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| kfox1111 | j^2: alive? | 15:55 |
|---|---|---|
| j^2 | yep | 15:56 |
| kfox1111 | recheck wont help. its a lagit schema check issue. | 15:56 |
| j^2 | oh | 15:56 |
| kfox1111 | schema changed while it was in flight. | 15:56 |
| j^2 | how can i fix this? | 15:56 |
| kfox1111 | http://logs.openstack.org/55/206255/2/gate/gate-apps-catalog-python27/ba32443/console.html#_2015-08-03_12_03_18_271 | 15:57 |
| kfox1111 | add a service: type: heat subsection. | 15:58 |
| j^2 | ah ok | 15:58 |
| j^2 | will do after my openstack-chef meeting | 15:58 |
| j^2 | in two mins :P | 15:58 |
| kfox1111 | there's one more in flight too. | 15:58 |
| kfox1111 | docaedo: you around? | 15:59 |
| kfox1111 | if we can get that one through too, then you could do that update at the same time. | 15:59 |
| rhagarty_ | kfox1111: good morning | 16:04 |
| kfox1111 | good morning. | 16:04 |
| rhagarty_ | just trying to wrap up the discussion we had about adding Horizon plug-ins to your new App Catalog. What do you think the chances are of getting | 16:04 |
| rhagarty_ | anything into a future release? | 16:04 |
| openstackgerrit | JJ Asghar proposed stackforge/apps-catalog: Adding HOT for Chef Standalone Server https://review.openstack.org/206255 | 16:05 |
| kfox1111 | the answer is, I don't know... :/ | 16:05 |
| rhagarty_ | See http://stackoverflow.com/questions/24289397/searching-pypi-by-topic. Seems like an easy way to perform a PyPI package search... so any | 16:05 |
| rhagarty_ | contributor who wanted to be included in your | 16:05 |
| rhagarty_ | catalog listing could add a special keyword or classification to their package which would be picked up by your search. The App Catalog listing would include | 16:05 |
| rhagarty_ | the PyPI package name, a description, and link. | 16:05 |
| rhagarty_ | just an idea... | 16:05 |
| kfox1111 | I'm for it I think. docaedo's against. | 16:05 |
| kfox1111 | I think once the new ui's in place, it should be easy to filter out things like horizon plugins for non ops, so having them is a benifit. | 16:06 |
| kfox1111 | we don't currently support external catalogs... its someting I've been mulling over a little bit, but we'd have to discuss that one too. | 16:07 |
| kfox1111 | It would be benifitial to the docker use case too, | 16:07 |
| kfox1111 | but also could be a slipery slope. | 16:07 |
| kfox1111 | so, lets not call the idea dead, but I'm guessing its probably not going to be a short term thing either, unless someone wants to code it and convince others. | 16:10 |
| rhagarty_ | ok - have to report to my team, so just wanted to make sure I understood where you guys stand. Thanks for your time and patience. | 16:10 |
| kfox1111 | np. I do think it belongs somewhere. | 16:10 |
| kfox1111 | baring somewhere else existing (it doesn't), the app catalog seems like a reasonable place to me. | 16:11 |
| rhagarty_ | I definitely agree. Maybe my team can help with that effort. | 16:12 |
| kfox1111 | cool. | 16:12 |
| rhagarty_ | one last quick question... the App Catalog will be an admin-only panel, correct? | 16:14 |
| kfox1111 | no. anyone will be able to use it. | 16:14 |
| kfox1111 | my hope though is to add a tag that is shown only to admins. | 16:15 |
| kfox1111 | j^2: its going to fail again. format: HOT needs to be moved to the service section. | 16:15 |
| rhagarty_ | ok. thanks | 16:16 |
| j^2 | kfox1111: grr, ok i’ll try again | 16:16 |
| j^2 | thanks | 16:16 |
| kfox1111 | then I think it will pass. though not sure if git's smart enough to merge it. | 16:16 |
| kfox1111 | arg... and supported_by changed too. | 16:16 |
| kfox1111 | supported_by: name: Community and Chef Partnereng | 16:17 |
| kfox1111 | if you want to not have to wait for jenkins, | 16:17 |
| kfox1111 | you can run 'tox' in the root of the apps-catalog repo. | 16:17 |
| openstackgerrit | JJ Asghar proposed stackforge/apps-catalog: Adding HOT for Chef Standalone Server https://review.openstack.org/206255 | 16:19 |
| docaedo | kfox1111: Hi, I'm around | 16:24 |
| kfox1111 | good morning. | 16:25 |
| docaedo | regarding horizon plugins in the app catalog, I'm still agains (as you noted), but I'm not intractably dug in | 16:25 |
| kfox1111 | can you please review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/208103/ | 16:25 |
| docaedo | will review momentarily | 16:25 |
| kfox1111 | thx. | 16:25 |
| docaedo | and on the "what goes in the catalog" topic, I was thinking about it this morning and am going to write to the mailing list about this exact thing | 16:26 |
| docaedo | My thinking right now is that doesn't make sense at this moment (the way the catalog is structured, etc.) but as we expand and change the catalog to easily handle more types, it starts to make sense | 16:27 |
| docaedo | the reason I want to float it the ML is to get other perspectives, especially people who have put a lot of effort into packaging openstack components, etc. | 16:27 |
| kfox1111 | yeah, thats what I was thinking. once we just have one file, and service: type: X is fully in place, | 16:28 |
| kfox1111 | then it would be pretty easy to do a service: type: horizon or something. | 16:28 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. | 16:28 |
| docaedo | on a related tanged, I'm pretty strongly against just reflecting other indexes (pypi for instance), if that's what the suggestion was (maybe I misinterpreted?) | 16:28 |
| kfox1111 | being an rpm guy myself, I do know the pain pip can inflict if not used properly. | 16:29 |
| kfox1111 | I think the idea might be this... | 16:29 |
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| kfox1111 | say Magnum takes off bigtime. | 16:29 |
| kfox1111 | then you want to be able to run docker containers on top of openstack. | 16:29 |
| kfox1111 | We probably don't want to duplicate the docker hub's catalog. that would be painful. | 16:30 |
| kfox1111 | so could we hook in the docker hub in such a way that all the entries just show up in a docker section? | 16:30 |
| kfox1111 | the ui is handy for users, they just pick a container, hit launch, and it shows up on their openstack. | 16:30 |
| kfox1111 | but its a little odd to hook into external other catalogs. | 16:31 |
| docaedo | Good chance searching docker hub externally like that would be frowned upon if it ever got popular, and also makes the app catalog sound like it wants to be a search engine | 16:32 |
| kfox1111 | isn't the app catalog a search engine? | 16:32 |
| kfox1111 | a place to go for users to find X app to run on their openstack, and integration to make it easy to launch it. | 16:33 |
| kfox1111 | once the catalog becomes of any useable size, its got to have search at its heart, or no one will be able to find the needle in the haystack they want. | 16:33 |
| docaedo | I think of it as an index of things IN the app catalog, not an index of all things related to openstack | 16:33 |
| docaedo | so yes, searchable index | 16:34 |
| docaedo | no on indexing external catalogs | 16:34 |
| kzaitsev_mb | kfox1111: wonder if it's a good idea to make a proxy for dokerhub. Seems that it would be nicer if magnum-ui would support doker API (if any) | 16:34 |
| docaedo | (i.e. I think including a component for deploying Cloud Foundry is great, but including an index of everything in CLoud Foundry's index is not) | 16:34 |
| kfox1111 | kzaitsev_mb: what about the other 3 ways of launching docker containers? | 16:34 |
| kfox1111 | Murano's pushing to be a docker provider as well. | 16:35 |
| docaedo | nova-docker is in the mix too | 16:35 |
| kfox1111 | yeay. | 16:35 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. | 16:35 |
| kfox1111 | so, I'm with you on apps.openstack.org. it really doesn't need to provide entries for docker on it. since the hub already has a website for that. | 16:35 |
| kfox1111 | but what about in horizon itself? being able to find and click "launch" and actually get it is a very compelling feature. | 16:36 |
| kfox1111 | maybe the app catalog ui provides a plugable ui for pulling catalog entries from multiple locations? | 16:36 |
| kfox1111 | then the docker folks could provide their own plugin to pull from the hub? | 16:36 |
| kfox1111 | I'm worried if we don't centralize the ui a little bit, we'll end up with the Murano app catalog, the global ap catalog, the docker app catalog.... | 16:37 |
| kfox1111 | thing next app catalog... | 16:37 |
| kfox1111 | bleh. | 16:37 |
| docaedo | that's an interesting thought, trying to make app-catalog-ui a sort of funnel for finding/fetching/launching all the external bits | 16:38 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. | 16:39 |
| kfox1111 | it provides the ability for users that don't care about what engine's needed to run the app not to have to care. they just find "Jenkins" and launch one. | 16:39 |
| kfox1111 | if its heat or docker they don't have to care. | 16:39 |
| kfox1111 | hows the app tags thing look? | 16:41 |
| docaedo | I like the idea, and if the horizon bit is a good enough framework so "project xyz" can be easily added, could be really compelling | 16:42 |
| docaedo | similar to the goal of oslo, becomes "the one place" to do that | 16:42 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. I've been trying to make the code as generic as possible to support the new service types coming up. I don't htink it would be too hard to make extendable. | 16:42 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. | 16:42 |
| docaedo | re: 208103, I like it, was about to +2 it, I like it | 16:43 |
| kfox1111 | arg. my test horizon broke... and not sure why.. | 16:43 |
| kfox1111 | k. thx. | 16:43 |
| kfox1111 | j^2: please add a tags["app"] to your template too. | 16:44 |
| kzaitsev_mb | so all the assets are now apps, but some would later be libraries, right? | 16:45 |
| kfox1111 | no, I took a stab at marking things as apps or not based on our previous conversation about the topic. for example, murano has libraries listed in a comment in the yaml. I did not tag those as apps. | 16:46 |
| kzaitsev_mb | oh, I see | 16:46 |
| kzaitsev_mb | I just scrolled to -enum and there were only apps at the moment =) | 16:47 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. probably will need a lot more. :) | 16:47 |
| kfox1111 | I saw that murano also has some other "types" defined as a comment header with entries inside. | 16:47 |
| kfox1111 | it would be nice to understand what they are intended for, and maybe tag those too. | 16:47 |
| kfox1111 | so they can be retrieved programatically. | 16:48 |
| kzaitsev_mb | well. there was an intention to have bundles of apps, that are just json files, that list apps (with versions) included in the bundle. | 16:49 |
| kzaitsev_mb | some sort of meta-package | 16:49 |
| kfox1111 | currently there are only two catagories of things apps and components. all apps are components (no tags['app']). apps are stuff just tags:['app'] | 16:49 |
| kfox1111 | what is a bundle for? | 16:49 |
| kfox1111 | an app is something a user would directly want to "launch" | 16:50 |
| kzaitsev_mb | say, databases bundle, that includes mysql, postgresql and oracle apps | 16:50 |
| kfox1111 | as a user, why would I want to install all those databases? | 16:50 |
| kfox1111 | I probaly only want 1. | 16:50 |
| kfox1111 | ? | 16:50 |
| kzaitsev_mb | as a cloud admin — you might want to give your users ability to choose which db they would install | 16:51 |
| kfox1111 | the user can install all of them already. | 16:51 |
| kfox1111 | or are you tihkning, if the cloud admin disabled custom image loading? | 16:52 |
| kfox1111 | so they might want to load them all themselves with the public bit set? | 16:52 |
| kzaitsev_mb | or another example — say LAMP. a bundle, that contains mysql, apache and smth else | 16:52 |
| kzaitsev_mb | it's more like apt-get install build-essentials thing | 16:53 |
| kfox1111 | I kind of see it for murano, but those things are part of the os running inside. | 16:53 |
| kfox1111 | those can be configured with heat params. | 16:53 |
| kfox1111 | the heat template woudl have a drop down for db type, or git repo to pull source from? | 16:54 |
| kfox1111 | I guess bundle isn't really that different from having dependency installing working. | 16:55 |
| kfox1111 | just a dummy entry with dependencies on the bundle entries. | 16:55 |
| kfox1111 | so it wouldn't hurt to make that sort of thing. | 16:55 |
| kzaitsev_mb | you can install gcc and gmake (and whatever is there) separatelly, but this type of thing allows you to install several things in one line. | 16:55 |
| kfox1111 | something service: type: bundle with the deps listed. | 16:55 |
| kfox1111 | I still don't quite follow with respect to pulling in multiple openstack components... | 16:56 |
| kfox1111 | you apt-get/yum install in a vm thats booted. | 16:56 |
| kfox1111 | we don't custom build a set of glance images with all permutations of software inside them so you don't have to apt-get/yum install stuff? | 16:56 |
| kfox1111 | so why create a bundle that can pull in 7 different images? | 16:57 |
| docaedo | (stepped away, but back now) | 16:57 |
| kfox1111 | got a 10-11:00. :/ its a good conversation though. | 16:57 |
| docaedo | I can explain the point of the murano bundle | 16:57 |
| kfox1111 | hope to talk about it more in a bit. | 16:58 |
| kfox1111 | bbiab. | 16:58 |
| docaedo | think of the murano bits as individual building blocks, so in a given cloud environment, it's useful to have mysql, postgres and some other DB | 16:59 |
| openstackgerrit | JJ Asghar proposed stackforge/apps-catalog: Adding HOT for Chef Standalone Server https://review.openstack.org/206255 | 16:59 |
| docaedo | then I can grab an apache/wordpress app, and that has a requirement of "A Database". When I deploy that one, I can choose to use postgres or mysql DB | 16:59 |
| kzaitsev_mb | docaedo: thanks, that's exactly what I meant by an example of databases bundle =) | 17:00 |
| docaedo | hopefully that explanation helps :) | 17:01 |
| kfox1111 | back. | 17:13 |
| kfox1111 | so, its not a database that its depending on, but a murano plugin that provides a database api? | 17:14 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged stackforge/apps-catalog: Add tag to apps https://review.openstack.org/208103 | 17:14 |
| kfox1111 | like a heat resource type? | 17:14 |
| kzaitsev_mb | not a specific database, yes. | 17:15 |
| docaedo | AFAIK that is correct | 17:15 |
| kfox1111 | hmm... thats interesting... | 17:15 |
| kfox1111 | so murano is set to become an "Uber service" | 17:16 |
| docaedo | it's pretty handy, and from the user side, it works nicely. In a perfect world all that great user-side stuff from Murano would be part of heat | 17:16 |
| kfox1111 | Rather then implement magnum, sahara, etc, you write plugins to murano to do it. | 17:16 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. and heat gets resource types for sahara stuff, etc. | 17:17 |
| kfox1111 | so... these types, do they require a turing complete language? | 17:18 |
| kfox1111 | and can users load them themselves? | 17:18 |
| kfox1111 | as an op, thats really scary. :/ | 17:18 |
| docaedo | users can load them themselves, but how is that scary? It's just a VM. | 17:18 |
| docaedo | the op is not responsible for it | 17:19 |
| kfox1111 | its not just a vm thouhg, its code for managing a db deployment to load into murano? | 17:19 |
| kfox1111 | or is it just passing it through to the vm where it runs all the code inside the vm? | 17:20 |
| kfox1111 | so more similar to a heat template software deployment then a sahara engine. | 17:20 |
| docaedo | well .. believe it generates a heat template, and then heat creates a VM and gets the DB installed. But the VM has murano agent so I am not sure what murano does and what heat does. but it's all tenant isolated, so does not impact anyone else | 17:21 |
| kfox1111 | tenant isolation's fine in the vm. its if the tenant can load code into the engine, which isn't isolated and run code there that worries me. | 17:22 |
| docaedo | it's fully isolated | 17:23 |
| kfox1111 | I can see the point of a bundle though. If heat say, had generic software config's that could be loaded into a tenant environment as a new resource type, it would be roughly the same, and then loading bundles of resources would make sense. | 17:23 |
| kzaitsev_mb | kfox1111: murano has it's own dsl, that's small and shouldn't be able to harm anything outside the scope of one deployment enviroment | 17:24 |
| kfox1111 | is is the dsl turring complete or not? | 17:24 |
| kfox1111 | thats the level where I start worrying. :) | 17:24 |
| kfox1111 | a dsl can be either. | 17:24 |
| kfox1111 | so, lets take solum language packs as another example. the user may want to bulk add a common set of them to then build apon. | 17:26 |
| kfox1111 | or in fact, ui wise, it would be awesome to show the whole set with check boxes, and the user can uncheck what they dont want, then bulk load the rest. | 17:28 |
| kfox1111 | so a bundle is a collection of components that a user might want to install together. The components may be of different types. | 17:35 |
| kfox1111 | I think that makes sense. | 17:36 |
| kzaitsev_mb | speaking catalog-ui-wize those can potentially be even from different types, I guess | 17:36 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. | 17:36 |
| kfox1111 | so like, a set of common glance images, murano libs, and solum language packs could be all in one bundle. | 17:37 |
| kzaitsev_mb | like i-want-it-all.bundle that would have everything! +) | 17:37 |
| kfox1111 | heh. that one would have to be autogenerated.... and no. just no. ;) | 17:38 |
| kzaitsev_mb | =) | 17:39 |
| kfox1111 | so +1 for creating a new type for bundles. service: type: bundle or something. | 17:39 |
| kzaitsev_mb | that would actually make a good UI-testing thingy. | 17:39 |
| kfox1111 | or service: type: app-catalog with subtype: bundle or something. | 17:39 |
| kzaitsev_mb | cause it would be an edge-case of edge cases | 17:39 |
| kfox1111 | yeah, but once the sum total of resources grows beyond a few hundred TB, not many folks can actually test. ;) | 17:40 |
| kfox1111 | bbiab. | 17:42 |
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| j^2 | kfox1111: so it seems i put tags i the wrong place? | 18:07 |
| j^2 | http://logs.openstack.org/55/206255/5/check/gate-apps-catalog-python27/91f34bf/console.html#_2015-08-03_17_34_44_301 | 18:07 |
| j^2 | the properties doesn’t look for it? | 18:08 |
| kfox1111 | I think the tags schema update hasn't quite made it all the way through the system. | 18:09 |
| j^2 | ah | 18:09 |
| j^2 | recheck in a bit? | 18:09 |
| kfox1111 | yeah. | 18:10 |
| kfox1111 | also see my comment in irc above about supported_by. | 18:11 |
| j^2 | looking | 18:13 |
| j^2 | hmm, ok, i’m blind | 18:22 |
| j^2 | i cant find it | 18:22 |
| kfox1111 | sec... | 18:28 |
| kfox1111 | 12:16 < kfox1111> arg... and supported_by changed too. | 18:29 |
| kfox1111 | 12:17 < kfox1111> supported_by: name: Community and Chef Partnereng | 18:29 |
| kfox1111 | 12:17 < kfox1111> if you want to not have to wait for jenkins, | 18:29 |
| kfox1111 | 12:17 < kfox1111> you can run 'tox' in the root of the apps-catalog repo. | 18:29 |
| j^2 | oh | 18:29 |
| openstackgerrit | JJ Asghar proposed stackforge/apps-catalog: Adding HOT for Chef Standalone Server https://review.openstack.org/206255 | 18:53 |
| kfox1111 | looks good to me. gota wait for jenkins to check it though. | 18:57 |
| kfox1111 | did you ever get to adding the wait condition to the template? | 18:57 |
| kfox1111 | also, I did want to talk to you about floating ip's. | 18:57 |
| kfox1111 | Right now, your using a construct that both allocates an associates them. That's a very pet oriented way. | 18:58 |
| kfox1111 | if you regester the floating ip in dns, you have to be very careful to remove the dns entry before deleting your stack, or else someone else can steel your dns entry. | 18:59 |
| kfox1111 | so I tend to like to just allocate them via horizon, then pass them through and associate them in the template. | 18:59 |
| j^2 | Yeah never got the wait working. It's on my todo. | 19:07 |
| kfox1111 | k. | 19:08 |
| kfox1111 | j^2: yay. :) | 19:42 |
| kfox1111 | docaedo: care to second? | 19:42 |
| docaedo | kfox1111: talking about 206255? | 20:29 |
| j^2 | ^5 kfox1111 | 20:31 |
| kfox1111 | thx. :) | 20:32 |
| docaedo | np! | 20:32 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged stackforge/apps-catalog: Adding HOT for Chef Standalone Server https://review.openstack.org/206255 | 20:33 |
| kfox1111 | done. :) | 20:33 |
| kfox1111 | j^2: Thanks. :) | 20:33 |
| j^2 | Maybe in a little while…like a week or two? i’ll put in a review to add that to the apps thingy? or switch it out for the glance image? | 20:35 |
| kfox1111 | apps thingy? | 20:35 |
| j^2 | RECENTLY ADDED APPS | 20:36 |
| j^2 | (Requires OpenStack) | 20:36 |
| kfox1111 | ah. yeah. | 20:36 |
| j^2 | that thing, switch out the glance for template? | 20:36 |
| j^2 | that seems reasonable | 20:36 |
| kfox1111 | sure. sounds good. | 20:36 |
| j^2 | ah it seems that the Description…isn’t markdown | 20:50 |
| j^2 | I’ll be doing a formatting review here in a bit | 20:50 |
| kfox1111 | yeah, I don't think its anything but text at the moment. | 20:52 |
| kfox1111 | markdown's not a bad idea though... | 20:52 |
| j^2 | :D | 20:52 |
| docaedo | yes, description doesn't allow for any formatting, I completely forgot about being annoyed with that before launch :) | 20:55 |
| kfox1111 | :) | 20:55 |
| kfox1111 | I slid in a blueprint for it so we don't forget again. | 20:55 |
| docaedo | I will support any effort to fix that - would be really useful, and markdown would work pretty well I think. I'm just not sure what it takes to render that on the web side so haven't given it a lot of thought | 20:56 |
| docaedo | thanks kfox1111 for that blueprint! | 20:56 |
| kfox1111 | np. | 20:56 |
| j^2 | :D | 20:57 |
| kfox1111 | http://jsfiddle.net/davidchase03/u54Kh/ | 21:01 |
| kfox1111 | interesting... :) | 21:01 |
| openstackgerrit | JJ Asghar proposed stackforge/apps-catalog: Fixed up the formatting for Chef template https://review.openstack.org/208657 | 21:17 |
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