | still have a meeting or no? | 22:01 |
| dansmith | I'll have food in my mouth and it'll be real rude | 22:01 |
| * russellb wouldn't be there if so, among many others i would guess | 22:01 | |
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| sdague | <= won't be here | 22:02 |
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| russellb | vishy: any preference on meeting next week? | 22:02 |
| vishy | skip next week | 22:02 |
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| russellb | great thanks | 22:02 |
| sdague | it's also release day for g-1, right? | 22:02 |
| russellb | sdague: sure is | 22:04 |
| sdague | be a fun day for everyone else around :) | 22:04 |
| russellb | hehe, hope nothing is broken, SEE YA | 22:04 |
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| devananda | and on that note, let's start the db meeting, lol | 22:05 |
| devananda | #startmeeting db | 22:05 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Nov 15 22:05:59 2012 UTC. The chair is devananda. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:06 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:06 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'db' | 22:06 |
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| devananda | so who all has stuck around? | 22:06 |
| * dragondm waves | 22:06 | |
| jog0 | o/ | 22:06 |
| dkehn | 0/ | 22:06 |
| dkehn | o/ | 22:06 |
| devananda | :) | 22:06 |
| devananda | briefly, the action items from last week look all covered | 22:07 |
| devananda | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15709/ | 22:07 |
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| jog0 | devananda: meeting outline link? | 22:07 |
| devananda | ah, sorry | 22:07 |
| devananda | agenda is here | 22:07 |
| devananda | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/DBTeamMeeting | 22:08 |
| dripton | sorry forgot to wave | 22:08 |
| devananda | i'll get the hang of using the bot eventually :) | 22:08 |
| russellb | hi | 22:08 |
| devananda | so, i posted a list of suspected race conditions (prior link) | 22:09 |
| jog0 | devananda: I take it, it will be hard to make tests to trigger the race conditions | 22:09 |
| devananda | yep :( | 22:09 |
| devananda | i haven't managed to repro them locally as it's a matter of timing two threads issuing SELECT & INSERT at the same time | 22:10 |
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| devananda | but it is easy to simulate by replaying the transactions recorded in slow log by hand | 22:10 |
| devananda | the solution to most of those should be adding UNIQUE constraints | 22:10 |
| devananda | which, it turns out, someone tried to do last night :) | 22:11 |
| devananda | hwoever that needs work before it is done right | 22:12 |
| devananda | jog0: want to talk about sqlalchemy object leaks? | 22:12 |
| jog0 | devananda: sure | 22:12 |
| jog0 | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15450/ | 22:12 |
| jog0 | I have another version of the patch coming shortly | 22:12 |
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| jog0 | I got some good feedback from vishy on this | 22:12 |
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| jog0 | there are many places on the code where an object is used such as instance.id | 22:13 |
| jog0 | instead of instance['id'] | 22:13 |
| jog0 | the first step will be to change all of those | 22:13 |
| jog0 | and then we can either do decorator magic or explicitly include a function to convert away sqlalchemy objects | 22:14 |
| jog0 | this should be doable for G2 | 22:14 |
| devananda | sounds good | 22:14 |
| jog0 | I am not sure if this will have any strange side effects | 22:14 |
| jog0 | where someone assumes they get a sqlalchemy object and tries to modify the DB using it | 22:15 |
| jog0 | but we will find out soon | 22:15 |
| devananda | IMNSHO, that shouldn't be happening outside of db/api. but i wouldn't be too surprised if it is .... | 22:15 |
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| devananda | jog0: putting decorators on db/api, not db/sqlalchemy/api, yes? | 22:16 |
| jog0 | I put the the decrator in db/api but will be moving it to db.sqlachemy | 22:16 |
| devananda | the latter would probably cvause issues because there are many public funtions right now that are called within db/sqlalchemy/api | 22:16 |
| devananda | that is, the same function is called both via db.api and internally via self | 22:16 |
| devananda | with an expectation of slightly different behavior | 22:17 |
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| devananda | i'm working on cleaning that up with the db-session-cleanup bp | 22:17 |
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| devananda | for now, probably best not to decorate any db.sqlalchemy.api methods that have "session=none" in the definition | 22:17 |
| jog0 | devananda: I would like to leave it in db/api but I think that breaks the abstraction itself (no sqlalchemy outside of nova/db/sqlalchemy | 22:18 |
| devananda | if the decorator is sqlalchemy-specific, then i agree | 22:19 |
| devananda | just saying i'm pretty sure it will break stuff if applied to all public methods in db.sqlalchemy.api right now. which will probably help me find what i need to fix, actually :) | 22:19 |
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| jog0 | devananda: I tried applying to db.sqlalchemy.api and tons broke | 22:20 |
| devananda | heh | 22:20 |
| devananda | moving on then | 22:20 |
| devananda | anyone here to talk about db-common? | 22:21 |
| devananda | or no-db-compute? | 22:21 |
| jog0 | russellb was here a minute ago | 22:22 |
| russellb | hi | 22:22 |
| russellb | ummmm! we had a thread in the last week on openstack-dev about the next steps on no-db-compute | 22:22 |
| russellb | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2012-November/002573.html | 22:23 |
| jog0 | long live nova-conductor | 22:23 |
| russellb | general agreement on the direction, the name of the service changed since the original message | 22:23 |
| russellb | there's a patch up that creates the service | 22:23 |
| russellb | once that's in, we'll have a big flurry of patches for a while moving db accesses around :-) | 22:23 |
| devananda | great! | 22:24 |
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| russellb | so, good progress ... i'm feeling very good about having db access out of nova-compute by grizzly-3 | 22:24 |
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| russellb | likely not far off at grizzly-2 time | 22:24 |
| devananda | i'll give that patch a review after this | 22:25 |
| russellb | vishy posted to that thread about concerns with db being blocking | 22:25 |
| devananda | i'm very interested to see how some of the longer-running db tasks will get refactored | 22:25 |
| devananda | right | 22:25 |
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| russellb | and that a service that acts largely as a db writer is going to be held back because of that | 22:25 |
| russellb | so that's something to have on the radar... | 22:25 |
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| devananda | mordred keeps telling me that moving away from the mysql C connector would help with that a lot | 22:25 |
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| devananda | but there are apparently reasons we can't yet | 22:26 |
| russellb | yes, some rackspace guys tried the pure python one | 22:26 |
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| russellb | and the problem was that it was so much slower that overall it wasn't beneficial | 22:26 |
| jog0 | I played with the python one too | 22:26 |
| russellb | but that's heresay from me | 22:26 |
| jog0 | it was slower and faster all at the same time | 22:26 |
| russellb | hearsay rather :-) | 22:26 |
| devananda | hah | 22:26 |
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| devananda | it also broke migrations IIRC | 22:26 |
| jog0 | some things were slower others were faster due to eventlet working better | 22:26 |
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| * mordred would love to poke at the slower bits ... might be possible to fix the performance parts | 22:27 | |
| mordred | I mean, the mysql protocol isn't exactly rocket science | 22:27 |
| devananda | russellb: when you say, db writer service willb e held back, what does that mean? | 22:27 |
| russellb | slower/less efficient than it could be | 22:27 |
| devananda | ah | 22:28 |
| russellb | as long as any db operation is blocking, nothing else is going to be running | 22:28 |
| russellb | just due to the joys of eventlet and calling out to native code that may block | 22:28 |
| devananda | not "it wont be implemented". gotcha. | 22:28 |
| russellb | correct | 22:28 |
| mordred | so - there are some places where the python driver actually breaks currently, right? | 22:29 |
| russellb | can always just run more instances of nova-conductor to make up for it in the meantime, but obviously that's not long term ideal. | 22:29 |
| mordred | it seems like if we can get that part of the driver fixed - then we can treat the performance problems like other tuning things | 22:29 |
| devananda | russellb: what about running more connections from nova-conductor, since it is effectively acting as a connection-pooler | 22:29 |
| devananda | also not a great solution, but ... | 22:29 |
| russellb | comstud: were you going to look at the python mysql thing this week? i thought i remembered that coming up on IRC earlier this week | 22:29 |
| comstud | i was going to look at re-adding db pool | 22:30 |
| russellb | devananda: i don't think that helps, eventlet literally won't switch threads to let another thread do something on another connection | 22:30 |
| comstud | python mysql sux perf wise | 22:30 |
| russellb | so how does the pool help? | 22:30 |
| comstud | it doesn't improve anything, and makes it worse in some cases | 22:30 |
| comstud | it allows DB queries to happen in parallel | 22:30 |
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| comstud | right now all DB access is serialized | 22:31 |
| russellb | k, i'm trying to understand how that works if eventlet just sits around and blocks while a query is executed | 22:31 |
| comstud | if a DB query takes 5 seconds.. | 22:31 |
| comstud | the whole python process is locked up | 22:31 |
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| comstud | with a tpool... other greenthreads can run | 22:31 |
| russellb | ok, so i need to go look at tpool then ... | 22:32 |
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| comstud | it's real threads | 22:32 |
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| russellb | comstud: awesome. | 22:32 |
| russellb | so ok, makes sense then. :) | 22:32 |
| comstud | unfort eventlet still seems a big uggly | 22:32 |
| comstud | buggy | 22:32 |
| comstud | when using it | 22:32 |
| comstud | but we'll see | 22:32 |
| russellb | :-/ | 22:33 |
| comstud | it'll be an option, not a default | 22:33 |
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| russellb | ok. | 22:33 |
| devananda | real threads ++ | 22:33 |
| russellb | devananda: +1 :) | 22:33 |
| devananda | i dont see something like nova-conductor working at scale if it can't multi-thread db connections | 22:33 |
| russellb | agreed | 22:33 |
| jog0 | +1 | 22:33 |
| russellb | so we need to make it happen one way or another | 22:33 |
| russellb | comstud: thanks for jumping in :) | 22:34 |
| jog0 | should there be blueprint to track this? or would this be part of no-db-compute? | 22:34 |
| russellb | should be its own thing IMO | 22:34 |
| russellb | no-db-compute just happens to make it even more important (because of how we're implementing it in the short term) | 22:34 |
| devananda | is that even a nova thing, though? | 22:35 |
| dkehn | note on eventlet/gevent greelets, I thought it was a cooperative multithreading, which means that if a greenlet is stuck in an infinite loop, everything is waiting? | 22:35 |
| russellb | well, it is for now | 22:35 |
| devananda | or more generally a python / eventlet / mysql-connector thing | 22:35 |
| russellb | would be good to prove it out in nova first | 22:35 |
| dripton | dkehn: eventlet is cooperative. eventlet.Tpool lets you have a pool of "real" threads in addition, for calling blocking native code. | 22:35 |
| russellb | then can look at how to make it more gneral | 22:35 |
| dkehn | dragondm, thx | 22:36 |
| dkehn | dripton, thx, sorry dragondm | 22:36 |
| vishy | dkehn: threadpool puts the execution into a real thread | 22:37 |
| russellb | i think that's all on no-db-compute ... :-) | 22:37 |
| * vishy likes repeating stuff that dripton says :) | 22:37 | |
| devananda | russellb: so, separate BP? | 22:37 |
| russellb | for the tpool stuff, yes, IMO | 22:38 |
| devananda | #action russellb to post a BP for db threadpool separate from no-db-compute | 22:38 |
| russellb | who feels like writing it up? :-) | 22:38 |
| * russellb looks at comstud | 22:38 | |
| devananda | hehe | 22:38 |
| russellb | owned | 22:38 |
| russellb | k | 22:38 |
| devananda | fwiw, i'm happy to take a look into it, once baremetal stuff settles down a bit | 22:39 |
| russellb | k, sounds like comstud is the guy to coordinate with | 22:39 |
| * russellb will be busy making the problem worse | 22:39 | |
| devananda | awesome :) | 22:39 |
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| devananda | anyone want to jump in? | 22:40 |
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| devananda | i'm probably forgetting stuff, but that's all that was on the agenda | 22:40 |
| dripton | I did a wiki page with all the read_deletes='yes' hits. http://wiki.openstack.org/ReadDeletedYesOrOnly | 22:40 |
| dripton | Actually removing them scares the heck out of me; it's easy but will probably break stuff. | 22:41 |
| jog0 | wow thats a lot | 22:41 |
| russellb | definitely want to break up the removal into smaller logical pieces if you go forward | 22:41 |
| russellb | to make it easier to review that specific area of usage | 22:42 |
| jog0 | well if we are going down the road of still soft deletes and make the deleted column unique this becomes a non-blocker correct? | 22:42 |
| russellb | not sure what makes the most sense chunk wise ... just a general comment :) | 22:42 |
| devananda | jog0: i belive so | 22:42 |
| dripton | If we keep the soft deletes we should be okay. I just don't know how to get rid of them in a portable fashion. | 22:42 |
| jog0 | dripton: what about periodic task that cleans up db? | 22:43 |
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| devananda | I am leaning towards keeping soft deletes, using UNIQUE(col, deleted), and periodic cleanup task which can be adjusted per-table by the deployer | 22:43 |
| jog0 | devananda: +1 | 22:44 |
| dripton | jog0: I don't know callers' expectations of how long deleted data has to hang around. | 22:44 |
| devananda | caveat being that i dont think anyone's written a db-agnostic cleanup task | 22:44 |
| devananda | some folks at HP have one for mysql | 22:44 |
| devananda | using events and stored routines | 22:44 |
| jog0 | as devananda said it can be adjusted by deployer | 22:44 |
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| jog0 | if this is an optional feature if we support the common ones isn't that good enough, as long as its easily extensible? | 22:45 |
| jog0 | so postgres and mysql | 22:45 |
| dripton | It's the best we can do. | 22:45 |
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| devananda | dkehn: this might be something you are interested in? | 22:46 |
| dripton | Is the HP cleanup task open source? (Not that it should be hard to write from scratch.) | 22:46 |
| dkehn | devananda, being pulled in a lot of directions at present | 22:46 |
| devananda | i'm not sure. Paul Carlton talked about it at grizzly, so I assume it is... | 22:46 |
| devananda | or could be | 22:46 |
| devananda | dkehn: sure, np | 22:46 |
| dkehn | devananda, but, yes | 22:46 |
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| devananda | dripton: but yea, it should be easy to rewrite | 22:47 |
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| dkehn | I haven't seen it but generally this woould be straight forward if we are basing it on a time of life | 22:47 |
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| devananda | dripton: from talking with Paul, I think he's willing to share their implementation | 22:48 |
| devananda | dripton: but it wont apply to trunk right now | 22:48 |
| devananda | anyone want to take that and run with it? | 22:49 |
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| dripton | I'll take a look, if HP can post the code somewhere. | 22:49 |
| jog0 | ^ action item? | 22:50 |
| uvirtbot | jog0: Error: "action" is not a valid command. | 22:50 |
| dripton | The tricky bit will be figuring out how to do db-specific code without making it gross. | 22:50 |
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| devananda | #action devananda to find and post existing db-cleanup code | 22:50 |
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| devananda | dripton: it'll probably have to be sepaerate migrations for mysql and pgsql :( | 22:50 |
| devananda | at least i dont see another way | 22:51 |
| dripton | Some current migrations have if statements in them, but I don't know of a case where we have entirely separate migrations. | 22:51 |
| dripton | sqlalchemy-migrate does support that, though. | 22:51 |
| dripton | You can do migrations that are sql scripts rather than Python scripts, and then they get put in subdirectories by DB. | 22:52 |
| devananda | that might work | 22:52 |
| devananda | in any case, i'll try to get you the existing implemenation as a starting point at least | 22:52 |
| dripton | Speaking of migrate, I'm planning to send mail to openstack-dev about alembic and backportable migrations next week. Waiting for dprince to finish his migration squashing (he said he's working on it this week) so I don't have to massively rebase. | 22:53 |
| devananda | great | 22:54 |
| devananda | i should probably take a closer look at alembic ... | 22:54 |
| devananda | anything else or shall we #end? | 22:55 |
| dripton | bye all | 22:56 |
| jog0 | one more | 22:56 |
| jog0 | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/grizzly | 22:56 |
| jog0 | there are 3 db bps that don't have assignees | 22:56 |
| jog0 | I can take https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/db-api-cleanup | 22:57 |
| devananda | ++ | 22:57 |
| jog0 | but the other two need owners, and are marked as high | 22:57 |
| devananda | i can take db-reconnect, but i think that is, at best, G3, possibly H | 22:57 |
| jog0 | devananda: can you assign db-api-cleanup to me | 22:57 |
| devananda | the code is already written | 22:57 |
| devananda | but the patch was denied, and should probably wait till we finish the rest of cleanup | 22:58 |
| devananda | jog0: will do | 22:58 |
| jog0 | devananda: agreed about reconnect | 22:58 |
| devananda | that leaves db-archiving | 22:58 |
| dripton | I'll take db-archiving. | 22:59 |
| devananda | awesome | 22:59 |
| devananda | actually | 22:59 |
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| devananda | should we add a new one for db-unique-keys? | 22:59 |
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| devananda | or is that too fine grained | 22:59 |
| jog0 | do you mean unique keys with soft delete? | 22:59 |
| devananda | yes | 22:59 |
| dripton | I think that should be a separate blueprint. | 23:00 |
| jog0 | yes to bp. | 23:00 |
| dripton | It's much easier to get in than the rest of db-archiving | 23:00 |
| jog0 | separate bp* | 23:00 |
| devananda | #action devananda to post db-unique-key blueprint | 23:00 |
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| devananda | cool | 23:00 |
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| dripton | I may also take backportable-db-migrations away from vishy, depending on whether people want to do alembic or not. | 23:01 |
| dripton | If not then it's simple but gross. If so then it's bigger. | 23:01 |
| russellb | so you want it if it's bigger, not simple and gross? :-) | 23:01 |
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| dripton | I'll do it either way, but if I'm pushing alembic then I *have* to do it. If it's just adding padding numbers then anyone can do it. | 23:02 |
| russellb | makes sense | 23:02 |
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| dripton | And I'd rather not have my name on the clearly wrong solution. | 23:02 |
| devananda | hah | 23:02 |
| russellb | Author: Hackity Hack <hack@omgthisissuchahack.com> | 23:03 |
| russellb | and we all whistle and ignore it | 23:03 |
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| dripton | Alan Smithee. | 23:03 |
| devananda | all righty then :) looks like time to end... | 23:04 |
| dripton | bye again | 23:04 |
| devananda | #endmeeting | 23:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 23:04 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Nov 15 23:04:38 2012 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 23:04 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/db/2012/db.2012-11-15-22.05.html | 23:04 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/db/2012/db.2012-11-15-22.05.txt | 23:04 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/db/2012/db.2012-11-15-22.05.log.html | 23:04 |
| devananda | bye all | 23:04 |
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| jog0 | thanks devananda | 23:05 |
| dripton | +1 | 23:05 |
| dkehn | +1 | 23:05 |
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