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| carl_baldwin | Hi all. | 15:00 |
|---|---|---|
| YorikSar | Hi | 15:00 |
| carl_baldwin | I hope all are well. We'll get started... | 15:00 |
| xuhanp | hi | 15:00 |
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| carl_baldwin | #startmeeting neutron_l3 | 15:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 27 15:01:03 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is carl_baldwin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'neutron_l3' | 15:01 |
| carl_baldwin | #topic Announcements | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:01 | |
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| carl_baldwin | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Neutron-L3-Subteam | 15:01 |
| ajo | Hi , hello carl_baldwin , YorikSar , amuller , safchain | 15:01 |
| amuller | hiya | 15:01 |
| safchain | Hi | 15:02 |
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| carl_baldwin | In general, I encourage you to add your action items. Please feel free. Look up meetbot for commands that you can use during the meeting. | 15:02 |
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| carl_baldwin | Is there anything that we need to discuss related to the Icehouse release? | 15:03 |
| carl_baldwin | The only thing that I'm still working on is documentation of the sudo fix that we've identified. | 15:04 |
| carl_baldwin | I've been in contact with Edgar about that. | 15:04 |
| ajo | carl_baldwin, do you mean, the sudo performance fix? | 15:04 |
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| carl_baldwin | ajo: yes | 15:04 |
| carl_baldwin | Some of our testing has shown good promise for it. | 15:05 |
| ajo | #link http://www.sudo.ws/repos/sudo/rev/e9dc28c7db60 | 15:05 |
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| carl_baldwin | ajo: Thanks for the link. | 15:05 |
| ajo | It's supposed to slow down as you have more network interfaces unless you disable the new option in this patch. | 15:05 |
| carl_baldwin | Correct. | 15:06 |
| ajo | ok, that's good, I haven't been able to test it yet | 15:06 |
| ajo | neither the iproute one | 15:06 |
| carl_baldwin | It is looking good from my perspective. | 15:06 |
| carl_baldwin | I haven't been able to get much testing on the iproute one. | 15:06 |
| carl_baldwin | #topic l3-high-availability | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "l3-high-availability (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:07 | |
| carl_baldwin | safchain: Any update? | 15:07 |
| safchain | carl_baldwin, nothing this week | 15:08 |
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| Swami | hi | 15:09 |
| carl_baldwin | Okay. I'm getting closer to having some time to test but I haven't yet. | 15:09 |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: hi. Your timing is good. | 15:09 |
| carl_baldwin | #topic neutron-ovs-dvr | 15:09 |
| Swami | thanks | 15:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "neutron-ovs-dvr (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:09 | |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: Any updates for the team? | 15:09 |
| Swami | Yes | 15:09 |
| Swami | DVR Progress update was provided to the subteam. | 15:09 |
| Swami | The Plugin extension is almost done | 15:09 |
| Swami | Agent work is done for most part of the East-West | 15:10 |
| Swami | We still have some issues with the ovs rules to resolve, we fixing it right now. | 15:10 |
| Swami | Design docs are out there and we are addressing all the comments from it. | 15:10 |
| carl_baldwin | Good progress. | 15:10 |
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| Swami | That's all from me. | 15:11 |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: Thanks. I know we're all dying to see code. :) | 15:11 |
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| ajo | =) | 15:11 |
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| carl_baldwin | #topic bgp-dynamic-routing | 15:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bgp-dynamic-routing (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:12 | |
| Swami | carl: Yes I understand the problem, and we will upload it soon. | 15:12 |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: You know us developers. :) | 15:12 |
| amuller | safchain: Swami: I saw the patch that optionally removes the "normally learned" flows from br-tun | 15:13 |
| Swami | safchain: Thanks for the patch | 15:13 |
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| carl_baldwin | nextone92: hi | 15:14 |
| safchain | Swami, thank for suggesting this improvement | 15:14 |
| nextone92 | Hi | 15:14 |
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| nextone92 | The proposed changes to dynamic routing blueprint remove BGP functionality from tenant routers | 15:14 |
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| nextone92 | And then add a data structure “GatewaySpec” to external network | 15:14 |
| nextone92 | this new, optionally specified, data structure will contain dynamic routing configuration | 15:15 |
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| nextone92 | it may only be configured by the openstack administrator | 15:15 |
| carl_baldwin | I like the association with a network. | 15:15 |
| nextone92 | If that sounds good to everyone, I will update the document shortly :) | 15:15 |
| carl_baldwin | For one, it should remove all of my scale concerns. | 15:15 |
| nextone92 | I think it's clean and will only impact those who want additional routing services at the edge of neutron network | 15:16 |
| Swami | nextone92: what does this GatewaySpec datastructure hold. | 15:16 |
| nextone92 | Here's what I'm thinking: routing type: static/dynamic-bgp (more in the future) | 15:17 |
| nextone92 | and then information to accomplish the type of routing | 15:17 |
| nextone92 | for bgp it will be such information as remote peers, AS, and shared secrets | 15:17 |
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| carl_baldwin | BTW, I took a crack at outlining the use cases as I promised to last week. It needs more detail but it is a start. | 15:18 |
| carl_baldwin | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Neutron/DynamicRoutingUseCases | 15:18 |
| nextone92 | Oooh great! | 15:18 |
| carl_baldwin | The first use case is lifted directly from nextone92 's document. | 15:19 |
| carl_baldwin | I added the second. | 15:19 |
| ajo | nice carl_baldwin | 15:19 |
| carl_baldwin | The third is the result of my trying to wrap my head around the BGP/MPLS blueprint and use case. | 15:19 |
| carl_baldwin | Hopefully, this will aid in our discussions about the topic. | 15:19 |
| Swami | carl: I will go through the doc and provide my comments | 15:20 |
| amuller | carl_baldwin: Thanks for that | 15:20 |
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| carl_baldwin | amuller: Feel free to ask questions that come up on IRC on on the ML. I will be adding more detail as questions come up. | 15:21 |
| Swami | One question I had is, will this be configurable by a tenant or will it be intelligent enough to add "static/versus dynamic" based on the service type that we choose. Or is it all controlled by the Admin at this point. | 15:21 |
| nextone92 | It would only be configurable by the administrator | 15:22 |
| carl_baldwin | In my personal view of the world, this will all be controlled by the admin. What do others think? | 15:22 |
| carl_baldwin | With any dynamic routing relationship, I think it requires some administrative knowledge of the relationship of the openstack cloud with the infrastructure around it. | 15:23 |
| Swami | Today for example VPN service is configured by a Tenant and not by administrator and if the VPN Service requires Dynamic routing capability then it should be done already by an admin. Is that what you are suggesting. | 15:24 |
| carl_baldwin | It might make sense on a provider network or something where the tenant is given some control or knowledge of the outside. | 15:24 |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: the difference with BGP/MPLS is that it doesn't rely on strong endpoint authentication or encryption for privacy. | 15:25 |
| carl_baldwin | Instead, it relies on trust between customer and provider and, now, the cloud provider who is a third provider. | 15:25 |
| nextone92 | Also, Swami, Carl - if the dynamic routing is attached to the external network, would it be difficult to setup dynamic routing just for the tenant and not the rest of the network? | 15:25 |
| nextone92 | Maybe if a tenant owns the external network wholly? | 15:26 |
| carl_baldwin | nextone92: I wrote a few words on that. I think if the external network is shared between tenants, it will be very difficult. | 15:26 |
| nextone92 | agreed, carl_baldwin | 15:26 |
| carl_baldwin | nextone92: Yes, agreed. | 15:27 |
| Swami | Yes, that is what I am not clear. Is it per tenant basis or global flag that enables the dynamic routing. Or is it based on a router context. | 15:27 |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: the association is shifting from the router context to the external network context. | 15:27 |
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| Swami | carl: thanks for the clarification. | 15:28 |
| nextone92 | carl_baldwin, Swami - to clarify, it would be good to associate one or more external networks with the same gatewayspec | 15:28 |
| nextone92 | so a quagga instance could potentially serve more than one external network | 15:28 |
| carl_baldwin | Swami: yw, you're questions are very well-timed. These are the details we need to get out in the open. | 15:29 |
| Swami | carl: Yes we need to do it. | 15:30 |
| carl_baldwin | I think we're on track for a good discussion at the summit. nextone92 will you be updating your document? | 15:31 |
| nextone92 | Yes, I will take an action item to update the document | 15:31 |
| Swami | I will join briefly after a break. | 15:32 |
| carl_baldwin | Great. Feel free to use the action command to take action items. | 15:32 |
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| carl_baldwin | #action carl_baldwin will announce use case wiki on ML and field questions. | 15:33 |
| carl_baldwin | #action nextone92 will update bhp-dynamic-routing document | 15:34 |
| carl_baldwin | #topic DNS lookup of instances | 15:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "DNS lookup of instances (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:34 | |
| carl_baldwin | I wrote up a draft. It is pending approval to make public. So, soon. | 15:35 |
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| carl_baldwin | #topic Agent Performance with Wrapper Overhead | 15:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Agent Performance with Wrapper Overhead (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:35 | |
| ajo | carl | 15:35 |
| ajo | sorry, | 15:35 |
| ajo | ahh, nothing, you'll make it public soon | 15:35 |
| ajo | I was going to ask about the DNS lookup of instances | 15:35 |
| ajo | you mean, from outside tenant networks, right? | 15:35 |
| carl_baldwin | Feel free to ping me on IRC. | 15:36 |
| ajo | sure | 15:36 |
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| ajo | YorikSar, | 15:36 |
| carl_baldwin | ajo: I've tagged you as the lead on this performance stuff though I know YorikSar has been very active. | 15:36 |
| Swami_ | hi | 15:36 |
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| YorikSar | o/ | 15:37 |
| ajo | Yes, yorikstar is doing an awesome work | 15:37 |
| YorikSar | I've started working on Neutron changes to integrate rootwrap daemon | 15:37 |
| carl_baldwin | Mostly just because ajo brought it up on the ML originally. | 15:37 |
| YorikSar | https://review.openstack.org/82787 - I've already added carl_baldwin and ajo to that CR | 15:37 |
| carl_baldwin | YorikSar: I am part-way through a review of each of your two patches. | 15:37 |
| ajo | #link https://review.openstack.org/82787 | 15:37 |
| carl_baldwin | I have draft comments but it may take me a couple more days. | 15:37 |
| YorikSar | It became rather intrusive but I hope it won't be opposed too strongly. | 15:38 |
| carl_baldwin | I encourage others to review. Especially those who have been active in the ML thread. | 15:38 |
| ajo | YorikSar, did you see the security issues Thierry found in https://review.openstack.org/#/c/81798/ ? | 15:38 |
| ajo | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/81798/7/oslo/rootwrap/daemon.py | 15:39 |
| YorikSar | I doubt I will be able to work on this more this week (well, maybe only weekend) so it'll most likely be on hold till Tuesday. | 15:39 |
| YorikSar | I appreciate any comments or thoughts you can provide. | 15:39 |
| YorikSar | ajo: Let me check... | 15:39 |
| ajo | it seems that basemanager doesn't process the "serializer" parameter | 15:39 |
| ajo | and it will rely on pickle always | 15:40 |
| YorikSar | Oh... I'll respond there. | 15:40 |
| ajo | at least from the doc perspective, I didn't check the actual code of BaseManager | 15:40 |
| YorikSar | BaseManager does support this, but it's undocumented. | 15:40 |
| ttx | YorikSar: heh | 15:40 |
| ajo | ahhhh, that explains a lot | 15:40 |
| carl_baldwin | #action carl_baldwin will communicate details about sudo patch to Edgar to be included in the release documentation. | 15:40 |
| carl_baldwin | ^ Just throwing that in there. :) | 15:41 |
| YorikSar | That's unfortunate but it shouldn't change in future releases. | 15:41 |
| ajo | YorikSar, is that true for py26 too? | 15:41 |
| YorikSar | I can try to push change to CPython to include this parameter into docs. | 15:41 |
| YorikSar | ajo: Em.. I'm not sure. Let me check py26 | 15:42 |
| carl_baldwin | YorikSar: That'd be great to get some commitment on the feature. | 15:42 |
| ajo | I can see, the code is there for py27 | 15:42 |
| carl_baldwin | ajo: Good call on checking py26. | 15:42 |
| YorikSar | ajo: Yes, it's there in py26 | 15:42 |
| YorikSar | And py32 | 15:43 |
| YorikSar | And py33 | 15:43 |
| ajo | ahh, good YorikSar | 15:43 |
| ajo | and, is it documented for py3.3 ? | 15:43 |
| YorikSar | Gentoo is cool - you can have as many Python interpreters as you want installed in the system :) | 15:43 |
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| ajo | hehe :) | 15:43 |
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| YorikSar | Nope, it's not documented... | 15:44 |
| ajo | I wonder why | 15:44 |
| YorikSar | For 3.4 I mean. | 15:44 |
| YorikSar | I guess noone ever used this. | 15:44 |
| ajo | I hope we don't find bugs because of this, or that they change the implementation in the future unexpectedly | 15:45 |
| ajo | may be we should git-blame and ask the original authors of that feature. | 15:45 |
| YorikSar | We're switching off pickle just for security reasons and this might be never anticipated by authors of this :) | 15:45 |
| YorikSar | ajo: Since it's in 2.6, it might be svn-blame :) | 15:46 |
| ajo | :) | 15:46 |
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| YorikSar | I'll ask on python-dev | 15:46 |
| ajo | YorikSar, I'll do it if you want | 15:46 |
| ajo | I was writting an #action line | 15:47 |
| ajo | to provide some help :) | 15:47 |
| YorikSar | Oh, no. It's not for python-dev, but for python@, I guess. | 15:47 |
| YorikSar | ajo: I'll do it myself. I want to get to the bottom of it :) | 15:48 |
| carl_baldwin | #action carl_baldwin will finish review of root wrap daemon patches. | 15:48 |
| ajo | #action ajo ask in python-dev / python@ mail list about the undocumented 'serializer' parameter of multiprocessing.BaseManager object | 15:48 |
| ajo | ahh :D | 15:48 |
| ajo | ':D | 15:48 |
| ajo | #action YorikSar ask in python-dev / python@ mail list about the undocumented 'serializer' parameter of multiprocessing.BaseManager object | 15:49 |
| ajo | #action ajo finish review on neutron-side root wrap daemon patches | 15:49 |
| carl_baldwin | Good progress. Anything else? | 15:49 |
| YorikSar | Nope | 15:50 |
| carl_baldwin | #topic General Discussion | 15:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "General Discussion (Meeting topic: neutron_l3)" | 15:51 | |
| YorikSar | On, maybe I have a question about rootwrap. | 15:51 |
| YorikSar | Do you think it worth creating a blueprint? | 15:51 |
| carl_baldwin | I think so. | 15:52 |
| YorikSar | I guess, on for oslo and one for Neutron (and one for each of Nova and Cinder later) | 15:52 |
| ajo | YorikSar, yes, probably, you just need a link to your etherpad. | 15:52 |
| *** troytoman-away is now known as troytoman | 15:52 | |
| YorikSar | Ok, will do | 15:52 |
| ajo | I was listening to some concerns, minutes ago, about the qrouter- namespace memory usage (due to neutron-ns-metadata-proxy) | 15:52 |
| carl_baldwin | Yeah, it shouldn't be too much work at this point. Just formalizing the blueprint's existence and linking. | 15:52 |
| ajo | what was the initial reason to use this + domain socket ? | 15:53 |
| carl_baldwin | ajo: I'm not sure I understand the question yet. | 15:54 |
| ajo | thinking about it again... there isn't a decent way to route that via iptables to the neutron-metadata-server directly | 15:54 |
| ajo | We use the neutron-ns-metadata-proxy in every qrouter namespace | 15:54 |
| haleyb | ajo: because that proxy doesn't have access to the management network | 15:54 |
| ajo | (or qdhcp, when isolated_metadata is enableD) | 15:54 |
| YorikSar | I think those proxies will be replaced with one process with one thread per ns later. | 15:54 |
| ajo | haleyb, right, | 15:55 |
| ajo | YorikSar, is it possible to setns per thread? | 15:55 |
| haleyb | i could not find a way to reduce it's memory footprint, it's all just based on what it imports | 15:55 |
| YorikSar | ajo: Yes. setns works per-thread. | 15:55 |
| ajo | hmm, that's interesting | 15:55 |
| YorikSar | ajo: I didn't verify it with fork calls, so if we ever want to add this to rootwrap it'll require some investigation. | 15:56 |
| ajo | so we could just start a thread + setns for every tenant network we're serving | 15:56 |
| carl_baldwin | I imagine those threads must be OS level threads. | 15:56 |
| YorikSar | carl_baldwin: Sure. | 15:56 |
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| ajo | carl_baldwin, sure, | 15:56 |
| ajo | although python GIL doesn't provide much benefit of os threads... in this case, memory benefit... could do the work | 15:56 |
| YorikSar | I guess we can even spawn thread, do setns(), create socket, pass it to main thread and let helper thread die. | 15:56 |
| carl_baldwin | just clarifying. :) | 15:57 |
| ajo | but then there's the problem of scaling | 15:57 |
| YorikSar | ajo: Ah.. Those prejudices again... | 15:57 |
| ajo | if we don't get real threading speedup, and just memory speedup | 15:58 |
| ajo | we could end up being a bottleneck here | 15:58 |
| ajo | memory speedup -> memory usage reduction | 15:58 |
| ajo | can be ok if we fork once per "N" threads | 15:59 |
| YorikSar | I don't think there will be any measurable difference between thread per socket and greenthread per socket. | 15:59 |
| YorikSar | Since threads sleep on I/O anyway and GIL won't be held by them. | 15:59 |
| carl_baldwin | YorikSar: Can it still listen and accept connections on the address inside the ns if the worker thread dies? | 15:59 |
| YorikSar | carl_baldwin: I don't know. It should. Need more research here :) | 16:00 |
| ajo | I suppose it can't but just guessing | 16:00 |
| YorikSar | carl_baldwin: I guess I will be able to get to this task during J cycle | 16:00 |
| ajo | may be we should start the performance subteam ;) | 16:01 |
| carl_baldwin | We can discuss more on IRC, ML, or later meetings. For now, we're out of time. | 16:01 |
| YorikSar | sure | 16:01 |
| ajo | sure, thanks carl_baldwin , YorikSar , * | 16:01 |
| carl_baldwin | Great meeting. Thanks everyone. | 16:01 |
| carl_baldwin | #endmeeting | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 27 16:01:53 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_l3/2014/neutron_l3.2014-03-27-15.01.html | 16:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_l3/2014/neutron_l3.2014-03-27-15.01.txt | 16:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_l3/2014/neutron_l3.2014-03-27-15.01.log.html | 16:01 |
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| rockyg | #startmeeting refstack | 21:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 27 21:02:22 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is rockyg. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'refstack' | 21:02 |
| rockyg | Who's here? | 21:02 |
| davidlenwell | I'm here | 21:02 |
| davidlenwell | agenda: code reviews, py26 gate, tomorrows f2f, tcup methods | 21:03 |
| rockyg | Open discussion.... | 21:03 |
| rockyg | CatherineD? | 21:03 |
| rockyg | Waiman? | 21:03 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: ? | 21:03 |
| waiman | o/ | 21:03 |
| catherineD | Hi Rocky, I am here | 21:04 |
| * zehicle running late | 21:04 | |
| davidlenwell | also on the agenda but we can push it to tomorrows f2f .. docs | 21:05 |
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| rockyg | Okay, since zehicle is running late, let's talk #topic py26 | 21:05 |
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| rockyg | #topic py26 | 21:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "py26 (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:05 | |
| davidlenwell | okay .. so I'm planning to remove py26 from the gate all together | 21:05 |
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| rockyg | What do we need to do to get it working? | 21:05 |
| davidlenwell | a lot | 21:06 |
| ajo | project stats for lot, 90 days | 21:06 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: so far nobody has expressed interest in running our code in a py26 env .. and a lot of our code does things that didn't exist in py26 | 21:06 |
| davidlenwell | plus .. for those who want centos and rehl .. they can still run py27 | 21:07 |
| rockyg | But, tthe first pass is for Havana. and I though RHEL was py2.6? | 21:07 |
| rockyg | Ah. | 21:07 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: so it doesn't matter what env we are testing .. it matters what the test is running from | 21:07 |
| rockyg | Maybe we get a redhat contributor to help/work on 2.6? | 21:08 |
| davidlenwell | the thing running refstack.org right now needs to be py.27 or py3 | 21:08 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: maybe .. but right now having py2.6 in the gate slows down our merges | 21:08 |
| davidlenwell | py 26 is old .. we're hanging on to the past | 21:08 |
| rockyg | True. | 21:08 |
| rockyg | With time being precious, let's deal with 2.6 after we have working 2.7 | 21:09 |
| davidlenwell | So unless we have any objection I am going to remove py26 from the gate | 21:09 |
| zehicle | o/ | 21:09 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: im not sure I'll ever care about py26 . but we can bring it back into discussion at a later time | 21:09 |
| rockyg | I don't think we want to gate on py3 yet, either. | 21:09 |
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| davidlenwell | rockyg: I don't agree with you there | 21:10 |
| davidlenwell | esp since we pass py33 tests now | 21:10 |
| rockyg | how about we vote to not bother with 2.6 until someone shows a need for it? | 21:10 |
| *** mwagner_lap is now known as mwagner_bbl | 21:11 | |
| davidlenwell | I vote we vote on it later | 21:11 |
| davidlenwell | and put it out of our heads | 21:11 |
| rockyg | #action table 2.6 discussion for sometime in the future, by request | 21:11 |
| davidlenwell | thank you | 21:11 |
| davidlenwell | next topic .. code reviews | 21:11 |
| rockyg | Now that zehicle is here, let's go back to reviews | 21:12 |
| rockyg | #topic code reviews | 21:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "code reviews (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:12 | |
| davidlenwell | So several things got merged today including teds change for discovery of config options | 21:12 |
| davidlenwell | I made some minor dock changes.. | 21:12 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle has a few reviews that need some work | 21:13 |
| zehicle | I've got the pep8 fixes in | 21:13 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: I don't see the review yet | 21:13 |
| zehicle | cannot upload from the office.... in a hour or so | 21:14 |
| davidlenwell | it doesn't exist until there is a review ;) | 21:14 |
| davidlenwell | I've been working on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/81402/ .. will push it later today | 21:14 |
| rockyg | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/81402/ | 21:15 |
| davidlenwell | I think that covers the open reviews for now unless anyone else has anything? | 21:15 |
| rockyg | I've got similar network issues... can be on corporate network and get emails, or on guest net and get work done. | 21:15 |
| *** mwagner_bbl has quit IRC | 21:16 | |
| rockyg | Anything major besides zehicle's stuff still out there? | 21:16 |
| zehicle | I will need some support on the last step of TCUP | 21:16 |
| zehicle | because the execute test is not working for me yet | 21:16 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: I can make time for you this afternoon | 21:16 |
| zehicle | thanks | 21:16 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: I merged all the other open reviews today .. I think we're abandoning joshua's reviews from last week in favor of zehicle | 21:16 |
| rockyg | Do we want to do tcup next or f2f? | 21:16 |
| zehicle | have you been able to try the stuff to prep the environment? | 21:16 |
| davidlenwell | I was pushing tcup for last because it could drag on | 21:17 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: yes .. I have | 21:17 |
| zehicle | +1 | 21:17 |
| rockyg | I passed CatherineD's instructions on to our infra guy. Haven't heard back from him yet weher he could make it work. | 21:18 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: all of that will simplify | 21:18 |
| davidlenwell | we'll work out the details tomorro w | 21:18 |
| rockyg | Thought it would, but wanted to get him started. | 21:18 |
| rockyg | So, on to f2f? | 21:18 |
| davidlenwell | sure | 21:19 |
| rockyg | #topic F2F | 21:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "F2F (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:19 | |
| davidlenwell | so I have the room booked from 1-3:30 | 21:19 |
| fcarpenter | (And that 3:30 is a hard stop) | 21:20 |
| rockyg | I'm working on getting sphinx to generate docs. Some of it is working. | 21:20 |
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| davidlenwell | the agenda for the f2f is mostly centered around our docs | 21:21 |
| catherineD | Is the f2f strictly for doc? Have room for code discussion? | 21:21 |
| rockyg | We'll do handoff of davidlenwell's verbiage and drawings tomorrow. and yes, code is also happening tomorrow. | 21:21 |
| davidlenwell | yeah.. we'll cover both .. | 21:21 |
| davidlenwell | but my primary objective is to make sense of our docs . | 21:22 |
| davidlenwell | we can have some stuff happening in parallel | 21:22 |
| rockyg | Do you have a drwing/graphics package to recommend I have preloaded? | 21:22 |
| davidlenwell | I use a cloud based one | 21:22 |
| davidlenwell | gliffy | 21:23 |
| rockyg | I've used that before, but it was part of Confluence. | 21:23 |
| rockyg | I'll check it out after this meeting. | 21:23 |
| davidlenwell | sure .. | 21:23 |
| davidlenwell | okay.. so on to tcup.. | 21:24 |
| rockyg | So, code and docs tomorrow. Plus the Defcore meeting. | 21:24 |
| rockyg | #topic tcup | 21:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "tcup (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:24 | |
| davidlenwell | wait .. when is the defcore meeting ? | 21:24 |
| rockyg | zehicle? | 21:24 |
| rockyg | Maybe it's today? | 21:24 |
| * zehicle checking | 21:24 | |
| zehicle | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/DefCoreElephant.7 | 21:25 |
| zehicle | It's on 4/1 at 2pm | 21:25 |
| rockyg | Ah. Not today *or* tomorrow. Good. | 21:26 |
| davidlenwell | this is good | 21:26 |
| davidlenwell | its monday | 21:26 |
| zehicle | oh, there is something tomorrow too | 21:26 |
| zehicle | an Interlock w/ the TC | 21:26 |
| fcarpenter | monday == tuesday | 21:26 |
| rockyg | Oh, right. I knew there was something. | 21:26 |
| zehicle | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-designated-sections | 21:26 |
| zehicle | Friday 3/28 @ 8pm UTC | 21:26 |
| rockyg | 'which is 1pm PDT | 21:27 |
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| zehicle | yes | 21:27 |
| davidlenwell | so we'll be here at piston durring that | 21:27 |
| rockyg | So, first hour tomorrow we'll be at least listening in while working | 21:27 |
| zehicle | it's all about designated sections | 21:28 |
| rockyg | OK, that' means we should be on time. | 21:28 |
| davidlenwell | does that immidiately effect us .. because we do have limited time | 21:28 |
| zehicle | so, it's not likely to hit RefStack stuff just yet | 21:28 |
| davidlenwell | as fcarpenter said the 330 end is a hard stop | 21:28 |
| davidlenwell | we'll be kicked out of that room and will have to go to the local bar to keep talking | 21:29 |
| * zehicle buying tx to join in RefStack happy hour | 21:29 | |
| rockyg | Which is your favorite work bar? | 21:29 |
| rockyg | back to tcup. | 21:30 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: as I am new here I don't have one yet .. | 21:30 |
| davidlenwell | yes .. so we've had some discussion in the past about what is the right way to run things in docker | 21:30 |
| rockyg | Thirsty Bear is a bit far, but really good;-) | 21:30 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: do you want to state your position | 21:30 |
| zehicle | so, I've been working to make TCUP into something that runs RefStack | 21:31 |
| zehicle | basically, it puts all of into a container and then kicks off the test | 21:31 |
| zehicle | so it should be the same to use it from the dev setup, production infratructure or TCUP | 21:31 |
| zehicle | that makes it really really light for people to use | 21:32 |
| zehicle | basicially, it's just run one py file | 21:32 |
| zehicle | and it gets the container and runs the tests inside it | 21:32 |
| davidlenwell | I also want to discuss the generating the docker file from a template vs env variables | 21:32 |
| rockyg | I like the template idea. | 21:33 |
| zehicle | the template approach is a non-starter for me | 21:33 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: there is a reason it won't work | 21:33 |
| zehicle | I have some issues with it | 21:33 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: can you spell those out please | 21:33 |
| zehicle | 1st, it makes the code more complex for generating it | 21:33 |
| zehicle | 2nd, it means that the container is unique each time instead of standard | 21:33 |
| davidlenwell | #2 is actually what I am hung up on | 21:33 |
| zehicle | #2 is my biggest issue | 21:33 |
| catherineD | No the container is not unique for each run | 21:34 |
| zehicle | IMHO, the goal is that we have a standard environement that everyone uses | 21:34 |
| zehicle | and we pass in the unique stuff as env variables | 21:34 |
| zehicle | very easy to repeat and troubleshoot | 21:34 |
| zehicle | if we have custom templates then it's hard to troubleshoot | 21:34 |
| zehicle | and we can't upload the standard template for everyone to use in a single shot | 21:35 |
| davidlenwell | so it sounds to me like maybe we have a slight communication problem about what the template is used for and wather or not it caches or makes every container unuiqe | 21:35 |
| rockyg | Question: lots of people are expressing a desire to "run [api|acceptance|custom|etc] tests against their cloud" Mostly ops guys. How does this play in the two options? | 21:35 |
| catherineD | if you look at the way we build the container, we push the most stable variables up front. This will allow docker to cache .. and at the same time will rebuild image when it detected changes .. | 21:35 |
| zehicle | the tcup script I've been working on does exactly that - you put in the differents as environement variables | 21:36 |
| catherineD | I can send out the log files after the meeting you will see the evident of caching | 21:36 |
| davidlenwell | catherineD: please do .. | 21:37 |
| davidlenwell | that said .. | 21:37 |
| catherineD | Evironment variables only work in the case of local docker container .... we plan for it to work with gearman remotely | 21:37 |
| catherineD | will send dthe logs ... | 21:37 |
| davidlenwell | catherineD: the gearman remote thing won't use docker at all | 21:37 |
| davidlenwell | it will run the scripts that docker runs | 21:37 |
| zehicle | +1 | 21:38 |
| davidlenwell | doesn't need docker | 21:38 |
| zehicle | the scripts should work anywhere | 21:38 |
| davidlenwell | and refstack.org CANNOT have docker as a dependancy | 21:38 |
| zehicle | I'm trying to keep the docker stuff as a wrapper, not an internal dependency | 21:38 |
| catherineD | The scripts will work anywhere but will paring with RefStack | 21:38 |
| davidlenwell | +1 | 21:38 |
| davidlenwell | so for remote execution from the gui.. refstack should be able to be configured to use docker .. but in those instances I think that running them locally will be fine | 21:39 |
| davidlenwell | env variables are a more secure way of passing in creds .. and also keeps the container more of a container and less of a one off gererated thing for this one test | 21:40 |
| davidlenwell | then docker doesn't have to genreate anything at all and all of it is cached | 21:40 |
| zehicle | +1 | 21:40 |
| catherineD | +1 for security .. | 21:40 |
| davidlenwell | and rockyg as far as ops people using it to run there own tests .. nobody is stopping them from modifying things in the tcup thing for their own build | 21:40 |
| zehicle | I've been pretty happy w/ using env variables for this | 21:40 |
| zehicle | (it was not my original approach) | 21:41 |
| *** lcheng has quit IRC | 21:41 | |
| catherineD | one of the improvement that we will be doing is to improve security now that the code are merged | 21:41 |
| waiman | how about passing in as arg? the current execute_test.py takes them as command line arg. | 21:41 |
| davidlenwell | so catherineD I'd like to see us transition from the template generated docker into one that uses env variables | 21:41 |
| zehicle | effectively, the env variables ARE passed as args | 21:41 |
| davidlenwell | waiman: ^^ that | 21:41 |
| zehicle | the code sets them when the container is started | 21:41 |
| catherineD | we need to discuss who will set the ENV | 21:41 |
| davidlenwell | so the thing that calls the script from the command line can just pass them in | 21:42 |
| davidlenwell | catherineD: we can whiteboard tomorrow if that will help | 21:42 |
| catherineD | When you actually run the tests you will realized that some on need to pass in variables ... | 21:42 |
| zehicle | my code (and Josh's code) both build a set of input parameters to the container that set the env variables needed to run thetests | 21:42 |
| catherineD | yes let's discuss stomorrow | 21:42 |
| rockyg | Whiteboard sounds good. | 21:42 |
| davidlenwell | okay then .. I think we can move to open discussion | 21:43 |
| rockyg | #topic Open Discussion | 21:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:43 | |
| zehicle | oh, one minor note: Docker 0.8 has a bug that makes the Dockerbuild files return EOF | 21:43 |
| zehicle | I had to upgrade to 0.9.1 | 21:44 |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: thats one reason I was so hesitant to use docker at all | 21:44 |
| zehicle | just so you don't have to repeat my learning exprience | 21:44 |
| davidlenwell | its in a super early alpha stage | 21:44 |
| davidlenwell | riddled with bugs and a moving target | 21:44 |
| zehicle | I understand the concern | 21:44 |
| davidlenwell | thats why I will continue to support the need for it .. but refstack.org won't be dependant on it | 21:44 |
| davidlenwell | and in our docs we have to be clear that it is just one of many options | 21:45 |
| rockyg | what would be an alternative for the remote runs? | 21:45 |
| davidlenwell | a vm running the py scripts that run the tests and clean up afterwards .. probably triggered from gearman | 21:45 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: its essentially the same thing .. just not in a throw away container | 21:46 |
| davidlenwell | my goals are to make us hostable by infra long term | 21:46 |
| rockyg | I figured everything but the gearman part. Would gearman be a requirement, though? | 21:46 |
| davidlenwell | they aren't going to play with docker | 21:46 |
| davidlenwell | gearman would be a requirement if you chose that option .. just like docker would be if you wanted to use that | 21:46 |
| davidlenwell | gearman is also a lot more mature and in heavy use by the infra team now | 21:47 |
| rockyg | OK. I'll need to document options for remote execution. In case others don't want to use docker. | 21:47 |
| zehicle | realistically, we should also be able to clone and run the code too! | 21:47 |
| davidlenwell | so refstack.org will use gearman to queue tests | 21:47 |
| davidlenwell | thats what local tests are for | 21:48 |
| rockyg | Question on tests: are we cloning them fro the Havana branch? | 21:48 |
| davidlenwell | so far the three options for triggering tests are : local, tcup, and remote (gearman) | 21:48 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: we abslutely should be | 21:48 |
| davidlenwell | damnit my spelling .. absolutely | 21:49 |
| waiman | davidlenwell: 3 options from refstack web ui, right? | 21:49 |
| davidlenwell | waiman: yes | 21:49 |
| rockyg | I think we need a way to advertise the branch the tests are cloned from in the test log and the UI. | 21:49 |
| davidlenwell | 3 options for the refstack ui | 21:50 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: file a blueprint | 21:50 |
| rockyg | Will do. | 21:50 |
| zehicle | is the documentation for running the UI up to date? | 21:50 |
| davidlenwell | we are selecting the version at the time of making the tests | 21:50 |
| waiman | davidlenwell: i have one related to that | 21:50 |
| davidlenwell | thats right .. you ahve one for displaying the results | 21:51 |
| waiman | we talk about allowing users to pick version. each version will be mapped to a tempest url. | 21:51 |
| davidlenwell | it should say what version .. so rockyg just add to the whiteboard of the existing blueprint | 21:51 |
| rockyg | OK. | 21:51 |
| davidlenwell | we also talked about allowing them to specify a url of a specific tempest branch they want to run | 21:51 |
| waiman | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/refstack/+spec/support-different-tempest-versions | 21:52 |
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| waiman | davidlenwell: yes. i am working on this. | 21:52 |
| davidlenwell | excelent | 21:52 |
| davidlenwell | okay .. I think we all have lots of things to do .. lets all this meeting ajourned | 21:53 |
| rockyg | I think my homework before tomorrow is to review all the BPs. | 21:53 |
| Praveen-dell | Hi,this is praveen from Dell,Ireland,working for Rob on Refstack project | 21:53 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: good plan | 21:53 |
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| rockyg | Call to end... | 21:53 |
| davidlenwell | hi Praveen-dell | 21:53 |
| Praveen-dell | Hi David | 21:53 |
| zehicle | Praveen-dell is from my team here | 21:53 |
| zehicle | He's time zone disadvantaged (in the UK) | 21:53 |
| rockyg | Are you in Ireland? | 21:53 |
| davidlenwell | Praveen-dell: we're just wrapping up here .. wanna jump over to #refstack and introduce your self | 21:53 |
| Praveen-dell | sure | 21:54 |
| Praveen-dell | will do | 21:54 |
| Praveen-dell | thanks | 21:54 |
| rockyg | OK, then time to move back to our "home" | 21:54 |
| zehicle | can we have a short topic about potentially changing time? | 21:54 |
| rockyg | Here? Now? | 21:54 |
| rockyg | #topic meeting time | 21:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "meeting time (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 21:54 | |
| davidlenwell | zehicle: what time did you want to change to ? | 21:54 |
| zehicle | if we're going to change it for next week | 21:54 |
| davidlenwell | thursdays at 2 was your idea | 21:54 |
| davidlenwell | I'm fine with keeping it how it is | 21:55 |
| zehicle | true, did not have anyone from Europe at the time | 21:55 |
| davidlenwell | ahh | 21:55 |
| davidlenwell | how much time is Praveen-dell going to have for refstack ? | 21:55 |
| rockyg | Yeah. It's likely at least midnight start for Praveen | 21:55 |
| Praveen-dell | GMT 5pm or 6pm should be fine for me | 21:55 |
| rockyg | So, 11am or noon PDT | 21:56 |
| davidlenwell | so I'd like to keep meetings as static as we can .. if we keep moving it we're just going to loose poeple . | 21:56 |
| zehicle | +1 | 21:57 |
| rockyg | Sorry. 10am or 11am | 21:57 |
| davidlenwell | 10am is fine for me | 21:57 |
| davidlenwell | 11 is a nogo | 21:57 |
| rockyg | 10am works for me. | 21:57 |
| davidlenwell | any objections to changing the meeting time to 10am pst on thursdays? | 21:57 |
| rockyg | that's pDt | 21:58 |
| zehicle | I can make that work | 21:58 |
| davidlenwell | whats the diff between pdt and pst ? | 21:58 |
| catherineD | good for us | 21:58 |
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| rockyg | Standard vs Daylight savings | 21:58 |
| zehicle | I'd like to agree that we'll follow daylight time | 21:58 |
| zehicle | sorry, follow the changes | 21:58 |
| davidlenwell | I'm good with it .. zehicle wanna change the meeting time on the wiki thing ? | 21:59 |
| zehicle | +1 will do | 21:59 |
| zehicle | thanks | 21:59 |
| zehicle | Thursdays @ 10 am Pacific | 21:59 |
| rockyg | yes, thanks. | 21:59 |
| Praveen-dell | thanks for the time change | 21:59 |
| zehicle | likely to stay on this channel | 21:59 |
| davidlenwell | just update the email list | 21:59 |
| rockyg | Yeah. I know QA alternates between this time and the new time on the meeting channel. | 22:00 |
| rockyg | Time! | 22:00 |
| rockyg | last call. | 22:00 |
| rockyg | #endmeeting | 22:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 27 22:01:05 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2014/refstack.2014-03-27-21.02.html | 22:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2014/refstack.2014-03-27-21.02.txt | 22:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2014/refstack.2014-03-27-21.02.log.html | 22:01 |
| waiman | now our previous reviews have been merged, i can now continue to commit my new code on top... | 22:01 |
| rockyg | Praveen_dell, the team channel is #refstack | 22:02 |
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| Praveen-dell | joining now | 22:03 |
| rockyg | Praveen-dell, the team channel is #refstack | 22:03 |
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