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| sarob | Akanda moved to 11am pdt | 15:00 |
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| viveknarasimhan | Is this meeting to discuss Ironic Integration with Neutron? | 15:13 |
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| dtantsur | viveknarasimhan, I think it's in 37 minutes | 15:23 |
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| viveknarasimhan | thanks | 15:32 |
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| viveknarasimhan | hi sukhdev | 15:50 |
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| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: hello | 15:52 |
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| viveknarasimhan | hi Sukhdev | 15:54 |
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| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: we will start the meeting in 5 min | 15:55 |
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| jroll | ding! | 16:00 |
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| Sukhdev | Hello - good morning its time for the meeting | 16:00 |
| Sukhdev | #startmeeting ironic_neutron | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Jun 1 16:00:42 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Sukhdev. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| yushiro | Hi, all | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ironic_neutron)" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ironic_neutron' | 16:00 |
| lauramoore | hi Sukhdev | 16:00 |
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| BertieFulton | Hi folks | 16:00 |
| Sukhdev | Hello everybody | 16:00 |
| jlvillal | o/ | 16:01 |
| rameshg87 | o/ | 16:01 |
| jroll | \o good morning | 16:01 |
| lazy_prince | o/ | 16:01 |
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| Sukhdev | #topic: Agenda | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to ": Agenda (Meeting topic: ironic_neutron)" | 16:01 | |
| Sukhdev | #link: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Ironic-neutron | 16:01 |
| Sukhdev | #topic: Announcements: | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to ": Announcements: (Meeting topic: ironic_neutron)" | 16:01 | |
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| Sukhdev | Welcome to our first kick off meeting for Neutron-Ironic Integration | 16:02 |
| viveknarasimhan | good morning everybody | 16:02 |
| sambetts | o/ | 16:02 |
| dtantsur | o/ | 16:02 |
| Sukhdev | I would like to kick start with introduction - | 16:02 |
| clif_h | o/ | 16:02 |
| mariojv | o/ | 16:02 |
| Sukhdev | I am Sukhdev - have been very active in the neutron side | 16:02 |
| Sukhdev | I have jroll with me who is active on the Ironic/Nova side | 16:03 |
| jroll | ohai | 16:03 |
| jroll | devananda won't make this one, correct? | 16:03 |
| Sukhdev | devananda is traveling and will not be joining us today - but, he will be regular as well | 16:03 |
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| rsacharya | This is Srinivas, interested in bare-metal networking. My team works on Ironic. | 16:04 |
| Sukhdev | rsacharya: welcome and thanks for the intro | 16:04 |
| viveknarasimhan | I am viveknarasimhan | 16:04 |
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| viveknarasimhan | have been active in Neutron for juno and kilo | 16:04 |
| viveknarasimhan | interested in ironic-neutron integration | 16:05 |
| jlvillal | I am the Ironic liaison to Nova. Want to hear if anything impacts Nova as far as Ironic is concerned. But will defer to jroll for most of it. | 16:05 |
| lazy_prince | I am lazy_prince from HP and I have some interest in this. I have little exp with Neutron but I was able to port ironic neutron plugin to ML2 extension driver.. | 16:05 |
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| rameshg87 | this is ramesh, i work on the ironic side for HP. interested in ironic-neutron integration too :) | 16:05 |
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| Sukhdev | Thanks folks | 16:06 |
| stendulker | stendulker: This is Shiv, I work on the ironic side of HP | 16:06 |
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| dtantsur | this is Dmitry, I am working on ironic-inspector (former discoverd) which may be of use for figuring out network properties | 16:06 |
| Sukhdev | I m sure we have lot more people here - don't be shy, please introduce yourself to the team | 16:06 |
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| yushiro | I am Yushiro at Fujitsu and work in neutron and fwaas. We're very interested in integrating neutron and ironic. | 16:06 |
| lauramoore | I am Laura Moore, have been working with Bertie Fulton and Sukhdev on the Ironic-Neutron ML2 integration, but rather new to OpenStack contributions | 16:06 |
| BertieFulton | Bertie from SAP here. I've been working with Sukhdev on initial PoCs of Ironic/ML2 integration. Also working on a draft spec for some of this. | 16:07 |
| mitchj | I'm Mitchell, I work at Arista with Sukhdev | 16:07 |
| * Sukhdev waiting for the intros to be over | 16:07 | |
| jroll | clif_h and morgabra are here from my team at rackspace; morgabra has done a ton of awesomeness in our downstream version of all of this, and clif_h is going to be jumping in to help with all of this as well | 16:08 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: let's timebox to 16:10? | 16:08 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: 16:10? | 16:08 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: be done with intros at 16:10 | 16:09 |
| jroll | UTC | 16:09 |
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| jroll | e.g. 30 more seconds by now :P | 16:09 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: Oh I see | 16:09 |
| jroll | or just move on now :P | 16:09 |
| Sukhdev | #topic: Discuss team Goals | 16:09 |
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| Sukhdev | Folks I am sure you have had a chance to look at the wiki that I put together | 16:10 |
| Sukhdev | I tried to list three main goals under the team charter | 16:10 |
| lazy_prince | yup... | 16:10 |
| Sukhdev | BertieFulton and lauramoore are working on spec for the physical connectivity | 16:11 |
| Sukhdev | I was Hoping to have that release before this meeting - but, it needs some more work | 16:11 |
| jroll | "initial charter will not cover: Automated discovery of the ports physical connectivity" -- I think we can do this in parallel, if we let it just be covered by discoverd^Winspector | 16:11 |
| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: do you want to mention when do you think it will be ready? | 16:11 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: BertieFulton I'd love to see the work-in-progress version of that | 16:12 |
| dtantsur | jroll ++ I can keep an eye on it | 16:13 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: correct, we are not including discovered as part of this team's charter - but, anybody with the expertise in that area, feel free to work in parallel with us | 16:13 |
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| BertieFulton | Should be able to oblige. It is missing some of the many sections but I'm working on it | 16:13 |
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| jroll | dtantsur: I figure once we define where the data lives, you can just do it. IPA has lldp code you can steal :) | 16:14 |
| dtantsur | cool, will do | 16:14 |
| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: Look forward to WIP version of the patch | 16:14 |
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| BertieFulton | jroll: would you rather it was up and (very) incomplete to get feedback on the ideas? Or had some more depth? | 16:14 |
| Sukhdev | The second goal is to figure out the network flip logic | 16:15 |
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| Sukhdev | We want to do it with as little impact to nova as possible | 16:15 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: I would look at a very incomplete version, yes :) | 16:15 |
| viveknarasimhan | <Sukhdev> the spec by BertieFulton would detail changes to the Port resource that Neutron will consume? | 16:16 |
| lazy_prince | I think the network flip logic has been put up by rackspace guys as ironic bp.. right.. | 16:16 |
| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: yes | 16:16 |
| viveknarasimhan | Thanks Sukdhev | 16:16 |
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| jroll | lazy_prince: yes, but it needs to be redone and made better | 16:16 |
| jroll | lazy_prince: e.g. move from kilo -> liberty and fix some things | 16:17 |
| viveknarasimhan | jroll: Let us put out a WIP and improvise | 16:17 |
| lazy_prince | +1 | 16:17 |
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| jroll | sure thing | 16:17 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: will you be willing to work with the author to bring it up-to-date? | 16:18 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: shall I assign you an action? | 16:18 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: the author is a bit of a jerk | 16:18 |
| jroll | (I'm the author) | 16:18 |
| jroll | yes, assign away! | 16:18 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: ha ha - | 16:18 |
| Sukhdev | #action: jroll to bring the network flip logic spec up-to-date and publish the new version | 16:19 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: I want to see BertieFulton's ironic spec and see what sort of overlap etc is happening | 16:19 |
| jroll | so we don't write the same thing | 16:19 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: BertieFulton is specifying the contents of the physical connectivity dict - your spec will discuss the flip logic | 16:19 |
| BertieFulton | jroll: I'm trying to avoid overlap for the flip and reference your spec. | 16:19 |
| jroll | awesome. | 16:20 |
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| jroll | sounds good | 16:20 |
| Sukhdev | The third item is CI - | 16:20 |
| lazy_prince | jroll: If you need a hand on to complete the network flip spec, you can put me there.. | 16:20 |
| Sukhdev | It is bit early for that, but, want to shout out for the experts in this area - so that we can kick off work in this regard as well | 16:20 |
| Sukhdev | lazy_prince: that is nice - thanks | 16:21 |
| jroll | lazy_prince: cool, ty | 16:21 |
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| jroll | so for CI -- I see us needing an ovs implementation of this stuff | 16:21 |
| Sukhdev | If anybody wants to jump in and offer help - we are all ears :-) | 16:22 |
| jroll | and I think we can make this model the default; just use the same network for provisioning and tenant etc. once that all lands we can update CI to actually use different networks | 16:22 |
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| Sukhdev | jroll: that is a good way to go | 16:23 |
| lazy_prince | would that mean updating the ovs mech driver..? | 16:23 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: Build as you go - | 16:23 |
| Sukhdev | lazy_prince: probably not | 16:23 |
| lazy_prince | so you mean the existing ovs mech driver itself will work..? i am not sure.. | 16:24 |
| viveknarasimhan | lazy_prince : existing ovs mech driver won't work | 16:24 |
| viveknarasimhan | lazy_prince: we need to enhance OVS to handle the additional port attributes passed in by Ironic | 16:25 |
| Sukhdev | lazy_prince: not sure - just guessing we may have to build logic around it | 16:25 |
| lazy_prince | i am unable to look at the full picture in absence of a bp... | 16:25 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: is it necessary to support OVS for CI | 16:25 |
| Sukhdev | lazy_prince: perhaps we can delay this discussion until we have a little better picture - | 16:25 |
| jroll | viveknarasimhan: yes, unless someone is going to donate real switches :) | 16:26 |
| jroll | (which still might be a good thing as a second step) | 16:26 |
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| Sukhdev | I wanted to bring this up so that experts in CI area can start to think | 16:26 |
| lauramoore | so maybe seeing the specs together will help in this regard | 16:26 |
| lauramoore | sukhdev, have you also been working on the neutron spec? | 16:27 |
| lazy_prince | lauramoore: +1 | 16:27 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: we will discuss CI strategy for this change with armax and kyle | 16:27 |
| Sukhdev | lauramoore: no we decided neutron spec may not be needed | 16:27 |
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| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: we can use all the help :-) | 16:28 |
| Sukhdev | Lets move on | 16:28 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: a neutron spec would be helpful | 16:28 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: and might be required , since they may consider this as API change for Port entity | 16:28 |
| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: neutron proposal as was presented at the summit - which everybody approved, does not require any change to the neutron core | 16:29 |
| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan:hence, we felt there was no need to write a spec | 16:29 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: I agree with what we discussed, but still capturing it as a spec would be useful | 16:29 |
| BertieFulton | Sukhdev: so because of the binding:profile I agree we need no API changes - is there no need to specigy in a spec what will be in the binfing profile? | 16:29 |
| BertieFulton | *specify | 16:29 |
| BertieFulton | *binding | 16:30 |
| Sukhdev | If you review the proposal in the etherpad, we are using binding.profile - which is not an API change | 16:30 |
| BertieFulton | Sukhdev: or is the Ironic spec sufficient? | 16:30 |
| lazy_prince | we need to specify so that there is consistency... | 16:30 |
| viveknarasimhan | BertieFulton: yes we should specify what goes in binding.profile | 16:30 |
| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: yes, we should specify in the spec - | 16:31 |
| jroll | ironic spec seems sufficient to me -- there may end up being a small nova spec but am not sure | 16:31 |
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| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: we can refer to the etherpad as well | 16:31 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: i concur if you all feel so | 16:31 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: depending upon the network flip logic - i.e. how we decide to do, may require nova spec - but, I do not believe at this moment that we need one | 16:32 |
| Swami | Sukhdev: if there is a dependency to nova, should we not capture it in a spec. | 16:32 |
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| viveknarasimhan | rsacharya: do you have concerms? | 16:32 |
| Sukhdev | Swami: let jroll update the spec - I think this can be specified in ironic spec itself | 16:32 |
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| jroll | Sukhdev: right, I've been chatting with dansmith about it. will probably depend on the changes. we'll need some solid doc to point at, at the very least, ironic spec may be enough | 16:32 |
| lazy_prince | if we could get access to the early version of the spec, that would make things move fast and bring everyone on the same page... | 16:33 |
| Swami | ok, just making sure that the dependency should be captured in one or the other spec. | 16:33 |
| Sukhdev | jroll, BertieFulton : when do you think will be in a position to post the updated spec? | 16:33 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: I'll try to get something by the end of the week | 16:33 |
| lauramoore | we will aim for end of the week too | 16:34 |
| Sukhdev | cool - in that case, lets review both of these specs and we can decide in next meeting - if we need additional specs to not | 16:34 |
| lazy_prince | by nova change, do we also mean change in ironic virt driver in nova..? | 16:34 |
| jroll | yes | 16:35 |
| jroll | (if it's needed, may not be) | 16:35 |
| lazy_prince | probably, it will be needed if we want to take full control of networking in ironic.. | 16:35 |
| jroll | agree | 16:36 |
| Sukhdev | anything else on the spec issue? | 16:36 |
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| BertieFulton | Sukhdev: I have a technical question to throw out there if it is a suitable time? | 16:37 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: so 2 specs , one for Ironic Port API (with phys conn) and other is network flip | 16:37 |
| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: go ahead please | 16:37 |
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| jroll | viveknarasimhan: correct | 16:37 |
| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: yes | 16:38 |
| viveknarasimhan | Thanks | 16:38 |
| BertieFulton | Do we want to bring any of these concepts into a flavor for node selction on the first pass of this? | 16:38 |
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| BertieFulton | for example - aggregating ports gives us certain redundancy capabilities or extra bandwidth | 16:39 |
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| BertieFulton | my initial thoughts were to aim for connectivity first but Laura said there may have been some discussion around flavors at the summit | 16:39 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: my inclination is not in the first version, but I could be persuaded otherwise. I vote connectivity first and go from there | 16:40 |
| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: This is a good point, but, I would like to limit the charter to get first pass working first | 16:40 |
| BertieFulton | jroll +1 Sukhdev +1 | 16:41 |
| viveknarasimhan | jroll +1 | 16:42 |
| lazy_prince | +1. we need to make it work for a single net first.. | 16:42 |
| Sukhdev | I will put this on the wiki - so that we do not forget about it - for the long term | 16:42 |
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| Sukhdev | Anything else, before we move on? | 16:42 |
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| Sukhdev | #topic: Nova/Neutron interaction discussion | 16:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to ": Nova/Neutron interaction discussion (Meeting topic: ironic_neutron)" | 16:43 | |
| Sukhdev | jroll: posted a poc patch - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/186855/ | 16:43 |
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| Sukhdev | to elaborate a thought process - | 16:43 |
| jroll | right, so backing up a bit. | 16:43 |
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| jroll | there's basically two options we have here: | 16:44 |
| Sukhdev | #link: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/186855/ | 16:44 |
| jroll | 1) modify the neutron api to have a parameter do declare whether or not to plumb the network immediately. default to true. set it to false when provisioning bare metal ports during the build process, so we don't connect them until the build is done | 16:44 |
| jroll | (and when build is done, port-update from ironic to set that to true) | 16:45 |
| jroll | 2) modify the nova build process to not send enough info to plumb the networks. port goes into binding failed state. send the info later from ironic to allow the port to bind correctly. | 16:46 |
| jroll | both take some work | 16:46 |
| jroll | (1) is what we do today at rackspace, via an extension | 16:46 |
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| BertieFulton | jroll: Does 1) need an update? We will be specifying an ironic port in the binding:profile, no? | 16:47 |
| Sukhdev | jroll: I reviewed the patch and posted my comments on it | 16:47 |
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| Sukhdev | BertieFulton: not in 1) | 16:47 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: ironic would only call port-update to flip that bit, to tell neutron to plumb the things | 16:47 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: unless you mean something else by 'update' | 16:48 |
| BertieFulton | I mean an update to the API | 16:48 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: I responded in that patch, the other patch you reference posts extra info, but doesn't remove the binding info | 16:48 |
| BertieFulton | but yes agreed it needs to flip something | 16:48 |
| jroll | which api? | 16:48 |
| jroll | it requires an update to the neutron api to accept a parameter that says "don't plumb this through yet" | 16:49 |
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| jroll | but I don't believe it requires ironic api updates | 16:49 |
| viveknarasimhan | jroll: the flag you mention is 'commit' in your review | 16:50 |
| Sukhdev | if we go with 1) neutron has to be changed, if we go with 2) neutron does not require any changes | 16:50 |
| Sukhdev | viveknarasimhan: yes | 16:50 |
| jroll | probably will need to modify plug_vifs in the virt driver | 16:50 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: yes, but (2) is much more invasive nova-side | 16:50 |
| jroll | morgabra: would love your eyes on all of this ^ | 16:50 |
| BertieFulton | jroll: I think it could use the binding:profile - but I think it needs an update to tell it to go plumb it after - so I think I'm in agreement | 16:50 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: If (1) is a low hanging fruit, we can go for it for now | 16:51 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: oh! not a bad idea | 16:51 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: and then the update you mention could just be in the ML2 thing, right? | 16:51 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: and then work out (2) since (2) is changes to nova mostly and not neutron | 16:51 |
| jroll | BertieFulton: I like your thinking | 16:51 |
| BertieFulton | jroll: possibly - I'll defer to Sukhdev | 16:51 |
| viveknarasimhan | yes BertieFulton | 16:51 |
| BertieFulton | jroll: I'm slightly scared of making definitive statements on Neutron :) | 16:52 |
| jroll | indeed :) | 16:52 |
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| jroll | I like the sound of {binding_profile: {bind: False, ...}} | 16:53 |
| Sukhdev | jroll, BertieFulton: The way i was thinking is that we use binding.profile - if the connectivity information is passed, it will plumb the network, if the information is not passed, it will not plumb the network | 16:53 |
| jroll | or something like that | 16:53 |
| Sukhdev | we are all essentially meaning the same thing, but, using different semantics :-) | 16:54 |
| jroll | indeed, I think so :) | 16:54 |
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| lazy_prince | my opinion is to use a flag rather than not passing info.. | 16:54 |
| jroll | I think I like a mix of both. | 16:54 |
| Sukhdev | We can keep neutron out of picture by using binding.profile - one less approval level to worry about :-) | 16:54 |
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| jroll | nova passes the info nova knows, tells neutron don't bind it yet | 16:55 |
| jlvillal | 5 minutes left | 16:55 |
| jroll | ironic passes the rest of the info, that only ironic knows | 16:55 |
| jroll | and tells neutron to bind it | 16:55 |
| morgabra | I prefer passing a flag in binding:profile as well | 16:55 |
| lazy_prince | jroll: + | 16:55 |
| Sukhdev | jlvillal: thanks for heads up | 16:55 |
| lazy_prince | 1 | 16:55 |
| morgabra | because if you rely on bind_failed state, you don't know if it's actually broken | 16:55 |
| * jroll nods | 16:56 | |
| jroll | is anyone against a flag in binding:profile, nova passes what it knows, ironic passes what it knows (switchport etc)? | 16:56 |
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| Sukhdev | I think we can make it work by adding a flag, along with connectivity information as well - so, mix of both | 16:56 |
| Sukhdev | This puts the work on ML2 driver (instead of neutron core) - which will be easy to get approved | 16:57 |
| jroll | yep | 16:57 |
| BertieFulton | jroll: I'm happy with a flag for clarity | 16:57 |
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| Sukhdev | BertieFulton jroll : can you specify this flag in your specs? | 16:57 |
| jroll | of course | 16:58 |
| jroll | and I'll update that poc | 16:58 |
| Sukhdev | we are running out of time | 16:58 |
| BertieFulton | yep | 16:58 |
| lazy_prince | if time permits, would like to discuss about switch details within/outside neutron db | 16:58 |
| Sukhdev | #topic: Open Discussion | 16:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to ": Open Discussion (Meeting topic: ironic_neutron)" | 16:58 | |
| Sukhdev | anything on anybody's mind? | 16:58 |
| jroll | lazy_prince: shoot | 16:58 |
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| lazy_prince | to me, it makes more sense to keep the switch info (creds etc ) within neutron db.. | 16:59 |
| Sukhdev | lazy_prince: there will be no creeds - only physical connectivity info | 16:59 |
| lazy_prince | this way, we could follow a uniform way for all mech drivers.. | 17:00 |
| Sukhdev | lazy_prince: switch id, port id, etc | 17:00 |
| jroll | Sukhdev: somehow the mechanism will need to be able to configure the switch | 17:00 |
| viveknarasimhan | Sukhdev: lazy_prince is quoting information about Switch stored out of band | 17:00 |
| jroll | we're out of time... perhaps move to neutron channel? | 17:00 |
| BertieFulton | thanks everyone | 17:00 |
| jroll | or ironic channel should be free, ironic meeting is now | 17:00 |
| jroll | thank you everybody! | 17:01 |
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| lazy_prince | or next meeting.. we dont have to finalize everything in this meeting only.. | 17:01 |
| Sukhdev | Thanks folks, this was very good discussion - | 17:01 |
| Sukhdev | #endmeeting | 17:01 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "(Meeting topic: sc)" | 17:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Jun 1 17:01:13 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:01 |
| yushiro | jroll, thanks too. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic_neutron/2015/ironic_neutron.2015-06-01-16.00.html | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic_neutron/2015/ironic_neutron.2015-06-01-16.00.txt | 17:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic_neutron/2015/ironic_neutron.2015-06-01-16.00.log.html | 17:01 |
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