Saturday, 2016-06-25

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rm_workwe have to hotplug user networks00:00
clarkbbut why?00:00
clarkbjust l3 to them00:00
rm_workok well... with VMs we need to hotplug user networks00:00
rm_workmaybe with containers it can be done differently?00:00
clarkbI mean00:00
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clarkbwe do lb just fine without that in VMs00:00
funginova boot, apt-get install haproxy, configure00:01
rm_workso, when a user adds a member to their LB, we examine the subnet of the VM and hotplug the network its on00:01
clarkbrm_work: right that shouldnt be necessary00:01
rm_workthey can add members after create-time that are on arbitrary new subnets00:01
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clarkbalsoeans I cant load balance things not in my cloud tenant?00:01
rm_workwe need to plug those networks, no?00:01
clarkbyou shpuldnt need to if routing works00:02
rm_workerr00:02
fungigranted our use for virtualized load balancers is maybe trivial?00:02
rm_workthose subnets are isolated *by design*00:02
clarkbyou only need to hotplug an interface if l2 connectivity is rrquired00:02
rm_workI *hope* routing doesn't just magically work between them00:02
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clarkbrm_work: you can isolate at l3 with firewalls00:02
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rm_workok... well, all i can say is that's not even remotely our design :P00:03
rm_workand i'm not enough of a low level networking expert to really dive too deep into it T_T00:03
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rm_workbut I trust the people who designed it00:04
fungiyeah, i have to assume octavia is addressing use cases far more complicated than "load balance traffic between our cloud servers"00:04
clarkbMy biggest issue with that design is it assumes the load balancer is colocatable with the endpoints00:04
rm_workclarkb: it does not00:04
clarkbit does if it requires l2 connectivity to them00:04
rm_workwe can plug a subnet that can route to the internet00:04
fungibecause for that, you shouldn't even need a special separate service. just run load balancing software in virtual machines00:04
rm_workand you could put a home-server behind it if you want00:04
rm_workwe just need to plug *some* subnet that can route to the member node00:05
fungiwhich in our case i guess is trivial because they're on the same network00:05
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fungiand because we proxy balance rather than nat (so no triangulation problems or dsr to worry about)00:06
rm_workso if you have some set of servers on subnet E288BDE1-8668-43E6-BE56-7D339B5C0BE4 and then later you add another set on subnet B553EF7E-7F3B-460D-BD66-2F8C91863BD4 we need to have both plugged, right?00:07
rm_workbecause the Amphora can't just magically route from the first subnet to the other00:07
rm_workmaybe I'm missing something :/00:08
fungiit can if its default router has routes to those00:08
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fungiagain, we're probably assuming simple use cases involving everyone on globally-routed networks00:08
clarkbMy suggestion would be t o test balancing with a simple.setup to 'internet'00:09
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clarkband separately test your agents network plugiing00:09
clarkbthen you can make the slow bits fast and the less slow bits less slow00:09
clarkbsince I imagine the slow bits are botting nested VM not hitting neutron api00:10
fungiwell, and also building images, but i guess no way around that00:11
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fungiassuming the point of the functional job is to test a change to something in the image00:15
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clarkbmostly just thinking we can isolate the slow part to boot thing, load balance traffic through it00:19
clarkbthen separately test things that talk to neutron and so on00:19
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* clarkb wonders what happens if two metworks with overlapping ip.ranges are attached00:25
amriththat's easy ... bad things00:30
amrithdepends a bit on the kind of network hardware you have00:31
amrithsome hardware is smart about it, some others let's just say are not so smart about it.00:31
clarkbwell specifically with octavia00:31
clarkbpretty sure you can get packets to wrong backend based on who won arp battle00:32
amrithsorry clarkb, I was thinking the question was a more general one. I have ZERO (0.0000) understanding of octavia. Just from the basic networking perspective if there are arp broadcasts and some devices are dumb about them, you can get very weird things00:32
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clarkbya typically depends on who wins arp battle00:33
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amrithimagine you are a network driver which receives only some of the packets because the upstream device sent some of them to the other person with the same IP :)00:33
amrithalso, overlapping IP ranges are never a problem so long as you don't have IP address collisions00:33
amrith(assuming no vlans)00:33
clarkbthats not entirely true00:33
clarkbright00:33
amrithnow, when you get into the world where people spoof mac addresses, life gets to be a lot more fun00:34
amrithor if you have failover protocols which attempt to be 'seamless' by setting the mac on the interface on the fly00:34
amrithlife gets very very messy ...00:34
amrithlet me read the scrollback and see what you are speaking about specifically00:35
clarkbit gets messy the other way when you arp for io using new mac on failover too00:35
clarkbsince many network devices will kill ports in a large arp storm00:35
* clarkb looks at f500:35
amrithwell, that's where smart network hardware listens for arp broadcasts and won't take advertisements seriously if there is a detectable conflict00:36
clarkbthis is independent of that00:36
clarkbcisco for example will shut off an interface if the number of arps exceeds a threshold00:37
clarkbregardless of conflicting arp00:37
amrithbut they do that based on a very simplistic protocol00:37
amrith(used to)00:37
amrithgetting it wrong ~ easy00:38
amrithfrom the description above, it seemed more like a server on two networks with identical definitions, no?00:38
amriththe issue being described was more of an issue of which network to send stuff out on?00:39
amrith"some set of servers on subnet A then added to subnet B"00:39
amrithunless A and B are overlapping, should be no problem00:39
amrithbut the problem would be confined to machines on one or the other local network00:39
amrithnot for data routed through those networks00:39
amrithno?00:39
clarkbI was just wondering if octavia would catch this issue properly00:39
clarkbor if it would be at the mercy of arp00:40
amrithhmm, let me see.00:40
amrithdisclaimer: I don't know octavia00:40
amrithbut what's the situation you are facing?00:40
amrithassume the networks are00:40
clarkbnone was a hypothetical00:40
amrith10.1.2.3/16 and 10.1.2.3/1600:41
amrithboth are valid00:41
amrithassume that a machine gets attached to both00:41
amriththat machine would be very confused ...00:41
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amrithbut you could specify to route traffic even so ...00:41
amrithby specifying the interface name in the routes00:41
amrithoh. hypothetical ... sorry.00:41
amrithwhat was the scenario you were picturing?00:42
clarkbuser says octavia attach subnet 1.2.3.4/24 and 1.2.3.4/2500:42
clarkbdoes octavia say hell no?00:42
clarkbif not is the lb service at the mercy of arp for sending packets to 1.2.3.10?00:43
amrithgood point, I don't know.00:43
amrithnot necessarily00:43
clarkbehat about 1.2.3.10 talking to 1.2.3.11?00:43
amrithyou can override that behavior with routing table entries00:43
clarkbarps shouldnt transit the octavia interfaces so last thi g should be fine00:44
amrithhow many 1.2.3.10's and 1.2.3.11's are there and does this one machine do proxy arp and packet forwarding?00:44
clarkbI have no Idea depends on how octavia configues linux to do networking00:44
clarkbthat more what I was trying to figure out00:44
* amrith is usless in that regard (like a lot of other things :) )00:45
amrithcooking comes to mind, also boiling an egg ...00:45
amrithand tox jsut got its act done, off to see what it found ... ta ta ...00:46
amrithhave a good weekend clarkb00:46
clarkbyou too00:46
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rm_workclarkb: sorry had to disappear for a sec00:49
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rm_workclarkb: we use network namespacing and this is something that we do consider00:49
rm_workthough I believe we consider it "a stupid user decision", I think we may actually be handling it00:50
rm_workthere was definitely a story for it though00:50
rm_workwe spent a lot of time discussing that possibility T_T00:50
rm_work(overlapping subnets)00:50
* amrith coughs00:51
clarkbya its possible with neutron and totally fine to errornwhen it happens00:51
amrithoverlapping subnets are not a "stupid user decision"00:51
amrithcase in point, VPN's ...00:51
amrithbut maybe that's not germane in octavia00:51
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clarkbamrith: it generally is...00:51
* amrith shuts up00:51
amrithreally clarkb?00:51
clarkbif a /8 isnt big enough for you seriously consider ipv600:51
amrithsorry, I may have no choice ...00:52
clarkbyes because it creates confusing issues that are hard to debug00:52
amrithwell, hard to debug isn't the same as stupid user decision00:52
amrithmy VPN hands out IP's in the exact same range as some DHCP servers ...00:52
amrithI don't get to control either00:52
amrith(well, I can change my VPN's range, but would i?)00:53
clarkbsure or have it use ipv600:53
amrithipv6 only reduces the odds00:53
amrithdoesn't guarantee that it will never happen00:53
amrithit's a MUCH BIGGER space00:53
amrithbut in huge spaces, we do see collisions00:53
clarkbit reduces it to the point where if it does happen go buy all the lottery tickets00:53
clarkblike heat death of universe should happen sooner00:54
amriththat's what one dinosaur said to the other00:54
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amrithwell, I'm all good because I have my reserved ipv6 space ...00:54
amrithand no one dare use it :)00:54
rm_workwe're designing to loadbalance on user networks00:55
clarkbyou can also deal.with that situation usimg a proxy typically rather than a vpn00:55
rm_workso by definition they control the rannges00:55
clarkbrm_work: is the load balancer shared among tenants though?00:55
rm_workno00:55
rm_workone tenant creates one LB00:56
rm_workfor one task00:56
rm_workthese are not like shared-appliance F5s00:56
rm_workif you have two websites, make two loadbalancers00:56
rm_workour tests do not really test the neutron plugging operations BTW00:57
rm_worki was just saying *they need to work*00:57
rm_workso I was concerned about whether containers support that00:57
clarkbrm_work: ya I think you can test that outide of a slower more complicated test00:58
rm_workwe don't have tests that are just like "let's try to do a neutron plug"00:58
clarkbuse a VM for that if necessary then use a container for testing the other bits00:58
rm_workthe problem is they'd use different drivers, so we'd be testing a different branch of our code00:58
rm_work(if the plugging is handled differently)00:59
clarkbI dont think you need different driver sthough00:59
rm_workunless all of the plugging is handled exactly the same00:59
clarkbnova boot will plug an interface for container or VM00:59
rm_workright so we have a compute driver00:59
rm_workand ALSO a networking driver00:59
clarkbuse that for simple stuff making it faster00:59
rm_workthe compute driver might not change00:59
clarkbthen test your fancy networking stuff in another test run00:59
rm_work...00:59
rm_workbut we still need to test it00:59
clarkbyes00:59
clarkbyou get the same coverage its just partitioned to allow faster testing01:00
rm_workok, so we'd have some gates set up to run like... a limited set of tests on VMs01:00
rm_workand then most of our functionality tests would run on the containers driver01:00
clarkbyes01:00
rm_workhmmm01:00
rm_workwe can look into that01:00
rm_worki'm still just really concerned that "use containers" isn't as easy as you guys think01:01
rm_workI could be wrong01:01
rm_workbut we did a lot of work on this, in fact there are patches up for it01:01
clarkbI honestly dont know, but the theory is that it is because nova api01:01
rm_workbut it was never completed because there were so many issues01:01
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clarkband where it isnt is honestly likely a nova bug01:01
rm_worki'll look into how easy it is to actually get nova-lxc or whatever to run in devstack01:02
rm_workif it's easy enough, i can just flip the flavor in the octavia config and see what happens01:02
rm_worki was lead to believe that nova-lxc was *very* unofficial and not supported01:02
rm_workand possibly no longer maintained01:03
clarkbnova lxc is in tree and they have gates for it now iirc01:03
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rm_worknice01:03
rm_worki'll relay this01:03
clarkbmriedem: likely knows more01:03
clarkbbut I recall them setting up testing for it and it uses libvirt like kvm01:03
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greghaynesrm_work: From the dib standpoint - we should be able to make it as easy as you adding an arg -t <container_format> to dib and itll come out as a container01:05
greghaynesrm_work: that code isnt exercised a lot so there may be issues but I am very interested in making it work that way :)01:05
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rm_workah so it is a different image, but it's easy enough to do01:07
rm_workok01:07
rm_workwhen testing i can change the container format that DIB builds easily enough :)01:07
greghaynesyes, I have no idea how image uploading works for that or what format it would want but its pretty trivial to make dib output various formats01:07
greghaynesyea01:08
greghaynesplease add it to dib directly :)01:08
rm_workI mean, hopefully it's just changing the args we pass in our devstack/plugin.py01:10
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clarkbits a different format not a different image01:13
clarkbat least infra uses dib that way01:13
clarkb3 image formats one image01:13
greghaynesYea, you should be able to do it just as a separate format01:14
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greghaynesI mostly am wondering - what image format does something like nova-lxc want?01:14
clarkbmy.guess is raw01:14
greghayneshuh01:14
greghaynesseems like it should be a tarball01:14
greghaynesbut also then - what would it run when you boot?01:14
clarkbinit01:14
greghayneswhich is why formats like aci and such exist01:14
clarkbthe kernel and bootloader are useless01:15
greghaynesyea, it could...01:15
greghaynesa lot of container formats have a concept of storing the entrypoint as part of the image01:15
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mriedemclarkb: the nova lxc job is in the experimental queue, uses lvm for the image backend (ephemeral),01:22
mriedemit's not stable by any means01:22
clarkbdarn01:22
clarkbbut it is running and hopefully someone is workong on it?01:22
mriedemwell, it's experimental queue so not really01:23
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mriedemthere was someone from rax trying to get it working part time01:23
greghaynesIt totally worked once, right?01:23
mriedembut no real progress lately01:23
clarkbexperimental queue is for when people are working on something :P01:23
mriedemgreghaynes: not really01:23
greghayneshaha01:23
mriedemgreghaynes: i mean you can boot a server,01:23
mriedembut a full tempest run running concurrently tends to tip it over01:23
mriedemand then failures start building up01:23
mriedemplus i think he hit some kernel bug on 14.0401:24
mriedemso he switched for fedora01:24
mtreinishmriedem: I thought they at least got it to a point where tempest could start01:24
mriedembut it wasn't much better01:24
greghayneshah01:24
mriedemmtreinish: we can definitely run tempest01:24
mriedemjust, lots of things snowball with failures01:24
mtreinishright, but for a while you couldn't even get nova to start with it01:24
greghaynesSo yea, that sounds like a good indication of what 'make it work in lxc' will be like - a lot of unrelated fixes01:24
mtreinishgetting through devstack took time01:25
clarkbunfortunate because all of these on cloud things could benefit from testing on it01:25
clarkbtrove sahara etc01:25
greghayneseven ironic possibly01:25
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mtreinishgreghaynes: virtual baremetal in a container in a vm on a public cloud01:26
greghaynesmtreinish: septupleo01:27
mriedemi think thomas maddox was the guy working on it from rax01:27
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mriedemanyway, i'm single parenting tonight and have to get my kid to bed, so as much as i'd like to talk about the state of lxc in nova on a friday night, i have to run01:27
openstackgerritYAMAMOTO Takashi proposed openstack-infra/project-config: networking-midonet: Add experimental functional job  https://review.openstack.org/33323601:28
greghaynesmriedem: ty for the infos01:30
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rm_workhmm ok01:36
rm_workso maybe i did hear correctly about nova-lxc being kinda broken :P01:36
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mriedemgreghaynes: here you go https://review.openstack.org/#/c/274792/01:45
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openstackgerritSpencer Krum proposed openstack-infra/project-config: Move vinz jobs to javascript from python  https://review.openstack.org/33363401:51
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krotscheckfungi: Nope. Sick with the daycare plague. Can take a tweak though02:05
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openstackgerritSpencer Krum proposed openstack-infra/project-config: Move vinz jobs to javascript from python  https://review.openstack.org/33363402:10
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openstackgerritSpencer Krum proposed openstack-infra/vinz: Add Login button  https://review.openstack.org/33412402:20
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openstackgerritgreghaynes proposed openstack/diskimage-builder: Make xenial the ubuntu default  https://review.openstack.org/33413604:21
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openstackgerritKhai Do proposed openstack-infra/puppet-gerrit: Get java_home from parent modules  https://review.openstack.org/33152304:52
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387308:55
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387309:14
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387309:28
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387310:25
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387310:50
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387311:33
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Jeffrey4l_question: what the method in noodpool to set up the repo mirror? do we have any project/scripts related to this?12:01
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openstackgerritMerged openstack-infra/elastic-recheck: Update query for ceph scheduling bug 1475333  https://review.openstack.org/33396312:12
openstackbug 1475333 in devstack "gate-tempest-dsvm-full-ceph fails with Insufficient free space for volume creation on host ubuntu@ceph#ceph (requested / avail): 1/0.0" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/147533312:12
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openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387312:31
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mriedemi'm having a hard time figuring out why the ansible inventory script here fails http://logs.openstack.org/62/327762/5/check/gate-tempest-dsvm-multinode-live-migration/5175850/console.html#_2016-06-24_14_54_22_59457713:48
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mriedemassuming it's: "fatal: [node]: FAILED! => {"ansible_job_id": "693159264605.1403", "changed": false, "failed": true, "finished": 1, "msg": "Exit code 2", "rc": 2}"13:49
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mriedemin13:50
mriedemhttp://logs.openstack.org/62/327762/5/check/gate-tempest-dsvm-multinode-live-migration/5175850/_zuul_ansible/ansible_log.txt13:50
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openstackgerritKhai Do proposed openstack-infra/puppet-gerrit: Allow puppet to configure gerrit commitmessage parameters  https://review.openstack.org/31617513:56
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pabelangermriedem: no, that is the ansible logging from our zuul-launchers. you'll need to look in your job for the version of ansible you ran.  you'll likely need to enable logging in ansible.cfg to dump it to /var/logs on the node, if not already done so.13:59
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mriedempabelanger: i'm not really following14:01
mriedemyou mean to get the reason why the inventory thing failed?14:01
mriedembecause devstack on both nodes looked fine14:01
mriedemthis isn't probably something specific to this job, re: logging, it should probably be done at some basic level for all jobs14:02
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pabelangermriedem: if I understand, you are trying to figure out why ansible is returns exit_code 2, in the first log you linked14:04
mriedemyeah14:04
pabelangerthe ansible_log.txt file you then linked, if not from that instances of ansible.  It is actually from zl04, ansible-playbook we used to actually start the job.14:05
pabelangerif you are wanting more details about the ansible task in your devstack process, you'll need to enable log_path in ansible.cfg so you can get a debug log from that process: http://docs.ansible.com/ansible/intro_configuration.html#log-path14:06
mriedemhm, and log_path here isn't what i want b/c it's the wrong ansible instance, if i'm following you14:07
mriedemhttp://logs.openstack.org/62/327762/5/check/gate-tempest-dsvm-multinode-live-migration/5175850/_zuul_ansible/ansible.cfg14:07
pabelangerno14:07
pabelangeranything in _zuul_ansible, comes from our zuul-launcher servers, not the jobs that run in the worker14:08
pabelangerso you are seeing output of how to actually run the job14:08
pabelangerno the data from inside the jog14:08
pabelangerjob*14:08
openstackgerritKhai Do proposed openstack-infra/system-config: Override commit message length validation to 72 chars  https://review.openstack.org/31619714:09
pabelangerso, in your case, anything related to job output will only exist in the logs folder14:09
mriedemyeah, so i guess i have no idea where project-config configures ansible for the jobs themselves14:09
mriedemis that in project-config?14:09
pabelangerin zuul directly14:09
pabelangerlet me get some code14:10
openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387314:10
pabelangermriedem: for example, here is how we build up our playbook and post_playbook files: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/zuul/tree/zuul/launcher/ansiblelaunchserver.py#n113614:11
pabelangeryou'll also see line 1240 is the setup of ansible.cfg14:11
openstackgerritKhai Do proposed openstack-infra/system-config: Override commit message length validation to 72 chars  https://review.openstack.org/31619714:11
pabelangerthis code, has no affect on devstack version of ansible14:11
pabelangersince zuul-launcher, SSh into the node, they run bash scripts.14:12
pabelangerthen*14:12
openstackgerritKhai Do proposed openstack-infra/system-config: Override commit message length validation to 72 chars  https://review.openstack.org/31619714:13
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mriedempabelanger: ok...so where/what ansible.cfg do i need to modify for ansible that runs on the node (if that's what it does, i've never hacked on ansible)14:17
mriedemi'm assuming zuul-launcher is ssh'ing into the node to run devstack?14:17
pabelangermriedem: you'll need to add the logic to devstack-vm-gate-wrap.sh along with ansible.cfg14:18
mriedemok so i'm looking in the wrong repo14:19
* mriedem checks d-g14:19
openstackgerritKhai Do proposed openstack-infra/puppet-gerrit: Allow puppet to configure gerrit commitmessage parameters  https://review.openstack.org/31617514:19
pabelangermriedem: right, http://logs.openstack.org/62/327762/5/check/gate-tempest-dsvm-multinode-live-migration/5175850/_zuul_ansible/ansible_log.txt is the output of that process14:19
pabelangerthe _zuul_ansible will contain the scripts and playbooks needed to do that too14:19
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mriedempabelanger: so i'm guessing i have to create/modify /etc/ansible/ansible.cfg and add/uncomment the log_path option in there? and set that to /var/logs/ansible.log, which is also the default, but not enabled by default it looks like from the docs14:26
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mriedemand then just collect that when d-g ends and collects the logs14:26
mriedemi know how to do the log collection in d-g, just not sure about the ansible config14:26
mriedemi see where d-g is installing ansible in a venv though14:26
pabelangermriedem: Ya, that's basically the steps14:27
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mriedemok, progress! :)14:27
mriedemlooks like ansible also logs by default to syslog14:28
mriedemand i see that here http://logs.openstack.org/62/327762/5/check/gate-tempest-dsvm-multinode-live-migration/5175850/logs/syslog.txt.gz14:28
mriedemdirecting to a specific log file just makes it easier to read14:28
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pabelangerya, not sure of the top of my head how to use syslog and ansible14:30
pabelangersure it is possible14:30
openstackgerrityolanda.robla proposed openstack-infra/puppet-httpd: Update context on vhost for selinux  https://review.openstack.org/33387314:32
mriedempabelanger: this has been helpful though, thanks for your time14:36
pabelangermriedem: np14:37
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openstackgerritPedro Alvarez Piedehierro proposed openstack-infra/storyboard: Add support for email threading by story_id  https://review.openstack.org/33417915:07
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openstackgerritNattaphoom Chaipreecha proposed openstack-dev/hacking: Fix Google Python Style Guide link.  https://review.openstack.org/33419817:32
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openstackgerritMonty Taylor proposed openstack-infra/puppet-openafs: Enable the openafs-client service  https://review.openstack.org/33349617:43
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openstackgerritMerged openstack-infra/elastic-recheck: Revert "Add e-r query for 1590139"  https://review.openstack.org/33352722:46
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