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| cdent | thingee: hey, just wanted to report that I've not had a chance to the governance bit of the contributors guide, but its still high on my radar | 19:02 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/openstack-specs master: Define a set of basic default roles https://review.openstack.org/523973 | 22:56 |
| lbragstad | cc hrybacki ^ | 22:56 |
| lbragstad | sorry it took me a while to get back around to that | 22:56 |
| lbragstad | zaneb: jamielennox johnthetubaguy might be interested in ^ too | 22:56 |
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| jamielennox | lbragstad: ooo, you're going to try and crack that chestnut again | 23:05 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/openstack-specs master: Define a set of basic default roles https://review.openstack.org/523973 | 23:05 |
| lbragstad | jamielennox: lol yeah - that's the end game | 23:06 |
| jamielennox | so i think you know this already, but the two things you're likely to hit/sunk the last one is that currently all projects have any role == writer and so defining a lower priviledged role is hard | 23:07 |
| jamielennox | and adam saying we have implied roles and that admin should imply both | 23:07 |
| lbragstad | well projects should be able to change that using the policy deprecation bits, which a deployment can override if they want, right? | 23:08 |
| jamielennox | both of which are a problem with configuration that is hard to define from keystone | 23:08 |
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| jamielennox | agreed, but it's as much of a standardization and migration problem as it is a tech one | 23:10 |
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| jamielennox | lbragstad: so i think that's a good start and for a base line reader & writer is enough. we went through and added {project}_writer etc and you should consider that a strecth goal because if you can solve the community problem of reader and writer the rest is just building on it | 23:12 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 23:13 |
| lbragstad | jamielennox: you proposal for the project_writer bits were before the system discussions, right? | 23:13 |
| jamielennox | what we could never figure out though is how to rename _member_ -> writer and to fix all the policies in all of the projects because that's not a keystone problem | 23:13 |
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| jamielennox | lbragstad: they were, but is_admin was around at the time and it still applied | 23:14 |
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| jamielennox | like compute_writer in system means i can modify hypervisor info and compute_writer in project means you can create a vm | 23:14 |
| lbragstad | ahh | 23:14 |
| lbragstad | i was thinking about it differently | 23:15 |
| lbragstad | nevermind | 23:15 |
| lbragstad | i was thinking all nova admin stuff was specific to the compute_writer role | 23:15 |
| lbragstad | instead of just giving the writer role to someone on the compute subsystem | 23:15 |
| lbragstad | for the rename bit from member -> writer, do community goals or openstack specs help with the oslo.policy bits? | 23:16 |
| jamielennox | so it's definitely a community goal, but the problem i guess is getting everyone coordinated and that keystone (currently) does not ship with roles | 23:17 |
| jamielennox | and i'm not sure how far policy in code helps there | 23:17 |
| lbragstad | would part of that community goal be for keystone to ship with the reader and writer roles (do with bootstrap)? | 23:17 |
| jamielennox | the problem is the default policy for most projects is any role gives you writer | 23:18 |
| lbragstad | s/do/done/ | 23:18 |
| jamielennox | and if you add to the policy in code that you _need_ the writer role lots of deployments won't have that initially | 23:18 |
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| jamielennox | so you're instantly broken | 23:18 |
| jamielennox | (also side not on whether writer implies reader) | 23:19 |
| jamielennox | (note) | 23:19 |
| jamielennox | and even if you bootstrap reader and writer into keystone there is a manual task there that before upgrading to release X for compatibility you should assign all project members the reader and writer roles | 23:20 |
| jamielennox | because the problem is the existing installs, not ones that are being bootstrapped today | 23:20 |
| lbragstad | right | 23:20 |
| lbragstad | some cloud administrator has to go through and audit their users base | 23:21 |
| jamielennox | i mean you can automate that for 90% of people and the others probably know how | 23:21 |
| jamielennox | but god help anyone who has a manually defined reader/writer role today | 23:22 |
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| jamielennox | anyway, i fully support the proposal and we need to do something in that area | 23:23 |
| lbragstad | yeah - but there are a lot of dragons | 23:23 |
| lbragstad | clearly... | 23:23 |
| jamielennox | but it's going to be a big job and the messaging is going to be interesting | 23:23 |
| lbragstad | jamielennox: if you think i need to roll my proposal in yours, just let me know | 23:25 |
| lbragstad | i can do that | 23:25 |
| openstackgerrit | Lance Bragstad proposed openstack/openstack-specs master: Define a set of basic default roles https://review.openstack.org/523973 | 23:27 |
| jamielennox | lbragstad: not really - i think keep it really simple to start with and then you can work on people who want specialty roles later | 23:36 |
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